The Syndicate

@Seanzie I think Fingersplints can only be with Mac which from my PoV makes fingerspints always a bad kill, thoughts?

NAA, for being D2 I have no idea why your world views are so limited

falcon45ca wrote: ↑Tue Mar 29, 2022 10:24 am NAA, for being D2 I have no idea why your world views are so limited

Because it has to be, and the circumstances allow it to be. I would argue that my world view isn't sufficiently limited to have a winning record, even under the assumption that it's correct.

NotAnAxehole wrote: ↑Tue Mar 29, 2022 10:28 am

falcon45ca wrote: ↑Tue Mar 29, 2022 10:24 am NAA, for being D2 I have no idea why your world views are so limited

Because it has to be, and the circumstances allow it to be. I would argue that my world view isn't sufficiently limited to have a winning record, even under the assumption that it's correct.

I think your first 2 points in this post are only true if you're Maf

Fingers is also stuck in static world views.



I think in a game this size it's harder for Maf to be fluid

NotAnAxehole wrote: ↑Tue Mar 29, 2022 10:13 am @Seanzie I think Fingersplints can only be with Mac which from my PoV makes fingerspints always a bad kill, thoughts?

I don't agree that there absolutely has to be at least one mafia in Mac/Falcon, so if you are not willing to consider solves without this condition, then I don't know what to tell you. If you are willing to consider this, then I'd say that many people could be with Fingersplints. I think Fingersplints/Falcon and Fingersplints/Porscha are unlikely, and probably Fingersplints/LC is not the team since Fingersplints echoed someone else's echo of Nook's misgivings about LC, but otherwise I don't see anything eliminating pairs with Fingersplints.

So, my thoughts are unless you can convince me of your Mac/Falcon worldview, I don't agree that Fingersplints is a bad kill.

falcon45ca wrote: ↑Tue Mar 29, 2022 11:46 am

NotAnAxehole wrote: ↑Tue Mar 29, 2022 10:28 am

falcon45ca wrote: ↑Tue Mar 29, 2022 10:24 am NAA, for being D2 I have no idea why your world views are so limited

Because it has to be, and the circumstances allow it to be. I would argue that my world view isn't sufficiently limited to have a winning record, even under the assumption that it's correct.

I think your first 2 points in this post are only true if you're Maf

What..? No..? You do realize this is a set up with only 2 miss elims right?

So... Even a PoE of 4 is losing right now. Basic math..?

Seanzie wrote: ↑Tue Mar 29, 2022 12:06 pm

NotAnAxehole wrote: ↑Tue Mar 29, 2022 10:13 am @Seanzie I think Fingersplints can only be with Mac which from my PoV makes fingerspints always a bad kill, thoughts?

I don't agree that there absolutely has to be at least one mafia in Mac/Falcon, so if you are not willing to consider solves without this condition, then I don't know what to tell you. If you are willing to consider this, then I'd say that many people could be with Fingersplints. I think Fingersplints/Falcon and Fingersplints/Porscha are unlikely, and probably Fingersplints/LC is not the team since Fingersplints echoed someone else's echo of Nook's misgivings about LC, but otherwise I don't see anything eliminating pairs with Fingersplints.

So, my thoughts are unless you can convince me of your Mac/Falcon worldview, I don't agree that Fingersplints is a bad kill.

I see.

@Seanzie does it help if I say it's a Mac read?

And I've used it before

NotAnAxehole wrote: ↑Tue Mar 29, 2022 12:10 pm

falcon45ca wrote: ↑Tue Mar 29, 2022 11:46 am

NotAnAxehole wrote: ↑Tue Mar 29, 2022 10:28 am

falcon45ca wrote: ↑Tue Mar 29, 2022 10:24 am NAA, for being D2 I have no idea why your world views are so limited

Because it has to be, and the circumstances allow it to be. I would argue that my world view isn't sufficiently limited to have a winning record, even under the assumption that it's correct.

I think your first 2 points in this post are only true if you're Maf

What..? No..? You do realize this is a set up with only 2 miss elims right?

So... Even a PoE of 4 is losing right now. Basic math..?

So who's Maf when I flip green?


You've got static world views that don't have to be true...like, you're not even truly considering them to possibly be wrong.


You have MR as lock town. That's absurd

How about we all come together to vote Ender?

Master Radishes wrote: ↑Tue Mar 29, 2022 12:50 pm How about we all come together to vote Ender?

I'm not opposed to this sentiment, but I also have to question your motives.



Hawt takes? Hell, I'll settle for lukewarm from you at this point.



Cuz your def in your scum range

falcon45ca wrote: ↑Tue Mar 29, 2022 12:58 pm

Master Radishes wrote: ↑Tue Mar 29, 2022 12:50 pm How about we all come together to vote Ender?

I'm not opposed to this sentiment, but I also have to question your motives.



Hawt takes? Hell, I'll settle for lukewarm from you at this point.



Cuz your def in your scum range

You say that, but apparently I've town told in a way that makes me obv Town.

Deal wit it.

In future games I'm just gonna re use all my posts from this game. I will forever be lock town that way.

Also my motives are not in question. Pretty sure I've previously expressed a low key suss of Ender.

I might also be a tiny bit scarred from Hally and C4 snowing me in Highway Mafia. I knew something was wrong there but never could quite SR the two active voices driving conversations forward. This time I'm going straight to those slots instead.

Master Radishes wrote: ↑Tue Mar 29, 2022 1:02 pm Also my motives are not in question. Pretty sure I've previously expressed a low key suss of Ender.

Are you still low key, or have you moved up an octave?

falcon45ca wrote: ↑Tue Mar 29, 2022 1:04 pm

Master Radishes wrote: ↑Tue Mar 29, 2022 1:02 pm Also my motives are not in question. Pretty sure I've previously expressed a low key suss of Ender.

Are you still low key, or have you moved up an octave?

I tend to sing out of tune regardless.

Can you flesh out your sus a bit?




Also, why are you so (seemingly) comfortable w NAAs lock town read on you? I'd think it would make you wary of his slot, no?

Master Radishes wrote: ↑Tue Mar 29, 2022 1:05 pm

falcon45ca wrote: ↑Tue Mar 29, 2022 1:04 pm

Master Radishes wrote: ↑Tue Mar 29, 2022 1:02 pm Also my motives are not in question. Pretty sure I've previously expressed a low key suss of Ender.

Are you still low key, or have you moved up an octave?

I tend to sing out of tune regardless.

Not all Brits are Adele I spose

falcon45ca wrote: ↑Tue Mar 29, 2022 12:46 pm

NotAnAxehole wrote: ↑Tue Mar 29, 2022 12:10 pm

falcon45ca wrote: ↑Tue Mar 29, 2022 11:46 am

NotAnAxehole wrote: ↑Tue Mar 29, 2022 10:28 am

falcon45ca wrote: ↑Tue Mar 29, 2022 10:24 am NAA, for being D2 I have no idea why your world views are so limited

Because it has to be, and the circumstances allow it to be. I would argue that my world view isn't sufficiently limited to have a winning record, even under the assumption that it's correct.

I think your first 2 points in this post are only true if you're Maf

What..? No..? You do realize this is a set up with only 2 miss elims right?

So... Even a PoE of 4 is losing right now. Basic math..?

So who's Maf when I flip green?


You've got static world views that don't have to be true...like, you're not even truly considering them to possibly be wrong.


You have MR as lock town. That's absurd

I've answered this question repeatedly & Seanzie recently mentioned it too - which basically tells me you're pretending to be here, but you're really not paying attention to anything I've written, or anything that's been discussed in the thread as of recent.

Master Radishes wrote: ↑Tue Mar 29, 2022 1:03 pm I might also be a tiny bit scarred from Hally and C4 snowing me in Highway Mafia. I knew something was wrong there but never could quite SR the two active voices driving conversations forward. This time I'm going straight to those slots instead.

Who do you feel those voices are right now?

falcon45ca wrote: ↑Tue Mar 29, 2022 1:06 pm Can you flesh out your sus a bit?




Also, why are you so (seemingly) comfortable w NAAs lock town read on you? I'd think it would make you wary of his slot, no?

Fleshing out would involve reading back and I'm on my phone right now and refuse to so it. Ask again later.

Asked and answered about NAA. The whole thing is typical him. I've never seen him wolf so dunno the flavour difference but he often has reads like the one on me. If he's pocketing he picked a bad choice to do it to. He recently misread me so might have double checked his algorithm or whatever. My one concern on him is unrelated to his approach to my slot.

falcon45ca wrote: ↑Tue Mar 29, 2022 1:10 pm

Master Radishes wrote: ↑Tue Mar 29, 2022 1:03 pm I might also be a tiny bit scarred from Hally and C4 snowing me in Highway Mafia. I knew something was wrong there but never could quite SR the two active voices driving conversations forward. This time I'm going straight to those slots instead.

Who do you feel those voices are right now?

Ender and LC. More variety today but throughout D1 those two were in the perfect spot of being town read by virtue of having thread presence whereas everyone else barely had a pulse.

Master Radishes wrote: ↑Tue Mar 29, 2022 1:11 pm

falcon45ca wrote: ↑Tue Mar 29, 2022 1:06 pm Can you flesh out your sus a bit?




Also, why are you so (seemingly) comfortable w NAAs lock town read on you? I'd think it would make you wary of his slot, no?

Fleshing out would involve reading back and I'm on my phone right now and refuse to so it. Ask again later.

Asked and answered about NAA. The whole thing is typical him. I've never seen him wolf so dunno the flavour difference but he often has reads like the one on me. If he's pocketing he picked a bad choice to do it to. He recently misread me so might have double checked his algorithm or whatever. My one concern on him is unrelated to his approach to my slot.

To add on this, there's a reasonable argument to be made that MR should be more concerned about people pushing him. I know some people here are fond of TMI reads, but they are seldom right.

NotAnAxehole wrote: ↑Tue Mar 29, 2022 1:09 pm

falcon45ca wrote: ↑Tue Mar 29, 2022 12:46 pm

NotAnAxehole wrote: ↑Tue Mar 29, 2022 12:10 pm

falcon45ca wrote: ↑Tue Mar 29, 2022 11:46 am

NotAnAxehole wrote: ↑Tue Mar 29, 2022 10:28 am

falcon45ca wrote: ↑Tue Mar 29, 2022 10:24 am NAA, for being D2 I have no idea why your world views are so limited

Because it has to be, and the circumstances allow it to be. I would argue that my world view isn't sufficiently limited to have a winning record, even under the assumption that it's correct.

I think your first 2 points in this post are only true if you're Maf

What..? No..? You do realize this is a set up with only 2 miss elims right?

So... Even a PoE of 4 is losing right now. Basic math..?

So who's Maf when I flip green?


You've got static world views that don't have to be true...like, you're not even truly considering them to possibly be wrong.


You have MR as lock town. That's absurd

I've answered this question repeatedly & Seanzie recently mentioned it too - which basically tells me you're pretending to be here, but you're really not paying attention to anything I've written, or anything that's been discussed in the thread as of recent.

I'm sorry, but I read your answer of a world w/o me as Maf as "Mac + 1", and that's pretty damn narrow, static, and superficial IMO


There's a difference between pretending to be here and just not buying your explanation.


Also, "pretending to be here"...like your superficial (and self admittedly so) read on me? That's not pretending?

Master Radishes wrote: ↑Tue Mar 29, 2022 1:13 pm

falcon45ca wrote: ↑Tue Mar 29, 2022 1:10 pm

Master Radishes wrote: ↑Tue Mar 29, 2022 1:03 pm I might also be a tiny bit scarred from Hally and C4 snowing me in Highway Mafia. I knew something was wrong there but never could quite SR the two active voices driving conversations forward. This time I'm going straight to those slots instead.

Who do you feel those voices are right now?

Ender and LC. More variety today but throughout D1 those two were in the perfect spot of being town read by virtue of having thread presence whereas everyone else barely had a pulse.

I've seen them as partnered from D1, so how about we

[VOTE: Ender] aubergine

Master Radishes wrote: ↑Tue Mar 29, 2022 1:11 pm

falcon45ca wrote: ↑Tue Mar 29, 2022 1:06 pm Can you flesh out your sus a bit?




Also, why are you so (seemingly) comfortable w NAAs lock town read on you? I'd think it would make you wary of his slot, no?

Fleshing out would involve reading back and I'm on my phone right now and refuse to so it. Ask again later.

Asked and answered about NAA. The whole thing is typical him. I've never seen him wolf so dunno the flavour difference but he often has reads like the one on me. If he's pocketing he picked a bad choice to do it to. He recently misread me so might have double checked his algorithm or whatever. My one concern on him is unrelated to his approach to my slot.

MRS back in the USSR baby

falcon45ca wrote: ↑Tue Mar 29, 2022 1:16 pm

NotAnAxehole wrote: ↑Tue Mar 29, 2022 1:09 pm

falcon45ca wrote: ↑Tue Mar 29, 2022 12:46 pm

NotAnAxehole wrote: ↑Tue Mar 29, 2022 12:10 pm

falcon45ca wrote: ↑Tue Mar 29, 2022 11:46 am

NotAnAxehole wrote: ↑Tue Mar 29, 2022 10:28 am

falcon45ca wrote: ↑Tue Mar 29, 2022 10:24 am NAA, for being D2 I have no idea why your world views are so limited

Because it has to be, and the circumstances allow it to be. I would argue that my world view isn't sufficiently limited to have a winning record, even under the assumption that it's correct.

I think your first 2 points in this post are only true if you're Maf

What..? No..? You do realize this is a set up with only 2 miss elims right?

So... Even a PoE of 4 is losing right now. Basic math..?

So who's Maf when I flip green?


You've got static world views that don't have to be true...like, you're not even truly considering them to possibly be wrong.


You have MR as lock town. That's absurd

I've answered this question repeatedly & Seanzie recently mentioned it too - which basically tells me you're pretending to be here, but you're really not paying attention to anything I've written, or anything that's been discussed in the thread as of recent.

I'm sorry, but I read your answer of a world w/o me as Maf as "Mac + 1", and that's pretty damn narrow, static, and superficial IMO


There's a difference between pretending to be here and just not buying your explanation.


Also, "pretending to be here"...like your superficial (and self admittedly so) read on me? That's not pretending?

Ok, so your plan is to tell me you're going to flip green, and ask me to form a larger PoE (which is also losing)... I'll stick to my original reads & my own game solving process tyvm. If I'm wrong, I'll look to see why my reads were wrong in post-game like I do every time.

I'm giving my perspective and asking for someone to convince me of another world that makes more sense and that has the possibility of being winning, Mac says too tired, and Falcon arbitrarily says my reads are too specific and I need to revert to a guaranteed losing stance. I don't really know what to make of it other than /ignore.

Are we just waiting for the cop to come in and save us? That's a plan, not a very good one... But as long as we're rolling dice, I don't see anything else netting the win.

NotAnAxehole wrote: ↑Tue Mar 29, 2022 1:14 pm

Master Radishes wrote: ↑Tue Mar 29, 2022 1:11 pm

falcon45ca wrote: ↑Tue Mar 29, 2022 1:06 pm Can you flesh out your sus a bit?




Also, why are you so (seemingly) comfortable w NAAs lock town read on you? I'd think it would make you wary of his slot, no?

Fleshing out would involve reading back and I'm on my phone right now and refuse to so it. Ask again later.

Asked and answered about NAA. The whole thing is typical him. I've never seen him wolf so dunno the flavour difference but he often has reads like the one on me. If he's pocketing he picked a bad choice to do it to. He recently misread me so might have double checked his algorithm or whatever. My one concern on him is unrelated to his approach to my slot.

To add on this, there's a reasonable argument to be made that MR should be more concerned about people pushing him. I know some people here are fond of TMI reads, but they are seldom right.

To be fair, MR gave me some words when I was questioning his slot early

How would you even know that Mac isn't guaranteed to be mafia if you're town in the current game state? Yes, we started from rand, but if I'm right, certain actions have dictated that one of you MUST be mafia. How could you even presume that's false when you don't even know what you're objecting to?

NotAnAxehole wrote: ↑Tue Mar 29, 2022 1:22 pm

falcon45ca wrote: ↑Tue Mar 29, 2022 1:16 pm

NotAnAxehole wrote: ↑Tue Mar 29, 2022 1:09 pm

falcon45ca wrote: ↑Tue Mar 29, 2022 12:46 pm

NotAnAxehole wrote: ↑Tue Mar 29, 2022 12:10 pm

falcon45ca wrote: ↑Tue Mar 29, 2022 11:46 am

NotAnAxehole wrote: ↑Tue Mar 29, 2022 10:28 am

Because it has to be, and the circumstances allow it to be. I would argue that my world view isn't sufficiently limited to have a winning record, even under the assumption that it's correct.

I think your first 2 points in this post are only true if you're Maf

What..? No..? You do realize this is a set up with only 2 miss elims right?

So... Even a PoE of 4 is losing right now. Basic math..?

So who's Maf when I flip green?


You've got static world views that don't have to be true...like, you're not even truly considering them to possibly be wrong.


You have MR as lock town. That's absurd

I've answered this question repeatedly & Seanzie recently mentioned it too - which basically tells me you're pretending to be here, but you're really not paying attention to anything I've written, or anything that's been discussed in the thread as of recent.

I'm sorry, but I read your answer of a world w/o me as Maf as "Mac + 1", and that's pretty damn narrow, static, and superficial IMO


There's a difference between pretending to be here and just not buying your explanation.


Also, "pretending to be here"...like your superficial (and self admittedly so) read on me? That's not pretending?

Ok, so your plan is to tell me you're going to flip green, and ask me to form a larger PoE (which is also losing)... I'll stick to my original reads & my own game solving process tyvm. If I'm wrong, I'll look to see why my reads were wrong in post-game like I do every time.

I'm giving my perspective and asking for someone to convince me of another world that makes more sense and that has the possibility of being winning, Mac says too tired, and Falcon arbitrarily says my reads are too specific and I need to revert to a guaranteed losing stance. I don't really know what to make of it other than /ignore.

Are we just waiting for the cop to come in and save us? That's a plan, not a very good one... But as long as we're rolling dice, I don't see anything else netting the win.

If LC flipped red first, where would you go from there

Porscha wrote: ↑Tue Mar 29, 2022 1:25 pm

NotAnAxehole wrote: ↑Tue Mar 29, 2022 1:22 pm

falcon45ca wrote: ↑Tue Mar 29, 2022 1:16 pm

NotAnAxehole wrote: ↑Tue Mar 29, 2022 1:09 pm

falcon45ca wrote: ↑Tue Mar 29, 2022 12:46 pm

NotAnAxehole wrote: ↑Tue Mar 29, 2022 12:10 pm

falcon45ca wrote: ↑Tue Mar 29, 2022 11:46 am

I think your first 2 points in this post are only true if you're Maf

What..? No..? You do realize this is a set up with only 2 miss elims right?

So... Even a PoE of 4 is losing right now. Basic math..?

So who's Maf when I flip green?


You've got static world views that don't have to be true...like, you're not even truly considering them to possibly be wrong.


You have MR as lock town. That's absurd

I've answered this question repeatedly & Seanzie recently mentioned it too - which basically tells me you're pretending to be here, but you're really not paying attention to anything I've written, or anything that's been discussed in the thread as of recent.

I'm sorry, but I read your answer of a world w/o me as Maf as "Mac + 1", and that's pretty damn narrow, static, and superficial IMO


There's a difference between pretending to be here and just not buying your explanation.


Also, "pretending to be here"...like your superficial (and self admittedly so) read on me? That's not pretending?

Ok, so your plan is to tell me you're going to flip green, and ask me to form a larger PoE (which is also losing)... I'll stick to my original reads & my own game solving process tyvm. If I'm wrong, I'll look to see why my reads were wrong in post-game like I do every time.

I'm giving my perspective and asking for someone to convince me of another world that makes more sense and that has the possibility of being winning, Mac says too tired, and Falcon arbitrarily says my reads are too specific and I need to revert to a guaranteed losing stance. I don't really know what to make of it other than /ignore.

Are we just waiting for the cop to come in and save us? That's a plan, not a very good one... But as long as we're rolling dice, I don't see anything else netting the win.

If LC flipped red first, where would you go from there

If LC flipped red, I would flip Falcon and Mac.

If Ender flipped red, I would flip Falcon and Mac

If Fingers flipped red, I would flip Mac

If Seanzie flipped red, I would flip Falcon and Mac

If Porscha flipped red, I would flip Mac

If MR flipped red, I would throw my entire decision making tree in the garbage and quit mafia

Did I miss anyone?

Porscha wrote: ↑Tue Mar 29, 2022 1:25 pm

NotAnAxehole wrote: ↑Tue Mar 29, 2022 1:22 pm

falcon45ca wrote: ↑Tue Mar 29, 2022 1:16 pm

NotAnAxehole wrote: ↑Tue Mar 29, 2022 1:09 pm

falcon45ca wrote: ↑Tue Mar 29, 2022 12:46 pm

NotAnAxehole wrote: ↑Tue Mar 29, 2022 12:10 pm

falcon45ca wrote: ↑Tue Mar 29, 2022 11:46 am

I think your first 2 points in this post are only true if you're Maf

What..? No..? You do realize this is a set up with only 2 miss elims right?

So... Even a PoE of 4 is losing right now. Basic math..?

So who's Maf when I flip green?


You've got static world views that don't have to be true...like, you're not even truly considering them to possibly be wrong.


You have MR as lock town. That's absurd

I've answered this question repeatedly & Seanzie recently mentioned it too - which basically tells me you're pretending to be here, but you're really not paying attention to anything I've written, or anything that's been discussed in the thread as of recent.

I'm sorry, but I read your answer of a world w/o me as Maf as "Mac + 1", and that's pretty damn narrow, static, and superficial IMO


There's a difference between pretending to be here and just not buying your explanation.


Also, "pretending to be here"...like your superficial (and self admittedly so) read on me? That's not pretending?

Ok, so your plan is to tell me you're going to flip green, and ask me to form a larger PoE (which is also losing)... I'll stick to my original reads & my own game solving process tyvm. If I'm wrong, I'll look to see why my reads were wrong in post-game like I do every time.

I'm giving my perspective and asking for someone to convince me of another world that makes more sense and that has the possibility of being winning, Mac says too tired, and Falcon arbitrarily says my reads are too specific and I need to revert to a guaranteed losing stance. I don't really know what to make of it other than /ignore.

Are we just waiting for the cop to come in and save us? That's a plan, not a very good one... But as long as we're rolling dice, I don't see anything else netting the win.

If LC flipped red first, where would you go from there

If LC flipped red, I would flip Falcon and Mac.

If Ender flipped red, I would flip Falcon and Mac

If Fingers flipped red, I would flip Mac

If Seanzie flipped red, I would flip Falcon and Mac

If Porscha flipped red, I would flip Mac

If MR flipped red, I would throw my entire decision making tree in the garbage and quit mafia

Did I miss anyone?

Ok, probably not on the last one, but whatever, I've already given my thoughts :P

The biggest question-mark is what to do if Mac flips mafia, I have no clue.

POE Ender, fingers



Outside of a aelf pres, that's likely where my vote will end up this RD

Porscha wrote: ↑Tue Mar 29, 2022 1:22 pm

NotAnAxehole wrote: ↑Tue Mar 29, 2022 1:14 pm

Master Radishes wrote: ↑Tue Mar 29, 2022 1:11 pm

falcon45ca wrote: ↑Tue Mar 29, 2022 1:06 pm Can you flesh out your sus a bit?




Also, why are you so (seemingly) comfortable w NAAs lock town read on you? I'd think it would make you wary of his slot, no?

Fleshing out would involve reading back and I'm on my phone right now and refuse to so it. Ask again later.

Asked and answered about NAA. The whole thing is typical him. I've never seen him wolf so dunno the flavour difference but he often has reads like the one on me. If he's pocketing he picked a bad choice to do it to. He recently misread me so might have double checked his algorithm or whatever. My one concern on him is unrelated to his approach to my slot.

To add on this, there's a reasonable argument to be made that MR should be more concerned about people pushing him. I know some people here are fond of TMI reads, but they are seldom right.

To be fair, MR gave me some words when I was questioning his slot early

Did I? That was nice of me.

NotAnAxehole wrote: ↑Tue Mar 29, 2022 1:24 pm How would you even know that Mac isn't guaranteed to be mafia if you're town in the current game state? Yes, we started from rand, but if I'm right, certain actions have dictated that one of you MUST be mafia. How could you even presume that's false when you don't even know what you're objecting to?

I'd object to someone calling me mafia based on their own science they will not reveal. If I was town. Or mafia for that matter. I can object if I think the answer is wrong no matter how someone got to the answer.

Like I get that's your world view atm but just because you arent willing to share and someone isnt privy to the exact reasoning behind your conclusion doesnt inherently mean it cant be objected to

NotAnAxehole wrote: ↑Tue Mar 29, 2022 1:28 pm

Porscha wrote: ↑Tue Mar 29, 2022 1:25 pm

NotAnAxehole wrote: ↑Tue Mar 29, 2022 1:22 pm

falcon45ca wrote: ↑Tue Mar 29, 2022 1:16 pm

NotAnAxehole wrote: ↑Tue Mar 29, 2022 1:09 pm

falcon45ca wrote: ↑Tue Mar 29, 2022 12:46 pm

NotAnAxehole wrote: ↑Tue Mar 29, 2022 12:10 pm

What..? No..? You do realize this is a set up with only 2 miss elims right?

So... Even a PoE of 4 is losing right now. Basic math..?

So who's Maf when I flip green?


You've got static world views that don't have to be true...like, you're not even truly considering them to possibly be wrong.


You have MR as lock town. That's absurd

I've answered this question repeatedly & Seanzie recently mentioned it too - which basically tells me you're pretending to be here, but you're really not paying attention to anything I've written, or anything that's been discussed in the thread as of recent.

I'm sorry, but I read your answer of a world w/o me as Maf as "Mac + 1", and that's pretty damn narrow, static, and superficial IMO


There's a difference between pretending to be here and just not buying your explanation.


Also, "pretending to be here"...like your superficial (and self admittedly so) read on me? That's not pretending?

Ok, so your plan is to tell me you're going to flip green, and ask me to form a larger PoE (which is also losing)... I'll stick to my original reads & my own game solving process tyvm. If I'm wrong, I'll look to see why my reads were wrong in post-game like I do every time.

I'm giving my perspective and asking for someone to convince me of another world that makes more sense and that has the possibility of being winning, Mac says too tired, and Falcon arbitrarily says my reads are too specific and I need to revert to a guaranteed losing stance. I don't really know what to make of it other than /ignore.

Are we just waiting for the cop to come in and save us? That's a plan, not a very good one... But as long as we're rolling dice, I don't see anything else netting the win.

If LC flipped red first, where would you go from there

If LC flipped red, I would flip Falcon and Mac.

If Ender flipped red, I would flip Falcon and Mac

If Fingers flipped red, I would flip Mac

If Seanzie flipped red, I would flip Falcon and Mac

If Porscha flipped red, I would flip Mac

If MR flipped red, I would throw my entire decision making tree in the garbage and quit mafia

Did I miss anyone?

I hope I flip Mafia.

Master Radishes wrote: ↑Tue Mar 29, 2022 1:36 pm

NotAnAxehole wrote: ↑Tue Mar 29, 2022 1:28 pm

Porscha wrote: ↑Tue Mar 29, 2022 1:25 pm

NotAnAxehole wrote: ↑Tue Mar 29, 2022 1:22 pm

falcon45ca wrote: ↑Tue Mar 29, 2022 1:16 pm

NotAnAxehole wrote: ↑Tue Mar 29, 2022 1:09 pm

falcon45ca wrote: ↑Tue Mar 29, 2022 12:46 pm

So who's Maf when I flip green?


You've got static world views that don't have to be true...like, you're not even truly considering them to possibly be wrong.


You have MR as lock town. That's absurd

I've answered this question repeatedly & Seanzie recently mentioned it too - which basically tells me you're pretending to be here, but you're really not paying attention to anything I've written, or anything that's been discussed in the thread as of recent.

I'm sorry, but I read your answer of a world w/o me as Maf as "Mac + 1", and that's pretty damn narrow, static, and superficial IMO


There's a difference between pretending to be here and just not buying your explanation.


Also, "pretending to be here"...like your superficial (and self admittedly so) read on me? That's not pretending?

Ok, so your plan is to tell me you're going to flip green, and ask me to form a larger PoE (which is also losing)... I'll stick to my original reads & my own game solving process tyvm. If I'm wrong, I'll look to see why my reads were wrong in post-game like I do every time.

I'm giving my perspective and asking for someone to convince me of another world that makes more sense and that has the possibility of being winning, Mac says too tired, and Falcon arbitrarily says my reads are too specific and I need to revert to a guaranteed losing stance. I don't really know what to make of it other than /ignore.

Are we just waiting for the cop to come in and save us? That's a plan, not a very good one... But as long as we're rolling dice, I don't see anything else netting the win.

If LC flipped red first, where would you go from there

If LC flipped red, I would flip Falcon and Mac.

If Ender flipped red, I would flip Falcon and Mac

If Fingers flipped red, I would flip Mac

If Seanzie flipped red, I would flip Falcon and Mac

If Porscha flipped red, I would flip Mac

If MR flipped red, I would throw my entire decision making tree in the garbage and quit mafia

Did I miss anyone?

I hope I flip Mafia.

Porscha wrote: ↑Tue Mar 29, 2022 1:36 pm

NotAnAxehole wrote: ↑Tue Mar 29, 2022 1:24 pm How would you even know that Mac isn't guaranteed to be mafia if you're town in the current game state? Yes, we started from rand, but if I'm right, certain actions have dictated that one of you MUST be mafia. How could you even presume that's false when you don't even know what you're objecting to?

I'd object to someone calling me mafia based on their own science they will not reveal. If I was town. Or mafia for that matter. I can object if I think the answer is wrong no matter how someone got to the answer.

Like I get that's your world view atm but just because you arent willing to share and someone isnt privy to the exact reasoning behind your conclusion doesnt inherently mean it cant be objected to

Ok, sure... He's objecting in principle, but not because he actually understands whether or not what I said is plausible.

I'm actually going to sheep Mac's read on Falcon for today, and vote Mac.

I say we do another four way rand again.

Okay I think I'm just going to decide to get over MR, mac, falcon, and what I believe is a well intentioned NAA

That leaves me with seanzie, LC, Fingers, Ender

I townread LC day 1 and early day 2 but theyve quietly slipped out of convo
I didnt like fingers interaction with me but there is also only so much to go off of
Seanzie and Ender I'm not sure what to do with, I think I need to get out of bed and actually ISO them or something

NotAnAxehole wrote: ↑Tue Mar 29, 2022 1:39 pm

Porscha wrote: ↑Tue Mar 29, 2022 1:36 pm

NotAnAxehole wrote: ↑Tue Mar 29, 2022 1:24 pm How would you even know that Mac isn't guaranteed to be mafia if you're town in the current game state? Yes, we started from rand, but if I'm right, certain actions have dictated that one of you MUST be mafia. How could you even presume that's false when you don't even know what you're objecting to?

I'd object to someone calling me mafia based on their own science they will not reveal. If I was town. Or mafia for that matter. I can object if I think the answer is wrong no matter how someone got to the answer.

Like I get that's your world view atm but just because you arent willing to share and someone isnt privy to the exact reasoning behind your conclusion doesnt inherently mean it cant be objected to

Ok, sure... He's objecting in principle, but not because he actually understands whether or not what I said is plausible.

Well from what I understand you insist on making about your own personal tells/reads that you wont explain. So what else do you expect someone to do. Blindly follow you?

So, the list read is quite simple (which is where the AT LEAST 1 between Falcon / Mac comes from):

It assumes that, as town, each player has a random tendency to scum read and reply to another player. The degree of "how random" needs to be calibrated for each player individually.

In a nutshell, if a player takes a bunch of actions relating to other players in close succession, or over the length of the game, it affects the mechanical probability of them having randed mafia together.

I.E. If I have a discussion with Falcon, then MR, then Porscha, then MR... What is happening is a bunch of random events have resulted in me bumping into those people in the thread. This probability assumption isn't the same if I am mafia, because I have a more targeted objective, and I may not reply to the same things, I may not have prolonged discussions at all. Humans are terrible at being random, and they typically don't understand when their actions are actually random - the goal is to exploit this, not necessarily getting direct reads of Player A is diverging from meta while Player B is within their meta, it more looks at Player A is doing things that make group of players A, B, C & D contain mafia.

For the record, that group was not Mac Falcon... As I previously explained... That group is

Mac, Falcon, NAA, MR

Now, I know I'm not mafia... You get the idea of how I got there yeah?

I can even run this using my own data, I don't actually need other players because my town randomness differs from my mafia game... The issue is if I use my own data exclusively, I can end up forming conf biases where I stop being random as town... Which actually would be good, if I was playing against myself - in the long term.