Solar System Mafia [END]

[Porscha]

I think I am concerned with Roxy and rico the most from reading epi and like
Rico was cw
And roxy jumped on my pewr tmi read on psv

But also zenon exists idk

[Thunal33]

I thought I'd get NKed so I'm a little surprised at that choice.

[Thunal33]

There's not a lot of PSV content to go off of but what I saw had a couple minor town pings. Her immediately townreading Roxy for frustration looks good in hindsight since I feel like a wolf would keep what is probably t!Roxy in the PoE. I also like that she asked me to read Zenon and pushed Rico over Zenon after I gave a townlean.

you like a lot of things which is nice but you should consider that you could be getting pocketed or that just b/c someone gives in and provides a tr after a sr does not make them townier

There's not a lot of PSV content to go off of but what I saw had a couple minor town pings. Her immediately townreading Roxy for frustration looks good in hindsight since I feel like a wolf would keep what is probably t!Roxy in the PoE. I also like that she asked me to read Zenon and pushed Rico over Zenon after I gave a townlean.

you like a lot of things which is nice but you should consider that you could be getting pocketed or that just b/c someone gives in and provides a tr after a sr does not make them townier

I think a lot of people have been towny this game so it's hard to me to find a solve. It's not a general tell, it's that in this specific case I think it's a little more likely to come from a town to immediately TR Roxy for the frustration and not falter when Roxy was under a lot of pressure and scum might keep their options open.

was psv the first person to extend that sentiment? I read it and immediately thought it was very towny

Porscha is in my PoE because I think her EoD is wolfy. She tried to talk me off defending PSV then got cold feet and voted Zenon at 8:58 right before EoD. It reads like she wanted to get PSV eliminated and subtly swayed the thread that way but tried not to get her own hands dirty.

[Thunal33]

Where I'm at right now:
Town:
Zenon
Splints
Roxy
PoE:
Falcon
Porscha
Rico

[Porscha]

There's not a lot of PSV content to go off of but what I saw had a couple minor town pings. Her immediately townreading Roxy for frustration looks good in hindsight since I feel like a wolf would keep what is probably t!Roxy in the PoE. I also like that she asked me to read Zenon and pushed Rico over Zenon after I gave a townlean.

you like a lot of things which is nice but you should consider that you could be getting pocketed or that just b/c someone gives in and provides a tr after a sr does not make them townier

There's not a lot of PSV content to go off of but what I saw had a couple minor town pings. Her immediately townreading Roxy for frustration looks good in hindsight since I feel like a wolf would keep what is probably t!Roxy in the PoE. I also like that she asked me to read Zenon and pushed Rico over Zenon after I gave a townlean.

you like a lot of things which is nice but you should consider that you could be getting pocketed or that just b/c someone gives in and provides a tr after a sr does not make them townier

I think a lot of people have been towny this game so it's hard to me to find a solve. It's not a general tell, it's that in this specific case I think it's a little more likely to come from a town to immediately TR Roxy for the frustration and not falter when Roxy was under a lot of pressure and scum might keep their options open.

was psv the first person to extend that sentiment? I read it and immediately thought it was very towny

Porscha is in my PoE because I think her EoD is wolfy. She tried to talk me off defending PSV then got cold feet and voted Zenon at 8:58 right before EoD. It reads like she wanted to get PSV eliminated and subtly swayed the thread that way but tried not to get her own hands dirty.

I became aware that psv no longer seemed wolfy and the eod in general was bad which is what made me change my mind

I could have just as easily not moved my vote and committed to the bit if it was fake lol

[Porscha]

Zenon still wolfy for ate'ing while being on a moral tirade when I know her morals say ate is wolfy

[Thunal33]

There's not a lot of PSV content to go off of but what I saw had a couple minor town pings. Her immediately townreading Roxy for frustration looks good in hindsight since I feel like a wolf would keep what is probably t!Roxy in the PoE. I also like that she asked me to read Zenon and pushed Rico over Zenon after I gave a townlean.

you like a lot of things which is nice but you should consider that you could be getting pocketed or that just b/c someone gives in and provides a tr after a sr does not make them townier

There's not a lot of PSV content to go off of but what I saw had a couple minor town pings. Her immediately townreading Roxy for frustration looks good in hindsight since I feel like a wolf would keep what is probably t!Roxy in the PoE. I also like that she asked me to read Zenon and pushed Rico over Zenon after I gave a townlean.

you like a lot of things which is nice but you should consider that you could be getting pocketed or that just b/c someone gives in and provides a tr after a sr does not make them townier

I think a lot of people have been towny this game so it's hard to me to find a solve. It's not a general tell, it's that in this specific case I think it's a little more likely to come from a town to immediately TR Roxy for the frustration and not falter when Roxy was under a lot of pressure and scum might keep their options open.

was psv the first person to extend that sentiment? I read it and immediately thought it was very towny

Porscha is in my PoE because I think her EoD is wolfy. She tried to talk me off defending PSV then got cold feet and voted Zenon at 8:58 right before EoD. It reads like she wanted to get PSV eliminated and subtly swayed the thread that way but tried not to get her own hands dirty.

I became aware that psv no longer seemed wolfy and the eod in general was bad which is what made me change my mind

I could have just as easily not moved my vote and committed to the bit if it was fake lol

wdym by the EoD in general was bad?

[Porscha]

Thunal can you agree with me that Roxy's eod was wolfy

[Porscha]

There's not a lot of PSV content to go off of but what I saw had a couple minor town pings. Her immediately townreading Roxy for frustration looks good in hindsight since I feel like a wolf would keep what is probably t!Roxy in the PoE. I also like that she asked me to read Zenon and pushed Rico over Zenon after I gave a townlean.

you like a lot of things which is nice but you should consider that you could be getting pocketed or that just b/c someone gives in and provides a tr after a sr does not make them townier

There's not a lot of PSV content to go off of but what I saw had a couple minor town pings. Her immediately townreading Roxy for frustration looks good in hindsight since I feel like a wolf would keep what is probably t!Roxy in the PoE. I also like that she asked me to read Zenon and pushed Rico over Zenon after I gave a townlean.

you like a lot of things which is nice but you should consider that you could be getting pocketed or that just b/c someone gives in and provides a tr after a sr does not make them townier

I think a lot of people have been towny this game so it's hard to me to find a solve. It's not a general tell, it's that in this specific case I think it's a little more likely to come from a town to immediately TR Roxy for the frustration and not falter when Roxy was under a lot of pressure and scum might keep their options open.

was psv the first person to extend that sentiment? I read it and immediately thought it was very towny

Porscha is in my PoE because I think her EoD is wolfy. She tried to talk me off defending PSV then got cold feet and voted Zenon at 8:58 right before EoD. It reads like she wanted to get PSV eliminated and subtly swayed the thread that way but tried not to get her own hands dirty.

I became aware that psv no longer seemed wolfy and the eod in general was bad which is what made me change my mind

I could have just as easily not moved my vote and committed to the bit if it was fake lol

wdym by the EoD in general was bad?

I don't know how to really describe that I could tell psv was not wolfy and epi almost hammered her had I not moved when I did, nobody was trying to get over a different wagon, etc

The gamestate told me she was probably town but she also didnt want to tie with rico and I also really thought rico was town and nobody would zenon wagon with me so it was all bad

[Thunal33]

I've cooled on Roxy.

I don't think fingersplints is mafia.

falcon, maybe, but if you haven't the time, you haven't the time. Posts there look organic rather than "I've got to say something." Not a vote for me today.

I don't like Rico daring me to take the bait in voting him, and maybe that's his out today, but I'm not taking it.

Thunal is playing the best mafia member I've seen in a while if that is indeed the case. Very strategic if bad. Also not a vote for me today.

That leaves me with Porscha, potentialsheltervet, and Zenon.

Epi had Porscha, PSV, Zenon, and Rico in his PoE. As far as whether he was killed for reads, I don't know, but there has to be a reason why he was killed over me.

[Thunal33]

Thunal can you agree with me that Roxy's eod was wolfy

It's a bunch of nothing and she voted PSV just to break the tie. I'm not sure if it's wolfy for her but I'd find it wolfy in a vacuum.

[Thunal33]

I still think the sequence of Roxy dipping after her frustration and then regaining motivation was towny though.

[Ricochet]

Worked on this throughout the Night lock (click to open / enlarge)

[Ricochet]

1 PSV
#583 Porscha – seems to have been a poke-vote, with the expectation of PSV interpreting as omgus

2 Roxy – 1 PSV
Epignosis parked his vote on Roxy being “still” mafia. Thunal looks at Epig-Roxy interaction as potentially containing one wolf, deciding Roxy is the better candidate, disliking her D1 late post

2 Roxy – 1 PSV – 1 Splints
#613 Zenon parks her vote on Splints being “still mafia”

2 Roxy – 2 PSV
#635 Zenon moves to PSV, I can discern no reasoning, except maybe taking Porscha’s word that PSV pushed a “polarized” pocket read on her

2 Roxy – 2 PSV – 1 Falcon
#641 temp parked my vote on falcon for same D1 reasoning. This is also the post in which I argued that current gamestate has too many inactives, enough to not mind eliming them, if nothing changes. This was repeatedly twisted as I want nothing but lynch inactives.

3 Roxy – 1 PSV – 1 Falcon
#656 Zenon sanctions Roxy outburst

3 Roxy – 1 PSV – 1 Zenon
#662 I snap at Zenon’s Roxy vote reaction and hammer talk

3 Roxy – 1 PSV – 2 Zenon
#677 Splints does a Rondo round of votes and votes Zenon last. At this point, Zenon becomes a wagon, but not top wagon, and she claimed in accusing me that my snap vote pushed her to three.

2 Roxy – 1 PSV – 2 Zenon – 1 Falcon
#685 Thunal moves from Roxy (giving her breathing time) to Falcon (unreasoned or unclear if from an earlier reasoning)

2 Roxy – 1 PSV – 2 Falcon – 1 Zenon
#692 I move back to Falcon, which was meant just to go back to the original state of pressure voting an inactive, until pending better reads. This is also a post that got heat for not being serious hunting either way (which I never claimed it was and it sounds unreasonable to demand to have been at, like, the 10hour mark of a 48hour phase).

2 Falcon – 1 Roxy – 1 PSV – 1 Zenon – 1 Unvote
#711 Zenon unvotes off Roxy, out of frustration (? #713) of not having adequate wolfreads

2 Falcon – 2 Zenon – 1 Roxy – 1 Unvote
#716 Porscha votes Zenon for something about her Rondo reads and night kill opinion. This might also be the post that Zenon remembered having had 2 votes (thus a main wagon), but it is therefore inaccurate that my vote pushed her to “top wagon”.

3 Zenon – 2 Falcon – 1 Roxy – 1 Unvote
#736 PSV votes Zenon, deemed “question mark” and probably for an unconvincing POE (though this was probably a misunderstanding on PSV’s behalf). This is probably the post Zenon remembers having been a serious wagon, 2 votes shy of hammer.

2 Zenon – 2 Falcon – 1 Roxy – 1 Rico – 1 Unvote
#742 & #744 PSV deems me lynch-worthy, this was much later reasoned as me not having enthusiasm and not pushing stuff, which was the prevalent lynch-motive for an early phase in which I didn’t set out to push or conclude anything.

2 Zenon – 2 Falcon – 2 Rico – 1 Roxy
#748 & #749 Zenon displeased with my “shit-reason” vote and subsequent bail. As noted, she remembered faultily that my vote would have made her gain traction.

2 Falcon – 2 Rico – 1 Zenon – 1 Roxy – 1 PSV
#763 Porscha back on PSV (for…?)

2 Falcon – 2 Rico – 1 Zenon – 1 Roxy – 1 PSV – 1 Splints
#814 Falcon votes splints on defending LHF, but not sanctioning / voting pushers

3 Rico – 1 Falcon – 1 Zenon – 1 Roxy – 1 PSV – 1 Splints
#872 Voted by Thunal for not pressuring my reads

2 Rico – 1 Falcon – 1 Zenon – 1 Roxy – 1 PSV – 1 Splints – 1 Epignosis
#915 Thunal switches to Epignosis (to … shake up status quo or - #923 – having him in his PoE)

2 Rico – 1 Falcon – 1 Zenon – 1 PSV – 1 Splints – 1 Epignosis – 1 Unvote
#954 Epignosis moves to unvote, assumingly to look further (or not vote me, despite a “taunt” to do so)

2 Rico – 1 Falcon – 1 Zenon – 1 PSV – 1 Splints – 2 Unvote
#967 Thunal moves to unvote, doesn’t want pressure on Epig, not willing to push me to 3 votes

2 Rico – 2 PSV – 1 Zenon - 1 Splints – 2 Unvote
#972 Cast my final vote on PSV based off reads

2 Rico – 2 PSV – 2 Zenon - 2 Unvote
#976 Falcon makes 2-2-2 with Zenon vote, unreasoned (except that didn’t found me wolfy vs PSV)

2 Rico – 2 PSV – 2 Zenon – 1 Porscha - 1 Unvote
#984 Epignosis votes Porscha, as his PoE pick

3 PSV – 2 Rico - 1 Zenon – 1 Porscha - 1 Unvote
#985 Falcon moves on PSV based on Porscha ping (the Rondo question)

3 PSV – 3 Rico – 1 Zenon – 1 Porscha
#1003 Thunal back on me, prefers me over PSV or Porscha

4 PSV – 3 Rico – 1 Zenon – 1 Porscha
#1026 Roxy decides on PSV, just to break tie

3 PSV – 3 Rico – 2 Zenon – 1 Porscha
#1033 Porscha drops PSV and moves on Zenon (thinks it was better)

4 PSV – 3 Rico – 2 Zenon
#1037 Epignosis breaks tie to lynch PSV and seals it

[Ricochet]

Several curiosities and takes:

1. Porscha’s last-minute switch off the mislynch (Epignosis stated that he almost hammered it) should in all likelihood not prove a wolf move – in that, I can’t think why a wolf would make themselves look so sketchy by getting jitters on capitalizing a mislynch they had drafted as part of the PoE and stayed on for almost the entire phase. I am more accustomed (from the Anniv 4 game) to town questioning their choices and/or 180ing wagons and/or CFD’ing so last moment style – unless this move itself is one mighty psych tactic.

2. There should be almost no worlds in which Falcon or Porscha are teamed with Zenon, given how their switch votes on Zenon could have impacted her lynch (near buss scenario). Falcon made it 2-2-2, Porscha made it so Zenon could have entered a tie-break (had PSV self-pres’d) – both among the worst odds of getting their teammate chopped. There’s also Splints to add to this thought process; a wolf team-up would already be weird or unlikely to consider, given their thread infighting (worst case scenario, a quite deplorable and ugly gambit of distancing); an early buss-vote plant, with little control over how Zenon’s lynch could unfold or not, would also be an unlikely

3. Splints was active up until Epignosis unvoted (Roxy) and the state of the vote was a very spread out Rico 2 - Falcon 1 - Zenon 1 - PSV 1 - Splints 1 - Epig 1. For all their shared animosity, I think Splints failed to mention whether she in fact sees a wolf play in Zenon; on the other hand, she expressed enough displeasure, on principle or on several pings, in regards to me. So I’m puzzled as to why she did not choose to put her final vote on me, given momentum and a stronger wolfy read of me. Perhaps a wolf hesitance to cast a stamp on a mislynch.

4. Same puzzlement on why Epig never voted to flip and solve me, after a week-long placement in his PoE. He did not state that he no longer reads me wolf, just that he won’t react on principle or just give me a pass in light of a perceived taunt. But here’s the thing, since Epignosis broke the tie in the end: I don’t think wolf Epignosis would have cared one bit which way to swing between two townies, that he had crafted suspicions on.

[Ricochet]

Bottom line, two out of three wagons were town (PSV and myself) and were the strongest wagons during almost the entire EoD (Zenon wagon very marginal and a very last-minute push into contention). It’s likely one wolf or both was on these wagons.

How do I feel about my wagon voters’ motives?
-- Thunal voted me for a wrong picture of my gameplay or out of an over-demand that I had been serious (or more serious) in my gameplay.
-- Zenon voted me for an inaccurate or, worse, inflate picture of my gameplay.
-- PSV rip
I think Splints could have also voted me, she seemed to distrust every bit of my D2 gameplay and agreed with suspicions on me. Imagining a wolf Splints scenario, this sequence of suss’ing me but never voting me would look very sketchy and non-committal.
I think Epignosis could have also voted me off. Imagining a wolf Epignosis scenario, I can’t think of a reason why he would have spared me.

How do I feel about PSV’s voters’ motives?
-- I'm town, already proving mastery in mislynching
-- Falcon sheeped Porscha’s take on PSV
-- Roxy made a tiebreak vote, unreasoned
-- Epignosis rip also made a tiebreak vote, having profiled PSV as mafia in one prior post. As I’ve said, wolf Epignosis would have had mislynches on both scales of the balance, therefore likely not give a damn which mislynch to carry through.
-- There was also Porscha with a close-to-permanent vote on PSV. Was her reasoning (the a-ha on a potential TMI) the most enlightening and convincing? Wouldn’t say so upon re-read. But as I’ve said, a wolf Porscha not remaining content to bury PSV for good would be a very odd choice of a shady EoD move to make and be judged for.
-- There was also an early Zenon vote with no strong reasoning.

I think the PSV wagon was sketchier than mine, I would single out Zenon from mine and Falcon, Roxy from PSV’s. Hence my PoE at this point. There’s also Splints to consider as a potential wolf not getting their hands dirty, but bugger if I can tell from the votes’ angle alone.

[Thunal33]

Several curiosities and takes:

1. Porscha’s last-minute switch off the mislynch (Epignosis stated that he almost hammered it) should in all likelihood not prove a wolf move – in that, I can’t think why a wolf would make themselves look so sketchy by getting jitters on capitalizing a mislynch they had drafted as part of the PoE and stayed on for almost the entire phase. I am more accustomed (from the Anniv 4 game) to town questioning their choices and/or 180ing wagons and/or CFD’ing so last moment style – unless this move itself is one mighty psych tactic.

2. There should be almost no worlds in which Falcon or Porscha are teamed with Zenon, given how their switch votes on Zenon could have impacted her lynch (near buss scenario). Falcon made it 2-2-2, Porscha made it so Zenon could have entered a tie-break (had PSV self-pres’d) – both among the worst odds of getting their teammate chopped. There’s also Splints to add to this thought process; a wolf team-up would already be weird or unlikely to consider, given their thread infighting (worst case scenario, a quite deplorable and ugly gambit of distancing); an early buss-vote plant, with little control over how Zenon’s lynch could unfold or not, would also be an unlikely

3. Splints was active up until Epignosis unvoted (Roxy) and the state of the vote was a very spread out Rico 2 - Falcon 1 - Zenon 1 - PSV 1 - Splints 1 - Epig 1. For all their shared animosity, I think Splints failed to mention whether she in fact sees a wolf play in Zenon; on the other hand, she expressed enough displeasure, on principle or on several pings, in regards to me. So I’m puzzled as to why she did not choose to put her final vote on me, given momentum and a stronger wolfy read of me. Perhaps a wolf hesitance to cast a stamp on a mislynch.

4. Same puzzlement on why Epig never voted to flip and solve me, after a week-long placement in his PoE. He did not state that he no longer reads me wolf, just that he won’t react on principle or just give me a pass in light of a perceived taunt. But here’s the thing, since Epignosis broke the tie in the end: I don’t think wolf Epignosis would have cared one bit which way to swing between two townies, that he had crafted suspicions on.

Hi Rico! I haven't dug into your chart yet but I will. As far as the Porscha thing - why would she necessarily think that would make her look sketchy? The level 1 take is that not being on the mislim is a good thing and I think there are a lot of people who would go with that level 1 take.

I agree w/ the unpairings. I also think Falcon/you are unpaired and Zenon/Splints are unpaired.

That's an interesting point about Splints, and I think it would have made sense from what she said in the thread to land on you.

[Thunal33]

Bottom line, two out of three wagons were town (PSV and myself) and were the strongest wagons during almost the entire EoD (Zenon wagon very marginal and a very last-minute push into contention). It’s likely one wolf or both was on these wagons.

How do I feel about my wagon voters’ motives?
-- Thunal voted me for a wrong picture of my gameplay or out of an over-demand that I had been serious (or more serious) in my gameplay.
-- Zenon voted me for an inaccurate or, worse, inflate picture of my gameplay.
-- PSV rip
I think Splints could have also voted me, she seemed to distrust every bit of my D2 gameplay and agreed with suspicions on me. Imagining a wolf Splints scenario, this sequence of suss’ing me but never voting me would look very sketchy and non-committal.
I think Epignosis could have also voted me off. Imagining a wolf Epignosis scenario, I can’t think of a reason why he would have spared me.

How do I feel about PSV’s voters’ motives?
-- I'm town, already proving mastery in mislynching
-- Falcon sheeped Porscha’s take on PSV
-- Roxy made a tiebreak vote, unreasoned
-- Epignosis rip also made a tiebreak vote, having profiled PSV as mafia in one prior post. As I’ve said, wolf Epignosis would have had mislynches on both scales of the balance, therefore likely not give a damn which mislynch to carry through.
-- There was also Porscha with a close-to-permanent vote on PSV. Was her reasoning (the a-ha on a potential TMI) the most enlightening and convincing? Wouldn’t say so upon re-read. But as I’ve said, a wolf Porscha not remaining content to bury PSV for good would be a very odd choice of a shady EoD move to make and be judged for.
-- There was also an early Zenon vote with no strong reasoning.

I think the PSV wagon was sketchier than mine, I would single out Zenon from mine and Falcon, Roxy from PSV’s. Hence my PoE at this point. There’s also Splints to consider as a potential wolf not getting their hands dirty, but bugger if I can tell from the votes’ angle alone.

Fwiw, I don't think my take on your gameplay was wrong. I wasn't trying to say you were an LHF elim addict, I was concerned that you hadn't committed to many other reads while your vote was on Falcon, like your read on Epi:

I have no lock on this being superficial town or superficial wolf behaviour, but slight lean to think that minimal / low-on-time town Epig would poke more, pressure vote more, fish one or two ISO posts and judge right away, see what sticks, win or lose - and such. All I've re-read is on wary vibe.

and your PoE post:

my unresearched POE, probably

splints - better impression of her defense of not being an intimidated player, but scroll back and don't get a sense of what she's looking into, both her non-falcon poe choices seem just players she was at odds with during certain debates (either defensive w. Zenon or on lynch principles with me)
falcon - placeholder for slackaward
Zenon - very chaotic and not familiar with the tell that she would issue strong town reads, but have this much trouble to issue wolf reads - is it towny tell, is it wolfy tell of her?
ShelterVet - always appears to have a moment of contribution, but then look back and the reads aren't that clear and just switched between two votes with thin-to-no substantiation

Talk to me more about the bolded Splints thing. Do you think w!Splints would try to avoid looking sketchy and noncommittal here?

[Ricochet]

Idk, last minute switches or CFDs usually throw me off, makes me want to eyeball it as wolfy. But then, what logic would a wolf find in doing it and get eyeballed for it, is what I’m pondering.

Why do you say jumping off a wagon that will prove a mislynch is a “good thing” or how do you read it as a town move?

[Thunal33]

I definitely need to ISO Zenon, Roxy, and Splints when I have the time since I feel like there's a good chance I'm wrong on at least one of them.

[Thunal33]

Idk, last minute switches or CFDs usually throw me off, makes me want to eyeball it as wolfy. But then, what logic would a wolf find in doing it and get eyeballed for it, is what I’m pondering.

Why do you say jumping off a wagon that will prove a mislynch is a “good thing” or how do you read it as a town move?

I don't read it as town. I'm saying that it might be perceived as town by the thread because Porscha's vote didn't land on the mislim.

[Ricochet]

I have early activities today, so can't go right now into full details and replies.

[Ricochet]

Idk, last minute switches or CFDs usually throw me off, makes me want to eyeball it as wolfy. But then, what logic would a wolf find in doing it and get eyeballed for it, is what I’m pondering.

Why do you say jumping off a wagon that will prove a mislynch is a “good thing” or how do you read it as a town move?

I don't read it as town. I'm saying that it might be perceived as town by the thread because Porscha's vote didn't land on the mislim.

What's your (level 1) take, then?

[Thunal33]

I'm going to bed. Rico's analysis is the kind of info and logic I really enjoy picking apart and engaging with. I think just how much he deduced and picked things apart from the viewpoint of "these were t/t wagons" and treating them as equally plausible for wolves to be on rather than the easier stances of "wolves were on PSV" or "wolves were on me" makes me think I might have just been wrong on him.

[Thunal33]

Idk, last minute switches or CFDs usually throw me off, makes me want to eyeball it as wolfy. But then, what logic would a wolf find in doing it and get eyeballed for it, is what I’m pondering.

Why do you say jumping off a wagon that will prove a mislynch is a “good thing” or how do you read it as a town move?

I don't read it as town. I'm saying that it might be perceived as town by the thread because Porscha's vote didn't land on the mislim.

What's your (level 1) take, then?

I didn't like it and thought it could be trying not to get her hands dirty. Specifically I didn't like that Porscha voiced disagreement about my reasons for townreading PSV without vocally pushing PSV at the time and then got off at the last minute.

[Ricochet]

Idk, last minute switches or CFDs usually throw me off, makes me want to eyeball it as wolfy. But then, what logic would a wolf find in doing it and get eyeballed for it, is what I’m pondering.

Why do you say jumping off a wagon that will prove a mislynch is a “good thing” or how do you read it as a town move?

I don't read it as town. I'm saying that it might be perceived as town by the thread because Porscha's vote didn't land on the mislim.

What's your (level 1) take, then?

I didn't like it and thought it could be trying not to get her hands dirty. Specifically I didn't like that Porscha voiced disagreement about my reasons for townreading PSV without vocally pushing PSV at the time and then got off at the last minute.

Without pushing vocally PSV at what time, more exactly? Cause vote-wise she was with the vote almost all the way through.

[Ricochet]

Good night, Thunal.

[Porscha]

I feel better that rico is still being towny today

[☆Princess Abigail☆]

I think I am concerned with Roxy and rico the most from reading epi and like
Rico was cw
And roxy jumped on my pewr tmi read on psv

But also zenon exists idk

Sip sip

[VOTE: Porscha] aubergine

[Porscha]

I think I am concerned with Roxy and rico the most from reading epi and like
Rico was cw
And roxy jumped on my pewr tmi read on psv

But also zenon exists idk

Sip sip

[VOTE: Porscha] aubergine

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[☆Princess Abigail☆]

Where I'm at right now:
Town:
Zenon
Splints
Roxy
PoE:
Falcon
Porscha
Rico

Holy crap how am I top town

[☆Princess Abigail☆]

Zenon still wolfy for ate'ing while being on a moral tirade when I know her morals say ate is wolfy

I meant every word I said

[☆Princess Abigail☆]

I think I am concerned with Roxy and rico the most from reading epi and like
Rico was cw
And roxy jumped on my pewr tmi read on psv

But also zenon exists idk

Sip sip

[VOTE: Porscha] aubergine

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Hello. Will you lead a misexe on me today but unvote at the last second?

[Ricochet]

I think I am concerned with Roxy and rico the most from reading epi and like
Rico was cw
And roxy jumped on my pewr tmi read on psv

But also zenon exists idk

I’m confused by much of this.

Which part of Epig’s reading makes you concerned about Roxy and I, since Epig dropped both on EoD2.

I was counterwagon, but what of it?

And I don’t recall Roxy’s EoD vote having been reasoned, where did she votes based on your read?

[Ricochet]

Just to address this quickly

Fwiw, I don't think my take on your gameplay was wrong. I wasn't trying to say you were an LHF elim addict, I was concerned that you hadn't committed to many other reads while your vote was on Falcon, like your read on Epi:

From my perspective, you were often one step in advance of judging my activity.

When I parked a vote on inactive Falcon, I was clear that the gamestate had three inactives out of nine and it was worth contemplating flipping them and that it was placeholder pending better reads.
Then I snapped at Zenon, then return to the same vote and same placehold till reads mindset.

That this sequenced pinged you is fine, but this is what it is, it was not serious and it was not something to stamp me as intent to lynch inactives and skirt otherwise.

Then: end of first night (Sunday), I write short notes on several that would constitute my PoE. But I did say it was "unresearched". Splints took issue with it. You as well. Okay. But it was still far off from "not pushing my suspicions".

Then, even with time limitations, I do ISOs on Epig, Falcon and PSV. Falcon is no longer judged for inactivity, hence I don't fit the "wants to lynch inactives and push nobody else" bill anymore. And of Epig and PSV you only focus on Epig and call it unsatisfactory in deciding if he's wolf. True somewhat, but I was wary enough to not have confidence in what he was doing. I felt worse about PSV in my ISOs and that was my closest wolf read of the phase.

As a player, I am not a firm voice on tagging townies and wolves in my reads, never have been. My reads will contain a lot of doubts and turning things on both sides and what-ifs and tinfoil scenarios. If I get flak for not being decisive, I get it. Almost got me mislynched, nothing novel there either. But, as I've expressed, I find you processed all the info the wrong way and at times you projected a worse picture of my activity or demanded more than I had managed to actually deliver.

[Ricochet]

@Zenon, what's your take on me, now that the stats reveal that I was nowhere near the meanie to push you to a 3-vote wagon lead?

[☆Princess Abigail☆]

@Zenon, what's your take on me, now that the stats reveal that I was nowhere near the meanie to push you to a 3-vote wagon lead?

I maintain I think the vote and unvote was sussy amogus but admit I was wrong on timing

[☆Princess Abigail☆]

Sorry about that

[Roxy]

Thunal can you agree with me that Roxy's eod was wolfy

After you pushed PSV ALL DAY then got cold feet right after I voted you moved then Epi gave the hammer.

Let's talk about a wolfy way to end the day.

You pushed for that elim then knowing PSV was going to flip town you moved your vote so you could say "but I felt better about PSV so I moved".

I'll be quite honest about my EoD as I have nothing to hide from. I was fence riding most of the day. When I seen the tie I decided to break it but I could not really determine who I trusted the least betwixt Rico or PSV. I literally flipped a coin.
Not that it matter I stand by my vote.

I wanted to trust you here bc I helped elim you in the other game we were/are playing together.

[Roxy]

I think I am concerned with Roxy and rico the most from reading epi and like
Rico was cw
And roxy jumped on my pewr tmi read on psv

But also zenon exists idk

I’m confused by much of this.

Which part of Epig’s reading makes you concerned about Roxy and I, since Epig dropped both on EoD2.

I was counterwagon, but what of it?

And I don’t recall Roxy’s EoD vote having been reasoned, where did she votes based on your read?

I did not jump as I am far too old and could hurt my old ass. I just wanted to break the tie. Porscha's head seem a bit big here.

[☆Princess Abigail☆]

Potentially flipping Rico blows this game wide open

[Ricochet]

Potentially flipping Rico blows this game wide open

As in leaves you in f5 lylo, yeah.

[Ricochet]

Why didn’t / don’t you trust me, Roxy?

[☆Princess Abigail☆]

Yeah I'm fine being in F5 but imagine your the CW in very close wagons and the other wagon is a town and the behaviors around both wagons were weird. Learning if that was T v T or S v T is super beneficial.

[Roxy]

Why didn’t / don’t you trust me, Roxy?

I think it boils down to: we have not played together for quite some time and I cba'ed to remember your old game style so this is me learning to read you all over again.

[Ricochet]

Now that I recall, the sentiment that I wolfed out of a Zenon lynch - which was neither a real wagon at that time, nor was serious voting on my behalf - was more prevalent towards lynching me, compared to Thunal’s more in-depth reasoning.

Zenon initiated it.
Splints agreed with the suspicion - but then didn’t push for my lynch at all.
Roxy agreed with the suspicion - then didn’t suspect me as much to lynch me.

So do you genuinely think I’m wolf or just content to follow Zenon’s ping or what gives?

[☆Princess Abigail☆]

[VOTE: Rico,] aubergine

Money where my mouth is

[Ricochet]

Yeah I'm fine being in F5 but imagine your the CW in very close wagons and the other wagon is a town and the behaviors around both wagons were weird. Learning if that was T v T or S v T is super beneficial.

What do you gain from finding out my wagon was also on a mislynch path? Who will you solve f5 from it?

PSV could have self-pres’d into a tie with you, so why not apply the same with you?

[Roxy]

Now that I recall, the sentiment that I wolfed out of a Zenon lynch - which was neither a real wagon at that time, nor was serious voting on my behalf - was more prevalent towards lynching me, compared to Thunal’s more in-depth reasoning.

Zenon initiated it.
Splints agreed with the suspicion - but then didn’t push for my lynch at all.
Roxy agreed with the suspicion - then didn’t suspect me as much to lynch me.

So do you genuinely think I’m wolf or just content to follow Zenon’s ping or what gives?

I will not follow Zenon as I am very unsure of her this game. I do not think you are anything rn. I am still fence riding for you. I am trying not to be quick to judge and give my read a natural chance at developing.

[Roxy]

Yeah I'm fine being in F5 but imagine your the CW in very close wagons and the other wagon is a town and the behaviors around both wagons were weird. Learning if that was T v T or S v T is super beneficial.

What do you gain from finding out my wagon was also on a mislynch path? Who will you solve f5 from it?

PSV could have self-pres’d into a tie with you, so why not apply the same with you?

I do agree with this thought as well. Zenon's elim would also "blow the game wide open".