Cindy Kate & Percy Date Night Mafia <3 [ENDGAME]

[Sloonei]

It wasn't just the role it was the fact I idled. The role is quite whatever. I also was still thinking we might lose to anti claim up to a point.

prolonged fart noise

Yeah I went searching and felt similarly unimpressed with that answer.

[Sloonei]

[VOTE: macdougall] aubergine

has @Alison told us who has the double vote today?

[JaggedJimmyJay]

Yeah I went searching and felt similarly unimpressed with that answer.

Would you say you've a poisoner read with a confidence level similar to "I think it's just Mac" for mafia?

[TonyStarkPrime]

[VOTE: macdougall] aubergine

has @Alison told us who has the double vote today?

She claimed to have not submitted

[Sloonei]

Yeah I went searching and felt similarly unimpressed with that answer.

Would you say you've a poisoner read with a confidence level similar to "I think it's just Mac" for mafia?

No. TangyStarkPrime has been my default position for several days now.

[MacDougall]

It wasn't just the role it was the fact I idled. The role is quite whatever. I also was still thinking we might lose to anti claim up to a point.

prolonged fart noise

You should get that checked out.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

Also can't really help but doubt the validity of "I think Jay and Guillo interactions should be investigated" when the premise of that mutual suspicion is something that has never existed anywhere.

I meant Jay and Garden, i just didn't know it. You asked me for my reads of a game I haven't read, so I tried my best off the top. I don't have notes, and I forgot Garden was playing. So I accept my chop, my language comprehension and lack of object permanence are clearly to the detriment of town if I'm not making sense, but I don't think my route points are nonsensical here.

Someone please brave the wifom here and make a judgment for me, and thank you.

[MacDougall]

Made looks mafia there.

[MacDougall]

[VOTE: Made] aubergine

[MacDougall]

Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town.

[MacDougall]

Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town.

I rest my case.

[Sloonei]

do kids even know what lolcats are these days? someone give mac a cheezburger.

[MacDougall]

do kids even know what lolcats are these days? someone give mac a cheezburger.

Jesus christ Sloonei it might be time to start talking to a funeral planner.

[MacDougall]

That was an age joke not a death threat.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

Interactions of Made and lost monkey

From Made

Spoiler: show

Made noticed that his musings had infact drawn in the eyes of many, but how many did he feel like in his heart of hearts were those he could call his core?

I'm enjoying the role play Made, and it will be unfortunate when we are forced to utterly destroy it.

rarely being offered to be destroyed so early in a night, made was taken a back

hi pal, glad to see you're still as forward as always. I think i'll be able to hang at least for a bit with this, dw qt <3

Tell me about lost monkey, it a day one kinda vote or something actually there?

Let's just vote Made to be honest.

Like what even is the mafia team if Made is town? Is it Mac + Guillo? Is it [Mac/Guillo] + Allcrab who ripped off LoMo's watcher result and TMI'd bunny and has been skating by ever since? It is one of those + Martin who has fooled me?

I am not inspired by any of these possibilities. A mafia team with Made in it makes the most sense regardless of anyone else's alignment.

what points do you have in favor of Mac or Guilo or Allcrab or Lomo that makes them mutually incompatible? Is it Jay's analysis. The issue is if there's 2 scum left it's either those or you're getting got sis.

Lomo has low Activity meta right? any Percs have insights on what's the difference between their town play and scum play?

What even is a modified tracker?

What are your thoughts on the claims of living players? Why have you not claimed?

I think the attention you're putting on me is odd but i kinda appreciate it cuz it grounds my play. The Desperado stuff on you give you a pass for today, but if i were around I'd prob tinfoil at Fx

I like lomo's case on Jay, I think Jay/guilo interactions need to be looked at by non Jay person that's not comf biased as you seem to be on jay. This is doubly true if Martin is town and we're correctly assuming we have 2 scum left. Jay has the gavial hell in the cell working for him, but I do see him being the kind of confident player who would be willing to go for that play for the wifom

I wouldn't put faking mason's past Nanook, it's seeming like this game has a lot of btsc, so the idea of a neutral or evil align btsc sounds, but the case isn't really that compelling to me.

I think Mac's town on tone, he's as meme-y as he was in zelda mash and modern family, in comparison to spiderman where he ignored all my jokes. I think the fact that we're being shipped means we either only have one scum left in a player with less associative reads like martin, or it's just Jay/Guillo. based on my read of threads state, one scum is prob most likely

Allcrab reads fairly clean to me, but that might just be lack of familiarity with the player compared to the

I've already spoken on Alison, and I don't feel like being roasted on TangleStarkPro again. this is all off the top, so if i'm forgetting someone, that person auto sus af for missing my radar

but yeah, sorry for inactivity y'all, i normally don't get too into a game unless we're losing, or i'm getting turbo'd and that didn't really happen till today. I think we still got this tho

Also can't really help but doubt the validity of "I think Jay and Guillo interactions should be investigated" when the premise of that mutual suspicion is something that has never existed anywhere.

I meant Jay and Garden, i just didn't know it. You asked me for my reads of a game I haven't read, so I tried my best off the top. I don't have notes, and I forgot Garden was playing. So I accept my chop, my language comprehension and lack of object permanence are clearly to the detriment of town if I'm not making sense, but I don't think my route points are nonsensical here.

I wouldn't put faking mason's past Nanook

If you think the mason claims can be fake, pairing me with Guillosooa is a bizarre choice.

how so? didn't y'all claim lovers or something?

This might be a perspective slip of sorts from Made. In his first post he acknowledges that Nanook has claimed to be one half of a mason pair. In his next post he claims to suspect jay and guillotine/esooa as a pair because he believes they have claimed lovers together.

These two reads should not exist together. Nanook only claimed mason after being indirectly outed via Guillotine. There has never been anything suggestive of a Jay/Guillo pairing. If Made has the game awareness to know that Nanook is a mason, then he should not be mistakenly reading Jay and Guillo/esooa as lovers.
I feel like he needed to create fake suspicion against as many people as he could muster and accidentally slipped two completely contradictory views of the game.

I mean i knew that Nanook claimed mason, and Jay claimed lovers. Their partner's names both started with G and I only technically speak english.

How did you become aware of nanook's claim?

he said it, someone mentioned that Nanook and Lomo were off radar, so i read them and saw he claimed

I highlighted a couple of little moments where Made is discussing lost monkey tangential to discussing myself. The first is a generic question about my Day 1 vote on lost monkey to look involved, and the second is a piggyback on lost monkey's vague frights about my sincerity in the game. I think the latter is a decent moment for lost monkey, just because it represents Made hiding behind his tinfoil and throwing wads of paper at me from safety. That's easier to do when your makeshift shield is not mafia with you. It's a small point.

~~~

From lost monkey

Spoiler: show

Though tangrowth was the one who started the made lynch wagon i didnt expect her to come up as scum.

bad bunny has extremely high wolf equity in light of nutella's flip.

She could have voted for made but chose to not vote from the two wagons. Seems highly unlikely, can be 3p.

@Allcrab why do you think a mafia bad bunny would have voted for Made?

Why dont you think her not voting made looks better? With her claiming and how you and tangy who are the loudest players supporting nutella in the thread who could lynch nutella then if she would have tied it with voting made, it would have helped nutella the most. Also sloonei who sussed nutella also shifter so if she would have been saved, it would have been the worst thing which would have happened to town. Thats why i liked act's refusal to vote made and bunny's vote on someone else. The only reason i am considering act could be scum is because she is not paranoid enough.

The vote reached an 8-8 tie momentarily in the end without them. They made noncommittal votes at the moment of highest pressure when Made could have easily died without their direct intervention. Some mafia simply don’t have much courage and don’t want to “look bad” in the event of a nutella flip by being on the counterwagon.

Then she would have definitely hammered made.

Might remember some stuff wrongly but didnt you vote nutella and then change to made after her claim? and also didnt you say that owner might be town on D2. Allcrab was a better choice for me than you or tangy/tsp is because he can still use his power and which i consider to be a better thing and then tangy/tsp is someone who i have considered as possible poisoner candidate seeing longcon and bunny being poisoned.

What about protecting jay or seanzie?

Also (this stuff doesn't matter, but): you're remembering the nutella stuff wrong. I was never really involved in the push against her at all until the very end, and at that point she was pushing harder against me than I was against her. I voted for Made, but I don't believe that I was ever voting for nutella at any point, and I don't remember her claiming anything at any point.
RE: Owner, I did say "Owner is town" but that was just so I could get people to argue the point. Day 2 was stagnant. I was trying to get people to talk. I never actually thought that Owner was town.

Nah i remember you voting nutella mid D1 and i saw you taking the vote off nutella and shifting to made after she claimed. You may not remember that but i do because i was lurking at that time. I didnt read much of D2 but i saw that so i assumed you tried convincing owner as town.

Did sean claim tracker? I had him as town but I preferred to save because i believed his claim. I still dont trust jay lol, after the whole trying to save nutella and trying to off made made be wary of him. If made is scum then i might believe he could be town otherwise still don't trust him.

I didn't try to save nutella. I did vote for Made, and I will tend to absorb most of the tried to save nutella presumption from that wagon because I am the loudest player on it, but I made just about zero effort to keep nutella alive. I was fine with her being eliminated, and I think that's visible in my posts if one just takes a look. Indeed when I actively promoted a non-nutella wagon around EOD it was for Owner.

You would have probably lynched me if given the chance on D1. You tried telling nutella was town thing but too many people didnt agree with you and then you changed to a i dont care with nutella getting lynched thing. I dont wanna wifom over you but ill wait for the made lynch to happen before i talk more. If she is actually scum then its fine if not you will be my scum read.

[VOTE: made] aubergine

It seems a number of lost monkey's reads in the game have been in part predicated on those Day 1 wagons. From a non-Made perspective that's kind of meh. From a purely Made interactions perspective it doesn't make me feel a whole lot. bad bunny was town because she would have hammered Made. I was suspicious because I pushed the Made wagon. Yadda yadda. There's too little room to observe development here since Made only just flipped mafia, and lost monkey has been quiet all of Day 6.

~~~

Conclusion

I wish I had more to say. I have tinfoil of lost monkey, and I admit it is entirely a result of their low activity. Every time I remember they're playing and cannot remember anything about their most recent posts I get worried. That might not be entirely fair, but I will leave y'all to judge that. As it pertains to Made, call this one small tick in the positive direction.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

Interactions of Made and MacDougall

I'm ignoring Day 5 material.

From Made

Spoiler: show

Yeah, Nervous Dana is probably NAI, I'm looking for coached looking behavior from her slot

what if made is also mafia tho

shhhh i town read you for once, Let me have this

you are fake news

ight, riddle me this nerd: of the Syndicate powerhouses, who's your top scum read and why?

You know they say that all men are created equal, but you look at me and you look at Made and you can see that statement is not true. See, normally if you go one on one with another mafia player, you got a 50/50 chance of winning. But I'm a genetic freak and I'm not normal! So you got a 25%, AT BEST, at beat me. Then you add JaggedJimmyJay to the mix, your chances of winning drastic go down. See the 3 way at Sacrifice, you got a 33 1/3 chance of winning, but I, I got a 66 and 2/3 chance of winning, because JaggedJimmyJay KNOWS he can't beat me and he's not even gonna try!
So Made, you take your 33 1/3 chance, minus my 25% chance and you got an 8 1/3 chance of winning at Sacrifice. But then you take my 75% chance of winning, if we was to go one on one, and then add 66 2/3 per cents, I got 141 2/3 chance of winning at Sacrifice. See Made, the numbers don't lie, and they spell disaster for you at Sacrifice.

[HUGE FANFIC SNIPPED]

"We are safe now, they fell to certain doom."
Mac and JJJ got out from the bush where they were cuddleing. "Thank you, you saved us all"
"Dont mention it."

So they left the tower and went home. They lived happily ever after and had lots of kids.
The End

[VOTE: Hawk] aubergine

Should we fill Made in on the details he's missing now?

I would very much enjoy that

don't do it sloo it's a trap

Hi! am I missing something big right now? and If so, how stupid do I look?

Well all of that is meaningless.

~~~

From MacDougall

Spoiler: show

whatever this is all dumb lets chop made

[VOTE: made] aubergine

whatever this is all dumb lets chop made

[VOTE: made] aubergine

Do you actually scum read Jay?

And why Made?

Kinda feels like deflection here.

no I don't scum read Jay

do you intend to accuse everyone who introduces a new suspect as deflecting from somewhere arbitrary?

Made sure did make a post.

did he? I didn't see it.

Made sure did make a post.

did he? I didn't see it.

He made two, one with a cheeky multiple choice question. I don't town read Made.

yay

I think assuming Made is town is fine. I assume that too. No voting between a very close V/W wagon is honestly scum indivative.

if I was a vigilante I would have shot Made last night

I am absolutely serious about this tunnel by the way. If anyone has a good reason why mafia aren't contained in [Belzy, Act, bad bunny, Owner], please speak up. I include Owner primarily for connections with bad bunny and nutella -- different reasons, but tangential.

I'm not opposed. I suppose this could explain why nutella felt like unenthusiastic? for lack of a better word because it would indicate that her team was unable to control the thread narrative.

This is confusing to me though because you would think that a mafia nutella would be able to survive easily enough if town Jay and Sloonei were pushing another direction. The logical answer being that Made (and maybe Owner) are mafia.

I think the main problem may be that neither Sloonei nor I were doing much pushing. We were vaguely pointing directions and seeing what people did. I think nutella knew she'd lost us, at least from the standpoint of getting a hard, fervent defense at EOD from my prior confusion at her wonky reception of suspicion and Sloonei's "not feisty enough". She even railed against him, which only resulted in he and I reading her worse. It's frankly a wonder Made got to 7/8 votes at all. I didn't expect that.

Surely there are wolves in the late made voters then

Surely there are wolves in the late made voters then

Owner could well be. I think the off-wagon votes are generally worse though.

If Owner is mafia do you think that has any implication on Bad Bunny or Made's alignment?

@JaggedJimmyJay
@Sloonei
@MacDougall

You 3, look at this as well.

Yeah man it's bad but like apparently the only Made voter that looks bad is Owner so talk to SloonimmyJay cuz they're just operating in lockstep and I feel like an emotional abuse victim.

@JaggedJimmyJay If nutella and Owner are both mafia then Made is a save.

What is a "save" in this sense?

I believe Made is a villager who was run up in order to protect nutella and Owner.

oh that makes more sense

@Owner of a Lonely Heart what made you make made when you could have made nutella?

Ehhhhhh

I think a significant amount of the player list tends more towards individual mafia play than the kind of organized team play you're accustomed to

what does this mean?

That the gamestate reads around owner you're making don't necessarily apply imo

yeah maybe but also maybe she's not mafia anyway because of maths and this game being a game of rng

Yeah, could be ig

Idk maybe you're right, where do you wanna go if not owner? I'll follow you for a bit

Seth seems pretty adamant he has a red check on Hawk.

Bad Bunny looks bad.

Sonny would be a death blow to the mafia if that were a hit.

I am not entirely sold on Made being a save either.

Yeah, Nervous Dana is probably NAI, I'm looking for coached looking behavior from her slot

what if made is also mafia tho

[VOTE: Actv] aubergine

Wtf...I literally didn’t do anything last night. Either you’re lying or you were given wrong information.

Who do you think killed kito?

it was made i seened him

[VOTE: Actv] aubergine

Wtf...I literally didn’t do anything last night. Either you’re lying or you were given wrong information.

Who do you think killed kito?

it was made i seened him

Should we yeet made?

lets ask jay

Yeah, Nervous Dana is probably NAI, I'm looking for coached looking behavior from her slot

what if made is also mafia tho

shhhh i town read you for once, Let me have this

you are fake news

ight, riddle me this nerd: of the Syndicate powerhouses, who's your top scum read and why?

next question

Also I think it's best that Long Con pass on to the next world. I appreciate you @Long Con, it's just about coming to a solve. If you can't be healed anyway then you can leave with the heroic reads I know you bear deep within.

Not a fan of this tbh

Jay is town noob

You know they say that all men are created equal, but you look at me and you look at Made and you can see that statement is not true. See, normally if you go one on one with another mafia player, you got a 50/50 chance of winning. But I'm a genetic freak and I'm not normal! So you got a 25%, AT BEST, at beat me. Then you add JaggedJimmyJay to the mix, your chances of winning drastic go down. See the 3 way at Sacrifice, you got a 33 1/3 chance of winning, but I, I got a 66 and 2/3 chance of winning, because JaggedJimmyJay KNOWS he can't beat me and he's not even gonna try!
So Made, you take your 33 1/3 chance, minus my 25% chance and you got an 8 1/3 chance of winning at Sacrifice. But then you take my 75% chance of winning, if we was to go one on one, and then add 66 2/3 per cents, I got 141 2/3 chance of winning at Sacrifice. See Made, the numbers don't lie, and they spell disaster for you at Sacrifice.

Perhaps @ both. Easy mode answer would be mafia Made.

oh yeh

how bout made. what do we think of made?

wait wait wait wait wait, is there a reason we're not looking at Tangle???

Belzy desperado shot them and they died.

and that's a good look for her? doesn't that just mean Tangly has some sort of protections?

are you trying to get derp cleared?

That said, where is your head on Jay's 4 hit 3?

I have no idea what this means.

the scarecrow walks at midnight Jay

Should we fill Made in on the details he's missing now?

thats precisely what he wants you to do

Should we fill Made in on the details he's missing now?

I would very much enjoy that

don't do it sloo it's a trap

wait wait wait wait wait, is there a reason we're not looking at Tangle???

this is nearly signature worthy if you're mafia

Should we fill Made in on the details he's missing now?

I would very much enjoy that

don't do it sloo it's a trap

Hi! am I missing something big right now? and If so, how stupid do I look?

the only big thing you're missing is my...

Act maybe
Gnome maybe
Made maybe
OC maybe
Allcrab maybe
Martin ... no?
Lost Monkey no
Bad Bunny ... I kinda think we need to sheep Allcrab?

The POE is fine. If the game doesn't end once we kill all of them y'all can flip me first so I don't have to endure the paranoia party.

Which PoE? Can you list names?

Act, Allc, Gnome, Made etc.

Guillo is also my prime tinfoil subject based on how desperate and weird he gradually has become.

The poisoner is more or less could be anyone.

[VOTE: Made] aubergine

Day wagons. If Made is a hit the only person voting for not mafia thats alive is Actv.

Gotta feel like she wouldn't leave herself vulnerable to such obvious stuff.

Doubt Made/Act are a team based on it.

Day wagons. If Made is a hit the only person voting for not mafia thats alive is Actv.

Gotta feel like she wouldn't leave herself vulnerable to such obvious stuff.

Doubt Made/Act are a team based on it.

If the team is Made/Act they can't afford to bus.

On day 1 can they afford not to?

I'm not going to do the pointed color coding since this is technically a pre-flip interaction. I still suggest reading/skimming the posts in the spoiler though to remind oneself of the interactions and form general impressions. I note a general trend: Mac's stance on Made is almost always negative -- there are a few votes for Made thrown in there too. I don't, however, get an impression that Mac is applying himself effortfully to remove Made from this game. While I wouldn't say this progression must be distancing, I have no difficulty in seeing it as distancing.

~~~

Conclusion

The objective here was less "are they mafia teammates?" and more "is there a reason for me to say they aren't?"

My answer to the latter question is no. I would be unsurprised if Mac and Made are both mafia. If I wanted I could build a case from this content to say they are both mafia. I will refrain, because it doesn't seem appropriate and would encourage confirmation bias.

Bringing this one back since it is more relevant now. Mac himself suggested I fell into confirmation bias with this one. Whatever his own biases in saying so, it is still possible it's true. I would appreciate anyone else taking a look at this and/or the Mac/Made interactions and reporting your own feelings.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

I understand if some folks think all of my posting is pointless when consensus is already working, so thanks for bearing with me. This is how I try to leave no stones unturned. I don't like losing.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

I think we have a relatively good understanding of how Mac treated nutella. I haven't looked quite as closely at the inverse. I will do so. If Mac is mafia, then their interactions need to make sense. I grant that my perception of "make sense" must be very broad with these two, because they know entering any game with Sloonjay that interactions are getting microscoped.

[MacDougall]

Nothing you do is pointless Jay. You are a pointy man.

[Alison]

[VOTE: macdougall] aubergine

has @Alison told us who has the double vote today?

You.

[Alison]

I’ve been wondering if I was not in fact the Night 1 kill. It would explain why I’m still alive: I have an in-tact vest and they don’t want to waste a night shooting through it.

Where did the mafia kill go N1 then?

[JaggedJimmyJay]

nutella's handling of MacDougall

Spoiler: show

Today I will be tunneling Nanook until he died.

lol sup

I think I like Mac, but I'll inevitably tunnel him at some point.

this is the way

If act has a read on gnome already she's a hot stinking liar

opportunistic

.....wat

I choose to believe Guillo really did catch Nutella and Alison.

gottem

I choose to believe Guillo really did catch Nutella and Alison.

LAMISAAOC

what's this mean?

Look at Me I'm Such an Agent of Chaos

do you think that's hit an AI mark for mac?

there are differences in how mac "does" chaos as town vs mafia but it's not necessarily a regular pattern ime

I choose to believe Guillo really did catch Nutella and Alison.

LAMISAAOC

what's this mean?

Look at Me I'm Such an Agent of Chaos

do you think that's hit an AI mark for mac?

do you?

idk should i

yeah i'm not convinced what jay is talking about applies to literal 2021 mac

What happened in spiderverse?

mac was wolf and fooled me pretty hard/won in endgame

@nutella what do you think of Jay?

hes a fucking dweeb

whatever this is all dumb lets chop made

[VOTE: made] aubergine

Do you actually scum read Jay?

And why Made?

Kinda feels like deflection here.

no I don't scum read Jay

do you intend to accuse everyone who introduces a new suspect as deflecting from somewhere arbitrary?

?? it's not arbitrary you've been talking about jay all day

Strong town
Jay
Sonny
Guillo
Tangy

Town leans
Gnome
Alison
Martin I guess sheeping alison
Dana
Mac
Sloonei
Hawk? Liked their style
Act maybe at this point

Gav Nook LC are more tbd
Dont remember anyone else

Going to sleep for like 12 hours gl

@nutella @Tangrowth @Sloonei @Alison what if Jay is pocketing everyone on course for a curbstomping shame bringing victory? How are we gonna deal with that? Just let the game revolve around him and hope by the time he gets caught by mech the game isn't locked as a mafia win?

Im kinda down if that's the plan actually.

I can catch wolf jay don't worry lol. Think he's just legit so far

I think if Jay is mafia then you are mafia

If not q then not p ez

I wanna kill nutella

Oh cool

Like mafia mac or nook could be pushing me because I'm not literally the top poster and they think they can look good for not just admitting I'm obv town already

But I'm not afraid of mac staying on me for more than like five minutes regardless of his alignment

I feel like town nutella would be fiercer and less deflective here.

I'm torn about whether to vote Owner or nutella.

The people voting for me are mac, nanook, and guillo

I'm not concerned lol

I wanna kill nutella

why

she keeps pinging me, that spicy comment in particular was weird

Okay what

Like mafia mac or nook could be pushing me because I'm not literally the top poster and they think they can look good for not just admitting I'm obv town already

What of Alison?

Do you suspect this to be the case for either Mac or Nanook?

If Alison continues to stretch her poe to include me she could have agenda but I mostly feel good about her from other stuff and think she's still just sorting me out.

Idk about mac and nook, yolo probably one or both of them is wolfing

I've been calling things I agree with spicy for literal years now what is wrong with you people

generally they are in fact spicy

So what did you think about those owner posts then

you people?

this Australian racism has gotta stop

mash in and mash out it's the same shit

Like this is easy, mac does this every game, if he's town he's just gauging reactions and will rescind soon enough but do it again on and off, if he's mafia he'll decide it's not worth it and lock me town to try to get in my pocket

I feel like town nutella would be fiercer and less deflective here.

I'm torn about whether to vote Owner or nutella.

The people voting for me are mac, nanook, and guillo

I'm not concerned lol

Why do the people voting you matter here?

for mac see my last post, for nanook and guillo basically I always expect us to suspect each other

Like mafia mac or nook could be pushing me because I'm not literally the top poster and they think they can look good for not just admitting I'm obv town already

What of Alison?

Do you suspect this to be the case for either Mac or Nanook?

If Alison continues to stretch her poe to include me she could have agenda but I mostly feel good about her from other stuff and think she's still just sorting me out.

Idk about mac and nook, yolo probably one or both of them is wolfing

I was in your town reads last I checked and you aren't an omgusser so you're woofin

if anything you were just barely over the line toward a town lean

Like this is easy, mac does this every game, if he's town he's just gauging reactions and will rescind soon enough but do it again on and off, if he's mafia he'll decide it's not worth it and lock me town to try to get in my pocket

How do you intend to figure out which of those Macs is the correct Mac?

I mean seeing as the pocket worked last time I might not lol

I like to think I understand how to read him more every game but I'm not sure I do

Oh I did put mac on that list huh. Must have felt stronger at the time, when i was comparing tangy's gth reads to my own mac was one of the harder ones

Nutella who are your teammates

It's in your signature innit

I suddenly townread nutella

just had to flash my gun a bit eh

still don't have a new read from lost monkey *checks watch and paces back and forth with incredible frustration*

suppose that's who is gonna actually die today innit

That's the spirit

I think regardless of alignment, nutella was bothered by my comment. I stand by it, but I acknowledge that it's an annoying way to present a suspicion. But I think this reactionary vote is kneejerk, impulsive, and probably an attempt to stir up some of the absent feistiness. I don't think nutella actually suspects me for the comment or anything else I've done. I think the suggestion that my beliefs in this game are dubious has no contextual backing. It is verbal filler. I have not been Thread Leader Sloon in this game, but I have not withheld reads either.

No he backed off of accusing me and went on some tangent about his posting. It was deflection and looked like tmi on me.

Does Not Compute

It says regardless of alignment right there, and the original comment was not a scumread

The original comment was an implied suspicion. I thought that much was clear.

But I think, regardless of your alignment, the way in which I expressed that read annoyed you. I think this is true because I get annoyed by that type of read all the time.
But I stand by it as a statement of suspicion. I think your return upon seeing you were the leading bandwagon had the air of an exasperated wolf who'd been caught and saw no way out. Radiohead came to mind. I would expect town nutella to bring a more discerning eye to that situation, rather than a blanket shrug of "wolves are definitely on me."

I am not currently voting for you. You believe that at least one mafia member is. Who dey?

I just woke up idk when half the votes happened

Made I definitely don't remember and could be a wolf who hopped on

Nanook I have issues with

Mac i thought he said he started townread me but maybe that was a bluff

Alison idk anymore

Scrutinize mac and alison for motives

Town
Guillo
Sonny
Belzy
Dana
Tangy
Kito

Slight town/reservations
Jay
Alison
LC
Martin
Hawk
Gav

Mixed feelings or little impression
Allcrab
Gnome
Actv
Sean
Owner
Mac

Scum lean
Nanook
Made
Lost monkey
Sloonei
Bunny

Part of me just hopes mac is mafia because if he's town and left his vote on me there I'm gonna have words with him postgame tbh

Forgive the huge spoiler.

The theme here is pretty clear. nutella gets a solid helping of shit from Mac through Day 1 and at no point gives even a single shit. I can still hear the faint echoes of her beeps and boops.

Orange - nutella pooh-poohed my initial suspicion of Mac when I felt he was trying to slide into his usual chaos pajamas and looked fake. This is a generic defense and can be a teammate thing. It doesn't have to be.

Green - Just making note that nutella town read Mac nearly all of Day 1, and only shifted him to that middling "null" area in her post-chop wifom spam. Whatever.

Cyan - This is the most important stuff to me, and I suspect their interaction can be reduced to it singularly. nutella's handling of Mac suspicion was to write the abstract concept of eyerolls into distinct English words and sentences. She didn't take it seriously. It was weird at the time and caused me to drop my own town read on her. A town Mac going at nutella's jugular is a literal threat to her survival, and she yawned. There's no effort to rebut or deflect or, well, anything. It's like reading the jerkoff motion.

Is this teammate behavior? I don't think I can discount it since the mittens she is wearing are so soft and harmless to Mac. But I also grant it's not the sort of interaction I usually call teammate-indicative. It's just bizarre. Bizarre is standout, and standout shouldn't be ignored for better or for worse.

Red - This is a potential oops by nutella where she realized an inconsistency in her Mac treatment and felt like she needed to cover her ass. It'd be a considerable blunder for someone like nutella. I won't be generous at this point in the game though.

~~~

TL;DR

This isn't a super clear-cut thing that screams in support of the present consensus against Mac. There's a lot to unpack. The most important thing to me though is whether or not it can give me confidence to dissociate the two from one another. I don't have that confidence. As always I invite thoughts from anyone so inclined. I understand some folks don't have this hyper-analytic mindset and are just working POE. I am doing both.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

Tomorrow I need to take a closer look at Alison’s relationships with the mafia.

[Alison]

the main thing that looks good for mac is the fact that nutella was like "mac will come around to townreading me soon" like she was hoping/praying for it

[TonyStarkPrime]

I’ve been wondering if I was not in fact the Night 1 kill. It would explain why I’m still alive: I have an in-tact vest and they don’t want to waste a night shooting through it.

Where did the mafia kill go N1 then?

Only one person knows. Or, maybe, two.

[Garden Gnome]

Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town. Mac is town.

Are you trying to hypnotize me to the point that I self vote.
Uh.
No.
Methinks that the lady doth protest too much.
Perhaps thou art scum.
What kind of scum?
Mafia scum?
Or poisoner scum?
We can find out with your flip, Sir Scum.

[Garden Gnome]

It wasn't just the role it was the fact I idled. The role is quite whatever. I also was still thinking we might lose to anti claim up to a point.

prolonged fart noise

Yeah I went searching and felt similarly unimpressed with that answer.

He could be poisoner.

[Sloonei]

It wasn't just the role it was the fact I idled. The role is quite whatever. I also was still thinking we might lose to anti claim up to a point.

prolonged fart noise

Yeah I went searching and felt similarly unimpressed with that answer.

He could be poisoner.

Why not mafia?

[Garden Gnome]

It wasn't just the role it was the fact I idled. The role is quite whatever. I also was still thinking we might lose to anti claim up to a point.

prolonged fart noise

Yeah I went searching and felt similarly unimpressed with that answer.

He could be poisoner.

Why not mafia?

I think that, since he didn't use his role, it's more likely that he is poisoner than mafia. Somebody did get NKed, but no one was poisoned, which is why I'm leaning toward a poisoner role for him.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

@lost monkey why are you ignoring me?

[JaggedJimmyJay]

Who do you think is mafia if not Mac, @Garden Gnome?

[Garden Gnome]

Who do you think is mafia if not Mac, @Garden Gnome?

I am thinking that it could be TonyStarkPrime. I noticed how he has been asked several times to claim but his responses have been evasive. As for his reads, he's been really flip floppy. At one point, he said "Mac's not mafia," and he seemed very convinced that this read was right. Then, much later, after all his avoidance of claiming, he "hard claimed JOAT." Okay, so he claimed, but that doesn't mean that the JOAT is town. I am not convinced that TSP is town and, if he is not town, I think that he is most likely to be mafia.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

Interactions of Alison and Made

From Made

Spoiler: show

Act, Gnome, Made, and OC seem to form my premier suspect tier. Allcrab, bad bunny, lost monkey, and MartinGG99 would have to round out whoever's missing. This doesn't take any third party into consideration.

Are at least three mafia not contained above? I ask whoever cares to ponder.

The reason I ask this question is this:

Allcrab, lost monkey, and Martin all look town to me at face value. If I give Allcrab the nod, then I am generally inclined to do the same bad bunny given Allcrab's view.

If all of the above is correct, I need three mafia within [Act, Gnome, Made, and OC] or something has to be incorrect. It could be that three mafia are in that set if we're very fortuitous. These reads aren't without controversy though, especially if your name is Nanook.

What's the best reason to town read Alison?

Alison seems cocky/"I am a god"y this game, which she was in Stardew Valley where we were hydra partners. Compared to Modern family where her slot was scum and generally was lot tighter to the chest

HI friends, sorry for missing yesterday, i got my start of day/end of days dates twisted. Before I waste my time in iso hell, is Allcrab cleared for any reason? I see they claimed on day 2 and alison didn't buy it, but then they got a red check on owner.

Let's just vote Made to be honest.

Like what even is the mafia team if Made is town? Is it Mac + Guillo? Is it [Mac/Guillo] + Allcrab who ripped off LoMo's watcher result and TMI'd bunny and has been skating by ever since? It is one of those + Martin who has fooled me?

I am not inspired by any of these possibilities. A mafia team with Made in it makes the most sense regardless of anyone else's alignment.

what points do you have in favor of Mac or Guilo or Allcrab or Lomo that makes them mutually incompatible? Is it Jay's analysis. The issue is if there's 2 scum left it's either those or you're getting got sis.

Let's just vote Made to be honest.

Like what even is the mafia team if Made is town? Is it Mac + Guillo? Is it [Mac/Guillo] + Allcrab who ripped off LoMo's watcher result and TMI'd bunny and has been skating by ever since? It is one of those + Martin who has fooled me?

I am not inspired by any of these possibilities. A mafia team with Made in it makes the most sense regardless of anyone else's alignment.

what points do you have in favor of Mac or Guilo or Allcrab or Lomo that makes them mutually incompatible? Is it Jay's analysis. The issue is if there's 2 scum left it's either those or you're getting got sis.

What's your read on Alison herself?

Town on tone, she's dunking on me in wreckless way i don't think i've ever seen her do as scum, but i have seen her do it town

@Alison Does remembering Nanook do anything for your read of the game state?

Eh that's probably a bad read, nvm

Martin still not mafia unless Alison is too tho

What's the relation between Martin and Alison?

Alison is hard townreading him

Any takes on Martin outside of Alison?

Seanzie red checked Owner the day after a scum flipped. If it was a crazy gambit, it's not one we're catching on D4.

this. Was there any other checks or was it just a one shot, i don't think his role said one shot

What even is a modified tracker?

What are your thoughts on the claims of living players? Why have you not claimed?

I think the attention you're putting on me is odd but i kinda appreciate it cuz it grounds my play. The Desperado stuff on you give you a pass for today, but if i were around I'd prob tinfoil at Fx

I like lomo's case on Jay, I think Jay/guilo interactions need to be looked at by non Jay person that's not comf biased as you seem to be on jay. This is doubly true if Martin is town and we're correctly assuming we have 2 scum left. Jay has the gavial hell in the cell working for him, but I do see him being the kind of confident player who would be willing to go for that play for the wifom

I wouldn't put faking mason's past Nanook, it's seeming like this game has a lot of btsc, so the idea of a neutral or evil align btsc sounds, but the case isn't really that compelling to me.

I think Mac's town on tone, he's as meme-y as he was in zelda mash and modern family, in comparison to spiderman where he ignored all my jokes. I think the fact that we're being shipped means we either only have one scum left in a player with less associative reads like martin, or it's just Jay/Guillo. based on my read of threads state, one scum is prob most likely

Allcrab reads fairly clean to me, but that might just be lack of familiarity with the player compared to the

I've already spoken on Alison, and I don't feel like being roasted on TangleStarkPro again. this is all off the top, so if i'm forgetting someone, that person auto sus af for missing my radar

but yeah, sorry for inactivity y'all, i normally don't get too into a game unless we're losing, or i'm getting turbo'd and that didn't really happen till today. I think we still got this tho

Orange - Made's initial reception of Alison (it was perhaps late in the game to call it "initial") was a town read. I highlight this because the read is meta-driven by some former hydra game. Made did the same thing with nutella, albeit in a considerably more awkward manner. It was that nutella post with his vote that initially set me off and drove his Day 1 wagon. So this parallel might not mean much, but it's still worth noting.

Green - Made's later handling of Alison, particularly the first green blurb, looks to me more like a mafioso talking to a non-teammate than otherwise. "You're getting got, sis." It's a small point.

~~~

From Alison

Spoiler: show

@Alison what is mac’s alignment?

I think he's town. Not lock levels, but I'm pretty comfortable with slapping him into my town pile and moving on. He hasn't tried to wow us with an over-the-top Maccy display, he hasn't tried to pocket or bury me, and his pushes make sense from a town Mac perspective. (I had the same reaction as him to the Owner first post, and pushing JJJ his rival and Made the person he always suspects is in-character for Mac.) I don't get the feeling that he's fishing for an easy misexe with his Owner/Made pushes either. His posts theorizing that JJJ is using WIFOM and a shared history against him show enough depth of thought to satisfy me.

bad bunny has extremely high wolf equity in light of nutella's flip.

I am very confidant bunny is a villager if she's a wolf she votes made 100% I'm sure of it.

You seem to also know Made's alignment.

I think assuming Made is town is fine. I assume that too. No voting between a very close V/W wagon is honestly scum indivative.

If everyone but Made on the nutella wagon is pure then Made is also villager. If there are no scum on nutella then all scum are on Made or voting offwagon which strongly indicates V/W.

@JaggedJimmyJay If nutella and Owner are both mafia then Made is a save.

@JaggedJimmyJay If nutella and Owner are both mafia then Made is a save.

What is a "save" in this sense?

I believe Made is a villager who was run up in order to protect nutella and Owner.

I would happily murder the following people:

Allcrab
bad bunny (if Allcrab is not town)
Garden Gnome
Owner of a Lonely Heart
Sonny

I believe this to be a nice snug POE that the mafia feels very claustrophobic in. For now I am assuming Made is a save, Long Con gets a pass and hawkataine was the victim of lolGavial. Everyone else has towntold.

act, gnome, orangecrush are my top mafia poe.

if I'm misclearing someone it's most likely made. I believe that martin is almost certainly town but the thin worlds where he is scum involve him being in a very sticky situation mechwise and so he will probably be outed which means I don't have to cover that possibility.

that's my solve

It occurs to me that from a wagons perspective, Sonny being mafia might be a tiny tick back in the teammate direction for Made. It depends on when Sonny was around late in Day 1, but he now represents an official nutella voter and not-Made voter who flipped mafia. If Made was a save, they didn't ALL go for it.

Yeah we have to look at Made now.

@Made gibe reads list

[POE LIST SNIPPED]

Act is my top suspect since me and JJJ basically concluded that she had suspicious interactions with flipped mafia at the same time. Allcrab is probably the towniest person here because I think he has been townie on play today and looks very good if Act is mafia. Made seems to have been coasting by on being the counterwagon but Sonny's vote points towards something fishy going on in the D1 wagons. That's suspicious. I keep putting Gnome in my POE because frankly she won't get out but to be honest deep down I feel like she's erratic as either alignment and is probably sort of rand.

Act
Made
Gnome
Allcrab

Scummiest to towniest.

This is my solve. You guys have sold me on Made, congrats. (Sonny's vote helped.)

Plenty of scumteams let OC go at Mac like she did. If the scumteam is, let us say, Act and Made, they aren't the kind of players who would micromanage their partners' attempts. They may even be feeling demoralized and just want OC to go out in a blaze of glory.

You're making some pretty reachy assumptions about how scumteams must or should act in order to twist the interpretation of OC's attack(s) around. Occam's Razor is that OC tried to whack Mac because Mac is town, end of story.

I had a brief glance through Made's ISO and it is mafia indicative.

Lots of nothingburger, seems to have no real pushes, interacts mostly with townies and stays away from interacting with any of the mafia. Gets progressively more disheartened and inactive as mafia members start dropping dead.

Day wagons. If Made is a hit the only person voting for not mafia thats alive is Actv.

Gotta feel like she wouldn't leave herself vulnerable to such obvious stuff.

Doubt Made/Act are a team based on it.

If the team is Made/Act they can't afford to bus.

Gnome doesn't seem as grumpy and unmotivated as I'd expect from someone whose team got decimated.

Act and Made do.

In all seriousness it is probably just Made.

To be honest Made seems to be mafia in all worlds anyway and his posting has been really bad so I might just vote him as the highest % exe.

Made's posting this day has been incredibly bad.

Made's posting this day has been incredibly bad.

Yeah he can be chopped.

#cantchopwontchop

keep up friends, this play is bout to be legendary. bout to come off the bench for the game winning shot

If you're going to claim or reveal as innocent child or something just do it.

If Mac is scum I think his partner is >90% to be Made. His bickering with Guillo doesn't seem like they're teammates, and everyone else seems varying degrees of townie. Therefore I will be examining Mac/Made interactions to see if there's anything that would point away from a team of those two, and (speculatively) Guillo as the poisoner.

I guess it could be Guillo/Made and Mac as the poisoner.

Apparently Made is too common a word in Mac's iso for me to search and I don't feel up to manually ctrl + fing through 16 pages of iso so I'll let someone harder working than me handle that.

Made's ISO contains no meaningful interactions with either Mac or Guillo.

Let's just vote Made to be honest.

Like what even is the mafia team if Made is town? Is it Mac + Guillo? Is it [Mac/Guillo] + Allcrab who ripped off LoMo's watcher result and TMI'd bunny and has been skating by ever since? It is one of those + Martin who has fooled me?

I am not inspired by any of these possibilities. A mafia team with Made in it makes the most sense regardless of anyone else's alignment.

[VOTE: Made] aubergine

Made is the most likely to be eliminated today, so it's not something I am inclined to talk about much on its own yet. I'm looking for relationships and other suspects tangential to him.

I remember that I said something like, I think Made is a save, and Mac came in and said I agree.

I don't remember many other interactions they've had but the one I remember seems teammate compatible. I trust you'll do your due diligence on all their interactions anyway.

I think Mac/Made is pretty much outed at this point.

The poisoner is probably Allcrab or something.

Nobody targeted mac last night.

Figured poisoner MO was to go after people on the fringe of the PoE which was kinda right they were a bit more direct than I expected and I guessed wrong, sorry.

And yeah I am trying to get poisoner identity over wolves cuz that's gonna be WAAAAAAAYYYYYYYY harder to get if we gotta do it the old fashioned way.

I wanna vote martin today but out of respect for Alison's read I'll try made first.

@Alison this is a mafia post. What do you think

I don't see it. I think Made has very very high scum equity at this point so consciously abandoning a Martin push and going on Made is a good look, since I think Martin is town.

why do you think Made is mafia

His posting has been bad and everyone else is townie.

Hello

I skimmed through the last few pages

I can't conceive many worlds with a town made and am happy to sleepwalk to a made exe today

Green - Alison didn't pay much attention to Made until after the Day 1 chop, and the wagon dynamics led her to a town read. That hasn't been an uncommon view in this game, so my reaction is pretty much "whatever". It's not teammate-indicative, but it's compatible.

Orange - By about Day 4, Alison was ready to place Made in a posture for reconsideration, especially after orangecrush was shot revealing Sonny's nutella vote as a bus. It's at least internally consistent with her previous stance, for whatever consistency is worth (to me, not a whole lot).

Red - Moving into Day 5, Alison's view of Made turned sharply to a hard mafia read. This was very much consensus by this point. If we are considering a world where Alison is mafia, that means we're already considering her as a hard-line busser in this game. So going against Made at this point would just be a continuation of that theory and doesn't change it. This doesn't mean she is a hard-line busser. Her progression on Made follows a similar thread to Allcrab's. I doubt they're both mafia, which would imply there's room for this to be a town mindset too.

~~~

Conclusion

The most important thing to me here is to interpret the Made side of the interaction. Alison's side is already well-enough known without analysis, and this didn't change that. Her own treatment of him doesn't look "bad", but from a POE perspective where we consider Alison as a bussing mafioso it just fits cleanly within that world anyway. So it doesn't do much to change that. Made, however, is not making posts subject to the same logic and are what I would call more revealing. Unfortunately Made also didn't say or do much of anything, so the insights are limited (this rationale of mine might yield more fruit in analyses with different mafia). The one small positive point I made there is the one that speaks to me most, so I guess call it a tiny positive. None of this is enough to change Alison's current posture.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

Who do you think is mafia if not Mac, @Garden Gnome?

I am thinking that it could be TonyStarkPrime. I noticed how he has been asked several times to claim but his responses have been evasive. As for his reads, he's been really flip floppy. At one point, he said "Mac's not mafia," and he seemed very convinced that this read was right. Then, much later, after all his avoidance of claiming, he "hard claimed JOAT." Okay, so he claimed, but that doesn't mean that the JOAT is town. I am not convinced that TSP is town and, if he is not town, I think that he is most likely to be mafia.

Gnomey dear, Tony is confirmed not mafia because of Belzy's desperado shot. His JOAT claim was a champs meme. This was Made-like of you.

[Garden Gnome]

Who do you think is mafia if not Mac, @Garden Gnome?

I am thinking that it could be TonyStarkPrime. I noticed how he has been asked several times to claim but his responses have been evasive. As for his reads, he's been really flip floppy. At one point, he said "Mac's not mafia," and he seemed very convinced that this read was right. Then, much later, after all his avoidance of claiming, he "hard claimed JOAT." Okay, so he claimed, but that doesn't mean that the JOAT is town. I am not convinced that TSP is town and, if he is not town, I think that he is most likely to be mafia.

Gnomey dear, Tony is confirmed not mafia because of Belzy's desperado shot. His JOAT claim was a champs meme. This was Made-like of you.

You could be right.
I forgot about that shot, lol.

[Garden Gnome]

Who do you think is mafia if not Mac, @Garden Gnome?

I am thinking that it could be TonyStarkPrime. I noticed how he has been asked several times to claim but his responses have been evasive. As for his reads, he's been really flip floppy. At one point, he said "Mac's not mafia," and he seemed very convinced that this read was right. Then, much later, after all his avoidance of claiming, he "hard claimed JOAT." Okay, so he claimed, but that doesn't mean that the JOAT is town. I am not convinced that TSP is town and, if he is not town, I think that he is most likely to be mafia.

Gnomey dear, Tony is confirmed not mafia because of Belzy's desperado shot. His JOAT claim was a champs meme. This was Made-like of you.

I actually don't have a clue as to who the scum could be.
So I will have to think more about that.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

I actually don't have a clue as to who the scum could be.
So I will have to think more about that.

If it's not Mac, you're my first guess. Are we going to have drama in our household?

[Garden Gnome]

Who do you think is mafia if not Mac, @Garden Gnome?

I am thinking that it could be TonyStarkPrime. I noticed how he has been asked several times to claim but his responses have been evasive. As for his reads, he's been really flip floppy. At one point, he said "Mac's not mafia," and he seemed very convinced that this read was right. Then, much later, after all his avoidance of claiming, he "hard claimed JOAT." Okay, so he claimed, but that doesn't mean that the JOAT is town. I am not convinced that TSP is town and, if he is not town, I think that he is most likely to be mafia.

Gnomey dear, Tony is confirmed not mafia because of Belzy's desperado shot. His JOAT claim was a champs meme. This was Made-like of you.

You could be right.
I forgot about that shot, lol.

My true love, why do you think that Alison voted Tony?

[Garden Gnome]

I actually don't have a clue as to who the scum could be.
So I will have to think more about that.

If it's not Mac, you're my first guess. Are we going to have drama in our household?

Oooh, our first spat!!! Let's kiss and make up!

[JaggedJimmyJay]

My true love, why do you think that Alison voted Tony?

She said she believes his lack of a role claim to be strong evidence of his being evil (specifically poisoner). It's a perspective I tend to agree with. I'm not sure Tony is my preferred vote only because he can only be one of the two problem children.

[Sloonei]

Forgetting that TSP is confirmed not-mafia is a more egregious oversight than mixing up the masons, and one that I think would be less likely to occur if the player has access to a team chat. I imagine there is no room for any remaining member of the mafia team to be unaware of TSP’s slot’s status. Mixing up a couple of claims ~24 hours after they were revealed (as Made did) is a different story.

[Garden Gnome]

My true love, why do you think that Alison voted Tony?

She said she believes his lack of a role claim to be strong evidence of his being evil (specifically poisoner). It's a perspective I tend to agree with. I'm not sure Tony is my preferred vote only because he can only be one of the two problem children.

Well, that would make sense. If Belzy shot him and died, it doesn't clear Tony as town, only as non mafia. So someone else would have to be the mafia. I'm not sure who that is, however.

[Sloonei]

My true love, why do you think that Alison voted Tony?

She said she believes his lack of a role claim to be strong evidence of his being evil (specifically poisoner). It's a perspective I tend to agree with. I'm not sure Tony is my preferred vote only because he can only be one of the two problem children.

Well, that would make sense. If Belzy shot him and died, it doesn't clear Tony as town, only as non mafia. So someone else would have to be the mafia. I'm not sure who that is, however.

If TSP is the poisoner, what does that do to mac?

[JaggedJimmyJay]

Sonnycrush on Alison

Spoiler: show

Martin is lock town never rescind.

Why?

Alison reps a godread on Martin so just sheep it.

Err, I mean good to know, would still like to see if for myself if it's something she can articulate.

I think Sonny is town.

Awkward, I literally just shaded you in the lightest of greens on my list.

[NUTELLA INTERACTIONS FAKE READS SNIP]

Alison: Didn't like Alison having her in her PoE, vibed as real annoyance - probably town

Okay, end of Page 9. Guillo pointed out possible wolves in Nutella/Alison. Guillo also went from simply bear posting to regular posting in a way I kind of like (he wanted to do a gimmick, but then it feels like he just got excited as town and dropped the gimmick). Clearly Nutella was a hit, and I agree about Alison thus far. Mac also kind of pushed in that direction, and Nutella seems to be trying to butter Mac up afterwards (defended Mac at some point, and talked about how good Mac was in spiderverse, blah blah blah), so I am giving Mac a few town points here. Guillo probably also good, but seems to be getting less reactions from Nutella and others. I'd like to see Alison's flip to help sort these two.

What would Alison's flip mean for Guillo and Mac?

Okay, end of Page 9. Guillo pointed out possible wolves in Nutella/Alison. Guillo also went from simply bear posting to regular posting in a way I kind of like (he wanted to do a gimmick, but then it feels like he just got excited as town and dropped the gimmick). Clearly Nutella was a hit, and I agree about Alison thus far. Mac also kind of pushed in that direction, and Nutella seems to be trying to butter Mac up afterwards (defended Mac at some point, and talked about how good Mac was in spiderverse, blah blah blah), so I am giving Mac a few town points here. Guillo probably also good, but seems to be getting less reactions from Nutella and others. I'd like to see Alison's flip to help sort these two.

What would Alison's flip mean for Guillo and Mac?

At this point? Jack (I didn't intend this, but realized afterwards that I think the bear is called jack? very funny;)) shit in my mind. I have a singular focus. I feel like I am the owner of a whole new idea.

I suspect this may be the point where I stop making sense of your posts. It's hella fun tho.

Was it a serious question, Sonny? Because to me it read like a question to divert my attention. If it it was a serious question, I will give it a bit more seriousness.

It was, as Alison's flip is imminent unless it can be stopped.

I missed the "end of page 9" bit though, so if it's outdated than fine.

If the poll displays votes in order then guillo more or less hammered nutella, or could've swapped last moment, or did a completely unnecessary bus. So he can be town and my belzy/guillo angle was stupid after all lol.

He was both first and last or close to.

Guillo was first on Nutella initially but switched to Belzy for a while
Nook didn't post his vote in thread but his vote was down before me so second or third
Mac was second or third
JJJ voted Nutella but then jumped about a bit: LoMo>Owner>Made
Sonny
Alison
LoMo
Guillo again
Don't know where Made or Gavial voted in the order as they didn't post in thread as far as I could see.

I'd answer but I have no idea, apparently @Alison is the Martin-whisperer and the one to ask.

hello everyone i actualy only fecognise some of you but i am excited to play here

i have not been able to catch upw tith everything but i have started to

so far i have these people town: Act (though am becoming cautious with him the more i read), Jay, Tangrow, Guil, Dana, Alison (lesser town read)

I'm kind of flipping back and forth between current day and reading back

My thoughts on the healer thing is that I don't see any reason we can't have multiple healers when we now know that there have been multiple poisons, that obviously doesn't mean anything for the alignment of each one so that's an important thing to remember

The one thing that sticks out is 1-shot and 2-shot claims. I have no real reason for thinking this but I think they would both be 1 or both be 2 OR are different Alignments if both real. It just seems kinda random to give town a 1 shot and a 2 shot of the same role instead of just two 1 shots or a 3 shot. Maybe it's my ocd lol

Anyway I'm more concern with Gnome and Mac at the current times

Did you see my post to Hawk? I asked her some questions and brought up some things that don’t make sense to me. Can you make sense of my concerns?

I think they think they wasted a shot because Alison was already healed by Martin so they both healed the same person which would mean one shot was wasted.

But then instead of saying that it kind of looks like they think they wasted a shot because they were roleblocked but I don't think that would affect a day action lol

So it's all a bit confusiong and doesn't really make sense as an entire post

I do agree a shot was wasted though if both targeted Alison

@orangecrush do you townread or do you scumread Alison?

if you look at the read klist i posted when i joined you will see that I have alison listed in my town column as a lesser town read, this is still the case. they have made some posts that i agreed with (had the same thoughts as) you can refer to my chart if you need to see which ones, the reason the town read is slightly lesser is that they made one TMI-ish psot which is also referenced in my chart if you go take a look, this one stood out to me. I have definitely been following the more recent discussions about other TMI possibilities in Alisons game so far. however my gut is that they are town just because of our thoughts being very similar and knowing im town i think the thought process for her being similar to my is encouraging

@orangecrush do you townread or do you scumread Alison?

if you look at the read klist i posted when i joined you will see that I have alison listed in my town column as a lesser town read, this is still the case. they have made some posts that i agreed with (had the same thoughts as) you can refer to my chart if you need to see which ones, the reason the town read is slightly lesser is that they made one TMI-ish psot which is also referenced in my chart if you go take a look, this one stood out to me. I have definitely been following the more recent discussions about other TMI possibilities in Alisons game so far. however my gut is that they are town just because of our thoughts being very similar and knowing im town i think the thought process for her being similar to my is encouraging

Ok.Do you think it is likely for a scum!Healer to try to heal Town!Alison?

it's hard for me to answer because i don't know good of a player alison is. if they are a very strong player and i was scum and they were not my teammate then i would probably not want to heal them. however being able to claim that heal obviously has a very genrerous potential up side, especially so if alison is a good town player. to answer your question i would say it is unlikely but there are reasons it is not a bad idea and therefore it is possible

so far about 1/3 of the way in i think jagged and alison have both been generous and show good conviciton in the town reads they have made. i thik they are being more generous with town reads than scum would be because scum is better off keeping the poe wider for themselves. I think this is a good sign that both are town

@orangecrush is the red check on me real?

It would be dumb to fake a check right now I'd say so probably real unless something happened but I wouldn't rule that out, like I said I thought you were town on your early play before the red check . Alison said she had a redirect so we should wait to see if they used jt

Actually self admittedly shit posting is anti town because it disrupts the thread which could be used for good solving discussion and it clogs up the thread with stuffs that we don't need. Like I've already said Gavlis did this in the last hame I played exactly the same and yes he was scum

Fake red checking someone if you are town would be hilariously anti-town so the question is Just how bad are you as town because if the answer is not very then the plausible explanation is anti-town you is not actually town this game.

Any reasonablly good town lplayer doesn't have to fake check someone to get people to vote them too they can get those votes anyway, wouldn't you agree with that?

lets kill this

Sonny's posting plummeted after a bad start to the game by scum and now his replacement is trying to get mac run up for shitposting and faking checks

I can't speak for sunny but I do stand by my reads and am confident in them despite the hawk flip and in my head it makes a lot of sense that such play would be by a scum player, especially after recent games I played. I totally understand voting me though and to be honest I've had a hard time catching up with the game

Green - Just making note of a few town reads from Sonny on Alison. Their significance is a bit elevated given that these occurred on Day 2 when Alison was poisoned. In the event mafia thought she would die, these would be bold reads to put on record right before she flips mafia herself. Grains of salt and all that given what we don't know about poison.

Orange - orangecrush maintained the town read on Alison (that initial "lesser town read" qualifier is a little ugly). The two orange paragraphs contain a degree of explanation and waffle that doesn't make me super comfortable.

Cyan - I feel this moment a bit as favorable for Alison. OC seemed content to just dump both she and I into the same "too town to bother with" basket for handing out generous town reads. That might be a conceded town read.

Pink - If Alison's redirect claim was a bluff or joke, mafia would know that. So we can ask ourselves whether OC was carrying forward the bluff deliberately or just literally didn't know the claim was untrue. The latter would be nice for Alison.

~~~

This isn't as conclusive as I'd like for it to be. It's overall another small nudge in the positive direction for Alison. I'll have to keep looking at nutella and Owner to develop my view further.

[Sloonei]

@JaggedJimmyJay has your analysis uncovered anything that points to Mac not being mafia?

[Alison]

@JaggedJimmyJay has your analysis uncovered anything that points to Mac not being mafia?

I uncovered one thing I think is a legit point in his favor, which was nutella's treatment of him.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

@JaggedJimmyJay has your analysis uncovered anything that points to Mac not being mafia?

Sonnycrush's treatment of Mac opens the door for uncertainty. I haven't removed Mac from my POE and still view him as a premier suspect, but it's something nobody has discussed with me yet.

[Alison]

Have you reviewed my interactions with nutella, JJJ? I think they'll help you get there on me being town a lot better. She doesn't treat me like a teammate at all, and she especially doesn't treat me as a hellbusser. There's no attempt to draw attention to our interactions or play up our animosity. She made a few half-hearted attempts at discrediting me, then gave up and tried to pocket me.

not sure, how I feel about all the lomo votes...hmm...I'm not caught up. But it seems like I keep seeing PerC wagons as if we are unwelcomed on someone's home turf...adk

I really hate this AtE.

[VOTE: Owner] aubergine

It's not AtE. It's I see 4 votes on lomo that look steady or have been there for a period of time. Generally like 4 or 5 votes on someone is like there is probably scum in that wagon. Or it could mean like a cop check or something, but generally day 1 a wagon that size and potentially unmoving is kind of meh for me.

So from that point of view, I think he might be town, but I have yet to read his posts, so I don't know yet.

"PerC players are being wagoned by unwelcoming Syndicate players" -> "This specific wagon on a PerC player is probably scum-driven because of its static nature" doesn't connect. If you don't like the LoMo wagon because there's no resistance, say so. Framing it as a PerC vs Syndicate thing reads as fishing for an appeal to emotion, and doesn't really make sense if your primary concern was the size and fluidity of the wagon. It does make sense if you have TMI on LoMo so I'm very happy to vote you.

mmmm spicy

What about 5his is spicy

That owner seemed to backtrack on why she was uneasy with the wagon. I think Alison might be onto something, it seemed like a fake elaboration

This bus on Owner in particular outs her as trying to pocket me by sheeping me.

[JaggedJimmyJay]

I'm actually looking at nutella's treatment of you right now.

[Alison]

Nice.