Secret Playerlist - ENDGAME

[Sloonei]

[VOTE: Scotty] aubergine

[Hally]

[VOTE: Scotty] aubergine

por que

[Hally]

fwiw i wouldn’t say that “lack of content” is generally a great way to read wilgy

he tends to get mislunched for his low volume/crypticness/whatever you wanna call it

old time syndicaters will probably be able to speak to this better

[santygrass]

lol, Rans been here but still won't interact with me.

Well, here's an illustration: this post is hella wolfy, because it's not a real thought town have when trying to sort out who is mafia and who isn't. This is shade that comes from a mafia perspective of "we need to get Ran off of me and discredit her, how do we do that, let's find something to make her sound bad like 'not interacting with me'".

What does that mean? Why would that be relevant? How does this come from a town thought process? Does Wilgy think I'm a real player? Does Wilgy think I'm a wolf? Is he putting forward some theory like "not interacting with your scumreads is wolfy"? Why? I've already expressed that the main basis for the read is lack of content.

https://www.mafiauniverse.com/forums/th ... vitational - here's a recent game where I found Hellsbells, a wolf, on d1, and cased them. Their response was pretty much identical to what Wilgy is doing: OMGUS and accusations that I wasn't working with them.

https://www.mafiauniverse.com/forums/th ... ost6310705
https://www.mafiauniverse.com/forums/th ... ost6310787
https://www.mafiauniverse.com/forums/th ... ost6310955

Ranmillia are you a wolfsiding?

Wilg point here is 100% valid and I even questioned you yesterday when Wilg first appeared and you didnt interact with them at all even and it pinged me too.

So why you call it wolfy from wilg now I dont like tbh

[Porscha]

i don’t agree with the strategy that villagers should just coast until the NPCs die

then you give wolves chances to eliminate real players at night (and even to try to take over the thread during the day)

and by the time the NPCs are gone you can be down villagers that wolves have managed to kill at night without eliminating wolfy real players from the PoE because you’re twiddling your thumbs instead of trying to lunch wolves

i feel like if every villager got aggressive today and started solving with the help of the town siding NPCs we could have started to box wolves in pretty well

just not sure what the upside of doing nothing is realistically

It isnt about doing nothing, it's about not intentionally outing yourself as a player.

Additionally, does your suggestion not require a general consensus/ agreement among the people remaining to adhere to? Do you think this is feasible with 20 NPC's remaining? Not feasible today, imo.

[Hally]

i acknowledge people’s concerns with ran and have had my own paranoia about her but i don’t think today is the day to resolve that

still think she’s most likely an NPC but even if she’s a player she can very easily be town

[Hally]

i don’t agree with the strategy that villagers should just coast until the NPCs die

then you give wolves chances to eliminate real players at night (and even to try to take over the thread during the day)

and by the time the NPCs are gone you can be down villagers that wolves have managed to kill at night without eliminating wolfy real players from the PoE because you’re twiddling your thumbs instead of trying to lunch wolves

i feel like if every villager got aggressive today and started solving with the help of the town siding NPCs we could have started to box wolves in pretty well

just not sure what the upside of doing nothing is realistically

It isnt about doing nothing, it's about not intentionally outing yourself as a player.

Additionally, does your suggestion not require a general consensus/ agreement among the people remaining to adhere to? Do you think this is feasible with 20 NPC's remaining? Not feasible today, imo.

i don’t see how engaging with the game and posting some solving would out anyone as a real player

it’s not like NPCs haven’t been solving too

[Hally]

also no, i don’t think every single real player necessarily has to start doing what i said

any number of real players who have previously done nothing starting to get involved and be aggressive would be an improvement

[santygrass]

Yeah. I dont think ran shouldn't be yeeted like never today.

But their push on wilg I think is kinda bad and not showing reasess there is kinda concerning.

I think that both me/Michelle have showed some sort of pushback on the wilg push but it felt like ran ignored it also so idk

[santygrass]

i don’t agree with the strategy that villagers should just coast until the NPCs die

then you give wolves chances to eliminate real players at night (and even to try to take over the thread during the day)

and by the time the NPCs are gone you can be down villagers that wolves have managed to kill at night without eliminating wolfy real players from the PoE because you’re twiddling your thumbs instead of trying to lunch wolves

i feel like if every villager got aggressive today and started solving with the help of the town siding NPCs we could have started to box wolves in pretty well

just not sure what the upside of doing nothing is realistically

It isnt about doing nothing, it's about not intentionally outing yourself as a player.

Additionally, does your suggestion not require a general consensus/ agreement among the people remaining to adhere to? Do you think this is feasible with 20 NPC's remaining? Not feasible today, imo.

@Porscha . Today is going to be a purge at EoD with half of Npc players removed from the game + a lot of Npc slots are kinda obvious so I dont think that mafia is going to miss more nks fwiw.

And its feasible to start solving today. At least there are list with prob players and pushes there and who is likely npc and to ignore. Ran is prob an Npc and not a good push today

[Porscha]

i don’t agree with the strategy that villagers should just coast until the NPCs die

then you give wolves chances to eliminate real players at night (and even to try to take over the thread during the day)

and by the time the NPCs are gone you can be down villagers that wolves have managed to kill at night without eliminating wolfy real players from the PoE because you’re twiddling your thumbs instead of trying to lunch wolves

i feel like if every villager got aggressive today and started solving with the help of the town siding NPCs we could have started to box wolves in pretty well

just not sure what the upside of doing nothing is realistically

It isnt about doing nothing, it's about not intentionally outing yourself as a player.

Additionally, does your suggestion not require a general consensus/ agreement among the people remaining to adhere to? Do you think this is feasible with 20 NPC's remaining? Not feasible today, imo.

i don’t see how engaging with the game and posting some solving would out anyone as a real player

it’s not like NPCs haven’t been solving too

And many NPC's havent, either. Again, it comes to a consensus that we are unable to obtain. So at best, it's a pick your poison concept - lay low and pretend to NPC so you dont get offed or scouted too early, observe without saying too much so you cant cause too many waves, or have no fear and just start saying shit and additionally hope you have the time to be caught up in a game like this -of this amount of players and posting, when half of the players and posts do not matter - to attempt say things that makes a modicum of sense.

Either way, I stand in my stance on the subject.

[Ranmilia]

"They post no content as town" is not a defense to me; that just makes me feel better about yeeting them if they're town. Yeeting everyone who posts no content and doesn't help town is generally a winning strategy and one of the cornerstones of how I play.

I am not sure what about Wilgy's point would be "valid." Interacting with wolves is not good, unless you think you have a clever bait to get them to spew more wolves. Usually people do not like it much when I interact with people I am scumreading, because that interaction consists of calling them a wolf and saying they should be voted out. If you'd prefer a different target, I'm going to need reasons - better ones than "they post no content as town" and a wolfier target.

[Hally]

i don’t agree with the strategy that villagers should just coast until the NPCs die

then you give wolves chances to eliminate real players at night (and even to try to take over the thread during the day)

and by the time the NPCs are gone you can be down villagers that wolves have managed to kill at night without eliminating wolfy real players from the PoE because you’re twiddling your thumbs instead of trying to lunch wolves

i feel like if every villager got aggressive today and started solving with the help of the town siding NPCs we could have started to box wolves in pretty well

just not sure what the upside of doing nothing is realistically

It isnt about doing nothing, it's about not intentionally outing yourself as a player.

Additionally, does your suggestion not require a general consensus/ agreement among the people remaining to adhere to? Do you think this is feasible with 20 NPC's remaining? Not feasible today, imo.

i don’t see how engaging with the game and posting some solving would out anyone as a real player

it’s not like NPCs haven’t been solving too

And many NPC's havent, either. Again, it comes to a consensus that we are unable to obtain. So at best, it's a pick your poison concept - lay low and pretend to NPC so you dont get offed or scouted too early, observe without saying too much so you cant cause too many waves, or have no fear and just start saying shit and additionally hope you have the time to be caught up in a game like this -of this amount of players and posting, when half of the players and posts do not matter - to attempt say things that makes a modicum of sense.

Either way, I stand in my stance on the subject.

i don’t see how it requires consensus

it doesn’t have to be that all real town start doing stuff or all agree to do nothing

any villager can just solve if they want to and so can any NPC, so i don’t see how doing stuff outs anyone as a real player to wolves or how it requires universal agreement

[Vivax]

Wilgy where‘d you place your vote right now?

Creature I still have slight ire with.

Ran after, but I'd like to see how this day evolves.

Don‘t know about creature I‘m guessing NPC for now.
RANMILLA had a bit of a dropoff, Scotty is usually a lot more nosy so NpC or wolf.

As for santy’s question, feels while going over posts and votes being largely unagenda-d while reading them in game context. Seemed NPC-y during ISO afterwards.

If you ask me alignment related questions you get alignment related answers. The NPC read was a delayed realization as addendum.

[Porscha]

i don’t agree with the strategy that villagers should just coast until the NPCs die

then you give wolves chances to eliminate real players at night (and even to try to take over the thread during the day)

and by the time the NPCs are gone you can be down villagers that wolves have managed to kill at night without eliminating wolfy real players from the PoE because you’re twiddling your thumbs instead of trying to lunch wolves

i feel like if every villager got aggressive today and started solving with the help of the town siding NPCs we could have started to box wolves in pretty well

just not sure what the upside of doing nothing is realistically

It isnt about doing nothing, it's about not intentionally outing yourself as a player.

Additionally, does your suggestion not require a general consensus/ agreement among the people remaining to adhere to? Do you think this is feasible with 20 NPC's remaining? Not feasible today, imo.

@Porscha . Today is going to be a purge at EoD with half of Npc players removed from the game + a lot of Npc slots are kinda obvious so I dont think that mafia is going to miss more nks fwiw.

And its feasible to start solving today. At least there are list with prob players and pushes there and who is likely npc and to ignore. Ran is prob an Npc and not a good push today

I understand that there are players and NPC's and I've had my own opinions as well as to who is which.
I agree it is *possible* to attempt solving today. The longer the game goes, the more possible it becomes.
I'm likely to not be convinced off Ran today. We are most likely to hit an NPC with our votes anyway. So I'm going to put my vote on someone who, as I said, regardless of player or NPC, isnt particularly town siding in my opinion.

Consider this my attempt at solving today, and I will not be swayed off of attempting to solve, by people who keep insisting I'm not solving and that my stance on how people would likely play is not pertinent.

Do you want me to solve or not? If you do, then I suggest you quit trying to get my vote off Ran.

[Porscha]

i don’t agree with the strategy that villagers should just coast until the NPCs die

then you give wolves chances to eliminate real players at night (and even to try to take over the thread during the day)

and by the time the NPCs are gone you can be down villagers that wolves have managed to kill at night without eliminating wolfy real players from the PoE because you’re twiddling your thumbs instead of trying to lunch wolves

i feel like if every villager got aggressive today and started solving with the help of the town siding NPCs we could have started to box wolves in pretty well

just not sure what the upside of doing nothing is realistically

It isnt about doing nothing, it's about not intentionally outing yourself as a player.

Additionally, does your suggestion not require a general consensus/ agreement among the people remaining to adhere to? Do you think this is feasible with 20 NPC's remaining? Not feasible today, imo.

i don’t see how engaging with the game and posting some solving would out anyone as a real player

it’s not like NPCs haven’t been solving too

And many NPC's havent, either. Again, it comes to a consensus that we are unable to obtain. So at best, it's a pick your poison concept - lay low and pretend to NPC so you dont get offed or scouted too early, observe without saying too much so you cant cause too many waves, or have no fear and just start saying shit and additionally hope you have the time to be caught up in a game like this -of this amount of players and posting, when half of the players and posts do not matter - to attempt say things that makes a modicum of sense.

Either way, I stand in my stance on the subject.

i don’t see how it requires consensus

it doesn’t have to be that all real town start doing stuff or all agree to do nothing

any villager can just solve if they want to and so can any NPC, so i don’t see how doing stuff outs anyone as a real player to wolves or how it requires universal agreement

Yes, also any observer not in the game can try solving. Anybody can try solving whenever they want.

"Doing stuff" was the biggest basis to how everyone was evaluating whether people were players or NPC's up until this point. If a player is attempting to hide as an NPC, they will try harder to not be seen as a player, which would include "doing things."

This is why how someone is playing can be outing.

[Hally]

santy is right

we probably have enough players that have true claimed player at this point that wolves probably have a fairly good sense of who is likely itg and who to NK

plus they have their scout results and also half the NPCs who they could miss on are dying at EoD

wolves are not going to keep killing NPCs forever, they will start hitting villagers

if villagers aren’t hitting them back during the day and trying to solve the game, town will be down a lot by the time the NPCs are all gone

[Porscha]

Sorry, am I misunderstanding that the mafia deleter can only delete 1 real player like the town deleter?

[Hally]

Sorry, am I misunderstanding that the mafia deleter can only delete 1 real player like the town deleter?

as i understand it, each faction’s deleter can only delete one NPC the whole game

if they target a player they will fail and can keep going until they hit an NPC

[Sloonei]

[VOTE: Scotty] aubergine

por que

I have read about 10% of this thread but Scotty has, on a couple of occasions, looked like a player who wants to look like he's being calm and collected.

This is not a highly informed vote.

[katze]

nya

[Porscha]

"Each faction has a Scout and a Deleter. The scout can target a player every night to find out if they are a real player. The deleter gets to remove one player from the game if they aren't a real player. They can target every night but as soon as they land one, they cannot use the role again."

I had this backwards. Can we assume the deleters have both used up their ability?

[Manny]

Do you want me to solve or not? If you do, then I suggest you quit trying to get my vote off Ran.

Slay Queen

(for the record i think Ran is townsiding if an NPC or town if a player.)

[Ranmilia]

Only one deleter has been used, unless there was a crosskill. I find it highly unlikely that there was a crosskill though.

[katze]

ran is like, the most obvious wolf in the game

[Ranmilia]

Oh yeah. They got me dead to rights when I crossed out dead players on a reposted VC.

[katze]

is what i would say if i were trying to wolfside

[Michelle]

"They post no content as town" is not a defense to me; that just makes me feel better about yeeting them if they're town. Yeeting everyone who posts no content and doesn't help town is generally a winning strategy and one of the cornerstones of how I play.

I am not sure what about Wilgy's point would be "valid." Interacting with wolves is not good, unless you think you have a clever bait to get them to spew more wolves. Usually people do not like it much when I interact with people I am scumreading, because that interaction consists of calling them a wolf and saying they should be voted out. If you'd prefer a different target, I'm going to need reasons - better ones than "they post no content as town" and a wolfier target.

Ranmila a townie is a townie, if you disagree with the playstyle that doesn't make that player not/less important.
Every single townie counts and trying to read the players harder to read is important in any game.
I rarely saw town winning when town went for policy like you are advocating in this game.

You pushed me and sheeped Nanook who's vote wasn't even serious and now you're pushing Wilgy and I asked you twice about why him and no other player low posting if the idea to kill a low poster is so dear to you.

[Porscha]

Do you want me to solve or not? If you do, then I suggest you quit trying to get my vote off Ran.

Slay Queen

(for the record i think Ran is townsiding if an NPC or town if a player.)

This is very possible

[Porscha]

is what i would say if i were trying to wolfside

Maybe you are

[katze]

is what i would say if i were trying to wolfside

Maybe you are

me? never

[Ranmilia]

Naw. Policy wins games. Gotta hold people to some standard. If you reward people for having an antitown meta, that just makes them more likely to be antitown in future games and makes it harder to sort them when they are actually a wolf.

Check SCI which I linked a bit ago, we spent the first three days policying people who all flipped town, then destroyed the wolves when they had no one to hide behind. (This is not a completely accurate summary of the game, but the policy part worked out).

The better question is - why NOT Wilgy? There certainly are other good votes, but why is the Wilgy push getting so much resistance?

[Ranmilia]

(for the record the behavior of some of those SCI policies definitely hardened my heart coming into this game. I don't have time or energy to waste trying to work through whether someone who posts "fart" five times is town or mafia, just kill them, if too many town act that way then town will lose and deservedly so. But usually it is wolves who act that way.)

[katze]

ran u would never policy me for posting fart 5 times...... would u?

[Michelle]

Simply because i consider his posts pretty good

I already said when I found good posts from him.

Pushing just Wilgy means we don't look at the others.

[Ranmilia]

Simply because i consider his posts pretty good

I already said when I found good posts from him.

Pushing just Wilgy means we don't look at the others.

Then we are in accord and I encourage you to keep on keepin on.

[Manny]

I have the opposite POV to Ranmilia i've seen town lose a bunch of games due to policy lynches zzz.

[DeeZees]

Anyone else really wanna post fart

[Porscha]

"They post no content as town" is not a defense to me; that just makes me feel better about yeeting them if they're town. Yeeting everyone who posts no content and doesn't help town is generally a winning strategy and one of the cornerstones of how I play.

I am not sure what about Wilgy's point would be "valid." Interacting with wolves is not good, unless you think you have a clever bait to get them to spew more wolves. Usually people do not like it much when I interact with people I am scumreading, because that interaction consists of calling them a wolf and saying they should be voted out. If you'd prefer a different target, I'm going to need reasons - better ones than "they post no content as town" and a wolfier target.

If all you do when you interact with people you're scumreading is call them a wolf and saying they should be voted out, that is of course generally not... mmm... how to say... well, my point is that of course nobody likes it. It doesnt provide dialog or the opportunity for the person being scumread to change your mind.

Additionally, by your logic, any low poster is wolfy right now. So any of them could be considered a wolfy target, and yet we are still sitting ass on wilgy. What do you hope to get out of it? (Your answer is "a wolf, obviously, you stupid idiot porscha" but I'd like to know where the line is being drawn on why you insist on focusing on wilgy when you could also be making cases on the other people youd be willing to vote and seeing reactions to those instead of sitting on wagon not achieving much by way of player reaction testing, vote reaction, etc...)

[Vivax]

Neon probs player, tentatively town on a quick skim. Porscha maybe NPC but likely town if PC.
Ranmilia wagon looks pure mostly.

Quite possibly a bunch of scum among nonvoters but phoneplaying so it‘ll be a slow chore to look further and it‘s killing my motivation (or WIM as you fancily call it)

[Michelle]

(for the record the behavior of some of those SCI policies definitely hardened my heart coming into this game. I don't have time or energy to waste trying to work through whether someone who posts "fart" five times is town or mafia, just kill them, if too many town act that way then town will lose and deservedly so. But usually it is wolves who act that way.)

Let's not exagerate, this fart example cannot be applied to Wilgy.

[Porscha]

Naw. Policy wins games. Gotta hold people to some standard. If you reward people for having an antitown meta, that just makes them more likely to be antitown in future games and makes it harder to sort them when they are actually a wolf.

Check SCI which I linked a bit ago, we spent the first three days policying people who all flipped town, then destroyed the wolves when they had no one to hide behind. (This is not a completely accurate summary of the game, but the policy part worked out).

The better question is - why NOT Wilgy? There certainly are other good votes, but why is the Wilgy push getting so much resistance?

Because town wilgy can play like this and still be a boon to his town team.

[Manny]

Anyone else really wanna post fart

its taking all of my 3 active braincells to stop me from doing so.

[Michelle]

Anyone else really wanna post fart

its taking all of my 3 active braincells to stop me from doing so.

[Michelle]

[VOTE: @RondoDimBuckle ] aubergine

[Michelle]

[VOTE: RondoDimBuckle ] aubergine

[Michelle]

Simply because i consider his posts pretty good

I already said when I found good posts from him.

Pushing just Wilgy means we don't look at the others.

Then we are in accord and I encourage you to keep on keepin on.

There is a nuance between your stance and mine.

I wouldn't call that accord, but i will keep trying to find the wolves.

[Ranmilia]

"They post no content as town" is not a defense to me; that just makes me feel better about yeeting them if they're town. Yeeting everyone who posts no content and doesn't help town is generally a winning strategy and one of the cornerstones of how I play.

I am not sure what about Wilgy's point would be "valid." Interacting with wolves is not good, unless you think you have a clever bait to get them to spew more wolves. Usually people do not like it much when I interact with people I am scumreading, because that interaction consists of calling them a wolf and saying they should be voted out. If you'd prefer a different target, I'm going to need reasons - better ones than "they post no content as town" and a wolfier target.

If all you do when you interact with people you're scumreading is call them a wolf and saying they should be voted out, that is of course generally not... mmm... how to say... well, my point is that of course nobody likes it. It doesnt provide dialog or the opportunity for the person being scumread to change your mind.

Additionally, by your logic, any low poster is wolfy right now. So any of them could be considered a wolfy target, and yet we are still sitting ass on wilgy. What do you hope to get out of it? (Your answer is "a wolf, obviously, you stupid idiot porscha" but I'd like to know where the line is being drawn on why you insist on focusing on wilgy when you could also be making cases on the other people youd be willing to vote and seeing reactions to those instead of sitting on wagon not achieving much by way of player reaction testing, vote reaction, etc...)

Because staying on a target consistently A. produces more useful reactions and content and B. is much more likely to follow through and kill them if they are actually a wolf. People's jimmies are rustled, people are posting takes and getting serious about whether they're pro wilgy or anti wilgy. Jumping around between a bunch of cases in my experience diffuses player attention and lets wolves slip by treating it as "just another rando case that will pass by in a few hours." I have the opposite take on how this has turned out, I think sitting on Wilgy has generated a great amount of valuable content and reactions and achieved quite a lot of value, whereas hopping around would not have.

[Ranmilia]

I have the opposite POV to Ranmilia i've seen town lose a bunch of games due to policy lynches zzz.

As to this though

[Michelle]

I have the opposite POV to Ranmilia i've seen town lose a bunch of games due to policy lynches zzz.

As to this though

They mischopped Jack? Do you think that was ok?