Avatar The Last Airbender Mafia postgame

[cassowary]

yeah, I think dov is the correct vote for me tomorrow

[cayvie]

i don't think it's chardonnay or wilgy

fmpov this leaves 3 teams, cayvie/fatmo, cayvie/dov, or dov/fatmo

if i can eliminate one of these i'll know who to vote

i mean i think it has to be dov/fatmo??

otherwise it's like cass/char with some hard mutual defense. bleh.

god that'd be so fuckin bold for char to say "i have this towntell for cass, wink wink" as scum partners

[cassowary]

legit if it turns out chard is scum and is leading me on with this towntell business i'll be... well, i'll be vaguely upset for like 2 seconds

but also i don't think chard being scum makes sense with this whole burn thing barring some extremely weird shenanigans so i feel p confident trusting him

[cayvie]

legit if it turns out chard is scum and is leading me on with this towntell business i'll be... well, i'll be vaguely upset for like 2 seconds

but also i don't think chard being scum makes sense with this whole burn thing barring some extremely weird shenanigans so i feel p confident trusting him

i'm with you there, i think. like that play would just be *so* daring for your first time on a new forum etc

[dov]

i never saw a real objective in voting carrot. i don't think I would've defended against the decision if I was scum

um:

not feeling anything with fatmo, may be carrotte in a scenario where i am still alive based on her knowing it's my first game knowing i will be very vulnerable (then again lots of people could've used this strategy on this basis, i just know her personally)

still wasn't strong enough evidence to make me swerve towards voting her though as I didn't see her as a present threat. if I was correct about that read anyways, I would assume myself to continue to live anyways and would prioritize on other maf member

[chardonnay]

legit if it turns out chard is scum and is leading me on with this towntell business i'll be... well, i'll be vaguely upset for like 2 seconds

but also i don't think chard being scum makes sense with this whole burn thing barring some extremely weird shenanigans so i feel p confident trusting him

i'm with you there, i think. like that play would just be *so* daring for your first time on a new forum etc

i've made my fair share of wild mafia gambits, but I'd say that this situation is not one i could pull off as scum.

i never saw a real objective in voting carrot. i don't think I would've defended against the decision if I was scum

um:

not feeling anything with fatmo, may be carrotte in a scenario where i am still alive based on her knowing it's my first game knowing i will be very vulnerable (then again lots of people could've used this strategy on this basis, i just know her personally)

still wasn't strong enough evidence to make me swerve towards voting her though as I didn't see her as a present threat. if I was correct about that read anyways, I would assume myself to continue to live anyways and would prioritize on other maf member

who was the other member? me?

[chardonnay]

i don't think it's chardonnay or wilgy

fmpov this leaves 3 teams, cayvie/fatmo, cayvie/dov, or dov/fatmo

if i can eliminate one of these i'll know who to vote

i can try and look into this too

-/-/-/

[mention]cayvie[/mention] In endgame senerios do you pull youre buddies closer, or distance yourself from them?

If you have previous examples from other games that would be appreciated.

[chardonnay]

I wish i voted DoV tbh. >.>

I feel like yesterday went to fast before i could get my crap together, and i went with my gut.

[cayvie]

i don't think it's chardonnay or wilgy

fmpov this leaves 3 teams, cayvie/fatmo, cayvie/dov, or dov/fatmo

if i can eliminate one of these i'll know who to vote

i can try and look into this too

-/-/-/

@cayvie In endgame senerios do you pull youre buddies closer, or distance yourself from them?

If you have previous examples from other games that would be appreciated.

you mean when i'm a wolf? i usually try to win as soon as possible. this is probably the best recent example of me winning as wolf.

https://www.mafiauniverse.com/forums/th ... ampionship

you can also check out pyre mafia here if you want, it has a lot of the players in this game, weird-ass mechanics tho that kinda made everyone play oddly.

viewtopic.php?f=27&t=1906

[NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME]

[mention]DrWilgy[/mention] has died, he was town and flips:

Mai (Fire Nation)

You have no abilities. You are town, and you win when all the mafia are dead.

Nobody has been burnt tonight. Today is KILO, day will end September 17, 4pm EDT or at 4 votes on a player.

Postcaps are these plus 66:



[mention]cassowary[/mention]
[mention]cayvie[/mention]
[mention]chardonnay[/mention]
[mention]dov[/mention]
[mention]Fatmo[/mention]

[cassowary]

ok f5 nobody vote cavalierly lol

[cayvie]

ok f5 nobody vote cavalierly lol

it's actually interesting because from what i can tell, it takes a 2/3 majority to chop someone, so even if a townie votes wrong, mafia can't quickhammer bc they need 4 votes right now

[cayvie]

from my perspective it basically has to be dov/fatmo.

char being wolf is just too farfetched with the burns
cass/fatmo i ruled out yesterday.

cass/dov is technically possible i suppose.

[cayvie]

Oh, we're mass claiming.

I'm June from the Fire Nation. I'm a tracker.

I tracked Long Con N1. He didn't go anywhere.

Tracked Wiggly N2. He didn't go anywhere.

I tracked Cass N3, and I got no result. I'm pretty sure this means they are Water Nation so my track doesn't work there because I'm fire.

First two nights I was going for two people me and the thread in general didn't seem to know what to make of. Cass was because a lot of people had suspected them earlier but that seemed to be kind of dying down from what I gathered. And maybe scum would have sent him to kill if they thought he was starting to be more village read.

So we know Long Con didn't do the kill N1, Wiggly didn't do it N2 (unless I was roleblocked those nights), and that Cass is likely Water Nation.

do these seem like reasonable track targets? was wilgy a suspect n2? like i mean i guess those first 2 targets were the 2 targets of our confirmed cop so i guess investigators think alike. does cass make sense as a n3 target?

@fatmo what was your result last night? why did you target cass n3?

idk what optimal phscologicy for town tracker is as some go after most scummy players, others go after players they think would preform the kill as mafia instead of explicitly scum reading them.

easiest way is to ask for Fatmo's justification.

which they've yet to check in today it seems. :/

-/-/-/-

pre-edit

I outted being water tribe at day 4 start when i mentioned getting burned.

ah yeah if you think scum!fatmo would be afraid to thunderdome you, then that means that the plan would have been to thunderdome cass, since he knew you two were the two water tribe people left.

would scum!fatmo go in on a plan of thunderdoming cass?

oh, i think this means that fatmo/cass isn't the team. hell yes, we're getting somewhere.

ah yeah this is why i ruled out fatmo/cass, because what is scum!fatmo's plan in that world. it relies on char's read on fatmo being correct.

[cayvie]

do we want to set up a vote order? i think it's a good plan to force scummier players to vote first, in a situation like this.

my proposed order would be:

1 dov
2 fatmo
3 cayvie
4 cass
5 char

[cassowary]

yeah, I think that makes sense esp since as you pointed out we actually need 2/3 to hammer which i did forget

i bet chard would want to swap you and fatmo in the list tho

[mention]chardonnay[/mention], what's informing your fatmo read? are you still townreading fatmo over cayvie? can't decide tbh :/

[mention]Fatmo[/mention], do you have a track result?

i doubt anyone will take issue with putting dov first on the list though, so [mention]dov[/mention] you should go ahead and vote for someone

[cayvie]

yeah, I think that makes sense esp since as you pointed out we actually need 2/3 to hammer which i did forget

i bet chard would want to swap you and fatmo in the list tho

@chardonnay, what's informing your fatmo read? are you still townreading fatmo over cayvie? can't decide tbh :/

@Fatmo, do you have a track result?

i doubt anyone will take issue with putting dov first on the list though, so @dov you should go ahead and vote for someone

yeah actually i would be fine with char just picking an order if he wants

[chardonnay]

General notice that im going to try and evaluate as much as possible, and explore some topics that may not be likely.

-/-/-/-

I read through some of cayvie's champ game from mafia universe. The end game specifically. She keeps her allies in a nullish area during endgame there.

This game i noticed that past few days Cayvie outted suspicion for most the roster currently alive at one point or another. Except for me, but i was semi-cleared from burns so thats understand able for her to trust in. I believe that would point her not being with Fatmo, or DoV, this game, since shes hard selling them as a team. Probably dov moreso since he is probably her vote today, if she votes him then she wouldnt have to bus Fatmo. If shes mafia its with Cassowary most liekly. THats not really a world i find as likely as Fatmo/Dov. But its worth considering.

I think that there is some things to take into account, like her being on the verge of a prefect victory in her champ game might discourage her bussing. Whereas this game she lost mafia fam early on in the game. So she may be more inclined to play survivalistically.

@cayvie if you have more scum games demonstrating your typical endgame play please share. Im not sure if Poir mafia is worth exploring if its not your typical scum game play.
-/-/-/

also aside that cayvie seemed a lot more theatrical in her scum game, compared to this game where she seems focused on playing the game and avoided tangets.

-/-/-/-

Pre-edit

I dont know about voting order just yet. Im fine to have DOV lead RN tho. (Votes are retractable this Endgame right?)

[chardonnay]

yeah, I think that makes sense esp since as you pointed out we actually need 2/3 to hammer which i did forget

i bet chard would want to swap you and fatmo in the list tho

@chardonnay, what's informing your fatmo read? are you still townreading fatmo over cayvie? can't decide tbh :/

@Fatmo, do you have a track result?

i doubt anyone will take issue with putting dov first on the list though, so @dov you should go ahead and vote for someone

The thing about Fatmo is that i don't understand scum coming into a masscliam. Seeing thier still widely town read. Then claiming their legit PR role instead of VT. Claiming VT would be much safer.

[chardonnay]

I guess you said dov/carotte earlier but like, now you're saying one of me or fatmo is mad? how does that square

i... would appreciate some other eyes on this exchange. i'm starting to feel like you're not engaging in good faith here, cass.

like, i hadn't put it together that you or fatmo is probably maf when i thought dov/carot was the most likely team. so no, right now, i don't think dov/carot is the team, because that team does not leave fatmo alive.

unless they really thought long con had to go? he was gunning for dov pretty hard. idk. i don't think it's them.

i think fatmo/dov makes sense. they would kill long con for being onto the whole "mj busing a partner" business.

who did fatmo say he tracked again

Cayvie... if fatmo was mafia, and was not in any hot water... then why would they cliam anything other then VT?

b/c claiming Tracker means that going into a lylo situation as unkilled claimed PR is going to look super bad

i mean it doesn't tho because there's water tribe people around and he can be like "they didn't need to kill me, they left me alive bc they knew they were safe from my track"

THing is that i dont think Fatmo ever has the charisma as scum to push that argument.

They've very much been dedicated to sheeping within their TR's and thats it. They aren't super self-motivated in a way that lets them set-up to push townie water tribe in lylo. In fact Fatmo was Town reading me EoD4 I believe. After mass claim were scum!Fatmo would need to plant a SR on me or something. I dont think they have a current read on Cass.

They were also town reading you last i checked. SO that means that they really came into today with thier pants down if thier scum. They dont really have a team to push. Even tho they arent a strong presence this game i feel Fatmo is smart enough to realize the bad position they were putting themselves in. Whereas town is not aware b/c they actually think their reads could flip mafia.

[chardonnay]

do we want to set up a vote order? i think it's a good plan to force scummier players to vote first, in a situation like this.

my proposed order would be:

1 dov
2 fatmo
3 cayvie
4 cass
5 char

yeah, I think that makes sense esp since as you pointed out we actually need 2/3 to hammer which i did forget

i bet chard would want to swap you and fatmo in the list tho

@chardonnay, what's informing your fatmo read? are you still townreading fatmo over cayvie? can't decide tbh :/

@Fatmo, do you have a track result?

i doubt anyone will take issue with putting dov first on the list though, so @dov you should go ahead and vote for someone

If this really is Cavie, and Cass, it would make sense to support my position of power as a town leader, and point me at DoV.

[chardonnay]

cayive could just be ditching DOV here, and hoping to win a 3 way with Cassowary, and fatmo.

THat might actully make more sense then Cayvie and Cass togather.

Something doesnt feel right about FatmoXDoV.

I should investigate Cassowary a bit more. I sorta hand waved them as sorted a for a while, and thats dangerous since we're in lylo

[chardonnay]

[mention]Fatmo[/mention]
Could you do me a favor and share prevous scum games of yours?

-/-/-/-/-

[mention]cassowary[/mention]
Talk to me about Fatmo's claim, do you think Fatmo cliams tracker in thier position as mafia?

[chardonnay]

fatmo is still alive.
fatmo has claimed fire nation tracker

to me this either says:
fatmo is mafia
there's a water tribe person in the mafia team who can't get tracked by fatmo

So, you think there's mafia in { me, chardonnay, fatmo }?

Isn't it possible mafia just killed off one of the green-checked people because they didn't want to narrow the pool of unconfirmed town?

To clarify here, had mafia killed off Fatmo, they'd essentially narrow the mafia pool down to you, Carot, and dov, where 2/3 of those were mafia. Bad odds. Fatmo isn't remotely cleared by this of course, but I don't think killing LC means as much as you're making it out to mean.

I think this kind of questioning of an allies push onto a townie is dangerous b/c if partner supplies reasonable explanation why what thier buddy is pushing is incorrect, then that could ruin the push and cost mafia the game. This is more specific to the game being so close to bieng done. mafia need their plans to go down w/o a hitch more now then ever.

i'll probably flip onto cayvie to break the tie if it's still a tie in like an hour. bc ties are broken by the mafia, so if cayvie's maf, there's no sense in giving them the choice, and if cayvie is town then we're ending up with a misflip no matter whether or not we're tied

Cassowary casually offering to flip cayvie to break the tie is also really risky.

Cassowary as scum alone would be facing DoV, Fatmo in 3 way most liekly. Fatmo can clear DOV as town due to no movement at night. So Cass is forced into a 1v1 right away.

I guess Cassowary could take me to 3 way with Fatmo since Fatmo cant clear either of us. But still thats p risky.

[chardonnay]

So Cass and CAyvie is a no-go.

Fatmo i think is town, but i would like to talk about it more w/ others.

Teams is most likely DoV, and one of Cassowary/Cayvie.

[cassowary]

cayive could just be ditching DOV here, and hoping to win a 3 way with Cassowary, and fatmo.

This is my #1 fear rn. I doubt it's Cayvie+Fatmo, but I don't know whether I should trust Cayvie or Fatmo in that case.

Re fatmo's claim, yeah that is definitely kind of weird. The only scum motive I can really think of would be, like, if fatmo claimed VT and they were worried someone else would later turn out to be an investigative (like, watcher or something) who could spot fatmo visiting someone (either for track or kill) and call them out. But I think in that case when the doc is dead, why not just kill the investigator next night before they have the chance to spot you? It's a massclaim, you know who they would be. So I think that's kind of a weird choice to make for scum in this position :/

On the other hand this is kind of wifom especially in this game where roles are alignment blind; like maybe fatmo is scum and claimed tracker bc it doesn't say anything about his alignment and claiming a PR gives him a bit of town cred. (although it also makes people more suspicious of you when you aren't dead... so like... hmm)

In a town fatmo world do you think Cayvie/dov leave fatmo alive when the risk of getting caught is so high? I guess yeah because if they got rid of fatmo they'd have to try to make everyone vote me... and because it'd be easy to write off fatmo's results as trying to frame Cayvie or whatever. I guess it wouldn't be too hard to wifom out of that situation.

I really wish we'd already flipped Cayvie. I'm sorry about that, I know dead chat probably wants to kill us right now.

[cassowary]

the more I think about this the more I'm convinced that if fatmo is scum then this is a really weird/bad move on their part

on the other hand I can see fatmo/dov who aren't exactly the most engaged with the game, just deciding to have fatmo claim their real role bc why not, and not thinking about the logistics of being a claimed power role at KILO

but I think assuming some modicum of planning on scum's part that probably makes fatmo town? it's like a weird backwards thing, where if they did just make this bad decision, they might have just won with it since we're all so confused lol

[cassowary]

I don't really think I buy Cayvie's logic that she and dov would have killed fatmo bc of the risk of getting caught, when it would be pretty easy to just claim fatmo was lying scum trying to frame one of them if fatmo happened to track them successfully

I also feel like that logic over fatmo being alive coming from Cayvie felt a bit... neat? like the logic perfectly worked to cast suspicion on everyone unconfirmed except Cayvie and dov. But I'm nervous to cast judgement based on this because my gut feelings have been trash this game lol

[chardonnay]

cayive could just be ditching DOV here, and hoping to win a 3 way with Cassowary, and fatmo.

This is my #1 fear rn. I doubt it's Cayvie+Fatmo, but I don't know whether I should trust Cayvie or Fatmo in that case.

Re fatmo's claim, yeah that is definitely kind of weird. The only scum motive I can really think of would be, like, if fatmo claimed VT and they were worried someone else would later turn out to be an investigative (like, watcher or something) who could spot fatmo visiting someone (either for track or kill) and call them out. But I think in that case when the doc is dead, why not just kill the investigator next night before they have the chance to spot you? It's a massclaim, you know who they would be. So I think that's kind of a weird choice to make for scum in this position :/

On the other hand this is kind of wifom especially in this game where roles are alignment blind; like maybe fatmo is scum and claimed tracker bc it doesn't say anything about his alignment and claiming a PR gives him a bit of town cred. (although it also makes people more suspicious of you when you aren't dead... so like... hmm)

In a town fatmo world do you think Cayvie/dov leave fatmo alive when the risk of getting caught is so high? I guess yeah because if they got rid of fatmo they'd have to try to make everyone vote me... and because it'd be easy to write off fatmo's results as trying to frame Cayvie or whatever. I guess it wouldn't be too hard to wifom out of that situation.

I really wish we'd already flipped Cayvie. I'm sorry about that, I know dead chat probably wants to kill us right now.

I dont think CayvieXFatmo is ever a thing. Fatmo was pretty widely town read, nobody really messing with that slot. Then Cayvie comes in and makes it look as scummy as DoV. Thats some really wild bussing that risks them the game for no reason.

Yeah... i was wondering "what if" Fatmo claimed w/o thinking of ramifications as scum. I feel like Scum wouldnt do that, but i its not impossible.

hmmm, actully in a CayviexDov would that probably would hit Fatmo. Or if not Cayvie would act more appeasing towards Fatmo, b/c as Fatmo's strongest town read Cayvie was not at much risk to be tracked. But with the stuff she was pushing yesterday Fatmo may decide to track Cayvie. So cayvie willingly puts herself in a bad position pushing on Fatmo yesterday as scum.

In a cavyie scum world is she most afraid of LC/Wigley/Fatmo?

LC might be a weird start since he wasn't scum reading her (tho he was scum reading DOV), wigley was an obstacle in a lylo, fatmo was potentially an obstacle depending where they tracked.

[chardonnay]

Ugh, mechanically a town fatmo really points towards Cass scum. Any team with cassowary isnt afraid of a tracker. So cop clears always take precedence.

Cass, if youre scum, you really stepped up your game this time around. Like wow...

[cassowary]

Lol, I wish I was this good as scum.

Why does town fatmo point towards me being scum, specifically? Does that mean fatmo is scum fmpov? :o

[cassowary]

Oh, duh, because fatmo can't track me due to element stuff. Yeah that's Cayvie's thought as well. But I guess that doesn't actually help me resolve whether or not to trust fatmo... :/

[dov]

voting cayvie, already said i would essentially lock in a vote for her. been busy with irl stuff, so sorry about that. i assume this will be permissible maf win w/ me being chopped

[chardonnay]

Thanks DoV.

Who do you think is scum with Cayvie?

[chardonnay]

wish Fatmo would hurry up and out thier result. We're almost halfway through this day phase. :/

Ill be back tonight as usual.

If anybody has things for me to reread please do point me in that direction.

[cayvie]

i think it's my turn. ultimately i just don't see a world where dov is town. [VOTE: dov] aubergine

this probably means it's gonna be me/fatmo/cass tomorrow. tho maybe there's still a doctor out there, so that might shake things up? afaik we still don't know why char didn't die from the burns

like at this point the only world i see where dov is town is one where char is mafia and burned himself twice, and, honestly, im almost okay losing to that. i guess that would make either him or cass a mafia doctor?

[cassowary]

fatmo... where'd you go? do you have a track result? what's your vote?

honestly fatmo not being here is making me distrust them more - fatmo if you're town, don't make us lose this way

[Fatmo]

I tracked Cay and they went nowhere.

Bleh, I never get to catch anyone.

I'm leaning towards voting Dov. I'll try to look a bit more into them later tonight or sometime before the deadline if I can. It's F5 so I should at least try to do that, and there's time. Not voting yet because hammer. But that's where I'm thinking.

[cayvie]

I tracked Cay and they went nowhere.

Bleh, I never get to catch anyone.

I'm leaning towards voting Dov. I'll try to look a bit more into them later tonight or sometime before the deadline if I can. It's F5 so I should at least try to do that, and there's time. Not voting yet because hammer. But that's where I'm thinking.

ehhhhh gross.

[VOTE: fatmo] aubergine

[cassowary]

[VOTE: dov] aubergine

[cayvie]

I tracked Cay and they went nowhere.

Bleh, I never get to catch anyone.

I'm leaning towards voting Dov. I'll try to look a bit more into them later tonight or sometime before the deadline if I can. It's F5 so I should at least try to do that, and there's time. Not voting yet because hammer. But that's where I'm thinking.

where you atmo

[chardonnay]

Maybe Fatmo is just scum that didnt realize the ramifications of claiming their role when they did. :/

A lot of the reasons I thought they were town were tied to me thinking that scum them would be aware that they were making things harder for themselves. Which given how roughly Fatmo has been follow the game... idk

[Fatmo]

I mean I'm pretty surprised I'm still alive as an outed tracker lol. I thought I wouldn't last until now.

I claimed when I did because I wanted to help the more active players solve the game with whatever info could be gained from my tracks and claim. And so if I actually caught a scum it wouldn't be a complete blindside with no reason to believe me. I thought about not claiming and continuing to just try to track people, but figured I'd go along with the massclaim to contribute my piece to the puzzle, since I at least had the clears I already had and the fact that Cass was likely Water Tribe.

[chardonnay]

i think it's my turn. ultimately i just don't see a world where dov is town. [VOTE: dov] aubergine

this probably means it's gonna be me/fatmo/cass tomorrow. tho maybe there's still a doctor out there, so that might shake things up? afaik we still don't know why char didn't die from the burns

like at this point the only world i see where dov is town is one where char is mafia and burned himself twice, and, honestly, im almost okay losing to that. i guess that would make either him or cass a mafia doctor?

their aren't any alignment specific roles tho, so mafia wouldnt get a dedicated mafia doc. And i doubt there are two docs with that'd be OP if they both randed town.

do you have any good points for why its DoVxFatmo?

I understand that its them together, or me, and im less likely scum by comparison. But from my PoV idk if you're town. Can you help me see it?

[chardonnay]

I mean I'm pretty surprised I'm still alive as an outed tracker lol. I thought I wouldn't last until now.

I claimed when I did because I wanted to help the more active players solve the game with whatever info could be gained from my tracks and claim. And so if I actually caught a scum it wouldn't be a complete blindside with no reason to believe me. I thought about not claiming and continuing to just try to track people, but figured I'd go along with the massclaim to contribute my piece to the puzzle, since I at least had the clears I already had and the fact that Cass was likely Water Tribe.

Can i see some prevous scum games of yours?

[Fatmo]

I think the following is the only game I've played as scum for like a year. Even though I mentioned I was busy or whatever a bit on D1 there like I have here, I was still much more active there than I've been here. Trying to manipulate things and whatnot.

https://www.playdiplomacy.com/forum/vie ... 14&t=60569

[chardonnay]

Most likely team is DoV, and Cayvie. imo Cayive was just willing to hard bus to play counterintuitive to the meta she provided. DoV playing into that as well by voting Cayvie here. Hard mutual bussing since as a team they couldn't reliably win together. I mean fatmo existing is also a great deal of pressure on them. If Fatmo reads one of them correctly they had to be prepared ahead of time. Then also the long list of dead townies SR DoV is also something stressful for CayvieXDoV that motivates bussing.

Fatmo could be with DoV, though nothing really points to it directly so far. I would be surprised if its Fatmo, and Cayvie, together.

Dont really feel like its Cassowary anymore. I was probably getting unduly worked up over a niche scenario yesterday.

[chardonnay]

I think the following is the only game I've played as scum for like a year. Even though I mentioned I was busy or whatever a bit on D1 there like I have here, I was still much more active there than I've been here. Trying to manipulate things and whatnot.

https://www.playdiplomacy.com/forum/vie ... 14&t=60569

is there a way to iso on Diplomacy?

[cayvie]

i think it's my turn. ultimately i just don't see a world where dov is town. [VOTE: dov] aubergine

this probably means it's gonna be me/fatmo/cass tomorrow. tho maybe there's still a doctor out there, so that might shake things up? afaik we still don't know why char didn't die from the burns

like at this point the only world i see where dov is town is one where char is mafia and burned himself twice, and, honestly, im almost okay losing to that. i guess that would make either him or cass a mafia doctor?

their aren't any alignment specific roles tho, so mafia wouldnt get a dedicated mafia doc. And i doubt there are two docs with that'd be OP if they both randed town.

do you have any good points for why its DoVxFatmo?

I understand that its them together, or me, and im less likely scum by comparison. But from my PoV idk if you're town. Can you help me see it?

well i assume a doc would be mafia because a town doc would have claimed, and someone stopped the burns. i guess it could be a mafia backup too, who took nutella's role.

i don't really know how to make you see that i'm town. it's kind of the mixed blessing of being in the POE, that i feel like i have a clearer view of the game because i can eliminate myself from consideration. i guess i just gotta ask who i would be partnered with

cayvie-cass: do you think i jump onto cass day 1, when it's 7-4 in favor of jiwon?
cayvie-dov: do you think we leave fatmo, who can track either of us, alive?
cayvie-fatmo: do you think i let him claim tracker, for one?

[Fatmo]

This GM made ISO links in the OP of that game.