Persona 5 Mafia [Game End]

[JaggedJimmyJay]

I believe that you believe in what you're saying Dragomir, but I think it's misguided. Rej's suspicion of you, which I find disagreeable and reliant upon considerable stretches, is still difficult to associate with some kind of mafia "agenda". If a mafia Rej is doing this, I think it'd have to be because a mafia Rej feels like doing it. Strategically speaking, spending his time and resources working against you is unlikely to net your lynch given your stature in other players' reads. If Rej wants to be rid of you for some reason, it's hard to understand why his chosen approach would be "kill Long Con and then pursue a Dragomir lynch" instead of just "kill Dragomir".

Why kill me? I'm pretty sure everyone and their mother thought I'd be protected. I don't think he actually wants to get me lynched. He's just trying to spend his time he knows ain't getting lynched to look contributive. He's trying to pull what TSP did and evidently by this exact post of yours, it's working. Why town read Rej? I don't get it.

I think I agree with you now. Regardless of whether you're lynched (highly unlikely), Rej's hunting efforts this phase have been almost exclusively low-probability tinfoils and WIFOM. In that regard the contributions, while novel, can be questioned for their actual value. I don't know him as a player -- do you view him as someone inclined toward unorthodox theorizing?

[Dragomir]

yes drago changed in his playstyle, this is indiscussable, is there mafia abilities that forces someone to lead a mislynch for them? out of curiosity.

else based on my day 1 suspicion on Epignosis I feel free to enter the epignosis wagon whenever I please, I can always come back to it plus add my D2 thoughts and feels to it.

I would have no problems to vote Dragomir, as he could also provide info to the civillians, I am so torn and for me personally it is hard to find a new option.

[VOTE: novote] aubergine

My playstyle at its backbone is still the same that you are familiar with from OJ/TB. It's just got a different "mood" to it.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

And "we can get info from a Drago lynch" is just ?

[JaggedJimmyJay]

[VOTE: Rej] aubergine

What took you so long to get to this point?

I was calling for his lynch yesterday.

[Dragomir]

I believe that you believe in what you're saying Dragomir, but I think it's misguided. Rej's suspicion of you, which I find disagreeable and reliant upon considerable stretches, is still difficult to associate with some kind of mafia "agenda". If a mafia Rej is doing this, I think it'd have to be because a mafia Rej feels like doing it. Strategically speaking, spending his time and resources working against you is unlikely to net your lynch given your stature in other players' reads. If Rej wants to be rid of you for some reason, it's hard to understand why his chosen approach would be "kill Long Con and then pursue a Dragomir lynch" instead of just "kill Dragomir".

Why kill me? I'm pretty sure everyone and their mother thought I'd be protected. I don't think he actually wants to get me lynched. He's just trying to spend his time he knows ain't getting lynched to look contributive. He's trying to pull what TSP did and evidently by this exact post of yours, it's working. Why town read Rej? I don't get it.

I think I agree with you now. Regardless of whether you're lynched (highly unlikely), Rej's hunting efforts this phase have been almost exclusively low-probability tinfoils and WIFOM. In that regard the contributions, while novel, can be questioned for their actual value. I don't know him as a player -- do you view him as someone inclined toward unorthodox theorizing?

He does theorize a lot as both alignments but as town it's more on the setup and he does less tinfoil and more game-solving. I've never seen this much tinfoil and wifom from him before tho.

[Dragomir]

[VOTE: Rej] aubergine

What took you so long to get to this point?

I was calling for his lynch yesterday.

But your vote was on Epi

[JaggedJimmyJay]

[VOTE: Rej] aubergine

What took you so long to get to this point?

I was calling for his lynch yesterday.

But your vote was on Epi

I mean "Day 1" yesterday. Whatever, who cares.

I'm not convinced it's Rej even now. He's back in the POE though.

[Dragomir]

Tbh, I don't pay enough attention to Rej's overall playstyle to have it embedded in my brain.

[Dragomir]

I gotta go to sleep now cause school and my laptop is at 2%. Peace. Lynch Rej.

[MacDougall]

I think Nutella is maybe the answer?

Reasons, please.

Lack of reasons to town read.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

I think Nutella is maybe the answer?

Reasons, please.

Lack of reasons to town read.

Why is Rej a civilian?

[JaggedJimmyJay]

I think Nutella is maybe the answer?

Reasons, please.

Lack of reasons to town read.

I liked her a lot in her interactions. I've been wrong before. Where are your disagreements?

[JaggedJimmyJay]

Reactions to Long Con kill:

Spoiler: show

Yeah, Long Con was in pretty much everyone's POE. No idea why he would have been shot.

"How's that? Hehehe..."

So I was thinking over the Mafia game while enjoying a nice shower as I am often wont to do, and I found myself stuck in a particular place:

Even within my POE, I have seen glimmers of things that look like civilians (Epignosis, Creature, and sprityo). I cannot pretend that lynching them would be something that gives me immense confidence, particularly with busser tinfoil ever-present. However, there's a direction that will all tend to point, when everyone seems like they can be fine.

Long Con.

What about him?

He's the only player remaining for whom I can identify nothing of any potentially civilian orientation. There's no reason it can't just be him.

If Jay killed LC after posting this, that's really funny and really good wine.

"This effin' rocks!"

Yeah, Long Con was in pretty much everyone's POE. No idea why he would have been shot.

The best way to get a read on Long Con is to solidify reads on everyone else. POE is the only way to do anything with inactive players.

Oh well, then it seems likely he's town.

Hehe, I am being right again.

Say I have TMI.

Really surprising kill. I thought it'd be me.

Damn. Long Con died. I had him 100% pegged as a civilian, and look at how right I was.

Poor Long Con, why mafia killed him off when they could order a mislynch on him if they played well.

Lmao

Guys the big question is: Why isn't someone from towncore killed by scum?
The answer is simple: The scum is inside towncore and feels like they can manipulate towncore.


[VOTE: Dragomir] aubergine

@Dragomir come at me! You a PR that bussed his goon!

Most of these give me no impression. Epi's is dopey in a way I don't care for. Rej's looks the most like someone putting a kill-driven strategy in motion.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

yes drago changed in his playstyle, this is indiscussable, is there mafia abilities that forces someone to lead a mislynch for them? out of curiosity.

else based on my day 1 suspicion on Epignosis I feel free to enter the epignosis wagon whenever I please, I can always come back to it plus add my D2 thoughts and feels to it.

I would have no problems to vote Dragomir, as he could also provide info to the civillians, I am so torn and for me personally it is hard to find a new option.

[VOTE: novote] aubergine

This post bugs me quite a bit. Color coding:

Yellow: wild theorizing about the motivation for Dragomir to suspect him grounded in nothing with any high probability of existing

Orange: "I am legally allowed to vote for Epignosis, because I suspected him on Day 1. I have the supporting evidence in my posts to justify a vote for Epignosis. You can check. So there." Wrong mindset.

Red: The following spoiler contains Day 2 posts pertaining to Rej's perspective of Epignosis:

Spoiler: show

Or who is supposed to be "towncore". I feel my and Creature activity is not enough to be considered towncore. Epignosis is to shady and way on his own to be counted as towncore.

not much happened huh, I just feel that Epignosis might be a safe lynch here this DP

if anyone reads epi as civillian, please let me know, I still need to learn how and why

So did scum epi waste a shot on Long Con? I feel scum could shoot Dragomir at best, with high profitting out of it.

[VOTE: epignosis] aubergine

"Shady" / "Way on his own" / "Safe lynch" / "If anyone thinks he's good lemme know" / "Did he shoot Long Con?"

These look more like justifications to place a vote than actual suspicions emerging from an innocent Rej soul.

Blue: I n f o L y n c h -- disregarding the inherent yuck that is that, the notion that lynching Dragomir provides information (beyond the information that is provided by lynching anybody is quite dubious. Again I see less hunting and more focus on justifying stances.

Pink: Ugly at face value.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

We have a weird deadline. Who is absolutely certain they won't be here for it? I should be here for the couple hours prior or so.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

[mention]Jackofhearts2005[/mention]
[mention]MacDougall[/mention]

Each of you have called Rej a civilian recently or not recently. If you still feel that way, please explain it to me, ideally with something reasonably substantive if you can. Time is of the essence.

[Rej]

@Rej what is your perspective of Dragomir as of this very moment?

I took my vote off Epignosis, so Drago can form the wagon on me with more ease and I become an easier lynch.
Dragomir is not trustworthy, can be Indie, can be everything.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

@Rej what is your perspective of Dragomir as of this very moment?

I took my vote off Epignosis, so Drago can form the wagon on me with more ease and I become an easier lynch.
Dragomir is not trustworthy, can be Indie, can be everything.

I return then to my previous question. You answered it last time with a completely separate theory.

@Rej, what makes Dragomir your choice vote among all of the "towncore" players who could be associated with the LC kill given your theory?

[Rej]

yes drago changed in his playstyle, this is indiscussable, is there mafia abilities that forces someone to lead a mislynch for them? out of curiosity.

else based on my day 1 suspicion on Epignosis I feel free to enter the epignosis wagon whenever I please, I can always come back to it plus add my D2 thoughts and feels to it.

I would have no problems to vote Dragomir, as he could also provide info to the civillians, I am so torn and for me personally it is hard to find a new option.

[VOTE: novote] aubergine

My playstyle at its backbone is still the same that you are familiar with from OJ/TB. It's just got a different "mood" to it.

Ah yeah I am familiar with your mislynch playstyle. LoL!

[Rej]

Any time for me to go to bed, Civillian Rej says, g'bye and g'morning



If I flip Civ, make sure to go after Dragomir. (Indie/Mafia)
Also check on the Epi, nutella and Mac triangle.

Adios

[JaggedJimmyJay]

[nutella]

If I flip Civ

Also check on the Epi, nutella and Mac triangle.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

[VOTE: Epignosis] aubergine

[sprityo]

I believe that you believe in what you're saying Dragomir, but I think it's misguided. Rej's suspicion of you, which I find disagreeable and reliant upon considerable stretches, is still difficult to associate with some kind of mafia "agenda". If a mafia Rej is doing this, I think it'd have to be because a mafia Rej feels like doing it. Strategically speaking, spending his time and resources working against you is unlikely to net your lynch given your stature in other players' reads. If Rej wants to be rid of you for some reason, it's hard to understand why his chosen approach would be "kill Long Con and then pursue a Dragomir lynch" instead of just "kill Dragomir".

Why kill me? I'm pretty sure everyone and their mother thought I'd be protected. I don't think he actually wants to get me lynched. He's just trying to spend his time he knows ain't getting lynched to look contributive. He's trying to pull what TSP did and evidently by this exact post of yours, it's working. Why town read Rej? I don't get it.

in context, we're in a heist, which is limited to 3 PRs max. It's reasonable to assume there's a doctor, but not a guarantee.

[sprityo]

We have a weird deadline. Who is absolutely certain they won't be here for it? I should be here for the couple hours prior or so.

I will be here since it's just before 10 pm for me

[sprityo]

Self voting. Interesting.

[Dragomir]

[VOTE: Epignosis] aubergine

Why change?

[Rej]

How long does DP last? There is scum on my wagon.

[Rej]

Or scum let it be an autorunner.

[Dragomir]

How long does DP last? There is scum on my wagon.

You are correct. That scum is you!

[JaggedJimmyJay]

[VOTE: Epignosis] aubergine

Why change?

I don’t want a wagon running away before an unusual deadline. There’s still more to talk about, and I don’t know who will be here.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

Or scum let it be an autorunner.

Why did you vote for yourself?

[JaggedJimmyJay]

How long does DP last? There is scum on my wagon.

We have less than three hours.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

We have a few reads playing an important role in the current situation that I don’t understand, and it’s important that we talk about them while there’s still time. I hope the time isn’t a huge issue.

[mention]MacDougall[/mention], I already asked why Rej is a civilian, but I also want to know about Epignosis. Likewise, nutella is outside my POE and won’t be my vote without an argument of some kind. I provided the reasons I saw to read her as a civilian. If I’m wrong I need help getting there.

[mention]Jackofhearts2005[/mention], why are you moderately certain sprityo is a civilian?

If these are gut reads, please don’t just say that. We’re late enough in the game that we can substantiate things. Point to one or more posts.

[Creature]

I'm only feeling Jack scum rn

[JaggedJimmyJay]

I'm only feeling Jack scum rn

What about Jack gets you scurred?

[JaggedJimmyJay]

I'm voting Rej if that self-vote doesn't move. I'm not playing with these gambits.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

The deadline is in 90 minutes and we have a considerable vote spread. I hope some people will be around.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

Asking questions in this game has been like pulling teeth.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

It'll be about 3:30am in Macville, so he's probably out.

[Jackofhearts2005]

[VOTE: Epi] aubergine

I don’t even have much of a townread on Rej anymore [mention]JaggedJimmyJay[/mention]. But I like an Epi lynch better.

[Jackofhearts2005]

We have a few reads playing an important role in the current situation that I don’t understand, and it’s important that we talk about them while there’s still time. I hope the time isn’t a huge issue.

MacDougall, I already asked why Rej is a civilian, but I also want to know about Epignosis. Likewise, nutella is outside my POE and won’t be my vote without an argument of some kind. I provided the reasons I saw to read her as a civilian. If I’m wrong I need help getting there.

Jackofhearts2005, why are you moderately certain sprityo is a civilian?

If these are gut reads, please don’t just say that. We’re late enough in the game that we can substantiate things. Point to one or more posts.

He’s too aggressive? Idk. I feel like I had a decent reason and then I started multigaming.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

Well at least there's beautiful symmetry in the tally.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

I'd rather lynch the guy voting on the counterwagon than the guy voting on himself. I'm making self-voting illegal in all of my future games (no slight on speedchuck, it's a personal frustration).

[Jackofhearts2005]

There are corner cases where self voting is protown (vengeful, if it’ll solve the game) but mostly it’s either throwing or appeal to emotion by pretending to throw and I’m not really a fan of either of those.

[Jackofhearts2005]

I’m kinda coming around on you Jay so shoot someone else.

[nutella]

Well at least there's beautiful symmetry in the tally.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

We should be so fortunate as to have nobody shot when the game ends.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

[mention]nutella[/mention], could you please indicate however you can whether you think Rej is a civilian or a mafioso? Something with a clear good-or-bad delineation?

[nutella]