The Syndicate

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Tue May 25, 2021 1:05 am

Gavial wrote: ↑Tue May 25, 2021 1:05 am Why TF is Hawk not being lynched?

Why should she be?

What do you think of bad bunny, Belzy, and Actvscenei?

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Tue May 25, 2021 1:05 am

Gavial wrote: ↑Tue May 25, 2021 1:05 am Why TF is Hawk not being lynched?

Why should she be?

What do you think of bad bunny, Belzy, and Actvscenei?

Dana wrote: ↑Tue May 25, 2021 1:04 am

Gavial wrote: ↑Tue May 25, 2021 1:03 am

Guillotine wrote: ↑Mon May 24, 2021 10:29 pm We chop between Belzy and Owner if they dont show up. Also Garden Gnome if they dont begin to contribute more, this will not be the game i lose to lurkers. No chance in hell.

No we vote Hawk.
@hawkataine
Tell me.
Did you receive any night result?

how would she receive a result if she didn't target anyone?

Guillotine wrote: ↑Mon May 24, 2021 10:29 pm We chop between Belzy and Owner if they dont show up. Also Garden Gnome if they dont begin to contribute more, this will not be the game i lose to lurkers. No chance in hell.

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Mon May 24, 2021 9:32 pm This is why folks hate nested quotes.

Let's use mentions or add spoilers for huge ones please and thanks my friends.

Sonny wrote: ↑Mon May 24, 2021 9:28 pm

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Mon May 24, 2021 4:11 pm Quality trolling from nutella, but it might have cleared people. I don't care about wifom. Long Con town from that, anyone?

Town from what?

Guillotine wrote: ↑Mon May 24, 2021 9:24 pm

Gavial wrote: ↑Mon May 24, 2021 8:58 pm

Guillotine wrote: ↑Mon May 24, 2021 8:53 pm

Sloonei wrote: ↑Mon May 24, 2021 8:11 pm nutella continues talking to people

Spoiler: show

Spoiler: show

nutella wrote: ↑Sat May 22, 2021 3:59 am [VOTE: lost monkey] aubergine

you seem to be in neutral commentary mode, let's see some reads

Beep boop vote for lost monkey. Meh. This could very easily be a teammate prod. It could just as easily be an easy observation to direct toward a low key civilian.

Spoiler: show

nutella wrote: ↑Sat May 22, 2021 4:05 am Strong town
Jay
Sonny
Guillo
Tangy

Town leans
Gnome
Alison
Martin I guess sheeping alison
Dana
Mac
Sloonei
Hawk? Liked their style
Act maybe at this point

Gav Nook LC are more tbd
Dont remember anyone else

Going to sleep for like 12 hours gl

Juicy. A reads list. Sonny gets places in the "Strong Town" pile after appearing only once previously in this ISO, when nutella simply agreed with someone else's town read on them. I am inclined to say that's a good look for Sonny: sometimes mafia members will effortlessly adopt firm town reads on town players that are not suspected by anyone because there's no sense in pushing on them. I don't feel like nutella would place her teammate on such a high pedestal out of the blue like this.

Intriguing town leans: Gnome, Martin, Dana, Hawk, Act. Both Hawk and Act get slight quibbles, which is something I could see nutella attaching to a teammate. Martin also gets a caveat about sheeping Alison, but that's not as much of a concern. If Alison is town and nutella has assigned town-read status to her, she is almost forced to also assign a town-read to Martin.
Dana and Mac both came up a little bit earlier on in this ISO but with no firm conclusions. I have no immediate concerns about them here. I would not be surprised if there is at least one teammate in nutella's "town leans" pile.
Gavial, nanook, and Long Con all get suspicion hurled at them for no stated reason. Noted. I don't remember any notable mentions of or interactions with LC prior to this.

Spoiler: show

nutella wrote: ↑Sat May 22, 2021 4:08 pm

Alison wrote: ↑Sat May 22, 2021 4:03 pm I think Act's posting has improved in recent times. I'm willing to give her some space and see how she uses it.

I liked her dismissive response to you asking for a read list tbh

Noting that nutella has now substantiated a town read on Act. Coolio.

Spoiler: show

nutella wrote: ↑Sat May 22, 2021 4:14 pm Alison what do you think about lost monkey?

Prompts Alison to talk about lost monkey. Inclined to call that a good look for our monkey friend.

Spoiler: show

nutella wrote: ↑Sat May 22, 2021 4:25 pm

lost monkey wrote: ↑Sat May 22, 2021 1:56 am

Tangrowth wrote: ↑Fri May 21, 2021 4:58 pm

Hi!

To the PerC people and/or anyone else who wants to answer:

1) what do you think you bring to a game when you're town?
2) what do you hope to accomplish this game?

1. My town reads.
2. Win with town.

lost monkey wrote: ↑Sat May 22, 2021 2:09 am

Sonny wrote: ↑Sat May 22, 2021 2:01 am Finding someone genuine?


Unrelated, screw nested quotes. Really.

yeah lol

lost monkey wrote: ↑Sat May 22, 2021 3:17 am

nutella wrote: ↑Fri May 21, 2021 8:11 pm Not really the only reason no I just sort of generally toneread you as wolfy/found your approach disingenuous, starting with the dana read (bc again I'm a defender of hedginess and didn't see it your way). But as you've posted more it seems like that's just your style and you are poking in various places and have solvey intentions. I could move off you but don't know where

You could just unvote? There is no compulsion that a person needs to be voted. This I could move off you but don't know where stuff I don't buy it and seems fake. Leaning scum here.

lost monkey wrote: ↑Sat May 22, 2021 3:29 am Allison like an evolved form of alana lol.

lost monkey wrote: ↑Sat May 22, 2021 3:45 am

Owner of a Lonely Heart wrote: ↑Sat May 22, 2021 12:33 am

Hi Tangy. This may be one of my final mafia games I play. I have been considering retirement. Not, to rain on the date though, I just feel as though I can't mod how I want to mod anymore, which is my main appeal to the game in the recent years.

Owner you should try modding games here owner. Some of the setup i have seen here are right up your alley.

lost monkey wrote: ↑Sat May 22, 2021 2:28 pm

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Sat May 22, 2021 2:20 pm



It'd be super to know what made you feel this way, and what playing a game before this one did to change your perspective.

The playstyles are mainly the reason if I have to say. Certain things which you guys see as townie are not seen as townie thing over there. Now lets take act what you guys saw stilted and acting scummie from act we consider as something normal from her. This is her playstyle this is how she plays regardless of alignment. Similarly to what you felt with gnome. I felt the same way when I saw syn, mac play. Dana coming in and saying i am nervous and stuff if i didnt see others play last game even i would have felt it was scummie.

Like my impression is most of LM's posts are comments on things that don't actually have bearing on the game itself, there's a couple like the discussion of act's style that could come close to giving a read but avoid actually doing so. There's a hint of a scumread on me, and some interaction with Jay and that's it. I feel like they're hesitant to actually get into the meat of the game.

Okay. By far the most substantial post in the first 24 hours of the game from nutella is a mini-case against lost monkey. That is a good look. This feels much more like "I have identified my Day 1 target and will begin pushing them here" rather than "I better start shading my partner."

Spoiler: show

nutella wrote: ↑Sat May 22, 2021 4:31 pm I thought Owner was sort of off-topic/not into the game yet in a more similar way to Gnome (which I found townier than LM's borderline approach)

By contrast, here's a not-good look for Owner. And maybe a good look for Gnome? Owner starts to receive some heat, and nutella comes to her defense promptly, and cites another player (Gnome) whose style Owner is reminiscent of. It's possible that Gnome is town and nutella chose this particular association (Owner -> Gnome) so that the towny goodness of Gnome could be transmitted to Owner in turn. The unprompted dig at lost monkey is also another good look for them, and gives this post an air of slight anxiety: nutella wants attention on monkey and off of Owner.

Spoiler: show

nutella wrote: ↑Sat May 22, 2021 8:55 pm ......kito? wat why

This is in response to Guillo placing Kito in their list of Top 3 town reads. It's an easy question to ask. It might be easier if Kito really is town. But it's still easy even if Kito is nutella's partner. Meh.

Spoiler: show

nutella wrote: ↑Sat May 22, 2021 9:30 pm

Sonny wrote: ↑Sat May 22, 2021 9:19 pm Funny thing, when I woke up one of my first thoughts was I bet LoMo would be leading the votes and lol, here it is, should be fun to catch up. 2 is meh, but it tickles me that I saw that one coming.

do you have a read there?

Unless lost monkey specifically requested to be bussed Day 1, this is too aggressive to be distancing. I don't think that is likely.

Spoiler: show

nutella wrote: ↑Sun May 23, 2021 12:05 am Meh talk to me about belzy i dont have a good handle there

After several posts going back and forth with Guillo (town), nutella asks for some talk about Belzy. This is Belzy's first appearance in nutella's ISO. Neat.

Spoiler: show

nutella wrote: ↑Sun May 23, 2021 12:44 am

Owner of a Lonely Heart wrote: ↑Sun May 23, 2021 12:33 am @Alison So my comment about nutella's first post feels similar to the interesting tell. "Upgaymers" feels like a filler word. In a previous game on here I picked out Sloonei saying "spicy", which apparently people on here and MU both use. I'm trying to keep an open mind that it could very well be a community clash. But at the same time, it feels like it is something that wouldn't necessarily be said. I don't know if it could be too scummy to be scum or if the context of it is just this site players that commonly use words I'm not use to, which typing them feels of note, as it is uncommon for me to see it in game. But for me, it feels off. It's not directly aligned with a specific tell though.

wait this is the funniest thing ive ever seen

Does this read from Owner exist if they are partners? It was a bit goofy from the beginning. I don't know Owner well enough to say whether or not she would produce this read on her teammate. Nutella's response is nothing.

Spoiler: show

nutella wrote: ↑Sun May 23, 2021 1:16 am

Owner of a Lonely Heart wrote: ↑Sun May 23, 2021 1:06 am

Tangrowth wrote: ↑Fri May 21, 2021 4:54 pm How does one catch Alison as scum anyway? This is not a rhetorical question.

I don't know. I think you need to explain her playstyle or look for patterns in her playstyle over time.

Huh

Why does this post exist

Why does this post exist?

Spoiler: show

nutella wrote: ↑Sun May 23, 2021 1:18 am

Owner of a Lonely Heart wrote: ↑Sun May 23, 2021 1:16 am

Alison wrote: ↑Sun May 23, 2021 1:12 am

I really hate this AtE.

[VOTE: Owner] aubergine

It's not AtE. It's I see 4 votes on lomo that look steady or have been there for a period of time. Generally like 4 or 5 votes on someone is like there is probably scum in that wagon. Or it could mean like a cop check or something, but generally day 1 a wagon that size and potentially unmoving is kind of meh for me.

So from that point of view, I think he might be town, but I have yet to read his posts, so I don't know yet.

lalala dadv isnt real it cant hurt me

Owner objects to the monkey wagon, and nutella playfully shoots her objection down. Meh. I can go either way on this.

Spoiler: show

nutella wrote: ↑Sun May 23, 2021 1:23 am

Alison wrote: ↑Sun May 23, 2021 1:20 am

Owner of a Lonely Heart wrote: ↑Sun May 23, 2021 1:16 am

It's not AtE. It's I see 4 votes on lomo that look steady or have been there for a period of time. Generally like 4 or 5 votes on someone is like there is probably scum in that wagon. Or it could mean like a cop check or something, but generally day 1 a wagon that size and potentially unmoving is kind of meh for me.

So from that point of view, I think he might be town, but I have yet to read his posts, so I don't know yet.

"PerC players are being wagoned by unwelcoming Syndicate players" -> "This specific wagon on a PerC player is probably scum-driven because of its static nature" doesn't connect. If you don't like the LoMo wagon because there's no resistance, say so. Framing it as a PerC vs Syndicate thing reads as fishing for an appeal to emotion, and doesn't really make sense if your primary concern was the size and fluidity of the wagon. It does make sense if you have TMI on LoMo so I'm very happy to vote you.

mmmm spicy

At the very least, nutella is no longer uncomfortable with people talking about Owner. I still don't know if anything here suggests that they are not compatible though.
The way nutella is handling Alison looks very good for her.

Spoiler: show

nutella wrote: ↑Sun May 23, 2021 1:40 am Like mafia mac or nook could be pushing me because I'm not literally the top poster and they think they can look good for not just admitting I'm obv town already

nutella wrote: ↑Sun May 23, 2021 1:40 am But I'm not afraid of mac staying on me for more than like five minutes regardless of his alignment

I think nanook is just town here. I am more iffy on Mac, but this second post feels like it's meant to be a playful taunt to disarm Mac slightly. That would be a good indicator for him.

Spoiler: show

nutella wrote: ↑Sun May 23, 2021 1:43 am

Alison wrote: ↑Sun May 23, 2021 1:37 am I feel like town nutella would be fiercer and less deflective here.

I'm torn about whether to vote Owner or nutella.

The people voting for me are mac, nanook, and guillo

I'm not concerned lol

I have deemed this response to be Fake. Nutella is concerned. She is concerned because all three of these people are town and their votes are Legit.

Spoiler: show

nutella wrote: ↑Sun May 23, 2021 1:49 am

Owner of a Lonely Heart wrote: ↑Sun May 23, 2021 1:44 am

Tangrowth wrote: ↑Fri May 21, 2021 4:58 pm
Hi!

To the PerC people and/or anyone else who wants to answer:

1) what do you think you bring to a game when you're town?
2) what do you hope to accomplish this game?

[VOTE: Tangy] aubergine Same reasons as voting for Sloonei...it's a tell. This questionnaire feels more agenda based than Sloonei's did. It feels like you are really looking to see where everyone is at. It's like you are specifically fishing for something. There is a motive behind this.

It kind of looks like you are trying to be on good graces, but to me it feels like you are searching for reasons to keep or not keep someone in the game. It is troublesome.

hmm

going for the big fish here eh

Not feisty enough.

Spoiler: show

nutella wrote: ↑Sun May 23, 2021 1:55 am

Sonny wrote: ↑Sun May 23, 2021 1:47 am

nutella wrote: ↑Sun May 23, 2021 1:43 am

The people voting for me are mac, nanook, and guillo

I'm not concerned lol

Why do the people voting you matter here?

for mac see my last post, for nanook and guillo basically I always expect us to suspect each other

It's always town in sonnydelphia.

Spoiler: show

nutella wrote: ↑Sun May 23, 2021 2:07 am

Owner of a Lonely Heart wrote: ↑Sun May 23, 2021 2:01 am

MacDougall wrote: ↑Sun May 23, 2021 1:56 am

got anything to say about nutellagate?

What's a nutellagate? Is is a gate made of nutella? I feel that's too on the nose to be it. They are there. I don't recall their playstyle. I feel like I should know more about their music tastes from all the walrus' we've been in together.

They are an elephant in this room, but I don't feel like they are the loudest or most memorable one here.

[VOTE: owner] aubergine

say something game related or die

Owner's response to the prompt for a comment about nutella looks super uncomfortable. Nutella responds by prodding her to say something more substantive. That could easily be A Teammate prodding Another to lean into the distancing act, rather than avoiding it. In fact, I might be inclined to say that it is. If Owner is town, she is at least passively resisting the wagon on nutella. Why does Mafia Nutella respond to that by calling Town Owner out like this?

Spoiler: show

nutella wrote: ↑Sun May 23, 2021 2:10 am

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Sun May 23, 2021 2:03 am I'm not sure I've seen this version of nutella before, with this sort of flippant reception of suspicion/votes. Wack. I'm just gonna stare at these a while and let my brain sort:

nutella wrote: ↑Sat May 22, 2021 4:05 am Strong town
Jay
Sonny
Guillo
Tangy

Spoiler: show

Town leans
Gnome
Alison
Martin I guess sheeping alison
Dana
Mac
Sloonei
Hawk? Liked their style
Act maybe at this point

Gav Nook LC are more tbd
Dont remember anyone else

Going to sleep for like 12 hours gl

Oh I did put mac on that list huh. Must have felt stronger at the time, when i was comparing tangy's gth reads to my own mac was one of the harder ones

Both Jay and Mac are town here. Jay read super 100% confident, though I was already there before. But since this is easy to substantiate, I'll articulate it here in case anyone is still on the fence and somehow reading all of this: nutella is very much caught off guard by Jay digging this list up and waving it in front of her to highlight the contradictory nature of her handling of Mac at the present compared to a few hours earlier. Jay has caught nutella in an inconsistency. Nutella is flustered. They are never teammates in this exchange.

Spoiler: show

nutella wrote: ↑Sun May 23, 2021 2:16 am

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Sun May 23, 2021 2:10 am

nutella wrote: ↑Sun May 23, 2021 2:10 am Oh I did put mac on that list huh. Must have felt stronger at the time, when i was comparing tangy's gth reads to my own mac was one of the harder ones

Please tell me about Gnome.

eh, I want more from her but her entry sounded more comfortable than not on a tonal level from what I know of her, even if she didn't really get into the game at all.

I have no clear read on Gnome here, but it exists. She was specifically prompted to justify a town-read on Gnome, and I have previously felt like that town-read looked good for Gnome, as a "too town to be suspected, so let's just move on" slot.

Spoiler: show

nutella wrote: ↑Sun May 23, 2021 2:25 am

NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME wrote: ↑Sun May 23, 2021 2:19 am

nutella wrote: ↑Sun May 23, 2021 2:17 am

Yeah I don't mind a few off topic comments but it's getting pretty excessive.

Wot

Like it's not banter she's pretending stuff is alignment indicative that is very not and it's jarring

Nutella is leaning more heavily into the Owner suspicion now, which could be a sign that they are not teammates. But the progression up to now has looked like potential distancing to me, and Owner's behavior in some of the posts nutella has criticized would be impossible not to criticize, tbh. nutella would look worse if she had produced a town-read on Owner here.

Spoiler: show

nutella wrote: ↑Sun May 23, 2021 2:27 am

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Sun May 23, 2021 2:22 am Owner has a unique way of looking at games, and it is typical of her to make reads on the basis of things most people would not. At face value that's fine.

What's problematic to me is that it doesn't seem to be leading somewhere yet, with the exception of some reads that I just don't think are appropriate (e.g. Tangy mafia for a questionnaire).

I thought the tangy one was actually one of the more intriguing ones, I want more from her on that

nutella wrote: ↑Sun May 23, 2021 2:31 am

NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME wrote: ↑Sun May 23, 2021 2:27 am

nutella wrote: ↑Sun May 23, 2021 2:25 am

Like it's not banter she's pretending stuff is alignment indicative that is very not and it's jarring

Pretend they're onion soup reads

Its just her thing, and as we say

Everything is game related

Okay but she said upgaymers is a filler word so I can't take anything she says seriously

These two posts back-to-back gave me mild whiplash. "Owner's read on Tangy is intriguing, actually." 4 minutes elapse. "I can't take anything Owner says seriously."
At the very least, this is a bogus read on Owner. But we kind of already knew that.

Spoiler: show

nutella wrote: ↑Sun May 23, 2021 3:01 am love that like a third of the players aren't doing anything d1

i forgot LC was even in this game

nutella had previously listed LC as one of her three strongest suspects. If they are partners, I feel like she does not so easily forget Distancing Plan #1 ("call him a suspect") before initiating Distancing Plan #2 ("pretend to forget he exists"). Tentative good look for LC.

The rest of nutella's posts came in a flurry at the end of the phase when she had All The Votes, or during twilight. I'll dig into those separately if I feel like it, but for now I'm leaving this as it is.

Loose tier rankings based purely on this ISO, tiers not internally ranked:

Very Town
Jay
Guillotine
Tangy
Sonny

Largely Town
Mac
Gavial
Alison
Nanook
lost monkey
Gnome

A Little Town
Martin
Long Con
Dana

Suspect or Intriguing
Actvscenei
Owner

Not Enough To Form A Clear Read
Allcrab
bad bunny
Belzy
hawkataine
Kito
Made*
Seanzie

*Made was the counterwagon to nutella at the end of the day, and I have not reviewed her posts from that time yet.

[/spoiler]

IDK what Guill is thinking but like.....
The top town is the EXACT SAME as Nut’s.

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Mon May 24, 2021 9:11 pm If it was still 2016 and I was the snap voting type I'd probably have already voted Belzy. But I'm an old sage now who takes his time.

Sloonei wrote: ↑Mon May 24, 2021 9:08 pm

Gavial wrote: ↑Mon May 24, 2021 9:07 pm @NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME
Vote Scum!

What are your thoughts on Belzy?

Sloonei wrote: ↑Mon May 24, 2021 9:07 pm

Gavial wrote: ↑Mon May 24, 2021 9:05 pm

Sloonei wrote: ↑Mon May 24, 2021 9:02 pm

Gavial wrote: ↑Mon May 24, 2021 8:59 pm No but for real, I don’t buy it that all 4 of them are town.
I think 1 is scum Nut slipped into their list.

You have arrived at the conversation Mac and I had a few minutes ago.

Also go review nutella’s responses to me at the end of Day 1 if you are beginning to entertain suspicion against me.

Ok but it shouldn’t fuckin clear them and make you have the same top town as a flipped fuckin scum.

My list was not a comprehensive view of the game. It was based purely on my analysis of nutella’s posts.
I have no firm read on Sonny outside of that exercise.

Sloonei wrote: ↑Mon May 24, 2021 9:02 pm

Gavial wrote: ↑Mon May 24, 2021 8:59 pm No but for real, I don’t buy it that all 4 of them are town.
I think 1 is scum Nut slipped into their list.

You have arrived at the conversation Mac and I had a few minutes ago.

Also go review nutella’s responses to me at the end of Day 1 if you are beginning to entertain suspicion against me.

Guillotine wrote: ↑Mon May 24, 2021 8:53 pm

Sloonei wrote: ↑Mon May 24, 2021 8:11 pm nutella continues talking to people

Spoiler: show

Spoiler: show

nutella wrote: ↑Sat May 22, 2021 3:59 am [VOTE: lost monkey] aubergine

you seem to be in neutral commentary mode, let's see some reads

Beep boop vote for lost monkey. Meh. This could very easily be a teammate prod. It could just as easily be an easy observation to direct toward a low key civilian.

Spoiler: show

nutella wrote: ↑Sat May 22, 2021 4:05 am Strong town
Jay
Sonny
Guillo
Tangy

Town leans
Gnome
Alison
Martin I guess sheeping alison
Dana
Mac
Sloonei
Hawk? Liked their style
Act maybe at this point

Gav Nook LC are more tbd
Dont remember anyone else

Going to sleep for like 12 hours gl

Juicy. A reads list. Sonny gets places in the "Strong Town" pile after appearing only once previously in this ISO, when nutella simply agreed with someone else's town read on them. I am inclined to say that's a good look for Sonny: sometimes mafia members will effortlessly adopt firm town reads on town players that are not suspected by anyone because there's no sense in pushing on them. I don't feel like nutella would place her teammate on such a high pedestal out of the blue like this.

Intriguing town leans: Gnome, Martin, Dana, Hawk, Act. Both Hawk and Act get slight quibbles, which is something I could see nutella attaching to a teammate. Martin also gets a caveat about sheeping Alison, but that's not as much of a concern. If Alison is town and nutella has assigned town-read status to her, she is almost forced to also assign a town-read to Martin.
Dana and Mac both came up a little bit earlier on in this ISO but with no firm conclusions. I have no immediate concerns about them here. I would not be surprised if there is at least one teammate in nutella's "town leans" pile.
Gavial, nanook, and Long Con all get suspicion hurled at them for no stated reason. Noted. I don't remember any notable mentions of or interactions with LC prior to this.

Spoiler: show

nutella wrote: ↑Sat May 22, 2021 4:08 pm

Alison wrote: ↑Sat May 22, 2021 4:03 pm I think Act's posting has improved in recent times. I'm willing to give her some space and see how she uses it.

I liked her dismissive response to you asking for a read list tbh

Noting that nutella has now substantiated a town read on Act. Coolio.

Spoiler: show

nutella wrote: ↑Sat May 22, 2021 4:14 pm Alison what do you think about lost monkey?

Prompts Alison to talk about lost monkey. Inclined to call that a good look for our monkey friend.

Spoiler: show

nutella wrote: ↑Sat May 22, 2021 4:25 pm

lost monkey wrote: ↑Sat May 22, 2021 1:56 am

Tangrowth wrote: ↑Fri May 21, 2021 4:58 pm

Actvscenei wrote: ↑Fri May 21, 2021 4:54 pm

Sloonei wrote: ↑Fri May 21, 2021 4:14 pm First date icebreaker question for everyone: what’s your favorite trip you’ve ever been on?

Disney World/Disney Cruises. And you?

Follow up, why did you choose to ask this particular question?

Hi!

To the PerC people and/or anyone else who wants to answer:

1) what do you think you bring to a game when you're town?
2) what do you hope to accomplish this game?

1. My town reads.
2. Win with town.

lost monkey wrote: ↑Sat May 22, 2021 2:09 am

Sonny wrote: ↑Sat May 22, 2021 2:01 am Finding someone genuine?


Unrelated, screw nested quotes. Really.

yeah lol

lost monkey wrote: ↑Sat May 22, 2021 3:17 am

nutella wrote: ↑Fri May 21, 2021 8:11 pm Not really the only reason no I just sort of generally toneread you as wolfy/found your approach disingenuous, starting with the dana read (bc again I'm a defender of hedginess and didn't see it your way). But as you've posted more it seems like that's just your style and you are poking in various places and have solvey intentions. I could move off you but don't know where

You could just unvote? There is no compulsion that a person needs to be voted. This I could move off you but don't know where stuff I don't buy it and seems fake. Leaning scum here.

lost monkey wrote: ↑Sat May 22, 2021 3:29 am Allison like an evolved form of alana lol.

lost monkey wrote: ↑Sat May 22, 2021 3:45 am

Owner of a Lonely Heart wrote: ↑Sat May 22, 2021 12:33 am

Tangrowth wrote: ↑Fri May 21, 2021 4:02 pm Hello, I'm Tangy and this is my first mafia game.

Hi Tangy. This may be one of my final mafia games I play. I have been considering retirement. Not, to rain on the date though, I just feel as though I can't mod how I want to mod anymore, which is my main appeal to the game in the recent years.

Owner you should try modding games here owner. Some of the setup i have seen here are right up your alley.

lost monkey wrote: ↑Sat May 22, 2021 2:28 pm

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Sat May 22, 2021 2:20 pm

lost monkey wrote: ↑Sat May 22, 2021 2:17 pm What do you want me to expand?

lost monkey wrote: ↑Sat May 22, 2021 3:22 amIf I didn't play a game before this one, I would been the same way as act and you on dana.

It'd be super to know what made you feel this way, and what playing a game before this one did to change your perspective.

The playstyles are mainly the reason if I have to say. Certain things which you guys see as townie are not seen as townie thing over there. Now lets take act what you guys saw stilted and acting scummie from act we consider as something normal from her. This is her playstyle this is how she plays regardless of alignment. Similarly to what you felt with gnome. I felt the same way when I saw syn, mac play. Dana coming in and saying i am nervous and stuff if i didnt see others play last game even i would have felt it was scummie.

Like my impression is most of LM's posts are comments on things that don't actually have bearing on the game itself, there's a couple like the discussion of act's style that could come close to giving a read but avoid actually doing so. There's a hint of a scumread on me, and some interaction with Jay and that's it. I feel like they're hesitant to actually get into the meat of the game.

Okay. By far the most substantial post in the first 24 hours of the game from nutella is a mini-case against lost monkey. That is a good look. This feels much more like "I have identified my Day 1 target and will begin pushing them here" rather than "I better start shading my partner."

Spoiler: show

nutella wrote: ↑Sat May 22, 2021 4:31 pm I thought Owner was sort of off-topic/not into the game yet in a more similar way to Gnome (which I found townier than LM's borderline approach)

By contrast, here's a not-good look for Owner. And maybe a good look for Gnome? Owner starts to receive some heat, and nutella comes to her defense promptly, and cites another player (Gnome) whose style Owner is reminiscent of. It's possible that Gnome is town and nutella chose this particular association (Owner -> Gnome) so that the towny goodness of Gnome could be transmitted to Owner in turn. The unprompted dig at lost monkey is also another good look for them, and gives this post an air of slight anxiety: nutella wants attention on monkey and off of Owner.

Spoiler: show

nutella wrote: ↑Sat May 22, 2021 8:55 pm ......kito? wat why

This is in response to Guillo placing Kito in their list of Top 3 town reads. It's an easy question to ask. It might be easier if Kito really is town. But it's still easy even if Kito is nutella's partner. Meh.

Spoiler: show

nutella wrote: ↑Sat May 22, 2021 9:30 pm

Sonny wrote: ↑Sat May 22, 2021 9:19 pm Funny thing, when I woke up one of my first thoughts was I bet LoMo would be leading the votes and lol, here it is, should be fun to catch up. 2 is meh, but it tickles me that I saw that one coming.

do you have a read there?

Unless lost monkey specifically requested to be bussed Day 1, this is too aggressive to be distancing. I don't think that is likely.

Spoiler: show

nutella wrote: ↑Sun May 23, 2021 12:05 am Meh talk to me about belzy i dont have a good handle there

After several posts going back and forth with Guillo (town), nutella asks for some talk about Belzy. This is Belzy's first appearance in nutella's ISO. Neat.

Spoiler: show

nutella wrote: ↑Sun May 23, 2021 12:44 am

Owner of a Lonely Heart wrote: ↑Sun May 23, 2021 12:33 am @Alison So my comment about nutella's first post feels similar to the interesting tell. "Upgaymers" feels like a filler word. In a previous game on here I picked out Sloonei saying "spicy", which apparently people on here and MU both use. I'm trying to keep an open mind that it could very well be a community clash. But at the same time, it feels like it is something that wouldn't necessarily be said. I don't know if it could be too scummy to be scum or if the context of it is just this site players that commonly use words I'm not use to, which typing them feels of note, as it is uncommon for me to see it in game. But for me, it feels off. It's not directly aligned with a specific tell though.

wait this is the funniest thing ive ever seen

Does this read from Owner exist if they are partners? It was a bit goofy from the beginning. I don't know Owner well enough to say whether or not she would produce this read on her teammate. Nutella's response is nothing.

Spoiler: show

nutella wrote: ↑Sun May 23, 2021 1:16 am

Owner of a Lonely Heart wrote: ↑Sun May 23, 2021 1:06 am

Tangrowth wrote: ↑Fri May 21, 2021 4:54 pm How does one catch Alison as scum anyway? This is not a rhetorical question.

I don't know. I think you need to explain her playstyle or look for patterns in her playstyle over time.

Huh

Why does this post exist

Why does this post exist?

Spoiler: show

nutella wrote: ↑Sun May 23, 2021 1:18 am

Owner of a Lonely Heart wrote: ↑Sun May 23, 2021 1:16 am

Alison wrote: ↑Sun May 23, 2021 1:12 am

Owner of a Lonely Heart wrote: ↑Sun May 23, 2021 12:45 am not sure, how I feel about all the lomo votes...hmm...I'm not caught up. But it seems like I keep seeing PerC wagons as if we are unwelcomed on someone's home turf...adk

I really hate this AtE.

[VOTE: Owner] aubergine

It's not AtE. It's I see 4 votes on lomo that look steady or have been there for a period of time. Generally like 4 or 5 votes on someone is like there is probably scum in that wagon. Or it could mean like a cop check or something, but generally day 1 a wagon that size and potentially unmoving is kind of meh for me.

So from that point of view, I think he might be town, but I have yet to read his posts, so I don't know yet.

lalala dadv isnt real it cant hurt me

Owner objects to the monkey wagon, and nutella playfully shoots her objection down. Meh. I can go either way on this.

Spoiler: show

nutella wrote: ↑Sun May 23, 2021 1:23 am

Alison wrote: ↑Sun May 23, 2021 1:20 am

Owner of a Lonely Heart wrote: ↑Sun May 23, 2021 1:16 am

Alison wrote: ↑Sun May 23, 2021 1:12 am

Owner of a Lonely Heart wrote: ↑Sun May 23, 2021 12:45 am not sure, how I feel about all the lomo votes...hmm...I'm not caught up. But it seems like I keep seeing PerC wagons as if we are unwelcomed on someone's home turf...adk

I really hate this AtE.

[VOTE: Owner] aubergine

It's not AtE. It's I see 4 votes on lomo that look steady or have been there for a period of time. Generally like 4 or 5 votes on someone is like there is probably scum in that wagon. Or it could mean like a cop check or something, but generally day 1 a wagon that size and potentially unmoving is kind of meh for me.

So from that point of view, I think he might be town, but I have yet to read his posts, so I don't know yet.

"PerC players are being wagoned by unwelcoming Syndicate players" -> "This specific wagon on a PerC player is probably scum-driven because of its static nature" doesn't connect. If you don't like the LoMo wagon because there's no resistance, say so. Framing it as a PerC vs Syndicate thing reads as fishing for an appeal to emotion, and doesn't really make sense if your primary concern was the size and fluidity of the wagon. It does make sense if you have TMI on LoMo so I'm very happy to vote you.

mmmm spicy

At the very least, nutella is no longer uncomfortable with people talking about Owner. I still don't know if anything here suggests that they are not compatible though.
The way nutella is handling Alison looks very good for her.

Spoiler: show

nutella wrote: ↑Sun May 23, 2021 1:40 am Like mafia mac or nook could be pushing me because I'm not literally the top poster and they think they can look good for not just admitting I'm obv town already

nutella wrote: ↑Sun May 23, 2021 1:40 am But I'm not afraid of mac staying on me for more than like five minutes regardless of his alignment

I think nanook is just town here. I am more iffy on Mac, but this second post feels like it's meant to be a playful taunt to disarm Mac slightly. That would be a good indicator for him.

Spoiler: show

nutella wrote: ↑Sun May 23, 2021 1:43 am

Alison wrote: ↑Sun May 23, 2021 1:37 am I feel like town nutella would be fiercer and less deflective here.

I'm torn about whether to vote Owner or nutella.

The people voting for me are mac, nanook, and guillo

I'm not concerned lol

I have deemed this response to be Fake. Nutella is concerned. She is concerned because all three of these people are town and their votes are Legit.

Spoiler: show

nutella wrote: ↑Sun May 23, 2021 1:49 am

Owner of a Lonely Heart wrote: ↑Sun May 23, 2021 1:44 am

Tangrowth wrote: ↑Fri May 21, 2021 4:58 pm
Hi!

To the PerC people and/or anyone else who wants to answer:

1) what do you think you bring to a game when you're town?
2) what do you hope to accomplish this game?

[VOTE: Tangy] aubergine Same reasons as voting for Sloonei...it's a tell. This questionnaire feels more agenda based than Sloonei's did. It feels like you are really looking to see where everyone is at. It's like you are specifically fishing for something. There is a motive behind this.

It kind of looks like you are trying to be on good graces, but to me it feels like you are searching for reasons to keep or not keep someone in the game. It is troublesome.

hmm

going for the big fish here eh

Not feisty enough.

Spoiler: show

nutella wrote: ↑Sun May 23, 2021 1:55 am

Sonny wrote: ↑Sun May 23, 2021 1:47 am

nutella wrote: ↑Sun May 23, 2021 1:43 am

Alison wrote: ↑Sun May 23, 2021 1:37 am I feel like town nutella would be fiercer and less deflective here.

I'm torn about whether to vote Owner or nutella.

The people voting for me are mac, nanook, and guillo

I'm not concerned lol

Why do the people voting you matter here?

for mac see my last post, for nanook and guillo basically I always expect us to suspect each other

It's always town in sonnydelphia.

Spoiler: show

nutella wrote: ↑Sun May 23, 2021 2:07 am

Owner of a Lonely Heart wrote: ↑Sun May 23, 2021 2:01 am

MacDougall wrote: ↑Sun May 23, 2021 1:56 am

Owner of a Lonely Heart wrote: ↑Sun May 23, 2021 1:54 am

Sonny wrote: ↑Sun May 23, 2021 1:41 am Oooh, Nook isn't self voting anymore.

Owner, please just catch up. All this talk about not being caught up is shady.

I'm like not caught up most games. I don't get why people keep calling it that way when it happens like every game. It's like no one remembers this...though we haven't really played together lately so I guess that's it.

smh

got anything to say about nutellagate?

What's a nutellagate? Is is a gate made of nutella? I feel that's too on the nose to be it. They are there. I don't recall their playstyle. I feel like I should know more about their music tastes from all the walrus' we've been in together.

They are an elephant in this room, but I don't feel like they are the loudest or most memorable one here.

[VOTE: owner] aubergine

say something game related or die

Owner's response to the prompt for a comment about nutella looks super uncomfortable. Nutella responds by prodding her to say something more substantive. That could easily be A Teammate prodding Another to lean into the distancing act, rather than avoiding it. In fact, I might be inclined to say that it is. If Owner is town, she is at least passively resisting the wagon on nutella. Why does Mafia Nutella respond to that by calling Town Owner out like this?

Spoiler: show

nutella wrote: ↑Sun May 23, 2021 2:10 am

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Sun May 23, 2021 2:03 am I'm not sure I've seen this version of nutella before, with this sort of flippant reception of suspicion/votes. Wack. I'm just gonna stare at these a while and let my brain sort:

nutella wrote: ↑Sat May 22, 2021 4:05 am Strong town
Jay
Sonny
Guillo
Tangy

Town leans
Gnome
Alison
Martin I guess sheeping alison
Dana
Mac
Sloonei
Hawk? Liked their style
Act maybe at this point

Gav Nook LC are more tbd
Dont remember anyone else

Going to sleep for like 12 hours gl

Oh I did put mac on that list huh. Must have felt stronger at the time, when i was comparing tangy's gth reads to my own mac was one of the harder ones

Both Jay and Mac are town here. Jay read super 100% confident, though I was already there before. But since this is easy to substantiate, I'll articulate it here in case anyone is still on the fence and somehow reading all of this: nutella is very much caught off guard by Jay digging this list up and waving it in front of her to highlight the contradictory nature of her handling of Mac at the present compared to a few hours earlier. Jay has caught nutella in an inconsistency. Nutella is flustered. They are never teammates in this exchange.

Spoiler: show

nutella wrote: ↑Sun May 23, 2021 2:16 am

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Sun May 23, 2021 2:10 am

nutella wrote: ↑Sun May 23, 2021 2:10 am Oh I did put mac on that list huh. Must have felt stronger at the time, when i was comparing tangy's gth reads to my own mac was one of the harder ones

Please tell me about Gnome.

eh, I want more from her but her entry sounded more comfortable than not on a tonal level from what I know of her, even if she didn't really get into the game at all.

I have no clear read on Gnome here, but it exists. She was specifically prompted to justify a town-read on Gnome, and I have previously felt like that town-read looked good for Gnome, as a "too town to be suspected, so let's just move on" slot.

Spoiler: show

nutella wrote: ↑Sun May 23, 2021 2:25 am

NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME wrote: ↑Sun May 23, 2021 2:19 am

nutella wrote: ↑Sun May 23, 2021 2:17 am

Guillotine wrote: ↑Sun May 23, 2021 2:12 am Not gonna lie, owner’s reads based on personality traits, anti-immigration sentiment and other non game related subjects is starting to ping me hard

Yeah I don't mind a few off topic comments but it's getting pretty excessive.

Wot

Like it's not banter she's pretending stuff is alignment indicative that is very not and it's jarring

Nutella is leaning more heavily into the Owner suspicion now, which could be a sign that they are not teammates. But the progression up to now has looked like potential distancing to me, and Owner's behavior in some of the posts nutella has criticized would be impossible not to criticize, tbh. nutella would look worse if she had produced a town-read on Owner here.

Spoiler: show

nutella wrote: ↑Sun May 23, 2021 2:27 am

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Sun May 23, 2021 2:22 am Owner has a unique way of looking at games, and it is typical of her to make reads on the basis of things most people would not. At face value that's fine.

What's problematic to me is that it doesn't seem to be leading somewhere yet, with the exception of some reads that I just don't think are appropriate (e.g. Tangy mafia for a questionnaire).

I thought the tangy one was actually one of the more intriguing ones, I want more from her on that

nutella wrote: ↑Sun May 23, 2021 2:31 am

NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME wrote: ↑Sun May 23, 2021 2:27 am

nutella wrote: ↑Sun May 23, 2021 2:25 am

NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME wrote: ↑Sun May 23, 2021 2:19 am

nutella wrote: ↑Sun May 23, 2021 2:17 am

Yeah I don't mind a few off topic comments but it's getting pretty excessive.

Wot

Like it's not banter she's pretending stuff is alignment indicative that is very not and it's jarring

Pretend they're onion soup reads

Its just her thing, and as we say

Everything is game related

Okay but she said upgaymers is a filler word so I can't take anything she says seriously

These two posts back-to-back gave me mild whiplash. "Owner's read on Tangy is intriguing, actually." 4 minutes elapse. "I can't take anything Owner says seriously."
At the very least, this is a bogus read on Owner. But we kind of already knew that.

Spoiler: show

nutella wrote: ↑Sun May 23, 2021 3:01 am love that like a third of the players aren't doing anything d1

i forgot LC was even in this game

nutella had previously listed LC as one of her three strongest suspects. If they are partners, I feel like she does not so easily forget Distancing Plan #1 ("call him a suspect") before initiating Distancing Plan #2 ("pretend to forget he exists"). Tentative good look for LC.

The rest of nutella's posts came in a flurry at the end of the phase when she had All The Votes, or during twilight. I'll dig into those separately if I feel like it, but for now I'm leaving this as it is.

Loose tier rankings based purely on this ISO, tiers not internally ranked:

Very Town
Jay
Guillotine
Tangy
Sonny

Largely Town
Mac
Gavial
Alison
Nanook
lost monkey
Gnome

A Little Town
Martin
Long Con
Dana

Suspect or Intriguing
Actvscenei
Owner

Not Enough To Form A Clear Read
Allcrab
bad bunny
Belzy
hawkataine
Kito
Made*
Seanzie

*Made was the counterwagon to nutella at the end of the day, and I have not reviewed her posts from that time yet.

Sloonei wrote: ↑Mon May 24, 2021 8:45 pm that... is not the emoji i selected.

MacDougall wrote: ↑Mon May 24, 2021 8:47 pm

Gavial wrote: ↑Mon May 24, 2021 8:45 pm

MacDougall wrote: ↑Mon May 24, 2021 8:43 pm I am mindful of the fact that if there is even 1 mafia between Jay, Sloonei and Alison that once the two of the three that aren't that mafia and I die that person is probably just going to win, and I am very conflicted as to why the three of them are choosing to walk that path, particularly Alison, given Jay and Sloonei both acted in defense of Nutella in the most literal way and Jay in particular was present during Nutella wifom hours mopping up anti spew cred.

JJJ doesn’t hard defend his scum bud right off the bat.
Like the way he handled Nut SoD1 felt never W/W.
I was actually going to clear Nut if JJJ flipped Red because I thought JJJ was the scum within them because JJJ felt like they were trying to pocket Nut. JJJ for some reason had a very strong TR on Nut.

JJJ is a power player. He absolutely would defend his teammate because, much like me, he is rarely if ever held to account for anything he does because of his clout and when he does he can just post himself clear as either alignment.

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Fri May 21, 2021 5:00 pm nutella seems town

MacDougall wrote: ↑Mon May 24, 2021 8:43 pm I am mindful of the fact that if there is even 1 mafia between Jay, Sloonei and Alison that once the two of the three that aren't that mafia and I die that person is probably just going to win, and I am very conflicted as to why the three of them are choosing to walk that path, particularly Alison, given Jay and Sloonei both acted in defense of Nutella in the most literal way and Jay in particular was present during Nutella wifom hours mopping up anti spew cred.

Sloonei wrote: ↑Mon May 24, 2021 8:22 pm [VOTE: owner] aubergine

Alison wrote: ↑Mon May 24, 2021 6:06 pm Has Garden Gnome done anything clearworthy?

Actvscenei wrote: ↑Mon May 24, 2021 6:04 pm I don’t mean to drive down this tunnel...but I really think Dana is scum, y’all. I do not like the question about Nutella’s flip (feels like a forced derp), and I do not like this reiteration of the reads list. I think I’m going to trust my D1 initial instinct right now because D2 hasn’t changed my mind yet. Her reads are trying too hard. She isn’t really scum hunting, I really believe she is spending more time on her appearance than finding scum. Call me crazy, but like...my vote is going back there haha.

NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME wrote: ↑Mon May 24, 2021 5:58 pm

Seanzie wrote: ↑Mon May 24, 2021 5:00 pm I scumread Nanook immediately after coming into the thread, just to see JJJ townread him right afterwards. Not sure what to make of it. Nook explained why he wasn't explaining reads, which is a very not like the town!Nook I usually see. Usually he just pretends to be ignorant of the fact that the answers he is giving to questions about his is flippant. I'm on Page 11, and y'all need to stop posting so much so I can read D1 while still keeping up with the current day.

This is a wild read

hawkataine wrote: ↑Mon May 24, 2021 5:41 pm

Gavial wrote: ↑Mon May 24, 2021 5:39 pm

hawkataine wrote: ↑Mon May 24, 2021 5:37 pm

Gavial wrote: ↑Mon May 24, 2021 5:34 pm

MacDougall wrote: ↑Mon May 24, 2021 5:34 pm

Gavial wrote: ↑Mon May 24, 2021 5:33 pm If another wagon grows and you haven’t claimed your target and result I will hard claim and expose you!

@hawkataine

you won't you giant baby

Yeah I think Hawk is chicken!

At least answer me this.
Did you visit anyone at all last night?

I did not.

hawkataine wrote: ↑Mon May 24, 2021 5:37 pm

Gavial wrote: ↑Mon May 24, 2021 5:34 pm

MacDougall wrote: ↑Mon May 24, 2021 5:34 pm

Gavial wrote: ↑Mon May 24, 2021 5:33 pm If another wagon grows and you haven’t claimed your target and result I will hard claim and expose you!

@hawkataine

you won't you giant baby

Yeah I think Hawk is chicken!

MacDougall wrote: ↑Mon May 24, 2021 5:34 pm

Gavial wrote: ↑Mon May 24, 2021 5:33 pm If another wagon grows and you haven’t claimed your target and result I will hard claim and expose you!

@hawkataine

you won't you giant baby

Sloonei wrote: ↑Mon May 24, 2021 5:29 pm It is a good thing when Mac tunnels Jay. He should keep doing it. We're all so proud of him for tunneling Jay.

MacDougall wrote: ↑Mon May 24, 2021 5:27 pm ngl ppl telling me not to tunnel Jay just makes me want to do it more

hawkataine wrote: ↑Mon May 24, 2021 5:28 pm

Sloonei wrote: ↑Mon May 24, 2021 5:18 pm

hawkataine wrote: ↑Mon May 24, 2021 5:13 pm guess I'll go make this chart better in a quest for stars from Mac
given that nobody seems to actually want to ask me anything lol

You did not seem particularly invested in yesterday's outcome. You voted for Made after catching up near the deadline, but you did so with an attitude that amounted to a shrug. Do you object to this characterization of your End of Day posture? Why did you prefer Made over nutella?

I wanted flips of some kind, I didn't specifically want made dead but I did want to know if that was a wagon that had potential to grow compared to owner who had seemed static, as I was pretty suspicious of how small the owner wagon was. Also some people who seemed to think they could read nutella started expressing doubts quite close to day end so that threw me off a bit. I'm a chaotic EoD voter by nature and very prone to short-term influence by general thread direction, so I will often intentionally store up town reads on myself during the day and tank them at day end for data xD

I had suspicion of nutella during the day, tbh possibly my strongest suspicion which is not saying much because I was mainly making town reads. The reason I didn't ever vote there is by the time I read the thread properly on Sunday she already had a 6-or-7 person wagon or something and I didn't think it was necessary to put her further in the lead, again for wagonomics reasons. If the wagon had started to deflate I probably would have voted there but I appreciate that's utterly meaningless to say now xD

TLDR I didn't particularly want made dead. If I was actually trying to get the wagon off nutella and onto him I probably would have either tried to defend nutella a bit or tried to shade made a bit, instead of laying a naked vote.

Also as an aside I assume Gavial's red check is a joke because it was like the fourth one in a row and it's also wrong but uh if people are voting me just based on that then make yourselves known so I can be annoyed at you ty

Guillotine wrote: ↑Mon May 24, 2021 4:32 pm My PoE today

Belzy
Owner
Hawk
LongCon
Dana

Someone from this list must be yeeted today.

@Owner of a Lonely Heart I gave you a second chance yesterday. Town up and show me it was the right decision.

Guillotine wrote: ↑Mon May 24, 2021 4:06 pm @Actvscenei
@Tangrowth

Welcome to my towncore

Alison wrote: ↑Mon May 24, 2021 5:15 pm

MacDougall wrote: ↑Mon May 24, 2021 5:13 pm

Alison wrote: ↑Mon May 24, 2021 5:12 pm I think assuming Made is town is fine. I assume that too. No voting between a very close V/W wagon is honestly scum indivative.

if I was a vigilante I would have shot Made last night

For what? nutella was in danger and he got flash wagoned.