Inception [END]

[vanity.]

ty40n is kinda villagery. thoughts?

[Trustworthy Liberal]

@Trustworthy Liberal I have to use the white background so colors like that green you answered me in are very hard for me to read. The yellow is impossible for me too. Just wanted to let you know so maybe in the future you could answer me in another color - red, blue and purple show up real well on my background

Sorry will do will also repost in another color incase others are as well and so you can read

[vanity.]

FWIW I wanted to ask people in the other thread why they scumread nova. What I could gather was it came mostly from the timing of the 112 vote with most people leaning town on 112. There were also some saying nova felt similarly coasting to how they were playing in the last game.

nova was posting tho and making some pretty decent posts imo. I think iaafr shaded them for increasing activity near EoD.

yo ty4on, what posts of nova's did you think were decent?

[juliets]

Can someone tell me what kneeneighbor means?

[Trustworthy Liberal]

Most of those questions have been pretty thoroughly addressed but you said you caught up? What are you missing? Other than the last one which I think no it's just the setup/was probably planned from the start by the hosts

I posted this and another page showed up Soo i guess when I reloaded it didn't show page 89-90 was 88 think my internet's not doing great atm.

Also I makes sense was curious I other's opinions on that as well just a thought in how to end it as to me seems like an anti town thing so seems like a way we would stop it.

But after reading i saw it mentioned Nanook was night killed which makes me ask these questions now

Do you think the mafia is isolated between threads as well?

Did the neutral kill each night? If so what side are they on currently thinking other side based on the Benson kill being better for mafia then a neutral

Also assuming we've had two vig shots I imagine they are on this side based on both deaths being from this side

TL if I had to guess I would say there is mafia in both groups. I base that on how these split games have normally worked when I played them.

If that's how they are normally that would make sense orginaly was thinking since it seems dieing over there isn't total death.

If I understand your question, I don't think we know anything about a neutral (I call it 3rd party) kill. Both the Benson kill and the Nanook kill feel like mafia kills. The Faraday kill and the TonyStarkPrime kills felt like vigs but as I think about it now, they could have been 3p kills or maybe one of them was. If there was a 3p kill on the other side last night I think they would be here now.

That makes sense, is also why If been thinking maybe killing the neutral realigns us with both sides and that the kills on Faraday and Tony were town aligned kills could be a mafia vig trying the blend but without role claims i don't see that ever being mafia or the neutral.

One thought from the middle of the night, I think we have to be careful of if Nanook or Ty4on is bad, the mafia probably know now that they can kill on the other level and the person will still be alive in the game on this level. They may purposely kill one of their own to gain cred on the other level and possibly here since they would also know we are looking at one of the two kills as someone who is town. I'm basing this on the mafia still being able to talk as a group even though they were split over two groups which is the way I remember it working in the past.

I assume is that they found out only last night if ty4on was indeed a wolf or atleast i hope so seems really strong if they always knew since the splet has already been iffy having mainly people at one time scum read and the other the remainder of people.

This is a repost with just changed color for people with white backgrounds

[vanity.]

Can someone tell me what kneeneighbor means?

yeah i'll do so really fast. basically kneeneighbor was a player in my qualifier for champs and his gimmick was to constantly try and tie the votes. so that's what i was doing. he was really fun to play with!

[juliets]

ty40n is kinda villagery. thoughts?

my gut on him is villagery but I didn't feel good at all about nova on day 1 so I don't know what to think. Maybe I should review my nova read.

[Trustworthy Liberal]

Can someone tell me what kneeneighbor means?

yeah i'll do so really fast. basically kneeneighbor was a player in my qualifier for champs and his gimmick was to constantly try and tie the votes. so that's what i was doing. he was really fun to play with!

Seems like an anti town play in which you are trying to justify it by saying another player did it before in your qualification game.

[juliets]

Can someone tell me what kneeneighbor means?

yeah i'll do so really fast. basically kneeneighbor was a player in my qualifier for champs and his gimmick was to constantly try and tie the votes. so that's what i was doing. he was really fun to play with!

TY

[vanity.]

Can someone tell me what kneeneighbor means?

yeah i'll do so really fast. basically kneeneighbor was a player in my qualifier for champs and his gimmick was to constantly try and tie the votes. so that's what i was doing. he was really fun to play with!

Seems like an anti town play in which you are trying to justify it by saying another player did it before in your qualification game.

anti-town? maybe. but i'm trying not to take this game too seriously.

[Elephant]

[quote=nutella post_id=563750 time=1572737158 user_id=262]
@Creature why aren't you scum

@Elephant why aren't you scum

I'ma start with a vote for one of you two probs
[/quote]

I am not scum because I am the subconscious aspect of elation, which I am not currently role-playing.
And because I am the Elephant.
[attachment=0]image.jpeg[/attachment]

[vanity.]

is flavor claiming even legal in this game?

[vanity.]

ok it appears flavor claiming is allowed

carry on

[juliets]

is flavor claiming even legal in this game?

JJJ said in the rules post we can claim character but not role or abilities.

[Trustworthy Liberal]

is flavor claiming even legal in this game?

JJJ said in the rules post we can claim character but not role or abilities.

Nice I tottaly missed that does it give us anything to flavor claim?

[vanity.]

oh fuck i dumbtelled

ignore me lol

[Elephant]

Ugh rip guys and I'm not thrilled to just keep playing with the same sub group. Was hoping it would be switched up more.

It's not the same group, we lost Benson and gained Nanook, who I guess is conftown.

Wait why

Because Ty says Nanook was NK'd. Though maybe that could have been a SK, but that would mean someone got blocked on the mafia team - I think.

Without full understanding of the mechanics I think mec locking me is suboptimal tbh.

That being said I should be widely townread for my D1 push on drago and my interactions with Nutella that led to that push starting.

Ok, let's un-confirm you. If you are the mafia night-kill, mafia could have killed one of their own to send here. If you are not the mafia night-kill, there is another killing power, which makes me feel we were short a body on N1. In that case, the mafia kill might have been blocked, or mafia kills do not send people here. Neither of these possibilities feels likely.

[Trustworthy Liberal]

Not likeing vanity so far today will be reading back on him

[Trustworthy Liberal]

Ugh rip guys and I'm not thrilled to just keep playing with the same sub group. Was hoping it would be switched up more.

It's not the same group, we lost Benson and gained Nanook, who I guess is conftown.

Wait why

Because Ty says Nanook was NK'd. Though maybe that could have been a SK, but that would mean someone got blocked on the mafia team - I think.

Without full understanding of the mechanics I think mec locking me is suboptimal tbh.

That being said I should be widely townread for my D1 push on drago and my interactions with Nutella that led to that push starting.

Ok, let's un-confirm you. If you are the mafia night-kill, mafia could have killed one of their own to send here. If you are not the mafia night-kill, there is another killing power, which makes me feel we were short a body on N1. In that case, the mafia kill might have been blocked, or mafia kills do not send people here. Neither of these possibilities feels likely.

I think the neutral is on the other side and their kills send people here having killed Nanook and possible being roleblocked or the next person I gonna show up tommorow.

This leads Nicely in their death joining the threads back together.

[Elephant]

Most all of us were read as scum by some at some point in the day (nutella I think we all saw as town all the way through).

And Benson. He and I were both pretty clear of suspicion.

You, LC, and TL I have varying levels of concern about but after yesterday I think it's likely one of elephant or vanity is scum, maybe with TL also based on how that went down.

@Creature why aren't you scum

@Elephant why aren't you scum

I'ma start with a vote for one of you two probs

Why Creature?

[vanity.]

Ugh rip guys and I'm not thrilled to just keep playing with the same sub group. Was hoping it would be switched up more.

It's not the same group, we lost Benson and gained Nanook, who I guess is conftown.

Wait why

Because Ty says Nanook was NK'd. Though maybe that could have been a SK, but that would mean someone got blocked on the mafia team - I think.

Without full understanding of the mechanics I think mec locking me is suboptimal tbh.

That being said I should be widely townread for my D1 push on drago and my interactions with Nutella that led to that push starting.

so i saw this post and uh

just gonna call nanook a lock v and never look back

[juliets]

Can someone tell me what kneeneighbor means?

yeah i'll do so really fast. basically kneeneighbor was a player in my qualifier for champs and his gimmick was to constantly try and tie the votes. so that's what i was doing. he was really fun to play with!

Seems like an anti town play in which you are trying to justify it by saying another player did it before in your qualification game.

Hyena explained more yesterday about why he (and presumably others) cast votes to tie up the vote when they are town. I am not familiar with playing that way if you're town but his explanation made a certain amount of sense to me.

[Trustworthy Liberal]

Can someone tell me what kneeneighbor means?

yeah i'll do so really fast. basically kneeneighbor was a player in my qualifier for champs and his gimmick was to constantly try and tie the votes. so that's what i was doing. he was really fun to play with!

Seems like an anti town play in which you are trying to justify it by saying another player did it before in your qualification game.

Hyena explained more yesterday about why he (and presumably others) cast votes to tie up the vote when they are town. I am not familiar with playing that way if you're town but his explanation made a certain amount of sense to me.

Hyena was talking about close wagons not tied those are different close allows good information Tied makes random chance and upon town flip if it's T/W.

[juliets]

ok I re-read nova and I guess some of the reasons his posts came off scummy to me are maybe bad reasons. Like he said all the syndicators were scummy (probably a joke) and he said the Drago lynch train was scummy, pointing out me and nutella specifically. Maybe I took those posts too personally. Also at one point during the dialogue nutella said he was lock town though I can't figure out what she was looking at.

On the other side of the coin he entered the game later than he usually does (I understand though he didn't enter D&C late and was a wolf there). He also made that post where he said "Drago is town here, no?" after Drago had taken a good amount of votes and he called one of Benson's posts "lame". And finally it felt like he just joking along most of the way.

He called sprityo and Epi bad and though I thought sprityo was good, maybe he makes a good point when he says sprityo was milking the mis-lynch thing too much. (Epi was null to me on day 1)

So maybe I should give Ty4on a chance. Maybe nova's play seemed more scummy to me day 1 than it really was. I'd like to know what he did day 2 that led people to having him on their top 3 list though.

[Elephant]

I have marked wildcards and finale players orange, other players in our group blue, and bolded everyone here.

img]https://static.boredpanda.com/blog/wp-c ... g__700.jpg[/img]


As I'm writing this I may or may not be dead (Schrodinger joke here) but I'm fucking hyped about the state of things after that lynch. Like we got got got the Godfather on D1. There's no way the wolves didn't counter push that wagon so we have many juicy reads to be gleaned from that flip. Obviously, Nanook is not a wolf after that. 112 can be my best pal again. That entire wagon on Drago is almost green, I'm sure. And the CW's are probably riddled with wolves. Nova came out of that round looking like a wolf for the attempt to save Drago.

READS:

Strong town read

Nanook - Huge push against Drago. This doesn't happen if he's w/w.

112 - Spewed probable non-wolf by Drago:

Spoiler: show

viewtopic.php?p=558136#p558136
viewtopic.php?f=260&t=1812&p=558183#p558183
viewtopic.php?f=260&t=1812&p=558436#p558436

112 also served as the CW that some wolves likely pushed to save Drago. 3P should remain a possibility, however.

Nutella - Involvement in Drago lynch is great.
The vote was fairly early on the wagon and a major contribution to the lynch. Her subsequent posts after the fact helped push the wagon along.

Town read/leans

Pawn - Big Drago vote.

vanity - Proponent and voter of the Drago wagon.

Juliets - Interactions with Drago suggest town. Her vote was fairly crucial in Drago's lynch and I don't see her as the type to bus like that.

Iaarf - Overall, had a villagery progression at EoD even though it did seem like he wanted 112 lynched over Drago, and almost made it happen.
Drago was hunting iaarf as a 3P candidate early on. This is typical wolf stuff when they no someone isn't a wolf, but may be 3P instead of a villager.

Hyena - I don't agree the wolf accusations. What I see is a villager with specific tactics to get reads and reactions that will help us.

Eva - I'm not sure where I stand on her. I was village reading her but after EoD she's lost some town equity. I'll have to re-evaluate.


PoE – towny

Master Radishes - He can have a little credit for switching to Drago, but he late on the wagon and MR is no enemy of bussing.

Long con - Idk, I just like him

Jack - I like Jack, but I want to call this TMI: viewtopic.php?f=260&t=1812&start=3350#p561129

Mac - He started the push for Epig at the same time the Drago wagon was taking off. It's concerning, however Nova tries to help Mac lynch Epi in a way I don't see w/w partners doing; and I'm already liking Nova as a wolf.

Spiny/boo - OK. He had some interactions with Drago that suggest they may not be w/w

TLib - He's saved by helping push Drago before it was a sure deal. If he's wolf, he could've just pushed 112 instead.

Epignosis

PoE - Null

Ladylambda
Quin
DFaraday
Rej
Dom
Michelle
sprityo

PoE - wolfy

Creature - I remember seeing his name at the bottom for most of EoD, but he wasn't posting as if he was a frozen wolf. Given the content I've seen from him, I don't see how he wouldn't be contributing at EoD, even if he wasn't caught up.

Elephant - Maybe I didn't find the mislynch seeds, but I'm still suspicious of him and his agenda. His EoD did nothing to elevate himself.


Wolf reads
Nova - Tried extensively to push away from the Drago lynch. Like his ISO is literally 50% defending Drago or trying to lynch a CW. Prime suspect today.

----------------------------


***After reading the kills****

Wtf, two of my wolf leans were killed. I'm not sure how that will affect the reads now.

The "good player bias" is apparent.

All of a sudden, everyone on the bottom end is here.

[Elephant]

I still do not feel good about vanity. I criticized his lynch box, and waited for vanity to appear at the time he said he would, but he did not, instead appearing only after three votes were placed. He did the minimum needed to brush off that case, which I am not happy about. Vanity seems to still not understand what strong player bias means.

[Elephant]

@nutella did you see my questions to you? If you don't want to talk about both, maybe you could just talk about Elephant since you voted him.

I just feel like he's the most likely scum in this bunch rn, partially poe and partially his thread activity/pushes on d2 (and some on d1). Like in general he seems like he might have an agenda. Could be teamed with TL I guess. I will do more in depth research in a bit, see how I feel about him in relation to Drago and such.

Drago is my third cousin twice removed. Drago was no Elephant.

[juliets]

I still do not feel good about vanity. I criticized his lynch box, and waited for vanity to appear at the time he said he would, but he did not, instead appearing only after three votes were placed. He did the minimum needed to brush off that case, which I am not happy about. Vanity seems to still not understand what strong player bias means.

I'm going back to look at your case and vanity's response and see if there is anything that looks scummy that he failed to address.

[Ty4on]

FWIW I wanted to ask people in the other thread why they scumread nova. What I could gather was it came mostly from the timing of the 112 vote with most people leaning town on 112. There were also some saying nova felt similarly coasting to how they were playing in the last game.

nova was posting tho and making some pretty decent posts imo. I think iaafr shaded them for increasing activity near EoD.

yo ty4on, what posts of nova's did you think were decent?

They're in the other thread ._.

There was a willingness to follow the game. Actual solving wasn't great, but the tone and reaction to people scumreading him was good and felt pure.
The thing that stood out to me the most was the initial reaction to losing all of D1 and entering a brand new thread was "I don't have to read 30 pages now " lol

[Elephant]

[VOTE: Ty4on] aubergine
I'm sheeping Benson. Also, novaseline was lynched once already, and I don't like a stream of potential mafia trickling down on us. I don't want to lynch Creature. I have not examined Nova's ISO myself, but will do so now.

[Ty4on]

Super random, but in this world individual role actions cost 2 role points (Post #5), but in that other world we were in they only cost 1 role point and it specified that it's "at this level". Otherwise similarly stated in an individual post near the beginning of the thread.

I'm not sure how that helps, but I just noticed it skimming through first page rules again.

[Ty4on]

[VOTE: Ty4on] aubergine
I'm sheeping Benson. Also, novaseline was lynched once already, and I don't like a stream of potential mafia trickling down on us. I don't want to lynch Creature. I have not examined Nova's ISO myself, but will do so now.

Right now is this a Benson sheep with your own read being null?

[Elephant]

[VOTE: Ty4on] aubergine
I'm sheeping Benson. Also, novaseline was lynched once already, and I don't like a stream of potential mafia trickling down on us. I don't want to lynch Creature. I have not examined Nova's ISO myself, but will do so now.

Nova has a 40 post ISO, and these posts are quite short. Nova has laughably few interactions, seems to have been mostly absent, and votes Epignosis before settling on 112 in the final minutes. I need to examine why this made a full wolf read for Benson.

[juliets]

I'm going to have to leave for a bit. bbs

[JaggedJimmyJay]

DST screwed up the poll deadline, so I have removed it. The poll will still terminate at 6:00 PM EST on Monday. We will screen shot it when the deadline hits.

Just in case it's unclear, this implies the phase will be a total of 49 hours instead of 48 (deadline is one raw hour later, even if the "same" time at 6PM). Thanks Ben Franklin.

[Long Con]

long con is far and away the wolfiest person on boo. the people on dfaraday look wolfy though i'd perceive villagers are more likely to vote on dfaraday in these scenarios

Mostly agree on that. Benson town, nutella looks town, Hyena also town. I'd say vanity is the wolfiest one on the boo train.

Here's where I sit after catching up:

NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME
nutella
Hyena
vanity.
Creature
Elephant
Trustworthy Liberal
novaselinenever / Ty4on

[Long Con]

I do have to do some rereads, I want to freshen up on the bottom four to compare them.

[Elephant]

Wolf reads
Nova - Tried extensively to push away from the Drago lynch. Like his ISO is literally 50% defending Drago or trying to lynch a CW. Prime suspect today.

I don't think that's necessarily scummy, could be just wrong townie. At least I'd expect scum to be more discreet unless I'm missing something.

Nova pings me so much because I don't understand his reasoning for being so firmly against the Dragomir wagon. It was like he was trying to get anyone (112 or Epignosis) lynched, as long as it wasn't Drag. Yes, this does seem strange for a wolf to do so blatantly, but it could have been because Drago had a power role and maybe he really wanted to preserve that?

This should say powerful role, not power role. I suppose the Godfather isn't as strong in games where you can't claim anything, however.

This is Benson's stance. I should examine whether "extensively" and "firmly" are warranted. Nova expressed town reads on both Drago and 112 before abandoning the Epignosis vote.

[Long Con]

Nova's ISO was pukey. Very little, if any, scumhunting effort. Calls Drago town and votes the other wagon.

@[mention]Ty4on[/mention] You mentioned some slight improvements to nova's play on level 2. The lynch still took him, so is it fair to say that the majority didn't agree with your assessment? Do you think more wolf or town votes were on nova?

[Long Con]

Wolf reads
Nova - Tried extensively to push away from the Drago lynch. Like his ISO is literally 50% defending Drago or trying to lynch a CW. Prime suspect today.

I don't think that's necessarily scummy, could be just wrong townie. At least I'd expect scum to be more discreet unless I'm missing something.

Nova pings me so much because I don't understand his reasoning for being so firmly against the Dragomir wagon. It was like he was trying to get anyone (112 or Epignosis) lynched, as long as it wasn't Drag. Yes, this does seem strange for a wolf to do so blatantly, but it could have been because Drago had a power role and maybe he really wanted to preserve that?

This should say powerful role, not power role. I suppose the Godfather isn't as strong in games where you can't claim anything, however.

This is Benson's stance. I should examine whether "extensively" and "firmly" are warranted. Nova expressed town reads on both Drago and 112 before abandoning the Epignosis vote.

I just read, I think they're warranted as much as they can be without nova getting completely ridiculous about it.

[Long Con]

oh fuck i dumbtelled

ignore me lol

Works better when you let someone else notice it first, but that's just the way I do it...

[Elephant]

Like I said earlier, I usually find Drago as a pretty strong townread early on when he's town (even when I mislynched him I had been townreading him for the first few days) and I haven't gotten that feeling at all here so my gut says he's likely scum.

novaselinenever

You had as scum in Dogs v Cat early on though, right? Also I'm more interested in something relating to the meat of his posts, so I can chew on that. He has plenty.

No that's what I'm referring to here I literally had a lock town read on him until after the Jay lynch/the first time you blocked me

I was referring to earlier in D1 when you were scum reading then you felt his sincerity after he got pushed, thing is he hasn't been around this game so maybe tht's why you're not getting that same vibe? It'd be neat to see him react to the wagon, he's pure af and stubborn as town lol.

I have discovered Nova's "firm" defense of Dragomir.

[Long Con]

benson was also pushing on tlib. he was also just one of the most active and villagery people in our group, though that raises the question why nutella didn't die?

thinking face emoji

Don't really like this post either. I've seen too many wolves (myself included) try to pull a frame-up job nightkill and they're usually the first to bring it up in the thread, after giving a little bit of time for someone else to say something.

Then the ol' leading-question-and-emoji to try to take nutella down a bit without actually making an accusation.

NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME
nutella
Hyena
Creature
Elephant
Trustworthy Liberal
vanity.
novaselinenever / Ty4on

[nutella]

long con is far and away the wolfiest person on boo. the people on dfaraday look wolfy though i'd perceive villagers are more likely to vote on dfaraday in these scenarios

Mostly agree on that. Benson town, nutella looks town, Hyena also town. I'd say vanity is the wolfiest one on the boo train.

Here's where I sit after catching up:

NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME
nutella
Hyena
vanity.
Creature
Elephant
Trustworthy Liberal
novaselinenever / Ty4on

You forgot juliets?

[Long Con]

I totally did. Sorry jules! I copied the lynch poll and cut out the extraneous stuff, and I guess I cut out juliets too.

NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME
nutella
Hyena
Creature
Elephant
juliets
Trustworthy Liberal
vanity.
novaselinenever / Ty4on
[/quote]

[Long Con]

Going through Elephant's posts from yesterday... he goes on and on about how vanity isn't the same as his town self, and it looks like nothing vanity does it right, and then takes a 90 degree turn and votes DFaraday because "he needs to be sorted".

Were you afraid to pull the trigger on vanity, El?

[Elephant]

Reading novaselinenever encounters the same difficulty as feading any low-activity player: there defense of Drago feels unfounded, but they did not have time to read the ISO and may not have seen the full ISO. The thingbthat strikes me most is that this defense only appears after nutelly challenges nova, and there nova deflects with a counter-question at first:

Drago is Town here no?

No?

Why?

Considering that this quote is the start of a conversation that ended with the quote I reproduced in my previous posts, then the conversation flows like this:
- Nova townreads Drago with no context
- nutella challenges, calls Drago town
- Nova ignores the challenge, questions nutella
- nutella defends scumread of Drago
- Nova attacks scumread of Drago

Nova never gives any own reasoning, instead the conversation turns from to source of Nova's own read to the legitimacy of nutella's read. It culminates in an argument that strongly implies that Dragomir would appear as town if he were present, which he wasn't. This is a strong Dragomir defense that feels as if it was conjured up out of thin air. I believe that the other group may well have caught a wolf here.

[Long Con]

It seems best tonwait for Nanook to weigh in, but if the other group lynched Nova, that seems to have been a good idea which we should consider emulating? Unless we assume that the other group was as adept with our wagons as we were -- not a surprising occurrence given my prediction, by the way. LHF lynches tend to get directed by scum. Given that both wagons were town, we might need to look towards who set these up.

Ten voters on two players. Who's more responsible, those who set it up, or those who finished it off? Maybe wolves were waiting in the wings to ensure a town lynch? Not to mention that the so-called "LHF group" were all involved in those votes as well, right?

[Elephant]

Going through Elephant's posts from yesterday... he goes on and on about how vanity isn't the same as his town self, and it looks like nothing vanity does it right, and then takes a 90 degree turn and votes DFaraday because "he needs to be sorted".

Were you afraid to pull the trigger on vanity, El?

As I returned to my home and then to this game, I saw that I was voting vanity by myself. Unfortunately, it is impossible to lynch a player by yourself, so I had to choose an existing wagon. The DFaraday wagon seemed to be the more sensible one. As Boo showed more activity, I felt they would have been resolvable eventually. In retrospect, the fact that Boo had voted Hyena and vanity earlier in the day and did not go for an easy mislynch push should have showed them to be town.

[Long Con]

My eyes started to close as I was reading posts, and I'm going to take a nap for a bit. Didn't sleep well at the camp last night.