The Syndicate

potentialsheltervet wrote: ↑Wed May 17, 2023 3:16 pm
staypositivefriend wrote: ↑Wed May 17, 2023 3:14 pm im tempted to self vote lol
Five way tie?

let the mafia gods decide our fate

potentialsheltervet wrote: ↑Wed May 17, 2023 2:48 pm
staypositivefriend wrote: ↑Wed May 17, 2023 12:20 pm i guess fmpov the question is just whether i'm willing to tie the vote and try to get sig eliminated instead

and i really need sig to come back and talk with me before i make that decision
I thought you were firm on TRing sig?

well i think that the nightkill specifically might point away from sig, even though coming into today, i had the mindset that he might just be mafia

i also don't think that it's you and i don't think that it's neon and i feel reasonably good about that even after re-reading both of your ISOs today

i was leaning dennis for a while even though i felt like i had good reasons to townread him, but i think it's probably just within sig and dennis and that it's important we get it right today

im tempted to self vote lol

if we don't hit the final maf today we proly lose lol

i guess fmpov the question is just whether i'm willing to tie the vote and try to get sig eliminated instead

and i really need sig to come back and talk with me before i make that decision

potentialsheltervet wrote: ↑Wed May 17, 2023 11:31 am So are we just going to shrug yeet Dennis and hope that's the answer, then panic when (fmpov) it isn't?

i've been hoping that either dennis or sig will come back before the deadline so that i can talk with them and make a more informed decision

but im not even gonna be able to be around much in the next few hours so idk

sig wrote: ↑Tue May 16, 2023 11:44 am He’s very hedgy and unsure of himself he’s lacking any sort of confidence in his scum reads.

That’s because he knows who mafia is and isn’t and not proficient enough to cover it up yet. I think it’s very clear he has TMI.

doesn't TMI usually come out in the opposite way, though? if you have perfect information, you don't need to be hedgy and lack confidence, right? usually wolves will show TMI by being needlessly confident

@Dennis -

do u think it's true that sig has a "good meta characterization" of you? cause sig has brought up his ability to metaread you multiple times as a justification for his push. what kind of experience do u two have together?

dennis, if u and me are both town, who is the mafia?

Dennis wrote: ↑Mon May 15, 2023 10:58 pm What are the reasons in these tho

i mean, you tell me. you're the one who has been acting confident that i'm town for the majority of this game

so, on the day when the wolf most likely needs to get me eliminated to win the game, you suddenly saying: "i don't know why i townread SPF" is a bit paranoia inducing, as i'm sure you can understand

Dennis wrote: ↑Mon May 15, 2023 10:55 pm
staypositivefriend wrote: ↑Mon May 15, 2023 10:34 pm if sig is mafia, why does he kill ted? why does he hard push on falcon early into d2 before falcon was even a consensus scumread?

if psv is mafia, why does she go out of her way to try to prevent me from dying when i could be an easy miselimination from her pov? (unless she's specifically trying to keep me alive for 3 way so that i will vote with her i guess)

dennis positioning me at the bottom of his readslist today after seeming p confident i was town in prior phases does have me paranoid that he's just setting himself up to eliminate me and then win in the f3 but
I rarely ever order readlists

It's like, a lot of have people said you're scum but I genuinely don't understand why

Like I don't think I've seen a case, but I can't exactly ignore the ghosts of the past yelling that you're bad

shrug

it's less the order of the readlist for me and more you saying that you "don't know" why you've been townreading me, as though your townread on me appeared out of thin air and isnt something youve been confidently repping for this entire game

dennis's character arc in this game is basically just a Shakespeare play

potentialsheltervet wrote: ↑Mon May 15, 2023 10:38 pm
staypositivefriend wrote: ↑Mon May 15, 2023 10:36 pm but it's not a meta read, it's just a basic strategy read

neon, as mafia, would know that falcon is dying soon

neon, as mafia, would know that she would need to be the one to solo endgame as a wolf

why does neon, in this position, aggressively defend falcon and go out of his way to call him town?

it has nothing to do with meta and everything to do with strategy
The strategy is WIFOM.
Look, I'm not saying it's perfect or cut and dry. I'm not super confident that's the solve. But I feel better voting Neon than I do other people right now.

yeah i mean, at the end of the day, any strategy can just boil down to "WIFOM"

i just dont see a specific reason to think that neon made a WIFOM play as a wolf, and the reasons that i have to townread her outweigh my reasons to wolfread her

if you have specific reasons to wolfread her, then im willing to listen

potentialsheltervet wrote: ↑Mon May 15, 2023 10:36 pm
staypositivefriend wrote: ↑Mon May 15, 2023 10:34 pm dennis positioning me at the bottom of his readslist today after seeming p confident i was town in prior phases does have me paranoid that he's just setting himself up to eliminate me and then win in the f3 but
Hmm, was he townreading you previously? If so that's a bit sus.
I think overall my reads are:
SPF
sig
Dennis
Neon

But I could go either way on voting those last two.

yeah i mean, these are the most recent things dennis said about me before he put me at the bottom of his list:

Dennis wrote: ↑Thu May 11, 2023 3:59 pm I have been townreading SPF for more or less the entire game, and I don't think Kate's case was super compelling because I think she misunderstood what spf was saying. So while you are following consensus and that's whatever, I don't think it's really alignment indicative cause you're new, I have my own reasons to disagree

Dennis wrote: ↑Thu May 11, 2023 5:54 pm
pyxxy wrote: ↑Thu May 11, 2023 5:32 pm probably just gonna afk until the night kill

not sure there's much for us to be gained here

sorry for the rand dennis but you know I gotta do it to ya

I guess maybe the one discussion to have it, do we actually just sheep Kate now? for realsies?
In a world where spf is mafia, I 1. Look like an ABSOLUTE doofus and 2. Have been pocketed so hard and I don't want to accept that

so, dennis suddenly saying:

Dennis wrote: ↑Mon May 15, 2023 10:19 pm SPF, I dunno why. I feel like she should be lower honestly, I think I'm just seeing a ton of words and going "yup!"

...is hard for me to swallow. because he made it very clear that his townread on me was based on specific reasons, and i don't buy that he suddenly "doesn't know why" he townreads me

but it's not a meta read, it's just a basic strategy read

neon, as mafia, would know that falcon is dying soon

neon, as mafia, would know that she would need to be the one to solo endgame as a wolf

why does neon, in this position, aggressively defend falcon and go out of his way to call him town?

it has nothing to do with meta and everything to do with strategy

okay i know how hedgy all of this sounds, but again, being transparent:

i think that i will die today. i think that's fine.

i think that before i die, i want to leave a legacy final wolfread that i feel confident about the rest of you sheeping.

i think that this is most likely going to come down between sig and dennis, and i'm just trying to decide which one i feel comfortable committing to.

if sig is mafia, why does he kill ted? why does he hard push on falcon early into d2 before falcon was even a consensus scumread?

if psv is mafia, why does she go out of her way to try to prevent me from dying when i could be an easy miselimination from her pov? (unless she's specifically trying to keep me alive for 3 way so that i will vote with her i guess)

dennis positioning me at the bottom of his readslist today after seeming p confident i was town in prior phases does have me paranoid that he's just setting himself up to eliminate me and then win in the f3 but

if i am in fact clearing neon, that does leave me with a dilemma, though

because when i saw that pyxxy was town, my first impression (other than being annoyed because i thought the game was about to end) was just: "ah okay, well it's probably just sig then, and i should have let him die instead"

but the main thing that gives me hesitation here is that ted sounded quite confident that sig was town before he died, and he was pretty insistent that he is usually a lot more obvious as mafia than he has been in this game

so while my overall reasons to townread sig might be the worst out of all my other townreads, it's kind of hard to imagine why he would shoot himself in the foot by killing one of his biggest defenders

but anyway, the possibilities fmpov right now are:

1. sig is mafia
2. i misread one of dennis and PSV, and they are mafia (neon could be included here too but i really just believe that she's clear)

now, the thing is, i agree that neon hasn't been particularly substantive or communicative over the last two(ish) dayphases, but i'm not sure i consider this to be alignment indicative overall

like yes, maybe she does look less towny in the short term, but thinking about the game overall, i really struggle to get to her being mafia

staypositivefriend wrote: ↑Sat May 13, 2023 12:08 am neon

-to put it as simply as possible, it does not feel to me like neon had TMI of falcon’s alignment. she went out of her way to defend him and call him a likely town flip, even at a point when falcon had seemed to have given up on saving himself

there is no real strategic incentive that i can see for neon defending falcon in the way that she did, and i think that her defense of falcon particularly makes sense in the context of falcon seeming to play in a way that was intended to manipulate neon’s meta on him (ie: the super pockety posts he made toward her, and the way neon expressed the sentiment that falcon might not be so bold as to try to pocket her 2 games in a row)

-the specific way that neon defended falcon aligns with the exact meta that ive seen in the last 2 games ive played with her (ie: neon has a tendency to passionately defend players she thinks are being treated/pushed unfairly), and idk if she would go out of her way to replicate this meta as a wolf unless her goal was to pocket just specifically me

-p#102 from seanzie (the post where seanzie is like: “i believe that SPF is telling the truth about mafia, and i think you do too”) is a weird post to make toward your own partner, because it feels a bit …like gaslighting in a sense? the wording of the post comes off as rather manipulative and i struggle to understand what the train of thought behind that post was if seanzie/neon were W/W, whereas it’s easy for me to see why seanzie would make that post if neon is town and he wanted to convince her that i’m mafia

-the way falcon talked about neon on p#271, p#275, and p#337 (and other posts, but those feel like the big ones to me) all feel a bit like TMI of her alignment

hard to imagine falcon going out of his way to hard townread his partner in the early stages of the game, but easy to imagine falcon trying to pocket neon in the early stages of the game by talking about how towny she is

-the way falcon sheeped neon on psv felt a bit like a wolf piggybacking off of a villagers incorrect push as opposed to a wolf sheeping another wolf

-super small point, but i like that neon essentially gave a non-answer on p#75 when she was asked to explain her townread on falcon, (Ie: “vibes”), when wolves who are TRing their partners or trying to powerwolf tend to be a bit more overly explanatory, in my experience

@potentialsheltervet - if you want me to get to a world where neon is mafia, i would really like you to address these points, please

in particular, if neon is mafia, then my questions are:

1. what was her plan to survive until the endgame and win? didn't her defense of falcon accomplish the opposite?

2. why did falcon interact with her in a way that looks obviously associated if they were W/W and he knew he was going to die soon? wouldn't falcon be more likely to distance?

potentialsheltervet wrote: ↑Mon May 15, 2023 6:39 pm
staypositivefriend wrote: ↑Mon May 15, 2023 5:32 pm anyway, i don't mind dying today because it's optimal for the gamestate and i would really rather not be taken to the f3

gonna spend the time i do have re-reading the game, mostly. feel free to ping me if you wanna discuss anything specific
I hate this honestly
If you're town a miselim is really the last thing we need right now.
I don't want to be in F3 either but I'm not just gonna say "okay, gobble me up!"

the reality of the situation is that two of the nightkilled players have died with their legacies as: "kill SPF" and if i get taken to a f3, it's going to be very difficult for anyone who is town with me to overcome the strength of those legacies

it's not about "not wanting to be in f3", it's about feeling like i would probably die every time in a f3 and that it is probably the safer option to just kill me today and then strongly consider the legacy read that i give for the f3

i know that it sucks, but that's where i'm at

anyway, i don't mind dying today because it's optimal for the gamestate and i would really rather not be taken to the f3

gonna spend the time i do have re-reading the game, mostly. feel free to ping me if you wanna discuss anything specific

staypositivefriend wrote: ↑Mon May 15, 2023 5:31 pm i'm not sure if ted makes that kill in a world where sig is mafia?

phrased that wrong lol

im not sure if sig makes that kill in a world where he's mafia, since ted was one of his main defenders

i'm not sure if ted makes that kill in a world where sig is mafia?

Roxy wrote: ↑Sun May 14, 2023 6:49 pm When pyxxy was awoken they had gotten such a bad sunburn that they felt nauseous. They decided they too was heading home. Absolutely fried.

actually yeah, sunburn is literally the last mafia role, so i think it's over too

maybe this game is just purgatory and we're all stuck here forever now

i really fucking hope so lol

all of the other eliminations so far have specified the name of the role that died and the alignment, but this one didn't, so....maybe?

potentialsheltervet wrote: ↑Sun May 14, 2023 6:59 pm Sounds like pyxxy was sunburn?

yeah, and this post:

pyxxy wrote: ↑Sun May 14, 2023 6:48 pmggs

made it sound like the game was about to end

is it over?

well i hope this is it then

Neon wrote: ↑Sun May 14, 2023 6:40 pm Well was anyways

yeah tbh i still think it's probaby pyxxy and just wanted to see how he would react to me voting sig

but looks like he isn't here

[VOTE: Pyxxy] aubergine

why did u switch to sig, neon?

@pyxxy - you here?

[VOTE: sg] aubergine

starting to feel like a broken record but do u have any thoughts on the reasons i gave to townread neon 2 pages ago? i feel confident about her being town bcuz of that and i want the ppl who disagree to engage w/me

potentialsheltervet wrote: ↑Sun May 14, 2023 4:17 pm I get being busy but feels like rolling over. Not sure if that's more scum or town indicative for pyxxy or if it's just... Him

yeah idk how to react to that

@potentialsheltervet - can u talk to me about why u fos neon?

yeah i hope it just ends with pyxxy

fwiw i am fairly confident that neon is not mafia

sig wrote: ↑Sun May 14, 2023 11:49 am Neon is almost 100% based off lemon like I said above + I know they also bus and can get far as mafia. I have to do a reread of neon and check. The counterpoint here is I’m not really feeling that wagon and I’ve not really had them on my radar until lemon died.

^^this only bothers me in the sense that sig's read on neon seems a little bit thoughtless. sig says that "neon can bus and get far as mafia", but how does a world where neon intended to bus and go deep square with the way she hard defended falcon throughout d2? how does it align with her overall approach this game in general?

it makes me paranoid that he is trying to throw neon back into the general POE because he perceives her as a necessary elimination to win the game

anyway i'm a bit hungover and grumpy today but here nonetheless if anyone wants to talk

sig wrote: ↑Sun May 14, 2023 11:49 am I’m not seeing the case on pyxxy at all. I don’t see why they’d play the way they are as mafia

so i may have spoken a bit too soon about you not reading my posts but it's not clear how you reached this conclusion about pyxxy after looking at my ~case~ on him. what do you not understand about it? what confuses you?

you need to understand that today is Do Or Die from my perspective, because i do think i should probably get eliminated tomorrow if we don't hit a wolf today, because i am absolutely NOT looking to get dragged to a f3 in this type of gamestate

so, it's important to me that i find the last mafia today, and i think that i may have, but when ppl disregard the case by saying they "don't see it" without elaborating further, it can be a bit baffling/frustrating

if youre still around between now and the EOD i would rlly appreciate if you went into more detail about your read on pyxxy in general

sig wrote: ↑Sun May 14, 2023 11:10 am We have to vote off SPF next phase if we don’t hit mafia this phase it’s really that simple.

i agree, so you should consider reading my posts and working with me instead of smugly dismissing them lol

sig wrote: ↑Sun May 14, 2023 11:07 am
potentialsheltervet wrote: ↑Sat May 13, 2023 10:48 pm kicks thread violently
We need town consensus on sig and pyxxy. So @sig why dennis over pyxxy?
@Dennis why sig other than omgus?
Does anyone have strong reasons to town read pyxxy?
Does anyone have strong reasons to scum read sig?

There is zero reason to scum read Pyxxy at this time and plenty of reason to go for Dennis which I and others have consistently said.

At this point I’m confident he’s the last mafia member and if it isn’t him it’s likely SPF and that’s just because they’re still alive

seems clear from your catch-up so far that you havent read the post that i asked you to read tbh, since you're saying tha there is "zero reason to scumread pyxxy" as though i have not said those reasons multiple times

for example:

staypositivefriend wrote: ↑Sat May 13, 2023 12:10 am pyxxy

-it was kind of hard for me to come up with strong reasons to townread pyxxy in general

-pyxxy doesn’t have much of a visible progression on either seanzie or falcon. he was absent when seanzie got flashwagoned at the EOD1

-his shift from: “i find falcon scummy and think he’s in scum meta” to “im sheeping neon’s tr on falcon” on d2 is a bit abrupt, and it could very well be because seanzie died and pyxxy was trying to pivot away from having to distance from his other partner

-falcon and seanzie did not seem to interact with or acknowledge the existence of pyxxy much at all

the shift on falcon is the one that i find the most damning in particular - going from voicing serious concern and suspicion on falcon to abruptly deciding to sheep neon on falcon and then not talk about him again does not strike me as an organic progression

sig wrote: ↑Sun May 14, 2023 11:06 am
Dennis wrote: ↑Sat May 13, 2023 3:09 pm Coming in and omgusing me isn't the best look in my opinion
Nah you’re playing within your scum meta and I’ve said that consistently since before your mentioned me and I voted their last phase.

You’re attempting to paint a picture that’s entirely inaccurate which only further fuels my suspicion that you’re mafia.

It also just makes sense from a wagonomics perspective. We had two wagons of players within the POE one got voted off and flipped civ. The next move isn’t to go and create two new wagons its to finish off the one we had and see how you flip

@sig - what is dennis's scum meta and how does it compare to this game? bcuza my impression is that dennis is playing differently from the scum meta ive seen from him

Search found 375 matches