Bread Mafia [Game Over]

[NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME]

I feel like you weighed his esooa progression too strongly and keep falling back on it

i could be weighing it too strongly - i just read his exchange with jagged and it didn't do anything for me at all. his tone was deflective and i find it awkward for him to call himself confirmed town while simultaneously arguing that there are no posts he could make in this game that he wouldn't be capable of making as scum

There’s no single post I could make in ANY game, not just this one, that I’m incapable of theoretically making as scum. It’s a silly way to read someone.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

Capability is a strong concept. A better way to put it would be "none of your posts seem like they'd pose any challenge to you when you're making them if you're mafia"

or "they're not hard to make"

[NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME]

K if we’re moving into the “NoThInG nAnOoK dOeS iS hArD oR uSeFuL” territory im going back to checking out

[staypositivefriend]

trustfall:

alison - every time i find myself getting worried about alison & tinfoiling her slot, she tends to come back into the game with some type of insight or questioning that makes me feel better about her. her gamesolving feels very authentic and she often reaches thoughts and conclusions that feel completely fluid . additionally, alison has not capitalized on the paranoia about the names in the "towncore" and has seemed content to shut it down, when i could see alison!scum wanting people to get more paranoid and more uncomfortable w/each other

DOOM: daughter's tone has never once felt stressed out or worried to me - they have "vibed" with the thread in a way that's relatively uncommon for a newer player in a new community. she gave herself room to hardpush on ellie, but she ISO'd and "cased" nanook of her own volition, which implies a level of fluidity to her reads that could be town indicative

Dkkoba: koba has a very strong tone and has arguably been "spew cleared" from the level of townreads that they got right out of the gate - they've had a lowkey presence in moments where i would expect scum!dk to have a higher presence, and i like them shifting their push from nutella to nanook

ellie: sometimes her frustration feels very genuine to me

esooa: posts at sod2 contain several underlying emotions & internal beliefs that would be difficult for a scum to fake and reflect so well - paranoia about me aligns well with how esooa has tinfoiled me in the past, lots of gamesolving that sounds extremely authentic, dont think that she would hard defend LC on d1 like she did as scum. if her goal was to get ellie chopped by defending LC, then it isn't reflected at all by the fact that esooa has been willing to chop outside of ellie at several points today

grogu: seems comfortable w/the thread dynamic, has some posts that sound pure

jagged: maintains an active and consistent gamesolve-y presence without trying to center the game around a specific agenda - has outed analysis that aligns well w/mine

made: tbh i have almost nothing - i sort of like that he seems unconcerned with the prospect of being chopped, and i sort of like how his gamesolving is unique and creative even if it's extremely hard for me to understand

michelle: tone has gradually become more authentic and more believable as the game has gone on , has ATE'd on a level that i'm honestly not sure michelle would if she was playing from a scum mindset, her desire to leave the game early felt pretty honest

nanook: good tone, decent progression on esooa. ????

nutella: out of her scumrange from my limited understanding of her scumrange - can easily understand, track, and vibe with her thought process even when we reach different conclusions. does not seem tied down to a specific agenda

tutuu: also arguably out of her "scumrange" - the paranoia toward me and the underlying frustration she showed when people did not follow her was extremely sincere and something i suspect that tutuu!scum wouldnt fake - has towntold constantly and done nothing to raise my eyebrows

[JaggedJimmyJay]

K if we’re moving into the “NoThInG nAnOoK dOeS iS hArD oR uSeFuL” territory im going back to checking out

yeah that's not what I meant at all

[JaggedJimmyJay]

That interpretation was bizarre and feels fake

[staypositivefriend]

i found it the hardest to write reasons to townread made, ellie, nanook, and (weirdly enough) jagged in that exact order

i found it the easiest to write reasons to townread esooa, michelle (??) and nutella

[NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME]

K if we’re moving into the “NoThInG nAnOoK dOeS iS hArD oR uSeFuL” territory im going back to checking out

yeah that's not what I meant at all

You literally just said they’re not hard to make as scum wtf are you talking about

[staypositivefriend]

I feel bad for scum reading spf but at the same time I always do lmao

that's exactly why im town

and ftr the reasoning you outed to scumread me is exactly why im town - you remarked that im "lagging" behind in reads, but why would i be lagging behind in reads as scum at all? it's easy to make up reads as scum, it's harder to have authentic ones as town

[JaggedJimmyJay]

K if we’re moving into the “NoThInG nAnOoK dOeS iS hArD oR uSeFuL” territory im going back to checking out

yeah that's not what I meant at all

You literally just said they’re not hard to make as scum wtf are you talking about

They're not hard as in "I don't think a mafia Nanook would experience trepidation about making this post"

[nutella]

it's easy to make up reads as scum, it's harder to have authentic ones as town

disagree

[nutella]

but that may be true for you ig

[NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME]

K if we’re moving into the “NoThInG nAnOoK dOeS iS hArD oR uSeFuL” territory im going back to checking out

yeah that's not what I meant at all

You literally just said they’re not hard to make as scum wtf are you talking about

They're not hard as in "I don't think a mafia Nanook would experience trepidation about making this post"

Do you think there are posts that scumNanook has trepidation about making?

[staypositivefriend]

it's easy to make up reads as scum, it's harder to have authentic ones as town

disagree

yeah it's def true for me

like esooa can confirm in the north pole oligarchy came that we played (where i was mafia), i was outing different reads and analysis CONSTANTLY. somebody nearly caught me as scum because they outright said "i don't believe that SPF is reaching all of these conclusions as quickly as she is"

so if i'm struggling w/my reads in a game, it's town indicative like 99% of the time lol

[JaggedJimmyJay]

Do you think there are posts that scumNanook has trepidation about making?

Yes, even if faint or readily overcome

I think that's human nature

[NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME]

I don’t think I’ve ever felt nervous about making a post in a mafia game that wasn’t a hammer as town

[DkKoba]

it's easy to make up reads as scum, it's harder to have authentic ones as town

disagree

yeah it's def true for me

like esooa can confirm in the north pole oligarchy came that we played (where i was mafia), i was outing different reads and analysis CONSTANTLY. somebody nearly caught me as scum because they outright said "i don't believe that SPF is reaching all of these conclusions as quickly as she is"

so if i'm struggling w/my reads in a game, it's town indicative like 99% of the time lol

u were a naughty kid. get my flavor right smh

[JaggedJimmyJay]

i found it the hardest to write reasons to townread made, ellie, nanook, and (weirdly enough) jagged in that exact order

i found it the easiest to write reasons to townread esooa, michelle (??) and nutella

You had a harder time with me than with Grogu?

[NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME]

I still find it incredible that someone who knows me thinks me having static somewhat off kilter reads is scummy smh

[staypositivefriend]

i found it the hardest to write reasons to townread made, ellie, nanook, and (weirdly enough) jagged in that exact order

i found it the easiest to write reasons to townread esooa, michelle (??) and nutella

You had a harder time with me than with Grogu?

lol well i have less reasons to townread grogu than i have to townread you, but yours was the one that made me pause for a while and struggle to come up with reasoning at the top of my head. that doesn't mean that you're scum, it just means that the reasons i've had to townread you are more "vibe" based than i had thought

[Esooa]

I feel bad for scum reading spf but at the same time I always do lmao

that's exactly why im town

and ftr the reasoning you outed to scumread me is exactly why im town - you remarked that im "lagging" behind in reads, but why would i be lagging behind in reads as scum at all? it's easy to make up reads as scum, it's harder to have authentic ones as town

the fact you're lagging behind make me feel like you're not willing to push outside of the direction the thread is going in, I can feel you feeling uncomfortable about doing such a thing as scum but you wouldn't be as town.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

I still find it incredible that someone who knows me thinks me having static somewhat off kilter reads is scummy smh

That's why I called you fringe POE (by way of saying "same" when you called me that). It's not something that makes me want to raise my pitchfork, but it's something I have to contend with -- primarily the Ellie read -- and otherwise I have no reason to say "yes, Nanook is town this time".

[JaggedJimmyJay]

lol well i have less reasons to townread grogu than i have to townread you, but yours was the one that made me pause for a while and struggle to come up with reasoning at the top of my head. that doesn't mean that you're scum, it just means that the reasons i've had to townread you are more "vibe" based than i had thought

Okay.

tbh I think everything in here's gonna be mostly vibes until a mafia flips

[Made]

Hi!

where did my voters go?

[DaughterOfOmega]

I need to be less towny or mafia are killing me tonight

[staypositivefriend]

distrustfall:

alison: it actually made me a little paranoid about how comfortable alison felt with the consensus POE of ellie/made/michelle/doom - and it made me even more paranoid how alison's main focus (iirc) within that POE has been michelle, since i think that michelle is more likely to be town than not. alison's gamesolving does appear authentic but she also appears to be very satisfied with the consensus, which might contrast awkwardly with the sense that a lot of us have had that the consensus is "wrong" somehow

doom: daughter had some pretty awkward sounding introductory posts - a lot of her reads have a level of underlying confidence that aren't exactly backed up by the reasoning she has outed (like her confident sr on ellie gives me concerns about potential TMI)

dkkoba: i outed this paranoia last night already, but a big concern i had about koba was the sense that they were TMI'ing michelle as town without meaningfully trying to steer the chop into another direction, since the chops they did push on were non-viable (tutuu, nutella). it also surprises me that koba has townread me as much as they have without as much scrutiny as i expected

ellie: made a post that felt extremely like she was TMI'ing esooa as town, while claiming to have a 50-50 read on esooa in her very next post. has outed lots of reads that don't feel like they came from an authentic place, in the sense that they are difficult to track from point A to point B. outed reads early in the game that felt like they were trying to pit me and michelle against each other

esooa: could be scumreading me in bad faith in theory - not much else makes me worried about her right now tbh

grogu: had a post that felt like they could be TMI'ing ellie as mafia - has outed several posts that have confident reads that dont appear to be substantiated with anything in particular (like a confident sr on michelle). generally has not towntold very much

jagged: i got paranoid that jagged joined my LC vote on d1 as a shield for misvoting. has a supposedly massive scumrange that he could still theoretically be in

made: i havent been able to understand or put myself into made's perspective even once throughout this entire game - reads are extremely oblique and sometimes feel more focused on WIFOM than anything

michelle: still having a hard time getting over michelle accusing me of lying about being drunk lol, still a little confused about how michelle could confidently scumread me/esooa nutella from a town mindset

nanook: skimming through nanook's ISO, the reasons i have to townread him are significantly less pronounced than any of my other townreads. a lot of vague good stuff like "tone" but a lot of reads that feel potentially inauthentic or even coming from a place of TMI - dont love the way he responded to jagged's pressure

nutella: could just be really good at pocketing me, i guess

tutuu: tutuu apparently has a very strong mafia game and that's something i dont want to underestimate - but nothing is pinging me about her right now

[DaughterOfOmega]

Hi!

where did my voters go?

Don't tease me

[staypositivefriend]

i found it the easiest to write reasons to distrust ellie & grogu

i found it the hardest to write reasons to distrust nutella & tutuu & esooa (which reaffirms the towncore i already had, i guess)

[DaughterOfOmega]

distrustfall:


doom: daughter had some pretty awkward sounding introductory posts - a lot of her reads have a level of underlying confidence that aren't exactly backed up by the reasoning she has outed (like her confident sr on ellie gives me concerns about potential TMI)

I'm curious, are you saying that I have TMI ellie is mafia? Like we are partners, seems weird

[JaggedJimmyJay]

I wish I was still in my mafia range. I'm overrated.

[staypositivefriend]

I feel bad for scum reading spf but at the same time I always do lmao

that's exactly why im town

and ftr the reasoning you outed to scumread me is exactly why im town - you remarked that im "lagging" behind in reads, but why would i be lagging behind in reads as scum at all? it's easy to make up reads as scum, it's harder to have authentic ones as town

the fact you're lagging behind make me feel like you're not willing to push outside of the direction the thread is going in, I can feel you feeling uncomfortable about doing such a thing as scum but you wouldn't be as town.

i made an entire tinfoil case on koba last night - i'm not uncomfortable with the prospect of pushing outside of the POE - but i did feel uncomfortable with my reads feeling more messy than they usually are. that's not indicative of somebody with perfect TMI

[Esooa]

spf I hope you aren't feeling deflated by my scum read on you

[Made]

Hi!

where did my voters go?

Don't tease me

Just start pushing a scum read on Nutella or Tutuu really hard and you’ll make it through the night dw

[staypositivefriend]

distrustfall:


doom: daughter had some pretty awkward sounding introductory posts - a lot of her reads have a level of underlying confidence that aren't exactly backed up by the reasoning she has outed (like her confident sr on ellie gives me concerns about potential TMI)

I'm curious, are you saying that I have TMI ellie is mafia? Like we are partners, seems weird

i haven't dived into whether or not you & ellie make sense as a team, but skimming through your ISO and seeing a number of confident posts about ellie flipping scum did give me that concern, yes

[Esooa]

Hi!

where did my voters go?

Don't tease me

Just start pushing a scum read on Nutella or Tutuu really hard and you’ll make it through the night dw

made is a PR trying to self pres with his reads

[DkKoba]

I feel bad for scum reading spf but at the same time I always do lmao

that's exactly why im town

and ftr the reasoning you outed to scumread me is exactly why im town - you remarked that im "lagging" behind in reads, but why would i be lagging behind in reads as scum at all? it's easy to make up reads as scum, it's harder to have authentic ones as town

the fact you're lagging behind make me feel like you're not willing to push outside of the direction the thread is going in, I can feel you feeling uncomfortable about doing such a thing as scum but you wouldn't be as town.

i made an entire tinfoil case on koba last night - i'm not uncomfortable with the prospect of pushing outside of the POE - but i did feel uncomfortable with my reads feeling more messy than they usually are. that's not indicative of somebody with perfect TMI

wtf did u really

[Esooa]

Hi!

where did my voters go?

Don't tease me

Just start pushing a scum read on Nutella or Tutuu really hard and you’ll make it through the night dw

made is a PR trying to self pres with his reads

oops wrong chat

[DkKoba]

Hi!

where did my voters go?

Don't tease me

Just start pushing a scum read on Nutella or Tutuu really hard and you’ll make it through the night dw

made is a PR trying to self pres with his reads

why are u giving scum PR reads

[staypositivefriend]

I feel bad for scum reading spf but at the same time I always do lmao

that's exactly why im town

and ftr the reasoning you outed to scumread me is exactly why im town - you remarked that im "lagging" behind in reads, but why would i be lagging behind in reads as scum at all? it's easy to make up reads as scum, it's harder to have authentic ones as town

the fact you're lagging behind make me feel like you're not willing to push outside of the direction the thread is going in, I can feel you feeling uncomfortable about doing such a thing as scum but you wouldn't be as town.

i made an entire tinfoil case on koba last night - i'm not uncomfortable with the prospect of pushing outside of the POE - but i did feel uncomfortable with my reads feeling more messy than they usually are. that's not indicative of somebody with perfect TMI

wtf did u really

yes lmao, i was expecting to wake up and see u snarkily responding to it

[NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME]

Should we just hammer Ellie and move on

[Made]

Hi!

where did my voters go?

Don't tease me

Just start pushing a scum read on Nutella or Tutuu really hard and you’ll make it through the night dw

made is a PR trying to self pres with his reads

which would means you should be gunning after tutuu no?

[staypositivefriend]

spf I hope you aren't feeling deflated by my scum read on you

dw, i don't feel deflated. i don't mind sharing that i've felt stressed about this game and like i need to towntell more meaningfully, but that's the nature of the game i signed up for

[Esooa]

Hi!

where did my voters go?

Don't tease me

Just start pushing a scum read on Nutella or Tutuu really hard and you’ll make it through the night dw

made is a PR trying to self pres with his reads

why are u giving scum PR reads

sorry I meant to post that in scum chat

[JaggedJimmyJay]

Thanks for doing the "falls" SPF. It's giving me things to think about which are currently too convoluted to write into a post, but it helps

[JaggedJimmyJay]

I defer to the rest of town on when to hammer. I am at peace with an Ellie bake, but I am in no hurry. If anyone else wants more time, you should have it.

I'm just kinda detaching and letting myself think.

[DkKoba]

distrustfall:

alison: it actually made me a little paranoid about how comfortable alison felt with the consensus POE of ellie/made/michelle/doom - and it made me even more paranoid how alison's main focus (iirc) within that POE has been michelle, since i think that michelle is more likely to be town than not. alison's gamesolving does appear authentic but she also appears to be very satisfied with the consensus, which might contrast awkwardly with the sense that a lot of us have had that the consensus is "wrong" somehow

doom: daughter had some pretty awkward sounding introductory posts - a lot of her reads have a level of underlying confidence that aren't exactly backed up by the reasoning she has outed (like her confident sr on ellie gives me concerns about potential TMI)

dkkoba: i outed this paranoia last night already, but a big concern i had about koba was the sense that they were TMI'ing michelle as town without meaningfully trying to steer the chop into another direction, since the chops they did push on were non-viable (tutuu, nutella). it also surprises me that koba has townread me as much as they have without as much scrutiny as i expected

ellie: made a post that felt extremely like she was TMI'ing esooa as town, while claiming to have a 50-50 read on esooa in her very next post. has outed lots of reads that don't feel like they came from an authentic place, in the sense that they are difficult to track from point A to point B. outed reads early in the game that felt like they were trying to pit me and michelle against each other

esooa: could be scumreading me in bad faith in theory - not much else makes me worried about her right now tbh

grogu: had a post that felt like they could be TMI'ing ellie as mafia - has outed several posts that have confident reads that dont appear to be substantiated with anything in particular (like a confident sr on michelle). generally has not towntold very much

jagged: i got paranoid that jagged joined my LC vote on d1 as a shield for misvoting. has a supposedly massive scumrange that he could still theoretically be in

made: i havent been able to understand or put myself into made's perspective even once throughout this entire game - reads are extremely oblique and sometimes feel more focused on WIFOM than anything

michelle: still having a hard time getting over michelle accusing me of lying about being drunk lol, still a little confused about how michelle could confidently scumread me/esooa nutella from a town mindset

nanook: skimming through nanook's ISO, the reasons i have to townread him are significantly less pronounced than any of my other townreads. a lot of vague good stuff like "tone" but a lot of reads that feel potentially inauthentic or even coming from a place of TMI - dont love the way he responded to jagged's pressure

nutella: could just be really good at pocketing me, i guess

tutuu: tutuu apparently has a very strong mafia game and that's something i dont want to underestimate - but nothing is pinging me about her right now

u know my read on u is based on an updated understanding of ur meta right

[staypositivefriend]

anyway the trustfalls/distrustfalls were actually extremely useful for me to get a better sense of where my head is at, and all of the foundations i have for my reads in this game

following along with jagged's idea of creating a 6 person POE from that list, my POE would look a little something like:

ellie
made
grogu
nanook
DOOM
koba

i'm pretty unsure about that 6th name - i suppose that i have alison/koba on the same tinfoil territory of being worried about them but finding the more likely answer that they are simply town. koba is a fine placeholder name for now while i see if my paranoia goes anywhere

[DkKoba]

did u like get lazy by the time u got to the bottom of that list cuz like lol

[Esooa]

doom/made I tr so much I'm probably not even going there if Ellie flips green

[staypositivefriend]

distrustfall:

alison: it actually made me a little paranoid about how comfortable alison felt with the consensus POE of ellie/made/michelle/doom - and it made me even more paranoid how alison's main focus (iirc) within that POE has been michelle, since i think that michelle is more likely to be town than not. alison's gamesolving does appear authentic but she also appears to be very satisfied with the consensus, which might contrast awkwardly with the sense that a lot of us have had that the consensus is "wrong" somehow

doom: daughter had some pretty awkward sounding introductory posts - a lot of her reads have a level of underlying confidence that aren't exactly backed up by the reasoning she has outed (like her confident sr on ellie gives me concerns about potential TMI)

dkkoba: i outed this paranoia last night already, but a big concern i had about koba was the sense that they were TMI'ing michelle as town without meaningfully trying to steer the chop into another direction, since the chops they did push on were non-viable (tutuu, nutella). it also surprises me that koba has townread me as much as they have without as much scrutiny as i expected

ellie: made a post that felt extremely like she was TMI'ing esooa as town, while claiming to have a 50-50 read on esooa in her very next post. has outed lots of reads that don't feel like they came from an authentic place, in the sense that they are difficult to track from point A to point B. outed reads early in the game that felt like they were trying to pit me and michelle against each other

esooa: could be scumreading me in bad faith in theory - not much else makes me worried about her right now tbh

grogu: had a post that felt like they could be TMI'ing ellie as mafia - has outed several posts that have confident reads that dont appear to be substantiated with anything in particular (like a confident sr on michelle). generally has not towntold very much

jagged: i got paranoid that jagged joined my LC vote on d1 as a shield for misvoting. has a supposedly massive scumrange that he could still theoretically be in

made: i havent been able to understand or put myself into made's perspective even once throughout this entire game - reads are extremely oblique and sometimes feel more focused on WIFOM than anything

michelle: still having a hard time getting over michelle accusing me of lying about being drunk lol, still a little confused about how michelle could confidently scumread me/esooa nutella from a town mindset

nanook: skimming through nanook's ISO, the reasons i have to townread him are significantly less pronounced than any of my other townreads. a lot of vague good stuff like "tone" but a lot of reads that feel potentially inauthentic or even coming from a place of TMI - dont love the way he responded to jagged's pressure

nutella: could just be really good at pocketing me, i guess

tutuu: tutuu apparently has a very strong mafia game and that's something i dont want to underestimate - but nothing is pinging me about her right now

u know my read on u is based on an updated understanding of ur meta right

i do

i'm still paranoid about you tho - it's probably because i'm the only person here (besides esooa) with firsthand experience of how strong your scum game can be