[END] Literal WWerecreatures Invade Syndicate Zoo: An SDN Crossover Game

[potentialsheltervet]

Okay, fine
[VOTE: creature ] aubergine

[Zenge]

I am a Falcon Partner now for suggesting having mech pointing at them being villa?

Where did I say this?

It is a rethorical question.
I am expecting to have something else from you and doing questions here

No I don’t think you’re a Falcon wolf partner. Despite your pushback.

The way you’ve gone about it is more villagey. Unlike some people who’s push back has been very scummy.

[Zenge]

Okay, fine
[VOTE: creature ] aubergine

You know Falcons are creatures. Just saying.

[santygrass]

If Flacon by some miracle flips Village I’ll have egg on my face and re-evaluate everything.

Do it now. No need to get super deep. Surface level thought on who would still be a wolf , can be unrelated to Falcon.

And giving your input on the what-ifs doesnt mean you need to stop thinking about W!Falcon world

[potentialsheltervet]

Okay, fine
[VOTE: creature ] aubergine

You know Falcons are creatures. Just saying.

I'm sorry. I see more to substantiate a vote on Creature at this time.
If someone has a gun they can shoot falcon for you so you can look at other people

[tutuu]

last post for this day phase, good luck guys and girls and everything in between

seanzie
mac
lawpy
zenge
neon
dennis
svs
falcon
santy
SARhandler - (riding on psv mafia. if psv not mafia, im dropping the townread)

sloonei
nate - purely sheeping
miranda - extremely miniscule gut townread, its very weak

migthyrunner
mayo - either wolf or exactly town vig; (not w/w with genny)

genny (not w/w with mayo)
creature
marmot - purely sheeping
psv

[santygrass]

You being stuck on falcon isn't giving anything new to the thread and simply put, doesnt help. Sorry if I'm being a bit harsh. But once again, I am not telling you to stop wolf-reading falcon.

But like, who else is a wolf regardless if they have equity with Falcon? Who could be taking advantage of your falcon push or Bussing falcon here?

That sort of reads I am asking of you, to put more nuance in your reads. Hyperfocusing is just bad . Village strongest weapon is reassesing.

If you only ask "falcon is a wolf? Yeah
Falcon is a wolf? Yeah " Then you are not reassesing. You are going deeper into the tunnel

[tutuu]

oh and please dont CFD. its always bad

just compete between the two main wagons, dont make any new wagons when there's like 4 hours or less remaining of day

its really bad and thats how town loses games and loses their chops and loses their days and time and morale

[Marmot]

oh and please dont CFD. its always bad

just compete between the two main wagons, dont make any new wagons when there's like 4 hours or less remaining of day

its really bad and thats how town loses games and loses their chops and loses their days and time and morale

But tutuu we have 3 main wagons!!

[genny]

oh and please dont CFD. its always bad

Confuse Fluffy Dogs?

[Marmot]

oh and please dont CFD. its always bad

Confuse Fluffy Dogs?

Critters For Days

[Zenge]

If Flacon by some miracle flips Village I’ll have egg on my face and re-evaluate everything.

Do it now. No need to get super deep. Surface level thought on who would still be a wolf , can be unrelated to Falcon.

And giving your input on the what-ifs doesnt mean you need to stop thinking about W!Falcon world

Give me a Village case for Falcon and I’ll consider it.

And honest to god village case. Not some handwavy BS about how a few Syndicate players feel like he’s village. Players who by the way are notoriously bad at actually reading Flacon, by their own admission.

Not one of those people, or you, or anyone else has laid out one sold case for why this is a lock villager.

And by the way. You don’t know the affiliation of ANY of those people either. So their handwaving about “Flacon is just sketchy sometimes, just ignore him” means ABSOLUTELY NOTHING!

No one. Has given me a reason to say Falcon isn’t a wolf. This is my wolf read. I’m certain of it. I’m sticking with it.

I get that you don’t agree with it. Fine. Go do something else then. I’m not throwing away a perfectly good wolf read just because not everyone agrees.

[tutuu]

oh and please dont CFD. its always bad

Confuse Fluffy Dogs?

if genny was town i think she'd be interested in why i'm scumreading her

town generally express curiosity (not necessarily effort to convince u, but they're just curious)

i have her colored as red on this same page so no way she didnt see it

genny not being curious why im scumreading her ... doesnt necessarily make her a wolf

but if she was town its a missed opportunity for her to towntell

ergo, in *some way* its scummy

but not *really*

if that makes any sense at all

[santygrass]

If Flacon by some miracle flips Village I’ll have egg on my face and re-evaluate everything.

Do it now. No need to get super deep. Surface level thought on who would still be a wolf , can be unrelated to Falcon.

And giving your input on the what-ifs doesnt mean you need to stop thinking about W!Falcon world

Give me a Village case for Falcon and I’ll consider it.

And honest to god village case. Not some handwavy BS about how a few Syndicate players feel like he’s village. Players who by the way are notoriously bad at actually reading Flacon, by their own admission.

Not one of those people, or you, or anyone else has laid out one sold case for why this is a lock villager.

And by the way. You don’t know the affiliation of ANY of those people either. So their handwaving about “Flacon is just sketchy sometimes, just ignore him” means ABSOLUTELY NOTHING!

No one. Has given me a reason to say Falcon isn’t a wolf. This is my wolf read. I’m certain of it. I’m sticking with it.

I get that you don’t agree with it. Fine. Go do something else then. I’m not throwing away a perfectly good wolf read just because not everyone agrees.

* Spanks *

I am not telling you to discard your wolfread.

Don't start with the stretchyness Zenge smh

[santygrass]

Like, if you can't find another wolfread that does not rely ln falcon being a wolf, then your entire view of the game should not be taken into account because it lacks a lot of nuance /shrug

[genny]

oh and please dont CFD. its always bad

Confuse Fluffy Dogs?

if genny was town i think she'd be interested in why i'm scumreading her

town generally express curiosity (not necessarily effort to convince u, but they're just curious)

i have her colored as red on this same page so no way she didnt see it

genny not being curious why im scumreading her ... doesnt necessarily make her a wolf

but if she was town its a missed opportunity for her to towntell

ergo, in *some way* its scummy

but not *really*

if that makes any sense at all

you already said i TMI'd? i figured it was that.

plus, you've got me with psv and mayo down there, and we're clearly not all together, so you've got some more sorting out to do. i don't grade unfinished work.

[Sloonei]

This is my wolf read. I’m certain of it

I think this is the problem santy is having right now, Zenge. Wolf read. Singular. Like me before, Santy is not telling you to discard your Falcon read. Santy is asking for you to talk about other things. You have repeated to both of us that you are reading everything else in the thread. Please tell us all what you think about those Other Things.

[Zenge]

You’re asking me to not solve based on my wolf read though. That just doesn’t make sense.

I think Falcon is a wolf. By far this is my strongest read. So my other wolf reads are going to stem from that, which is what Santy is asking me to ignore. he doesn’t want to hear about who I think could be partnered with Falcon.

Ergo, he’s asking for my wolf reads in a Village!Falcon world (as emphasized by his “if I had mech proof falcon was village” statement).

I’m not going to exert a bunch of energy and waste my time building cases I don’t believe in.

[Lawpy]

I feel like there’s a lot of resistance to zenges push on falcons

Santy at least is approaching from a pretty strongly village trajectory by highlighting the need to reassess in the event Zenges is wrong and looking for other wolves that don’t depend primarily on falcons being a wolf

[Zenge]

I feel like there’s a lot of resistance to zenges push on falcons

Santy at least is approaching from a pretty strongly village trajectory by highlighting the need to reassess in the event Zenges is wrong and looking for other wolves that don’t depend primarily on falcons being a wolf

There is a lot of resistance, yes. It’s been an uphill battle.

[Marmot]

I feel like there’s a lot of resistance to zenges push on falcons

Santy at least is approaching from a pretty strongly village trajectory by highlighting the need to reassess in the event Zenges is wrong and looking for other wolves that don’t depend primarily on falcons being a wolf

At least recently, I think the resistance is more about figuring out what other reads Zenge has, and less about the fact that falcon's the one being pushed.

[Sloonei]

I feel like there’s a lot of resistance to zenges push on falcons

Santy at least is approaching from a pretty strongly village trajectory by highlighting the need to reassess in the event Zenges is wrong and looking for other wolves that don’t depend primarily on falcons being a wolf

There is a lot of resistance, yes. It’s been an uphill battle.

Consider your own role in that.

[Zenge]

I feel like there’s a lot of resistance to zenges push on falcons

Santy at least is approaching from a pretty strongly village trajectory by highlighting the need to reassess in the event Zenges is wrong and looking for other wolves that don’t depend primarily on falcons being a wolf

At least recently, I think the resistance is more about figuring out what other reads Zenge has, and less about the fact that falcon's the one being pushed.

No but he’s asking me for wolf reads outside of a Wolf!Falcon world.

I don’t want to work hard solving the game under the assumption I’m wrong without actually flipping Falcon. That just completely undermines my position. I don’t want to build cases I don’t believe in.

[santygrass]

You’re asking me to not solve based on my wolf read though. That just doesn’t make sense.

I think Falcon is a wolf. By far this is my strongest read. So my other wolf reads are going to stem from that, which is what Santy is asking me to ignore. he doesn’t want to hear about who I think could be partnered with Falcon.

Ergo, he’s asking for my wolf reads in a Village!Falcon world (as emphasized by his “if I had mech proof falcon was village” statement).

I’m not going to exert a bunch of energy and waste my time building cases I don’t believe in.

This is my issue.

You not haing the ability to read people independently of Falcon.

Can't you recognize or have arguments of someone being scum NOT RELATED to falcon???

Look at the keyword here, not related. You don't even have to flip falcon as scum or village. Just ignore partnering aspect and you don't have reads???

I don't believe that, hence why I am asking you to work with me

[Zenge]

I feel like there’s a lot of resistance to zenges push on falcons

Santy at least is approaching from a pretty strongly village trajectory by highlighting the need to reassess in the event Zenges is wrong and looking for other wolves that don’t depend primarily on falcons being a wolf

There is a lot of resistance, yes. It’s been an uphill battle.

Consider your own role in that.

Watch your tone, Sloonei, you look pretty bad in a Wolf!Falcon world.

Consider your attempt to shut down the Flacon push early and then all the backtracking, hedging, and distancing you’ve done since to claim that this wasn’t what you were doing.

Your refusal to answer the point by point questions I laid out for you hasn’t been forgotten.

[Sloonei]

I feel like there’s a lot of resistance to zenges push on falcons

Santy at least is approaching from a pretty strongly village trajectory by highlighting the need to reassess in the event Zenges is wrong and looking for other wolves that don’t depend primarily on falcons being a wolf

There is a lot of resistance, yes. It’s been an uphill battle.

Consider your own role in that.

Watch your tone, Sloonei, you look pretty bad in a Wolf!Falcon world.

Consider your attempt to shut down the Flacon push early and then all the backtracking, hedging, and distancing you’ve done since to claim that this wasn’t what you were doing.

Your refusal to answer the point by point questions I laid out for you hasn’t been forgotten.

My point exactly.

You have been so blindly tunneled on Falcon that you are attacking anyone who doesn't immediately agree with you.

I am not participating in this discussion again.

[Zenge]

You’re asking me to not solve based on my wolf read though. That just doesn’t make sense.

I think Falcon is a wolf. By far this is my strongest read. So my other wolf reads are going to stem from that, which is what Santy is asking me to ignore. he doesn’t want to hear about who I think could be partnered with Falcon.

Ergo, he’s asking for my wolf reads in a Village!Falcon world (as emphasized by his “if I had mech proof falcon was village” statement).

I’m not going to exert a bunch of energy and waste my time building cases I don’t believe in.

This is my issue.

You not haing the ability to read people independently of Falcon.

Can't you recognize or have arguments of someone being scum NOT RELATED to falcon???

Look at the keyword here, not related. You don't even have to flip falcon as scum or village. Just ignore partnering aspect and you don't have reads???

I don't believe that, hence why I am asking you to work with me

Santy, I posted a reads list not too long ago. A lot of those are not based exclusively on Falcon. Go read it if you’re wondering where my head is at on the entire game. But I’m not going to build strong cases against people under the assumption Flacon is village.

[Zenge]

I feel like there’s a lot of resistance to zenges push on falcons

Santy at least is approaching from a pretty strongly village trajectory by highlighting the need to reassess in the event Zenges is wrong and looking for other wolves that don’t depend primarily on falcons being a wolf

There is a lot of resistance, yes. It’s been an uphill battle.

Consider your own role in that.

Watch your tone, Sloonei, you look pretty bad in a Wolf!Falcon world.

Consider your attempt to shut down the Flacon push early and then all the backtracking, hedging, and distancing you’ve done since to claim that this wasn’t what you were doing.

Your refusal to answer the point by point questions I laid out for you hasn’t been forgotten.

My point exactly.

You have been so blindly tunneled on Falcon that you are attacking anyone who doesn't immediately agree with you.

I am not participating in this discussion again.

I’m not attacking anyone. I’m arguing with Santy, but his approach to this conversation has been pro-town.

Yours has been scummy. There’s a stark contrast

[Zenge]

I feel like there’s a lot of resistance to zenges push on falcons

Santy at least is approaching from a pretty strongly village trajectory by highlighting the need to reassess in the event Zenges is wrong and looking for other wolves that don’t depend primarily on falcons being a wolf

There is a lot of resistance, yes. It’s been an uphill battle.

Consider your own role in that.

Watch your tone, Sloonei, you look pretty bad in a Wolf!Falcon world.

Consider your attempt to shut down the Flacon push early and then all the backtracking, hedging, and distancing you’ve done since to claim that this wasn’t what you were doing.

Your refusal to answer the point by point questions I laid out for you hasn’t been forgotten.

My point exactly.

You have been so blindly tunneled on Falcon that you are attacking anyone who doesn't immediately agree with you.

I am not participating in this discussion again.

I’m not attacking anyone. I’m arguing with Santy, but his approach to this conversation has been pro-town.

Yours has been scummy. There’s a stark contrast

Emphasis on Anyone. As in - “I’m not attacking JUST anyone, who disagrees with me. Only the ones who are super scummy about it”

[Zenge]

Actually I think this continues to be an example of Sloonei being super scummy in this.

Claiming that I’m Blinding attacking ANYONE who doesn’t agree with my Falcon read is a gross misrepresentation of the facts and reality.

[Lawpy]

Why is @Creature voting Santy?

[potentialsheltervet]

Why is @Creature voting Santy?

He made a comment about Santy's EOD1 looking really bad and hasn't checked back in.

[santygrass]

You’re asking me to not solve based on my wolf read though. That just doesn’t make sense.

I think Falcon is a wolf. By far this is my strongest read. So my other wolf reads are going to stem from that, which is what Santy is asking me to ignore. he doesn’t want to hear about who I think could be partnered with Falcon.

Ergo, he’s asking for my wolf reads in a Village!Falcon world (as emphasized by his “if I had mech proof falcon was village” statement).

I’m not going to exert a bunch of energy and waste my time building cases I don’t believe in.

This is my issue.

You not haing the ability to read people independently of Falcon.

Can't you recognize or have arguments of someone being scum NOT RELATED to falcon???

Look at the keyword here, not related. You don't even have to flip falcon as scum or village. Just ignore partnering aspect and you don't have reads???

I don't believe that, hence why I am asking you to work with me

Santy, I posted a reads list not too long ago. A lot of those are not based exclusively on Falcon. Go read it if you’re wondering where my head is at on the entire game. But I’m not going to build strong cases against people under the assumption Flacon is village.

Oho Will look into that. I hope not too long ago is on this day tho (as in D2) .

If not I will likely ask for updates if any

[tutuu]

okay I finally stopped being lazy and revoke what I said about Miranda.

Her tone is identical in Stardew and Fire Emblem.

was miranda town in these stardew and fire emblem games?

if so, both sport ponies and animal midwife died while having townreads on miranda

that should be taken into account (the reads of the towns who died n1)

miranda boosts up in townyness

[santygrass]

okay I finally stopped being lazy and revoke what I said about Miranda.

Her tone is identical in Stardew and Fire Emblem.

was miranda town in these stardew and fire emblem games?

if so, both sport ponies and animal midwife died while having townreads on miranda

that should be taken into account (the reads of the towns who died n1)

miranda boosts up in townyness

Scum in Fire emblem, Town in Stardew

[miranda920]

I'm interested in why @Seanzie is on SAR, she doesn't feel overtly scummy to me

I'm currently torn on where to put my vote and I don't have much time left before I need to leave for Taylor Swift!

[tutuu]

okay I finally stopped being lazy and revoke what I said about Miranda.

Her tone is identical in Stardew and Fire Emblem.

was miranda town in these stardew and fire emblem games?

if so, both sport ponies and animal midwife died while having townreads on miranda

that should be taken into account (the reads of the towns who died n1)

miranda boosts up in townyness

Scum in Fire emblem, Town in Stardew

rip nevermind then (unless they did actually townread miranda after all. ill check tomorrow)

[potentialsheltervet]

okay I finally stopped being lazy and revoke what I said about Miranda.

Her tone is identical in Stardew and Fire Emblem.

was miranda town in these stardew and fire emblem games?

if so, both sport ponies and animal midwife died while having townreads on miranda

that should be taken into account (the reads of the towns who died n1)

miranda boosts up in townyness

Scum in Fire emblem, Town in Stardew

rip nevermind then (unless they did actually townread miranda after all. ill check tomorrow)

Aren't you asleep?

[santygrass]

I'm interested in why @Seanzie is on SAR, she doesn't feel overtly scummy to me

I'm currently torn on where to put my vote and I don't have much time left before I need to leave for Taylor Swift!

Gth I think she does because the progression of

Voting me to 'beetlejuice' > Sheeping Zenge on falcon without caring much about individual read on Falcon its pretty bad

[miranda920]

I'm interested in why @Seanzie is on SAR, she doesn't feel overtly scummy to me

I'm currently torn on where to put my vote and I don't have much time left before I need to leave for Taylor Swift!

Gth I think she does because the progression of

Voting me to 'beetlejuice' > Sheeping Zenge on falcon without caring much about individual read on Falcon its pretty bad

okay, I see your perspective

I struggle with seeing her as anything but town because of my bias

[santygrass]

@santygrass you’re being weirdly quiet this game. Where are you?

I miss @santygrass

Hope he’s okay.

Didn't find the readlist but found this and I am ultrapocketed pls

[santygrass]

I'm interested in why @Seanzie is on SAR, she doesn't feel overtly scummy to me

I'm currently torn on where to put my vote and I don't have much time left before I need to leave for Taylor Swift!

Gth I think she does because the progression of

Voting me to 'beetlejuice' > Sheeping Zenge on falcon without caring much about individual read on Falcon its pretty bad

okay, I see your perspective

I struggle with seeing her as anything but town because of my bias

To be fair its not like SAR is howling, but on a base level. Could see this being SAR scum game, but keeping in mind its still pretty similar to SAR playstyle of flying pants or something like that.

Usually its far easier to rely on Dubz soulread, sadge

[Zenge]

I'm interested in why @Seanzie is on SAR, she doesn't feel overtly scummy to me

I'm currently torn on where to put my vote and I don't have much time left before I need to leave for Taylor Swift!

Gth I think she does because the progression of

Voting me to 'beetlejuice' > Sheeping Zenge on falcon without caring much about individual read on Falcon its pretty bad

okay, I see your perspective

I struggle with seeing her as anything but town because of my bias

To be fair its not like SAR is howling, but on a base level. Could see this being SAR scum game, but keeping in mind its still pretty similar to SAR playstyle of flying pants or something like that.

Usually its far easier to rely on Dubz soulread, sadge

There’s some irony here of scum reading SAR for sheeping me, while admitting you usually sheep Dubz for reading SAR.

I think is defense of SARs sheep, she’s played with me a fair amount. I think SAR knows I never make pushes like this as a wolf, and even as a villager I almost NEVER make pushes on anyone as strongly as I’ve been pushing Falcon here.

[Sloonei]

Commencing Operation Appease Zenge. Here is a Falcon ISO.

Spoiler: show

I'm going to aggressively omgus until the game like actually starts

Do you feel there's nothing to be learned during D0?

Falcon is a pot stirrer. He says provocative things to put direct pressure on people. Here we see him getting a head start by doing that to Dennis.

Spoiler: show

Hey look a wolfy opportunistic 3rd vote on the lead wagon.

[VOTE: Miranda] aubergine

Where have I seen this before?

Implying that Miranda is town I see. How'd ya arrive at that conclusion?

Here he does the same thing, targeting Wilgy.

Spoiler: show

I do not like the Miranda wagon. This is happening too fast

Well, Wilgy's vote is quite clearly tongue in cheek...

After wilgy responds jokingly to Falcon's initial pressure, Falcon comments on Zenge commenting on the Miranda wagon. This is actually a more reasonable post than the previous two, and is not purely provocative.

Spoiler: show

I do not like the Miranda wagon. This is happening too fast

3 out of 24 votes is hardly anything to get worked up about especially with over 47 hours left.

It just felt like a lot piling onto one person in a very short amount of time

Well, I s'pose you could ask those voting Miranda as to their reasons...but you're not doing that.

Why?

This one is more provocative. This is the same thing Falcon did to Dennis and Wilgy earlier. He is casting a wide net, if nothing else.

Spoiler: show

[VOTE: zenge] aubergine

This one is followed up by a vote. Noted.

Spoiler: show

3 out of 24 votes is hardly anything to get worked up about especially with over 47 hours left.

It just felt like a lot piling onto one person in a very short amount of time

Well, I s'pose you could ask those voting Miranda as to their reasons...but you're not doing that.

Why?

There’s 47 hours left

Why not solve now, especially if you find it suspicious?

What makes you think I’m not solving?

Oh, that's easy!

You called out a wagon for suspiciously developing too quickly, with no direct follow up with those responsible for the wagon, and when asked about why, you defelcted.

The first escalation of The Conflict. This is not out of bounds for Falcon's shtick. He is squeezing Zenge to see what comes out. Maybe a bit more tightly than Dennis or Wilgy before. But that is likely more to do with the way Zenge reacted than him being singled out or anything.

Spoiler: show

Santy trying to pocket like 9 players at once is a thing I guess

Another provocative statement, this time directed toward Santy.

Spoiler: show

Hi, I claim slank D1 cover.

I have ONE (1) read and that is Neon = Town and not much else

Have you played with Neon/Zenon a lot?

I have wolfed with them, played with them where I was Villa and them wolf, and played two games with both as Villa as far as I recall. If they keep up the good tone they are much more likely to be Villa and I think I'll be able to soulread them Villa


And ftr I think both games when we were both V/V we never found each other succesfully . Or if we did at some point it ended up rescinding. Comlex history, but I kinda think thats why they are one of the players I have better stored how they approach the game and what could be more indicative of a certain alignment

How would you describe Neon's scum approach to the game?

PSV is not currently a wolf

Here

What's informing all yer TRs, or are they just gut feels?

This is SDN meta, but Sportponies has knowledge of a secre PSV wolf tell that it has never failed yet, so the read of Sporty into PSV has weight tbh. Specially with PSV , they have a super good tone as wolf and its someone I can easily misread

Do you have a meta read on Sporty right now?

Some more back-and-forth with Santy. Falcon's tone is notably less antagonistic than with Zenge. But I can easily attribute that to Falcon matching the energy of those around him. He is still putting pressure on Santy here, his tone is just more reserved. I would also describe Santy's tone as more reserved than Zenge's.

Spoiler: show

It just felt like a lot piling onto one person in a very short amount of time

Well, I s'pose you could ask those voting Miranda as to their reasons...but you're not doing that.

Why?

Actually this is sort of hypocritical on review. Falcon votes me immediately after this. They’re tasking issue with my saying I’m uncomfortable with how fast the three votes seemed to pile onto Miranda, and not asking each of the voters for the reasons for their votes.

But then never asks me why I don’t like the wagon.

What’s worse here is I just noted that it was odd how many votes came on Miranda in rapid succession. But I didn’t use that as an opportunity to wolf read anyone or try to vote them out. Falcon here though did the exact same thing he accused me of doing and used it as an excuse to try and get me misyeeted.

That’s foundationally unsound.

You already said why you did not like the wagon, remember?

Now you're saying you found the speed of the wagon odd, before you clearly said you did not like it. So, is it strange, or is it scummy? There's a big difference.

You're also toning down the phrasing each time...first you say you don't like it, then uncomfortable, then odd. You keep scaling back how you feel about the wagon.

I see you still haven't followed up w/ any of the wagon voters. Duly noted.

Falcon and Zenge continue to butt heads. I do not agree with Zenge's interpretation of Falcon's actions. It is very reasonable for Falcon to assume that Zenge's initial objection to the Miranda wagon was the timing of it. In fact, I struggle to identify a different interpretation.

But Falcon's response is similarly nitpicky. "Is it strange or is it scummy?" is a reach. But that's still within Falcon's shtick here. This does not need to mean that Falcon is town. It just means that I am reading his words here as being intentionally provocative so as to get a strong reaction out of Zenge. Boy did he succeed at that.

Spoiler: show

We got more.

Genny:

Spoiler: show

See, this site needs reacts because this post deserves it's moment in the sun

Agreed, I miss react buttons *sad face*

Don’t you just love it when guests come over and complain about your decor?

I’m excited about all the options for ISOs that I will never do!

Caustic approach. Slightly pessimistic but thoughtful.
You are a crow, and definitely good.

potentialsheltervet:

Spoiler: show

Playing on a forum that doesn't censor profanity feels illegal. And empowering.

Is enriched and strengthened by profanity.

So I’m picking you out of the community to ask:

-how are you?
-do you actually handle dogs?
-what’s your least favorite dog?
-if the answer is Scotty, don’t
-I have a mean bark and a terribly ineffective bite
-What is the airspeed velocity of an unladen swallow?

Very tired, actually going to sleep maybe
Yes, the SAR is for search and rescue though I've been out of it a few years now
Probably huskies tbh but I think that's my vet showing
It's ok, Scotties be cool
African or European?

Smh everyone hates on huskies. Embracing the drama is way more fun.

Tut tuts those that don’t like drama.

What is the worst animal?

Geese. They’re mean and poop everywhere.

Shut the fuck up

Inimical. Has a prickly defense.

You’re a North American porcupine, and you are probably good.

SportPonies:

Spoiler: show

Note that I left out those that haven’t posted or if I missed their posts.

But I’ve solved a good majority of the game.

Everyone that’s good can get in my arc and we shall reside in love and peace and harmony

what am I? Get to work.

*playbows*

You’re a hippogriff, and you already have the most posts even though you hadn’t posted until 4 hours ago. So you’re probably just bad and mega posting because you’re trying to overcompensate for the fact that you’re not even real.

Sorry.

Creature:

Spoiler: show

Boy I am angry and exhausted

You sound like my father-in-law.

You are probably my father-in-law. He’s firmly 3P and keeps trying to offer me unprompted financial advice. As I’ve said before, Greg, we’re doing fine and my portfolio IS already diversified with foreign investments.

I’m sorry about your rand, Creature.

Also, I read all of this and understood nothing.

Is this a very crafty and unnecesarly complex way of posting fluff?

It's a reads list.

How seriously do you feel Scotty's reads actually are in these lists tho?

Kinda feels...I dunno, splish-splashy.

All filler, no killer if ya know what I mean

I do not like this post, especially in light of Scotty's flip. This is not antagonistic or provocative Falcon. This is just Falcon shading a player and undermining SVS' town read on Scotty.

Spoiler: show

Actually this is sort of hypocritical on review. Falcon votes me immediately after this. They’re tasking issue with my saying I’m uncomfortable with how fast the three votes seemed to pile onto Miranda, and not asking each of the voters for the reasons for their votes.

But then never asks me why I don’t like the wagon.

What’s worse here is I just noted that it was odd how many votes came on Miranda in rapid succession. But I didn’t use that as an opportunity to wolf read anyone or try to vote them out. Falcon here though did the exact same thing he accused me of doing and used it as an excuse to try and get me misyeeted.

That’s foundationally unsound.

You already said why you did not like the wagon, remember?

Now you're saying you found the speed of the wagon odd, before you clearly said you did not like it. So, is it strange, or is it scummy? There's a big difference.

You're also toning down the phrasing each time...first you say you don't like it, then uncomfortable, then odd. You keep scaling back how you feel about the wagon.

I see you still haven't followed up w/ any of the wagon voters. Duly noted.

First of all, no, I haven’t said why. I’ve said things about I don’t like but I haven’t stated my primary gripe with it.

Secondly, as part of my issue with the wagon, I originally said I felt like it was happening very quickly. Claiming I only just now have taken issue with the speed is a blatant lie and mischaracterization of reality.

Lastly I don’t need to follow up with the voters at this time. I don’t believe going to each one individually and asking them “why are you voting Miranda?” Like Oliver Twist asking for soup, will yield any relevant information from their catered and crafted answers. That’s not how I solve.

It’s furthermore counterintuitive for you to make such a big todo about how “WhY aReN’T yOu aSkiNg fOr tHeiR rEaSonS?!?!” When you yourself seem wholly uninterested in the reasons yourself.

I have a reason for not asking. But you, who based on your push of me it seems puts an ENORMOUS amount of value on asking people why they’re voting for someone is entirely uninterested in actually figuring out why people are voting for who they are. This is counterintuitive in a way that seems fairly scummy.

The lady doth protest too much, methinks.

I take this as an accusation that Zenge is suspicious for objecting too much to Falcon's initial pokes. I can see why Falcon might feel that way. Zenge is moving the goal posts a bit here. As I've said, it's not unreasonable for Falcon to have assumed that the entirety of Zenge's initial objection was the speed of the Miranda wagon. Zenge is only now (as far as their exchange goes) introducing new wrinkles to it. I do not think that needs to reflect poorly on Zenge. But I do think it undermines his argument against Falcon.

Spoiler: show

Yes, you’re clearly putting in the effort to actually have a conversation about this.

The fact that you didn’t ask what my primary gripe with the Miranda wagon actually is, is telling that you’re wholly uninterested in actually solving.

So, what is your gripe?

For the record, when someone says "I don't like this cuz of X", I will always assume that X is their primary reason.

When you say "I don't like this wagon, cuz it's happening too quickly" I assume you don't like the wagon, cuz it's happening too quickly.

When I asked you why you haven't followed up w/ any of the wagon voters, and get a whole lotta deflection w/ no real answers, well that doesn't really seem like you care to solve the wagon at all.

The irony of being told by a player who doesn't question players on a wagon he doesn't like that I'm not solving...

We are now going in circles. Day 1 noise.

Spoiler: show

@Zenge did you have an opinion about Miranda specifically, or Moreno the speed of the votes piling on her?

This issue I have with the Miranda wagon is that Miranda is by far the newest player on SDN in this game. Technically sure players like Dr.Wilgy have played fewer games on SDN but they have a lot more experience with forum mafia in general. Miranda on the other hand, I could count the number of games she’s played on one hand probably, maybe an extra finger? Thats games she’s played EVER.

I think it’s reasonable to assume there’s a mix of Syndicate and SDN players in the wolf pack. I think it’s reasonable to assume that one of the first conversations that would have taken place would be to formulate a list of players that would be the easiest to misyeet. From the SDN side, Miranda would have been the TOP of that list.

So when I see the first real cycle open, and within a half hour of a 48 hour cycle, there are already 3 votes on the player who I suspect would have been talked about in wolf chat as the best place to deliver a misyeet, it raises my suspicions and feels rather concerning.

I don’t have a read on Miranda. I honestly don’t believe anyone in this game could have a legitimate read on Miranda at this juncture.

Given that, I find it unlikely that by coincidence within the first half hour of a 48 hour cycle, that three villagers independently claim to have a wolf read on someone who just so happens to be the one player I think would be the most likely choice for wolves to try and misyeet.

So, what is your gripe?

For the record, when someone says "I don't like this cuz of X", I will always assume that X is their primary reason.

When you say "I don't like this wagon, cuz it's happening too quickly" I assume you don't like the wagon, cuz it's happening too quickly.

When I asked you why you haven't followed up w/ any of the wagon voters, and get a whole lotta deflection w/ no real answers, well that doesn't really seem like you care to solve the wagon at all.

The irony of being told by a player who doesn't question players on a wagon he doesn't like that I'm not solving...

I gave my response to why I don’t like the Miranda wagon to Marmot.

And I already told you previously that going to each of the Miranda voters and asking them “Why are you voting for Miranda” isn’t something I believe would yield fruit. It’s not how I solve the game. I was more interested it watching them to see how they behaved further. Asking them directly puts a spotlight on them and leads to them likely obfuscating their behavior. You’ve ruined that now.

Your entire argument against me here, is that “I’m not asking players on a wagon I don’t like about their votes.” Despite my telling you my reason for not asking, twice now.

So essentially your reason for wolf reading me and voting for me is that I’m not playing the game within the very ridged confines of how you think I should play the game. I’m not solving the way you think I should solve. Which is a terrible reason to wolf read someone. Everyone has different ways of solving and playing the game.

Lastly I didn’t appreciate your “doth protest too much comment”. It was unnecessarily antagonistic, and certainly not what I would expect from a legitimate villager looking to gather information and solve the game.

This is not a towny mindset

I do not understand this objection to Zenge's posts.

Spoiler: show

Literally saying that he suspects that Maf co-ordinated a wagon on LHF player, but also doesn't feel asking anybody on the wagon as to why would help solve anything.

Oh. I see. When it's phrased that way, I get it. I don't agree with that interpretation of Zenge's posts though.

Spoiler: show

OK, I'm done w/ Zenge for now. I feel he's intentionally bogging down discussion on a single topic, and so!

Moving on

Falcon announces his intention to move on from the Zenge argument. I am unclear on exactly how he feels about Zenge at this point.

Spoiler: show

@Dennis You've got yerself 2 votes bud. Do you have any guesses as to why?

Abigail,

It has been a trying night. My only comfort in those long hours was the knowledge that you were safely back at home.

Whilst I was in the depths of my despair, I had the most wonderful surprise!

As I am sure you must already be aware, mother has decided to come join me. I was worried she wouldn't recognize me. Time and distance have aged me nearly beyond recognition.

I could sense the trepidation in her face as she first looked upon me, and I must confess, the waters of my soul were near breaching the levees to my sanity when she at first seemed not to recognize my face. Alas, a mother's love does is not yet limited by spacial or temporal boundaries.

The wildlife here is wonderful, but I cannot shake the underlying sense of foreboding whenever I brave the wilderness. Abigail, I hear voices. I see visions.

Terrible visions.

Please keep me in your thoughts as you must know you are in mine.

-Mayo

PS Les voix disent bonjour à maman

Are these kind of posts normal for Mayo?

Falcon then directs a couple posts at/about Dennis and Mayo. Following through on his intention to move on.

Spoiler: show

ote=falcon45ca post_id=1041927 time=1681923008 user_id=813]

OK, I'm done w/ Zenge for now. I feel he's intentionally bogging down discussion on a single topic, and so!






Moving on

I don’t think so. Answer my question, Falcon.

Why do you believe that my trying to guess how wolves would approach the game, and then looking to see if anyone is doing what I expect wolves to do, isn’t a “Towny Mindset”?

Cuz' you don't follow up or question any of those players that are doing the exact thing you suspect wolves of doing
[/quote]

I understand Falcon's perspective here. Zenge frames his actions in a very favorable light/ Falcon does not. I don't think either of them are reading each other properly here. Falcon's objection is that Zenge didn't follow through on his objection to the Miranda wagon quickly enough. I don't care about that. But I get why it's a thing that Day 1 Falcon seized upon. Zenge's objection stems from his own perspective about his actions, and does not seem to take into account what Falcon is actually objecting to.

But now I'm running into a problem as I delve further into Falcon's ISO. Once we get beyond these early Day 1 spats, things drop off significantly. His feistiness gives way to generic prods and questions, and some surface level reads. To what extent flu medication is responsible for that is TBD.

Spoiler: show

Anyway, I find the split on whether falcon is playing out of character or not to be an interesting one. sloonei says no, neon says yes. Other Syndicats, what's your opinion?

For fear of raising the wrath of Zenge, I thought Falcon had some points.

I generally have a hard time reading Falcon; coming in here seeing him engage, I thought maybe I was getting a grip on his game. I thought he looked very civvie. And Sloonei i think was not so much defending Falcon as he was explaining someones Meta. I think he was trying to be helpful. I don't know that I think Sloonei would come in Day 1 to defend a teammate in that way, when he could easily be called out by people with more Falcon experience.

BUT Neon does read Falcon much better than I, so I need to see what she says.

I think Sloonei and Falcon are unlikely to be packmates anyhow but if Neon has a history of reading Falcon accurately than hmm

Why are you TR Neon? Are you sheeping other player's reads on her slot?

This prod of PSV has a little more life to it. But it's still not much.

Spoiler: show

For fear of raising the wrath of Zenge, I thought Falcon had some points.

I generally have a hard time reading Falcon; coming in here seeing him engage, I thought maybe I was getting a grip on his game. I thought he looked very civvie. And Sloonei i think was not so much defending Falcon as he was explaining someones Meta. I think he was trying to be helpful. I don't know that I think Sloonei would come in Day 1 to defend a teammate in that way, when he could easily be called out by people with more Falcon experience.

BUT Neon does read Falcon much better than I, so I need to see what she says.

I think Sloonei and Falcon are unlikely to be packmates anyhow but if Neon has a history of reading Falcon accurately than hmm

Why are you TR Neon? Are you sheeping other player's reads on her slot?

How are you reading Neon?

There's a feisty-ness to her tone in certain posts that I've come to associate w/ towny Neon

Who are you wolf reading other than me?

I actually feel a bit better about your slot...I've gotten into enough dust-ups w/ town before to know some of the signs, so


[VOTE: Nate] aubergine

It appears that Falcon came out of his scrape with Zenge with a town read. But I do have a concern here. Why did it take Falcon so long to announce that he had dropped his suspicion on Zenge? This post only came when he was directly pressed by Zenge to name a suspect. He also votes for Nate. I was initially uncertain about that, but Falcon's very next post has the answer:

Spoiler: show

@NateTheLesser Where did you go? You claimed Dennis was too serious D0, care to share w/ some quotes as to what led you to that conclusion?

This is fair.

Spoiler: show

Why are you TR Neon? Are you sheeping other player's reads on her slot?

Did I say I'm TRing Neon? SVS said Neon reads you better than SVS does, implying a decent read rate. And neon said you're acting weird. If Zenge is also saying you're scummy, then there's a common denominator.

It's implied you're TR Neon if you're looking for her take on my slot to inform your read, yes

I don't find this to be an accurate take.

Also, who said Falcon feels normal?

Oh? Do you normally ask players who you are SRing to inform your read on a slot?

I ask players who I am uncertain on to inform my reads on a slot.

Do you feel that's how PVS is approaching Neon w/ regards to my slot?

This is getting a bit more feisty. I like that at face value. But I'm not exactly following Falcon's point here.

Spoiler: show

@Seanzie It's reasonable to assume looking at the way PVS keeps referring back to Neon specifically, and the tone in general, that they're not SR her slot.

Or perhaps I'm wrong and PVS is trying to get a read on Neon based off their read on me? But it doesn't feel that way at all, it feels like PVS is TR Neon, or at the very least has her above null

I guess I kind of follow Falcon's reasoning here. PSV is using Neon's perspective to inform their own read on Falcon, but PSV is claiming to not have a town read on Neon. I don't think that necessarily needs to be a bad look for PSV. But I can see why Falcon would object.

Spoiler: show

[VOTE: NateTheLesser] aubergine

Why's that?

I got tired of the current wagon and wanted to move to someone else I felt was just standing around.

[VOTE: creature] aubergine

idk what specifically falcon and fry object to in this Creature post.

Spoiler: show

@potentialsheltervet What's your read on Neon right now?

Falcon seeks a direct answer to his PSV question. Cool.

Spoiler: show

@falcon45ca Do you have any comment about all the commotion surrounding your name in this game so far?

I feel it has bogged down discussion on a single topic, and it's also flattering to see my name so many times

Falcon does not seem interested in talking about the people who are talking about him. I don't love that.

Spoiler: show

@falcon45ca Do you have any comment about all the commotion surrounding your name in this game so far?

I feel it has bogged down discussion on a single topic, and it's also flattering to see my name so many times

Are there any topics you want to bring more attention to in the thread?

Where's @santygrass and where's @Kate ? I feel I saw them both early game, and they've totally dipped

I don't love this either. These are not names that Falcon has talked about much. He has pushed other things that are not receiving much attention in the thread at this point. He voted for Nate because of his handling of Dennis, for instance. He has been trying to raise a point about PSV's Neon read (though maybe he feels that one has received enough attention). "santy and Kate aren't here" isn't as substantive a take as I was hoping for when I prodded falcon here.

Spoiler: show

@falcon45ca Do you have any comment about all the commotion surrounding your name in this game so far?

I feel it has bogged down discussion on a single topic, and it's also flattering to see my name so many times

Are there any topics you want to bring more attention to in the thread?

What are you seeing in Marmot?

Delayed follow up to ask me about Marmot. I don't remember Falcon responding to me when I answered him.

Spoiler: show

@falcon45ca Do you have any comment about all the commotion surrounding your name in this game so far?

I feel it has bogged down discussion on a single topic, and it's also flattering to see my name so many times

Are there any topics you want to bring more attention to in the thread?

What are you seeing in Marmot?

I had a question about one single post he made, but he has not returned to the thread since I asked him about it.

So, a pressure vote more than a scum vote?

What's the post/question?

Oh he did respond. I guess I just didn't see it. But it's a nothing response where he downplays my vote and doesn't offer anything of his own.

Spoiler: show

I have played several games with Creature over the years, but he has played more games without me in them than with me. With that said, I have a vague notion that volume can be a somewhat reliable tell when reading him.

I agree, he gets pretty engaged as town and gives info on his reads. I'm not seeing that here

Falcon condones Creature suspicion. He has already voted for Creature, so this isn't news. But he supports the meta read I presented.

Spoiler: show

Marmot gave me weird feelings because it felt like all of their takes were unoriginal and just hopping on bandwagons

Which takes specifically?

@Marmot Hey, are you unoriginal and just jumping on bandwagons?

[VOTE: Marmot] aubergine

Falcon also asks Dennis about his Falcon suspicion. Falcon then prods Marmot and votes him. I'm not a big fan of the way this question is framed. It is deliberately playful and soft.

Spoiler: show

Let's talk about Scotty.

If you put in the energy to make a fancy flying banner, I imagine you've got something to say

Yes, I already said it but it went by without anyone noticing.

Scotty's reads list felt very uninspired to me, Pokemon name adaptions notwithstanding. His "suspects" were mostly just the people who have been the least involved, plus a couple token suspects that I would classify as "easy" (Dennis and pyxxy). When I called him out for it, he initially reacted defensively, but then turned a bit sheepish when I doubled down on the accusation. It was an uninspiring moment for Scottington.

Hmmmm...

Mostly this:

Pyxxytung - 42 posts
Pawmarmot - 28 posts, absent for 24+ hours
Bellosanty - 27 posts, absent for 24+ hours
Mirandreavus - 25 posts, labeled as "Low-hanging fruit" by SDN crowd
Dedennis - 62 posts, regular target of early suspicion in Sloonei's personal experience

And now you've added genny (6 posts) to this list.

Tell them to write more quality content

Can you provide (brief) reasons why you suspect them?

You’re gonna get some Lev 1 reasons bc D1 but sure

Townvibes:
Mightyena - well reasoned content
Seanzor - V I B E S
Nateran♂ - appreciated his take on the bizzarity of Zenge’s role fishing comment on D0
Creature - you know, he’s so despondent and uncaring it comes off as too wolf to be wolf
Falcorphish - I…don’t remember. I’m gonna remove him from here because I should remember
Seeloonei - you’re asking the right questions and getting the ball rolling. Don’t ask me what ‘the right questions are’. That’s the wrong question. Don’t push it.
SportPonyta - they made a comment about being death tunneled unfairly, and it gave me towny vibes.


Badvibes:
Pyxxytung - hedging for the sake of hedging in calling me not wolf but not town
Pawmarmot - not engaged. Marmot should be more engaged.
Bellosanty - for the memes but also content doesn’t thrill me
Mirandreavus - easy town read of me
Dedennis - defending pyxxy

This is odd, as I am quite famous this game & I find it incredulous that you'd just "forget" something related to reading my slot

Falcon sees my Scotty suspicion and piles on. I do not love it in light of Scotty's flip. But I don't think this is an unfair objection for Falcon to raise in the moment.

Spoiler: show

@DrWilgy Wherefore art thou?

Dead.

Have only read your ISO tbh. I think you are town and will sheep you until I can obtain more data to make a read.

Sheep me on Creature then


[VOTE: creature] aubergine

In spite of those Scotty objections, Falcon pivots back to Creature. Okay.

Spoiler: show

Scotty's reaction to receiving votes was lacking in a way that gives me pause. It felt like a civilian who is not invested enough to fight back.

Scotty's put in a fair amount of effort into the game to not be invested enough to fight back, don't ya think?

Then why aren't you voting for Scotty, Falcon?


------
This brings us to the end of Day 1, so I'm gonna hit submit here.

The tl;dr of all this is that I do not object to any of Falcon's early plays, but found that he dropped off as the phase went on. Not just in volume, but in conviction and direction. Early on he was making things happen. Later in the day, it felt like he was trying to grasp at things around him. I am not in love with the way he handled the Scotty and Creatre wagons. Falcon ended up on Creature, but spent multiple posts trying to talk me out of my doubts about my own Scotty case. @falcon45ca why that?

[Sloonei]

Actually I think this continues to be an example of Sloonei being super scummy in this.

Claiming that I’m Blinding attacking ANYONE who doesn’t agree with my Falcon read is a gross misrepresentation of the facts and reality.

Let me rephrase: You are responding to commentary around your Falcon read more defensively than is necessary. I do not believe there has been resistance to your push. I feel more like you have resisted people who talk to you about it (i.e. myself and santy.)

[Lawpy]

Actually I think this continues to be an example of Sloonei being super scummy in this.

Claiming that I’m Blinding attacking ANYONE who doesn’t agree with my Falcon read is a gross misrepresentation of the facts and reality.

Let me rephrase: You are responding to commentary around your Falcon read more defensively than is necessary. I do not believe there has been resistance to your push. I feel more like you have resisted people who talk to you about it (i.e. myself and santy.)

No there is a lot of resistance, with arguments essentially down to: “this is just falcons being falcons”. I don’t even understand why falcons is even being townread by some Syndicate players

[potentialsheltervet]

@Sloonei Gth, what is your read on falcon?

[Sloonei]

@Sloonei Gth, what is your read on falcon?

Mafia

[Lawpy]

Commencing Operation Appease Zenge. Here is a Falcon ISO.

Spoiler: show

I'm going to aggressively omgus until the game like actually starts

Do you feel there's nothing to be learned during D0?

Falcon is a pot stirrer. He says provocative things to put direct pressure on people. Here we see him getting a head start by doing that to Dennis.

Spoiler: show

Hey look a wolfy opportunistic 3rd vote on the lead wagon.

[VOTE: Miranda] aubergine

Where have I seen this before?

Implying that Miranda is town I see. How'd ya arrive at that conclusion?

Here he does the same thing, targeting Wilgy.

Spoiler: show

I do not like the Miranda wagon. This is happening too fast

Well, Wilgy's vote is quite clearly tongue in cheek...

After wilgy responds jokingly to Falcon's initial pressure, Falcon comments on Zenge commenting on the Miranda wagon. This is actually a more reasonable post than the previous two, and is not purely provocative.

Spoiler: show

I do not like the Miranda wagon. This is happening too fast

3 out of 24 votes is hardly anything to get worked up about especially with over 47 hours left.

It just felt like a lot piling onto one person in a very short amount of time

Well, I s'pose you could ask those voting Miranda as to their reasons...but you're not doing that.

Why?

This one is more provocative. This is the same thing Falcon did to Dennis and Wilgy earlier. He is casting a wide net, if nothing else.

Spoiler: show

[VOTE: zenge] aubergine

This one is followed up by a vote. Noted.

Spoiler: show

It just felt like a lot piling onto one person in a very short amount of time

Well, I s'pose you could ask those voting Miranda as to their reasons...but you're not doing that.

Why?

There’s 47 hours left

Why not solve now, especially if you find it suspicious?

What makes you think I’m not solving?

Oh, that's easy!

You called out a wagon for suspiciously developing too quickly, with no direct follow up with those responsible for the wagon, and when asked about why, you defelcted.

The first escalation of The Conflict. This is not out of bounds for Falcon's shtick. He is squeezing Zenge to see what comes out. Maybe a bit more tightly than Dennis or Wilgy before. But that is likely more to do with the way Zenge reacted than him being singled out or anything.

Spoiler: show

Santy trying to pocket like 9 players at once is a thing I guess

Another provocative statement, this time directed toward Santy.

Spoiler: show

Hi, I claim slank D1 cover.

I have ONE (1) read and that is Neon = Town and not much else

Have you played with Neon/Zenon a lot?

I have wolfed with them, played with them where I was Villa and them wolf, and played two games with both as Villa as far as I recall. If they keep up the good tone they are much more likely to be Villa and I think I'll be able to soulread them Villa


And ftr I think both games when we were both V/V we never found each other succesfully . Or if we did at some point it ended up rescinding. Comlex history, but I kinda think thats why they are one of the players I have better stored how they approach the game and what could be more indicative of a certain alignment

How would you describe Neon's scum approach to the game?

PSV is not currently a wolf

Here

What's informing all yer TRs, or are they just gut feels?

This is SDN meta, but Sportponies has knowledge of a secre PSV wolf tell that it has never failed yet, so the read of Sporty into PSV has weight tbh. Specially with PSV , they have a super good tone as wolf and its someone I can easily misread

Do you have a meta read on Sporty right now?

Some more back-and-forth with Santy. Falcon's tone is notably less antagonistic than with Zenge. But I can easily attribute that to Falcon matching the energy of those around him. He is still putting pressure on Santy here, his tone is just more reserved. I would also describe Santy's tone as more reserved than Zenge's.

Spoiler: show

It just felt like a lot piling onto one person in a very short amount of time

Well, I s'pose you could ask those voting Miranda as to their reasons...but you're not doing that.

Why?

Actually this is sort of hypocritical on review. Falcon votes me immediately after this. They’re tasking issue with my saying I’m uncomfortable with how fast the three votes seemed to pile onto Miranda, and not asking each of the voters for the reasons for their votes.

But then never asks me why I don’t like the wagon.

What’s worse here is I just noted that it was odd how many votes came on Miranda in rapid succession. But I didn’t use that as an opportunity to wolf read anyone or try to vote them out. Falcon here though did the exact same thing he accused me of doing and used it as an excuse to try and get me misyeeted.

That’s foundationally unsound.

You already said why you did not like the wagon, remember?

Now you're saying you found the speed of the wagon odd, before you clearly said you did not like it. So, is it strange, or is it scummy? There's a big difference.

You're also toning down the phrasing each time...first you say you don't like it, then uncomfortable, then odd. You keep scaling back how you feel about the wagon.

I see you still haven't followed up w/ any of the wagon voters. Duly noted.

Falcon and Zenge continue to butt heads. I do not agree with Zenge's interpretation of Falcon's actions. It is very reasonable for Falcon to assume that Zenge's initial objection to the Miranda wagon was the timing of it. In fact, I struggle to identify a different interpretation.

But Falcon's response is similarly nitpicky. "Is it strange or is it scummy?" is a reach. But that's still within Falcon's shtick here. This does not need to mean that Falcon is town. It just means that I am reading his words here as being intentionally provocative so as to get a strong reaction out of Zenge. Boy did he succeed at that.

Spoiler: show

We got more.

Genny:

Spoiler: show

Agreed, I miss react buttons *sad face*

Don’t you just love it when guests come over and complain about your decor?

I’m excited about all the options for ISOs that I will never do!

Caustic approach. Slightly pessimistic but thoughtful.
You are a crow, and definitely good.

potentialsheltervet:

Spoiler: show

Playing on a forum that doesn't censor profanity feels illegal. And empowering.

Is enriched and strengthened by profanity.

Very tired, actually going to sleep maybe
Yes, the SAR is for search and rescue though I've been out of it a few years now
Probably huskies tbh but I think that's my vet showing
It's ok, Scotties be cool
African or European?

Smh everyone hates on huskies. Embracing the drama is way more fun.

Tut tuts those that don’t like drama.

Geese. They’re mean and poop everywhere.

Shut the fuck up

Inimical. Has a prickly defense.

You’re a North American porcupine, and you are probably good.

SportPonies:

Spoiler: show

Note that I left out those that haven’t posted or if I missed their posts.

But I’ve solved a good majority of the game.

Everyone that’s good can get in my arc and we shall reside in love and peace and harmony

what am I? Get to work.

*playbows*

You’re a hippogriff, and you already have the most posts even though you hadn’t posted until 4 hours ago. So you’re probably just bad and mega posting because you’re trying to overcompensate for the fact that you’re not even real.

Sorry.

Creature:

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Boy I am angry and exhausted

You sound like my father-in-law.

You are probably my father-in-law. He’s firmly 3P and keeps trying to offer me unprompted financial advice. As I’ve said before, Greg, we’re doing fine and my portfolio IS already diversified with foreign investments.

I’m sorry about your rand, Creature.

Also, I read all of this and understood nothing.

Is this a very crafty and unnecesarly complex way of posting fluff?

It's a reads list.

How seriously do you feel Scotty's reads actually are in these lists tho?

Kinda feels...I dunno, splish-splashy.

All filler, no killer if ya know what I mean

I do not like this post, especially in light of Scotty's flip. This is not antagonistic or provocative Falcon. This is just Falcon shading a player and undermining SVS' town read on Scotty.

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Actually this is sort of hypocritical on review. Falcon votes me immediately after this. They’re tasking issue with my saying I’m uncomfortable with how fast the three votes seemed to pile onto Miranda, and not asking each of the voters for the reasons for their votes.

But then never asks me why I don’t like the wagon.

What’s worse here is I just noted that it was odd how many votes came on Miranda in rapid succession. But I didn’t use that as an opportunity to wolf read anyone or try to vote them out. Falcon here though did the exact same thing he accused me of doing and used it as an excuse to try and get me misyeeted.

That’s foundationally unsound.

You already said why you did not like the wagon, remember?

Now you're saying you found the speed of the wagon odd, before you clearly said you did not like it. So, is it strange, or is it scummy? There's a big difference.

You're also toning down the phrasing each time...first you say you don't like it, then uncomfortable, then odd. You keep scaling back how you feel about the wagon.

I see you still haven't followed up w/ any of the wagon voters. Duly noted.

First of all, no, I haven’t said why. I’ve said things about I don’t like but I haven’t stated my primary gripe with it.

Secondly, as part of my issue with the wagon, I originally said I felt like it was happening very quickly. Claiming I only just now have taken issue with the speed is a blatant lie and mischaracterization of reality.

Lastly I don’t need to follow up with the voters at this time. I don’t believe going to each one individually and asking them “why are you voting Miranda?” Like Oliver Twist asking for soup, will yield any relevant information from their catered and crafted answers. That’s not how I solve.

It’s furthermore counterintuitive for you to make such a big todo about how “WhY aReN’T yOu aSkiNg fOr tHeiR rEaSonS?!?!” When you yourself seem wholly uninterested in the reasons yourself.

I have a reason for not asking. But you, who based on your push of me it seems puts an ENORMOUS amount of value on asking people why they’re voting for someone is entirely uninterested in actually figuring out why people are voting for who they are. This is counterintuitive in a way that seems fairly scummy.

The lady doth protest too much, methinks.

I take this as an accusation that Zenge is suspicious for objecting too much to Falcon's initial pokes. I can see why Falcon might feel that way. Zenge is moving the goal posts a bit here. As I've said, it's not unreasonable for Falcon to have assumed that the entirety of Zenge's initial objection was the speed of the Miranda wagon. Zenge is only now (as far as their exchange goes) introducing new wrinkles to it. I do not think that needs to reflect poorly on Zenge. But I do think it undermines his argument against Falcon.

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Yes, you’re clearly putting in the effort to actually have a conversation about this.

The fact that you didn’t ask what my primary gripe with the Miranda wagon actually is, is telling that you’re wholly uninterested in actually solving.

So, what is your gripe?

For the record, when someone says "I don't like this cuz of X", I will always assume that X is their primary reason.

When you say "I don't like this wagon, cuz it's happening too quickly" I assume you don't like the wagon, cuz it's happening too quickly.

When I asked you why you haven't followed up w/ any of the wagon voters, and get a whole lotta deflection w/ no real answers, well that doesn't really seem like you care to solve the wagon at all.

The irony of being told by a player who doesn't question players on a wagon he doesn't like that I'm not solving...

We are now going in circles. Day 1 noise.

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@Zenge did you have an opinion about Miranda specifically, or Moreno the speed of the votes piling on her?

This issue I have with the Miranda wagon is that Miranda is by far the newest player on SDN in this game. Technically sure players like Dr.Wilgy have played fewer games on SDN but they have a lot more experience with forum mafia in general. Miranda on the other hand, I could count the number of games she’s played on one hand probably, maybe an extra finger? Thats games she’s played EVER.

I think it’s reasonable to assume there’s a mix of Syndicate and SDN players in the wolf pack. I think it’s reasonable to assume that one of the first conversations that would have taken place would be to formulate a list of players that would be the easiest to misyeet. From the SDN side, Miranda would have been the TOP of that list.

So when I see the first real cycle open, and within a half hour of a 48 hour cycle, there are already 3 votes on the player who I suspect would have been talked about in wolf chat as the best place to deliver a misyeet, it raises my suspicions and feels rather concerning.

I don’t have a read on Miranda. I honestly don’t believe anyone in this game could have a legitimate read on Miranda at this juncture.

Given that, I find it unlikely that by coincidence within the first half hour of a 48 hour cycle, that three villagers independently claim to have a wolf read on someone who just so happens to be the one player I think would be the most likely choice for wolves to try and misyeet.

So, what is your gripe?

For the record, when someone says "I don't like this cuz of X", I will always assume that X is their primary reason.

When you say "I don't like this wagon, cuz it's happening too quickly" I assume you don't like the wagon, cuz it's happening too quickly.

When I asked you why you haven't followed up w/ any of the wagon voters, and get a whole lotta deflection w/ no real answers, well that doesn't really seem like you care to solve the wagon at all.

The irony of being told by a player who doesn't question players on a wagon he doesn't like that I'm not solving...

I gave my response to why I don’t like the Miranda wagon to Marmot.

And I already told you previously that going to each of the Miranda voters and asking them “Why are you voting for Miranda” isn’t something I believe would yield fruit. It’s not how I solve the game. I was more interested it watching them to see how they behaved further. Asking them directly puts a spotlight on them and leads to them likely obfuscating their behavior. You’ve ruined that now.

Your entire argument against me here, is that “I’m not asking players on a wagon I don’t like about their votes.” Despite my telling you my reason for not asking, twice now.

So essentially your reason for wolf reading me and voting for me is that I’m not playing the game within the very ridged confines of how you think I should play the game. I’m not solving the way you think I should solve. Which is a terrible reason to wolf read someone. Everyone has different ways of solving and playing the game.

Lastly I didn’t appreciate your “doth protest too much comment”. It was unnecessarily antagonistic, and certainly not what I would expect from a legitimate villager looking to gather information and solve the game.

This is not a towny mindset

I do not understand this objection to Zenge's posts.

Spoiler: show

Literally saying that he suspects that Maf co-ordinated a wagon on LHF player, but also doesn't feel asking anybody on the wagon as to why would help solve anything.

Oh. I see. When it's phrased that way, I get it. I don't agree with that interpretation of Zenge's posts though.

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OK, I'm done w/ Zenge for now. I feel he's intentionally bogging down discussion on a single topic, and so!

Moving on

Falcon announces his intention to move on from the Zenge argument. I am unclear on exactly how he feels about Zenge at this point.

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@Dennis You've got yerself 2 votes bud. Do you have any guesses as to why?

Abigail,

It has been a trying night. My only comfort in those long hours was the knowledge that you were safely back at home.

Whilst I was in the depths of my despair, I had the most wonderful surprise!

As I am sure you must already be aware, mother has decided to come join me. I was worried she wouldn't recognize me. Time and distance have aged me nearly beyond recognition.

I could sense the trepidation in her face as she first looked upon me, and I must confess, the waters of my soul were near breaching the levees to my sanity when she at first seemed not to recognize my face. Alas, a mother's love does is not yet limited by spacial or temporal boundaries.

The wildlife here is wonderful, but I cannot shake the underlying sense of foreboding whenever I brave the wilderness. Abigail, I hear voices. I see visions.

Terrible visions.

Please keep me in your thoughts as you must know you are in mine.

-Mayo

PS Les voix disent bonjour à maman

Are these kind of posts normal for Mayo?

Falcon then directs a couple posts at/about Dennis and Mayo. Following through on his intention to move on.

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ote=falcon45ca post_id=1041927 time=1681923008 user_id=813]

OK, I'm done w/ Zenge for now. I feel he's intentionally bogging down discussion on a single topic, and so!






Moving on

I don’t think so. Answer my question, Falcon.

Why do you believe that my trying to guess how wolves would approach the game, and then looking to see if anyone is doing what I expect wolves to do, isn’t a “Towny Mindset”?

Cuz' you don't follow up or question any of those players that are doing the exact thing you suspect wolves of doing

I understand Falcon's perspective here. Zenge frames his actions in a very favorable light/ Falcon does not. I don't think either of them are reading each other properly here. Falcon's objection is that Zenge didn't follow through on his objection to the Miranda wagon quickly enough. I don't care about that. But I get why it's a thing that Day 1 Falcon seized upon. Zenge's objection stems from his own perspective about his actions, and does not seem to take into account what Falcon is actually objecting to.

But now I'm running into a problem as I delve further into Falcon's ISO. Once we get beyond these early Day 1 spats, things drop off significantly. His feistiness gives way to generic prods and questions, and some surface level reads. To what extent flu medication is responsible for that is TBD.

Spoiler: show

Anyway, I find the split on whether falcon is playing out of character or not to be an interesting one. sloonei says no, neon says yes. Other Syndicats, what's your opinion?

For fear of raising the wrath of Zenge, I thought Falcon had some points.

I generally have a hard time reading Falcon; coming in here seeing him engage, I thought maybe I was getting a grip on his game. I thought he looked very civvie. And Sloonei i think was not so much defending Falcon as he was explaining someones Meta. I think he was trying to be helpful. I don't know that I think Sloonei would come in Day 1 to defend a teammate in that way, when he could easily be called out by people with more Falcon experience.

BUT Neon does read Falcon much better than I, so I need to see what she says.

I think Sloonei and Falcon are unlikely to be packmates anyhow but if Neon has a history of reading Falcon accurately than hmm

Why are you TR Neon? Are you sheeping other player's reads on her slot?

This prod of PSV has a little more life to it. But it's still not much.

Spoiler: show

I think Sloonei and Falcon are unlikely to be packmates anyhow but if Neon has a history of reading Falcon accurately than hmm

Why are you TR Neon? Are you sheeping other player's reads on her slot?

How are you reading Neon?

There's a feisty-ness to her tone in certain posts that I've come to associate w/ towny Neon

Who are you wolf reading other than me?

I actually feel a bit better about your slot...I've gotten into enough dust-ups w/ town before to know some of the signs, so


[VOTE: Nate] aubergine

It appears that Falcon came out of his scrape with Zenge with a town read. But I do have a concern here. Why did it take Falcon so long to announce that he had dropped his suspicion on Zenge? This post only came when he was directly pressed by Zenge to name a suspect. He also votes for Nate. I was initially uncertain about that, but Falcon's very next post has the answer:

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@NateTheLesser Where did you go? You claimed Dennis was too serious D0, care to share w/ some quotes as to what led you to that conclusion?

This is fair.

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Did I say I'm TRing Neon? SVS said Neon reads you better than SVS does, implying a decent read rate. And neon said you're acting weird. If Zenge is also saying you're scummy, then there's a common denominator.

It's implied you're TR Neon if you're looking for her take on my slot to inform your read, yes

I don't find this to be an accurate take.

Also, who said Falcon feels normal?

Oh? Do you normally ask players who you are SRing to inform your read on a slot?

I ask players who I am uncertain on to inform my reads on a slot.

Do you feel that's how PVS is approaching Neon w/ regards to my slot?

This is getting a bit more feisty. I like that at face value. But I'm not exactly following Falcon's point here.

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@Seanzie It's reasonable to assume looking at the way PVS keeps referring back to Neon specifically, and the tone in general, that they're not SR her slot.

Or perhaps I'm wrong and PVS is trying to get a read on Neon based off their read on me? But it doesn't feel that way at all, it feels like PVS is TR Neon, or at the very least has her above null

I guess I kind of follow Falcon's reasoning here. PSV is using Neon's perspective to inform their own read on Falcon, but PSV is claiming to not have a town read on Neon. I don't think that necessarily needs to be a bad look for PSV. But I can see why Falcon would object.

Spoiler: show

[VOTE: NateTheLesser] aubergine

Why's that?

I got tired of the current wagon and wanted to move to someone else I felt was just standing around.

[VOTE: creature] aubergine

idk what specifically falcon and fry object to in this Creature post.

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@potentialsheltervet What's your read on Neon right now?

Falcon seeks a direct answer to his PSV question. Cool.

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@falcon45ca Do you have any comment about all the commotion surrounding your name in this game so far?

I feel it has bogged down discussion on a single topic, and it's also flattering to see my name so many times

Falcon does not seem interested in talking about the people who are talking about him. I don't love that.

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@falcon45ca Do you have any comment about all the commotion surrounding your name in this game so far?

I feel it has bogged down discussion on a single topic, and it's also flattering to see my name so many times

Are there any topics you want to bring more attention to in the thread?

Where's @santygrass and where's @Kate ? I feel I saw them both early game, and they've totally dipped

I don't love this either. These are not names that Falcon has talked about much. He has pushed other things that are not receiving much attention in the thread at this point. He voted for Nate because of his handling of Dennis, for instance. He has been trying to raise a point about PSV's Neon read (though maybe he feels that one has received enough attention). "santy and Kate aren't here" isn't as substantive a take as I was hoping for when I prodded falcon here.

Spoiler: show

@falcon45ca Do you have any comment about all the commotion surrounding your name in this game so far?

I feel it has bogged down discussion on a single topic, and it's also flattering to see my name so many times

Are there any topics you want to bring more attention to in the thread?

What are you seeing in Marmot?

Delayed follow up to ask me about Marmot. I don't remember Falcon responding to me when I answered him.

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@falcon45ca Do you have any comment about all the commotion surrounding your name in this game so far?

I feel it has bogged down discussion on a single topic, and it's also flattering to see my name so many times

Are there any topics you want to bring more attention to in the thread?

What are you seeing in Marmot?

I had a question about one single post he made, but he has not returned to the thread since I asked him about it.

So, a pressure vote more than a scum vote?

What's the post/question?

Oh he did respond. I guess I just didn't see it. But it's a nothing response where he downplays my vote and doesn't offer anything of his own.

Spoiler: show

I have played several games with Creature over the years, but he has played more games without me in them than with me. With that said, I have a vague notion that volume can be a somewhat reliable tell when reading him.

I agree, he gets pretty engaged as town and gives info on his reads. I'm not seeing that here

Falcon condones Creature suspicion. He has already voted for Creature, so this isn't news. But he supports the meta read I presented.

Spoiler: show

Marmot gave me weird feelings because it felt like all of their takes were unoriginal and just hopping on bandwagons

Which takes specifically?

@Marmot Hey, are you unoriginal and just jumping on bandwagons?

[VOTE: Marmot] aubergine

Falcon also asks Dennis about his Falcon suspicion. Falcon then prods Marmot and votes him. I'm not a big fan of the way this question is framed. It is deliberately playful and soft.

Spoiler: show

Let's talk about Scotty.

If you put in the energy to make a fancy flying banner, I imagine you've got something to say

Yes, I already said it but it went by without anyone noticing.

Scotty's reads list felt very uninspired to me, Pokemon name adaptions notwithstanding. His "suspects" were mostly just the people who have been the least involved, plus a couple token suspects that I would classify as "easy" (Dennis and pyxxy). When I called him out for it, he initially reacted defensively, but then turned a bit sheepish when I doubled down on the accusation. It was an uninspiring moment for Scottington.

Hmmmm...

Mostly this:

Pyxxytung - 42 posts
Pawmarmot - 28 posts, absent for 24+ hours
Bellosanty - 27 posts, absent for 24+ hours
Mirandreavus - 25 posts, labeled as "Low-hanging fruit" by SDN crowd
Dedennis - 62 posts, regular target of early suspicion in Sloonei's personal experience

And now you've added genny (6 posts) to this list.

Tell them to write more quality content

Can you provide (brief) reasons why you suspect them?

You’re gonna get some Lev 1 reasons bc D1 but sure

Townvibes:
Mightyena - well reasoned content
Seanzor - V I B E S
Nateran♂ - appreciated his take on the bizzarity of Zenge’s role fishing comment on D0
Creature - you know, he’s so despondent and uncaring it comes off as too wolf to be wolf
Falcorphish - I…don’t remember. I’m gonna remove him from here because I should remember
Seeloonei - you’re asking the right questions and getting the ball rolling. Don’t ask me what ‘the right questions are’. That’s the wrong question. Don’t push it.
SportPonyta - they made a comment about being death tunneled unfairly, and it gave me towny vibes.


Badvibes:
Pyxxytung - hedging for the sake of hedging in calling me not wolf but not town
Pawmarmot - not engaged. Marmot should be more engaged.
Bellosanty - for the memes but also content doesn’t thrill me
Mirandreavus - easy town read of me
Dedennis - defending pyxxy

This is odd, as I am quite famous this game & I find it incredulous that you'd just "forget" something related to reading my slot

Falcon sees my Scotty suspicion and piles on. I do not love it in light of Scotty's flip. But I don't think this is an unfair objection for Falcon to raise in the moment.

Spoiler: show

@DrWilgy Wherefore art thou?

Dead.

Have only read your ISO tbh. I think you are town and will sheep you until I can obtain more data to make a read.

Sheep me on Creature then


[VOTE: creature] aubergine

In spite of those Scotty objections, Falcon pivots back to Creature. Okay.

Spoiler: show

Scotty's reaction to receiving votes was lacking in a way that gives me pause. It felt like a civilian who is not invested enough to fight back.

Scotty's put in a fair amount of effort into the game to not be invested enough to fight back, don't ya think?

Then why aren't you voting for Scotty, Falcon?


------
This brings us to the end of Day 1, so I'm gonna hit submit here.

The tl;dr of all this is that I do not object to any of Falcon's early plays, but found that he dropped off as the phase went on. Not just in volume, but in conviction and direction. Early on he was making things happen. Later in the day, it felt like he was trying to grasp at things around him. I am not in love with the way he handled the Scotty and Creatre wagons. Falcon ended up on Creature, but spent multiple posts trying to talk me out of my doubts about my own Scotty case. @falcon45ca why that?
[/quote]

Now i am even more confused by your reaction to zenges push on falcons

[Lawpy]

Yikes massive quote fail