MacDougall wrote: ↑Tue Jun 20, 2023 9:54 pm
Your perspective here is probably very helpful honestly because honestly I think your game building mindset is most like Scotty's so your instincts about the setup are probably better than mine.
From the Setup:
Scotty wrote: ↑Mon Jun 12, 2023 12:49 am
OTHER IMPORTANT NOTES
There will be SPOILERS in this game if you haven’t seen the movie. I have taken liberties with some plot lines, but the essence is the same. So...I’d suggest watch the movie before playing, because it’s an amazing movie.
Also note that I have attempted extensive play testing with the balance of this game, and while I think it is as fair as I can make it, it is a role madness type where things can swing wildly depending on choices made. In the spirit of all things transparent, there are elements to this game that some might consider “unconventional”:
-There is vote manipulation tied to role abilities.
-3rd Parties have the opportunity to change alignment in this game, and have been notified as such.
The phrasing of the first red bit is passive voice. That's understandable, given the author wouldn't want us to know WHO is making those choices.
However, the phrasing of the second red bit is different. It says "3rd parties have the opportunity to change alignment." Opportunity is different from being recruited with no choice.
Therefore, point number one:
This is not a recruitment-style game. John Doe doesn't pick anybody.
From that we can infer point number two:
Anybody who can change alignments has, in some capacity, a method to accomplish that.
What do we know for sure about that?
Let's look at Kate's role description:
You are self aligned. Your current win condition is to be the last man standing.
Last Man Standing is generally impossible, especially without a kill.
Alternatively, if 2 different players that open one of your gifts are killed in any way, your alignment will change:
-You will become mafia, gaining BTSC with all other members a full phase after becoming mafia.
Wording is important here. "Are killed in any way" is another passive voice. To me this implies that Kate's gifts did not have killing power.
Therefore, to become mafia, Kate needs two of her recipients to die in order to leave LMS status.
Presumably, Kate had one chance to give a present and gave it to Dennis. Seanzie's testimony and Mac's tracking would lead us to believe that gift was BTSC, which also means Kate thought her kid was doomed. Great job mom!
Under the above framework, if Dennis is John Doe, this would have been a coincidence. Seanzie believed big time that Dennis is Greed. So who knows. Killing Dennis won't make Kate mafia because Kate is dead (and there are no resurrections) and presumably didn't get to target two people anyway. The move kills potential mafia or John Doe.
The "gaining BTSC with all other members a full phase after becoming mafia" doesn't strike me as something restricted to Lust. So I propose point number three:
Sins that become mafia members only gain BTSC after a full phase (and to me, that suggests not knowing their team until then).
You represent the inordinate craving for the pleasures of the body.
Don't we all?
So Kate was not mafia but could have become such.
pyxxy's case is trickier.
Obviously there isn't anything but a mafia alignment there, but pyxxy accomplished whatever goal there was rather quickly. If we fixate on Kate's "two targets" rule, it may have been that pyxxy hit the two dead mark Night 2, became mafia, and then died.
If so, given point three, pyxxy would never have even KNOWN of the alignment change in time (and didn't receive BTSC).
And if I'm right about that, digging through pyxxy's posts is a fool's errand.
++++
Despite the gleeful thrill going through the thread about Kate and Dennis, please look at the colors:
That's four dead civilians, one dead independent, and one dead mafia member. No dead John Doe.
Are things going well? Let's check in.
Thunal33 wrote: ↑Mon Jun 19, 2023 10:05 pm
Nice! This is going really well!
) so I'm doing that tonight.
