The Syndicate

No cowboy, just review.

Alison wrote: ↑Thu Jan 13, 2022 2:30 am Like let's say he is wolf, he is partners with me, and he sees the way you treat Fext. I hop on to kill Fext... and he has the perfect opportunity to defend Fext. He knows I can get people killed D1, which means Fext will go over regardless of whether he has his vote there or not, and he also knows that he can get sick towncred if he defends Fext. He could be in the position that NAA is in right now today with nobody really questioning him except me, if he had defended Fext and I was his partner.

So Mac would defend Fext if I was mafia, and Mac would defend Fext if I was town. Ergo, Mac is town.

I'm almost done with Alison's ISO. Just re reading the interactions between Seanzie and Alison makes me not as keen to that being the partnership.

Alison's a very good player, but do Seanzie and Alison as partners keep up that dialogue in the way they did? Doubt.

Mac however, such as in the quote above, there is always too many fail-safes on Alison's reads of Mac.

Also comparing how Alison treated Creature, NAA, along with Me and Seanzie, Mac is the only one that gets these hoops of a read.

Also, in reading through Alison's ISO, I just can't help but feel that LC being the early night yeet is a tell for scum Mac here.

DrWilgy wrote: ↑Mon Jan 17, 2022 12:08 am Also, in reading through Alison's ISO, I just can't help but feel that LC being the early night yeet is a tell for scum Mac here.

MacDougall wrote: ↑Mon Jan 17, 2022 12:24 am

DrWilgy wrote: ↑Mon Jan 17, 2022 12:08 am Also, in reading through Alison's ISO, I just can't help but feel that LC being the early night yeet is a tell for scum Mac here.

Who's Alison's teammate where the LC kill makes sense? LC was correct about Fext, could've been angled as tmi. Alison went out of the way to even mention that LC should be the train d2 and undid the effort with a kill following?

LC was like NAA, Creature, Mac.

I don't think he was right on NAA and Creature. Maybe he was right you you my guy?

Throws people, get your throws.

It's ok tbh I've played shit and been thoroughly outplayed by the wolves here so I won't actually be salty in post. I am actually extremely impressed.

MacDougall wrote: ↑Mon Jan 17, 2022 12:59 am Throws people, get your throws.

It's ok tbh I've played shit and been thoroughly outplayed by the wolves here so I won't actually be salty in post. I am actually extremely impressed.

I'm back to you or Seanzie I think, final answer.

DrWilgy wrote: ↑Mon Jan 17, 2022 12:36 am

MacDougall wrote: ↑Mon Jan 17, 2022 12:24 am

DrWilgy wrote: ↑Mon Jan 17, 2022 12:08 am Also, in reading through Alison's ISO, I just can't help but feel that LC being the early night yeet is a tell for scum Mac here.

Who's Alison's teammate where the LC kill makes sense? LC was correct about Fext, could've been angled as tmi. Alison went out of the way to even mention that LC should be the train d2 and undid the effort with a kill following?

LC was like NAA, Creature, Mac.

I don't think he was right on NAA and Creature. Maybe he was right you you my guy?

no offence to LC but I don't have any issues winning arguments with him

NotAnAxehole wrote: ↑Mon Jan 17, 2022 1:03 am

MacDougall wrote: ↑Mon Jan 17, 2022 12:59 am Throws people, get your throws.

It's ok tbh I've played shit and been thoroughly outplayed by the wolves here so I won't actually be salty in post. I am actually extremely impressed.

I'm back to you or Seanzie I think, final answer.

lol ok

LC is an Alison kill

i kill ppl i cant chop... neither of these kills i would make

MacDougall wrote: ↑Mon Jan 17, 2022 1:08 am i kill ppl i cant chop... neither of these kills i would make

At a certain point today I was trying to figure out how to read the game I said to myself I would town read anyone who didn't vote Fext, then I looked at the player list and said fuck you all.

LOL

Actually maybe mac and wilgy... I'm really lost, the only thing I almost know for sure is that I don't want to kill creature, and that might be wrong.

NotAnAxehole wrote: ↑Mon Jan 17, 2022 1:15 am Actually maybe mac and wilgy... I'm really lost, the only thing I almost know for sure is that I don't want to kill creature, and that might be wrong.

the words of a wise man
zomg everyone so towny.

If I die here my suggestion for f3 would be to just snap whichever of Seanzie/Axe is there unless it's both of them in which case the other person is the mafia.

Gl town.

I just woke up, pooped, flipped through Falcons ISO again, and I'm not sure about Mac anymore.

Falcon seemed like they wanted the Creature option way more than the Mac option.

Falcon put Mac and Seanzie on the same level. Not sure.

And perhaps D2, if it is creature, you don't go for a tie to potentially save Alison as you'd be shotgunned immediately?

Idk, night kills and potential vote removal is just super important in these types of games.

LC also wanted Creature D1.

Meh

Will probably have even less time to play this game so I really hope it just ends today

DrWilgy wrote: ↑Mon Jan 17, 2022 8:49 am And perhaps D2, if it is creature, you don't go for a tie to potentially save Alison as you'd be shotgunned immediately?

I'd probably have just voted Alison here if I was wolf. There was no point stalling and bringing attention to myself.

My reactions should be pretty pure this game and it's way harder to fake being genuinely scared of mislynching Alison and stalling EOD2.

Thinking about lynching Mac today. Though, if Mac flips town maybe I can rely on his Wilgy townread? I want to believe Mac, if town, would probably have caught wolf!Wilgy here.

Still wouldn't do NotAnAxehole because if they're wolf they have been bussing from D1 and trying to make the game purposefully hard to them.

I still believe we're facing an easier world.

I still think we need to flip Mac and if Mac is a miss, we just need to do a full re-eval tomorrow with more info.

I don't think Mac can be a miss. Everytime I start thinking he might be a miss, he just comes up with another unreasonable take. It's absurd.

Like I said before, Mac has played himself into a loss regardless of his alignment - which is the only argument for not killing him and it's a bad one.

Fair enough, but was Falcon just a bad kill then?

DrWilgy wrote: ↑Mon Jan 17, 2022 10:20 am Fair enough, but was Falcon just a bad kill then?

Who would have been a good kill for Mac?

DrWilgy wrote: ↑Mon Jan 17, 2022 10:20 am Fair enough, but was Falcon just a bad kill then?

I mean, I think so... But listen to Mac's own night kill logic "I kill people I can't chop, I could chop LC and Falcon, so those aren't mine."

1) LC doesn't really matter because it's an Alison kill
2) No fucking way he could have chopped them, those players could not be killed during the day
2a. Look how close I came to dying yesterday, that would have been LC as well... The TMI argument was just garbage
2b. How many people would have even considered Falcon for the rest of the game? I know I wouldn't.

The fact that Falcon was supporting the idea that Mac could be town doesn't factor into Mac's own NK logic.

I'd say NAA more than Falcon.

Seanzie wrote: ↑Mon Jan 17, 2022 10:24 am

DrWilgy wrote: ↑Mon Jan 17, 2022 10:20 am Fair enough, but was Falcon just a bad kill then?

Who would have been a good kill for Mac?

Only acceptable kills for Mac are me and Falcon, needs a non!Seanzie Alison voter

DrWilgy wrote: ↑Mon Jan 17, 2022 10:26 am I'd say NAA more than Falcon.

Right, but if he made the 2nd most reasonable kill in your mind, it's very likely to have just been the best kill in his mind, you know?

Aye

DrWilgy wrote: ↑Mon Jan 17, 2022 10:26 am I'd say NAA more than Falcon.

I could also see NAA, yeah, but I think scum!Mac needs miselims, and Falcon/Creature both looked really good after EoD since they both could have saved Alison, so that only would leave him with you/me. No offense, but I'm going to guess he was more worried about me than you (I've been much more active, and I've been pushing him more). You could say maybe he just goes for Creature instead of me anyways, but I was going to be pushing him, and it is hard to not end up thunderdoming someone hardpushing you.

He tried to push a narrative that a Falcon kill points to me today, bringing it up multiple times, so this is motive on it's own - a potential frame. This also ignores the nuance that again, Falcon made it clear at EoD he didn't want me over (He wasn't sure on Alison and was willing to move to Creature with Alison, but not willing to move to me), and he had posts near EoD that were like "Well, I don't agree with this, but I can see how you'd feel this as town" about some parts of my Mac case.

NAA on the other hand was hardpushing a Seanzie/Alison team.

So like... I don't mean to be egotistical, but I think scum!Mac killing Falcon makes perfect sense if scum!Mac wants me as a miselim.

Seanzie wrote: ↑Mon Jan 17, 2022 10:36 am

DrWilgy wrote: ↑Mon Jan 17, 2022 10:26 am I'd say NAA more than Falcon.

I could also see NAA, yeah, but I think scum!Mac needs miselims, and Falcon/Creature both looked really good after EoD since they both could have saved Alison, so that only would leave him with you/me. No offense, but I'm going to guess he was more worried about me than you (I've been much more active, and I've been pushing him more). You could say maybe he just goes for Creature instead of me anyways, but I was going to be pushing him, and it is hard to not end up thunderdoming someone hardpushing you.

He tried to push a narrative that a Falcon kill points to me today, bringing it up multiple times, so this is motive on it's own - a potential frame. This also ignores the nuance that again, Falcon made it clear at EoD he didn't want me over (He wasn't sure on Alison and was willing to move to Creature with Alison, but not willing to move to me), and he had posts near EoD that were like "Well, I don't agree with this, but I can see how you'd feel this as town" about some parts of my Mac case.

NAA on the other hand was hardpushing a Seanzie/Alison team.

So like... I don't mean to be egotistical, but I think scum!Mac killing Falcon makes perfect sense if scum!Mac wants me as a miselim.

This should also include that if I don't work out as a miselim, NAA is still just always an easier miselim than Falcon would be today. Falcon was widely townread on play and clear because of EoD2. While obviously you only need 2 miselims, and sometimes wolves take clears to FX that they think they can manipulate, it's rarely a bad idea to bring potential miselim, all else considered equal.

I wanted to push DrWilgy today to see how that would look, and I didn't like it. Let's kill Mac and see where the game is at.

I'm really struggling with the 3-2-1-1 vote...

1 - DrWilgy (Even if DrWilgy is town, mafia couldn't self pres here because DrWilgy was a swing vote)
1 - Creature (Even if Creature is town, mafia couldn't self pres here because Creature was a swing vote)
2 - Seanzie (Alison & Mac tried getting Creature on this wagon)
3 - Alison (Seanzie was here pretty early on, and wouldn't have had any self pres options due to Mac's vote)

Purely based on this, and nothing else, I would assume that Mac or Seanzie are mafia because it the DrWilgy/Creature cross vote feels so awkward for mafia to play around.



Maybe I'm looking at this the wrong way... Mafia had no options yesterday, so what would make it possible for them to vote Creature? - We need to look at the pre-EoD events for this because EoD was stagnant.

1) Creature would need to be town
2) Mac would need to be town (because mafia needs Maj - no convincing required)
3) DrWilgy would need to be town (because mafia needs Maj - no convincing required)

Vote would be DrWilgy, Mac, Alison, Seanzie (all 4 of these headed into F5 would be a nightmare)

- DrWilgy same conclusion except town!Mac probably wouldn't have voted DrWilgy so it's moot.

I think the fact that voting together wasn't considered makes Seanzie more than likely not mafia, I think if he's mafia he at least at some point tries to find common ground with Mac rather than repeatedly antagonizing their only ally (I mean, maybe he does it a bit for appearances, but if I'm Alison and Seanzie is antagonizing our only ally, I probably don't even show up to play the day, or I tell him to STFU and try to get Mac onboard with a better kill - which would have taken all of 2 seconds, Mac was eating out of Alison's hand).



Also, I wonder why Alison's partner doesn't work harder to bring Falcon over. The only person who actually tried to talk Falcon off of his reads yesterday was Mac who put in a considerable effort - I did too, but I pushed Falcon towards Alison over Creature.

Also, Falcon starting off on Creature reinforces the idea that Mafia would have just gone for a kill on Creature yesterday, the Seanzie / Alison bus world is unnecessary

@Seanzie if you're mafia, I'm voting you for a 2021 socky of your choice.

You can tell me which one you want now

NotAnAxehole wrote: ↑Mon Jan 17, 2022 11:01 am @Seanzie if you're mafia, I'm voting you for a 2021 socky of your choice.

NotAnAxehole wrote: ↑Mon Jan 17, 2022 11:02 am You can tell me which one you want now

If I was mafia here, I would deserve to win like... all of the mafia-sided and NAI sockys.

Unfortunately I'll have to settle with best townie if Mac dying wins the game... but probably won't win it because it is too early in the year, everyone will have forgotten by then, and no one will understand my play around Fext and see it as a bad move rather than a good one.

NotAnAxehole wrote: ↑Mon Jan 17, 2022 11:01 am @Seanzie if you're mafia, I'm voting you for a 2021 socky of your choice.

Beat Wilgy is reserved for me. Sorry.

DrWilgy wrote: ↑Mon Jan 17, 2022 11:18 am

NotAnAxehole wrote: ↑Mon Jan 17, 2022 11:01 am @Seanzie if you're mafia, I'm voting you for a 2021 socky of your choice.

Beat Wilgy is reserved for me. Sorry.

I'm nominating Seanzie for best roleplay.

Seanzie wrote: ↑Mon Jan 17, 2022 11:10 am

NotAnAxehole wrote: ↑Mon Jan 17, 2022 11:01 am @Seanzie if you're mafia, I'm voting you for a 2021 socky of your choice.

NotAnAxehole wrote: ↑Mon Jan 17, 2022 11:02 am You can tell me which one you want now

If I was mafia here, I would deserve to win like... all of the mafia-sided and NAI sockys.

Unfortunately I'll have to settle with best townie if Mac dying wins the game... but probably won't win it because it is too early in the year, everyone will have forgotten by then, and no one will understand my play around Fext and see it as a bad move rather than a good one.

I'm sorry that's me...

NotAnAxehole wrote: ↑Mon Jan 17, 2022 11:20 am

Seanzie wrote: ↑Mon Jan 17, 2022 11:10 am

NotAnAxehole wrote: ↑Mon Jan 17, 2022 11:01 am @Seanzie if you're mafia, I'm voting you for a 2021 socky of your choice.

NotAnAxehole wrote: ↑Mon Jan 17, 2022 11:02 am You can tell me which one you want now

If I was mafia here, I would deserve to win like... all of the mafia-sided and NAI sockys.

Unfortunately I'll have to settle with best townie if Mac dying wins the game... but probably won't win it because it is too early in the year, everyone will have forgotten by then, and no one will understand my play around Fext and see it as a bad move rather than a good one.

I'm sorry that's me...

You deserve to win all the mafia-sided Sockys for this game?

Seanzie wrote: ↑Mon Jan 17, 2022 11:35 am

NotAnAxehole wrote: ↑Mon Jan 17, 2022 11:20 am

Seanzie wrote: ↑Mon Jan 17, 2022 11:10 am

NotAnAxehole wrote: ↑Mon Jan 17, 2022 11:01 am @Seanzie if you're mafia, I'm voting you for a 2021 socky of your choice.

NotAnAxehole wrote: ↑Mon Jan 17, 2022 11:02 am You can tell me which one you want now

If I was mafia here, I would deserve to win like... all of the mafia-sided and NAI sockys.

Unfortunately I'll have to settle with best townie if Mac dying wins the game... but probably won't win it because it is too early in the year, everyone will have forgotten by then, and no one will understand my play around Fext and see it as a bad move rather than a good one.

I'm sorry that's me...

You deserve to win all the mafia-sided Sockys for this game?

Only the best town socky... If Mac is mafia

*pop pop pop*

[VOTE: Mac] aubergine

Four hours left.

@MacDougall any last minute/legacy thoughts?

I know earlier you said NAA/Seanzie, except if both are alive. Is this what you want your legacy to be?

yes