The Syndicate

my case on nanook is that he said "we're probably gonna lose" which I think he's more likely to do as mafia than as town and then he made a naked vote on LHF

I also still suspect HK but that wagon obviously doesn't need my involvement to grow

Esooa wrote: ↑Sat Jun 12, 2021 8:21 am wanna do me a favor and remove a couple vanity wagons by continuing to sheep me onto lc

what's your case on LC

Esooa wrote: ↑Sat Jun 12, 2021 8:20 am
Alison wrote: ↑Sat Jun 12, 2021 8:20 am [VOTE: hollowkatt] aubergine
that sheeping didn't last long

Yeah I sheeped you and then you moved off Herm so.

[VOTE: nanook] aubergine

actually

he's naked voting orange btw

[VOTE: hollowkatt] aubergine

Wiml wrote: ↑Sat Jun 12, 2021 7:53 am I think his entrance was really awkward (particularly the "what kind of scum are you?" question as well as "Damn son!"). Feels like he's trying way too hard to try to fit in and failing (which was why I made my original vote since I never explained it at the time).

I also don't like his reaction to my vote. Given that myself and Herm have never spoken or interacted at all before this game / my vote on Herm, the fact that Herm doesn't ask me for any sort of clarification on my vote but immediately says that I'm wilding (I'm not quote sure what he means here but I'm assuming it means that my vote is crazy) but not any sort of scumread on me if it's a bad vote feels really ingenuine to me (and I'm pretty sure this TMIs me town if Herm is a wolf) and then the insistence that I would come round on him (again, despite never having interacted with me before this exchange - I had barely posted at this point either and could be any random) doesn't feel like a genuine thought process at all.

Also something I thought was interesting from Herm's reaction was that he seemed to have implicitly known my vote on him was serious without any sort of explanation (and overreacted)? This is weak but it makes me feel like Herm is already feeling guilty/paranoid about posts they've made (which fits my narrative of struggling to fit in as a wolf) and reacted weirdly as a result?

Not as much to say on his later posts but a lot of of them (almost all of the earlier ones) are awkward-feeling fluff, questions that don't really go anywhere or just commentary. I also think that having his only scumreads being pretty much "because Gavial said so" is nagl (especially because I might be missing this but I don't think Herm actually outed a TR on Gavial anywhere?).

probably too convoluted to come from scum

Wiml wrote: ↑Sat Jun 12, 2021 7:17 am
EnderWiggin wrote: ↑Sat Jun 12, 2021 7:15 am
Wiml wrote: ↑Sat Jun 12, 2021 7:14 am I'm not confident HK is town but I don't like his wagon and I certainly wouldn't go there today.
Who would you go for?
ATM? Herm.

because of what esooa said or what

duskfall is probably town for being stubborn about pushing his reads and interrogating those who believe otherwise

Wiml wrote: ↑Sat Jun 12, 2021 8:14 am
Alison wrote: ↑Sat Jun 12, 2021 8:11 am
Wiml wrote: ↑Sat Jun 12, 2021 5:10 am Yeah I agree with Ezooa's take on Wurzel. He makes himself obvious town as town.
so why is wurzel not making himself obvious town this game and has instead posted awkward self aware shit followed by dipping
I'm pretty sure SoD is after he usually goes to bed (he's a fellow brit). He's self resolving and out of the 5 or so people I have no real read on he's the one I'm least concerned about right now.

oki doki, let's save him for later then.

Esooa wrote: ↑Sat Jun 12, 2021 6:28 am being annoyed at creature is NAI because I get annoyed at stuff creature does regardless of my alignment. I still want townies to play even if I'm mafia. I'm saying why I feel that way because it probably applies to Ender too

I don't, I feel warm and happy inside when townies troll the game and I am wolf.

Wiml wrote: ↑Sat Jun 12, 2021 6:23 am Wrt my hk read:

It's mostly for meta/tone reasons. I've been looking for another HK wolf game to compare it to but you can't find them through his MU account for whatever reason.

Gavial is obvious town and HK is pushing him for bad reasons.

Esooa wrote: ↑Sat Jun 12, 2021 8:12 am
Alison wrote: ↑Sat Jun 12, 2021 8:11 am
Esooa wrote: ↑Sat Jun 12, 2021 8:11 am if it matters the town read on me I dislike the second most is actually enders. His reasons were fine but not something I found to be justified under any real scrutiny. Though that's sometimes just how early game reads go
If Herm flips red I'll TR you
I've already moved on. And you'll probably tr anyways

If you do townie things I'll TR you.

Let me read your move off Herm.

Duskfall wrote: ↑Sat Jun 12, 2021 6:08 am
EnderWiggin wrote: ↑Fri Jun 11, 2021 9:41 pm
Alison wrote: ↑Fri Jun 11, 2021 9:40 pm
EnderWiggin wrote: ↑Fri Jun 11, 2021 9:29 pm Hey look at me, getting involved in conversations that started before I woke up.

If I can do it, you can.

Give me a read. I don't care if it's as weak as a nerd on first gym day.
I think this post expresses genuine annoyance at Creature's behavior, which is townie.
Not to ruin people townreading me, but I genuinely wasn't annoyed there. Just poking their response back at them.
I double down on town read (unlike Alison apparently oopsie its my read now)

why

Esooa wrote: ↑Sat Jun 12, 2021 8:11 am if it matters the town read on me I dislike the second most is actually enders. His reasons were fine but not something I found to be justified under any real scrutiny. Though that's sometimes just how early game reads go

If Herm flips red I'll TR you

Wiml wrote: ↑Sat Jun 12, 2021 5:25 am Every reason I've seen for people voting HK right now is bad.

No it's not.

Wiml wrote: ↑Sat Jun 12, 2021 5:10 am Yeah I agree with Ezooa's take on Wurzel. He makes himself obvious town as town.

so why is wurzel not making himself obvious town this game and has instead posted awkward self aware shit followed by dipping

Gavial wrote: ↑Sat Jun 12, 2021 2:58 am
Esooa wrote: ↑Sat Jun 12, 2021 2:54 am I looked at Wiml's posts and realized he didn't actually say anything about the vote other than voting. So maybe you didn't really give a fuck

I figure I know why Wiml voted you so I considered it serious myself though
Wouldn’t be surprised in Wiml/HK/Falcon team with some other random wolf.

Falcon is obvious town.

Esooa wrote: ↑Sat Jun 12, 2021 2:15 am My problem with Herm is he seems to be trying to participate more than actually participating. He's asking a lot of questions, but they don't really do anything, at all. I don't even need a read out of them but I would like to know he's thinking about them at least. Which I don't get the idea he is really ever. Here's some of the questions/attempts at participation I'm talking about

Spoiler: show
Herm wrote: ↑Fri Jun 11, 2021 6:48 pm Falcon, I have a question for you having read only 5% of the game so far.

What kind of scum are you?

Herm wrote: ↑Fri Jun 11, 2021 7:11 pm Wiml is wildin hard.

Herm wrote: ↑Sat Jun 12, 2021 12:43 am I do encourage anyone to vote whoever though.

I will try to read into the votes though.

Herm wrote: ↑Fri Jun 11, 2021 7:46 pm Updated some info about myself while everyone were busy pickpocketing!

Nice to meet everyone! Those who I have met with briefly before and those who I'm meeting for the first time.
The last quote just feels like he's having to force himself into thread. "Wiml is wildin hard" was immediately negated saying oh it was just a joke. Why does he say Wiml is wilding, say it was a joke, then end the topic? Does he not want to ask Wiml anything about Wiml's vote on him? These points are emphasized by posts like this

Herm wrote: ↑Fri Jun 11, 2021 7:12 pm Caught up.

I enjoy all the bird memes. Pretty good stuff.

Herm wrote: ↑Fri Jun 11, 2021 7:40 pm [VOTE: Long Con] aubergine

Long Con going for that long con.
Where after catchup, his summarizing post is "I enjoy the bird memes," or his vote is, "Long Con going for that long con."

Okay I will sheep.

[VOTE: Herm] aubergine

NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME wrote: ↑Sat Jun 12, 2021 2:10 am
Creature wrote: ↑Fri Jun 11, 2021 8:39 pm Is this gonna be a loss?
Yeah probably

wolfy post

Esooa wrote: ↑Sat Jun 12, 2021 2:09 am
Herm wrote: ↑Fri Jun 11, 2021 8:12 pm Seems like Alison pinged Don Wurzel.

I'm placing Alison in my very tiny townpool for now. Looking forward to interact with the Wurzel.
oh, there was also this

It's pretty meh. I didn't think Alison did anything towny but I also know her. Don't know how Herm would perceive it but I'd say it's a pretty expect reaction regardless of his alignment. "Alison is being loud, forceful with reads, etc, so town"

I think I've been the towniest person in the game at the point this post was made tbh.

It's just that you know it's in my scum range to be the towniest person in the game so you don't give me credit for it.

Esooa wrote: ↑Sat Jun 12, 2021 2:08 am so first of all

Herm has on read. It's a town read on me. He outed it after I wolf read him like close to 400 posts in the thread

Whether it's due to me wolf reading him or not, don't really know or care

But I think the fact that it's his only read, and that he outed it in such a weird way, means he's more likely mafia

It didn't feel natural. Why town read me then? He almost certainly didn't, so he had it before, so why not out it then?

Really all I can think is him going "I need to out some reads, Esooa is town"

Which can come from town? But it feels really scummy

Don't know if I'm explaining this properjly

I don't get why this is different from any of the other people townreading you

Gavial wrote: ↑Sat Jun 12, 2021 2:02 am
EnderWiggin wrote: ↑Fri Jun 11, 2021 10:13 pm I kinda like Esooa so far. Might be trying to ride in my pocket but I just like their content so far.
Yeah this game, Esooa is just giving overall Townie vibes.

She's not that townie.

She's been tryharding lately though so it's a pretty good idea to wait and see if she comes out with something big.

Esooa wrote: ↑Fri Jun 11, 2021 11:25 pm
EnderWiggin wrote: ↑Fri Jun 11, 2021 11:21 pm Esooa is trying to get you to dob in how you play as town or scum so she can call you on being similar to one or the other.
No. I actually want to learn how to read him accurately so I can go to Alison haha I can read him you can't

Good luck with that.

Long Con wrote: ↑Fri Jun 11, 2021 10:39 pm
EnderWiggin wrote: ↑Fri Jun 11, 2021 10:33 pm @Long Con

What's your top two non-HK reads?
Esooa, I don't really have another ping beyond that.

I can get on board with Alison and falcon as town.

What's your ping on Esooa?

I'm probably gonna go to bed soon, see you.

Why sign up to a game if you don't want to play Creature?

I saw you in hydra G1 and you were not like this.

EnderWiggin wrote: ↑Fri Jun 11, 2021 9:41 pm
Alison wrote: ↑Fri Jun 11, 2021 9:40 pm
EnderWiggin wrote: ↑Fri Jun 11, 2021 9:29 pm Hey look at me, getting involved in conversations that started before I woke up.

If I can do it, you can.

Give me a read. I don't care if it's as weak as a nerd on first gym day.
I think this post expresses genuine annoyance at Creature's behavior, which is townie.
Not to ruin people townreading me, but I genuinely wasn't annoyed there. Just poking their response back at them.

Ok then, I rescind my townread.

EnderWiggin wrote: ↑Fri Jun 11, 2021 9:29 pm Hey look at me, getting involved in conversations that started before I woke up.

If I can do it, you can.

Give me a read. I don't care if it's as weak as a nerd on first gym day.

I think this post expresses genuine annoyance at Creature's behavior, which is townie.

Creature wrote: ↑Fri Jun 11, 2021 9:28 pm
Alison wrote: ↑Fri Jun 11, 2021 9:27 pm
Creature wrote: ↑Fri Jun 11, 2021 9:25 pm
Alison wrote: ↑Fri Jun 11, 2021 9:22 pm Otherwise I'm going to look at Creature

Please take your time
Why have you chosen to ignore the conversations going on around you in favor of posting a dozen irrelevant one liners
Doubt I can get into conversations that have already started long before me.

ok here's a really simple one then. who is scum

I have no opinion on Creature/LC. When I said I'm looking at them I mean they're question marks to me and I want to find out their alignment, not that I suspect them. I may well come away with a townread on them after I finish my examination.

Creature wrote: ↑Fri Jun 11, 2021 9:25 pm
Alison wrote: ↑Fri Jun 11, 2021 9:22 pm Otherwise I'm going to look at Creature

Please take your time

Why have you chosen to ignore the conversations going on around you in favor of posting a dozen irrelevant one liners

EnderWiggin wrote: ↑Fri Jun 11, 2021 9:23 pm
Alison wrote: ↑Fri Jun 11, 2021 9:22 pm I tire of trying to convince HK he is scum. If anyone else has questions about my HK read I'm all ears. Otherwise I'm going to look at Creature and LC.

Esooa what do you think of Wurzel
Either you think similarly to me or you're jumping on my established IT reads.

I'm not sure how comfortable I am with either option.

no read was expressed in the quoted post other than "HK is scum"

I tire of trying to convince HK he is scum. If anyone else has questions about my HK read I'm all ears. Otherwise I'm going to look at Creature and LC.

Esooa what do you think of Wurzel

I think "you read too much into early NAI stuff" has to be the single most common defense used by scum when I catch them early

EnderWiggin wrote: ↑Fri Jun 11, 2021 9:19 pm
Alison wrote: ↑Fri Jun 11, 2021 9:17 pm what do you think about LC's hopping onto my push on you HK?
I also don't like Long Con.

I don't know how to read Long Con tbh. I used to think I had an idea but then I thought about it and realized I don't.

Last game I arbitrarily decided to just pretend he was confirmed town for no reason and he got killed by the hostile 3P and flipped town.

hollowkatt wrote: ↑Fri Jun 11, 2021 9:18 pm
Alison wrote: ↑Fri Jun 11, 2021 9:14 pm
hollowkatt wrote: ↑Fri Jun 11, 2021 9:12 pm a question people should be asking themselves: would wurzel bus a pack mate at the beginning of a game on a site he's never played on before
Wurzel dropped an RVS vote for you, that is not a bus.
yet I'm paired with wurzel and/or falcon, right? which would make it a bus, even if it's not intended to stick or are we just miscommunicating or using different definitions.

A serious vote that is meant to stick and generate momentum would be considered a bus.

If it's a throwaway vote that is effectively done at random and will be changed or shifted off with the ebb and flow of the tide I don't see why Wurzel wouldn't do it to a pack mate. Even if he's hesitant about murdering a fellow wolf surely he would have no problem with tossing some random votes your away and taking them off later.

Hello Creature.

Why are you acting like this? Is it a cry for attention?

what do you think about LC's hopping onto my push on you HK?

hollowkatt wrote: ↑Fri Jun 11, 2021 7:35 pm
KZA wrote: ↑Fri Jun 11, 2021 7:30 pm
Alison wrote: ↑Fri Jun 11, 2021 7:24 pm Falcon and Gavial are town.

Wurzel outed. Not liking the energy I'm seeing from Wiml or HK.
why is Wurzel outed
nobody knows the mysterious workings of the mind of alison

^

But also if that logic holds HK would still be scum TMI-ing a townie so you should vote him anyway.

EnderWiggin wrote: ↑Fri Jun 11, 2021 9:15 pm
Alison wrote: ↑Fri Jun 11, 2021 9:12 pm
hollowkatt wrote: ↑Fri Jun 11, 2021 9:08 pm Other than my supposed fake incredulity why am I a wolf here, and why specifically with wurzel?
Your townread on Esooa seemed designed to bait out a specific reaction from her more than a genuine expression of your thoughts about her alignment. Which can come from town as a reaction test, but in the moment it felt to me more like a weird attempt at pocketing her or striking up a conversation/rapport with her when she asks why. It's why I mentioned I didn't like the energy coming from you, because it was a nebulous "this feels icky" sense.

Your discredit of my Wurzel read which I felt was pretty well founded made me suspect you could be buddies with Wurzel. The push on Gavial you are currently making makes no sense to me and is caught for the wrong reasons-y. You are also trying to get out of it by being as loud and angry as possible which is a scumtell.
I'd like to say that I've seen Scum discredit fine lynches on townies for no reason other than to go "I WAS RIGHT" as a townread later when/if they flip town.

It also tends to make the towny inclined to be on the side of the person defending them. Honestly, may be personal forum bias, but I usually expect early defenses on little aggression to be less likely to be buddies than more as maf don't want to buddy too early.

I am incredibly arrogant and assume that the scum team is sent into a blind panic every time I catch one of their members early.

hollowkatt wrote: ↑Fri Jun 11, 2021 9:12 pm a question people should be asking themselves: would wurzel bus a pack mate at the beginning of a game on a site he's never played on before

Wurzel dropped an RVS vote for you, that is not a bus.

hollowkatt wrote: ↑Fri Jun 11, 2021 9:08 pm Other than my supposed fake incredulity why am I a wolf here, and why specifically with wurzel?

Your townread on Esooa seemed designed to bait out a specific reaction from her more than a genuine expression of your thoughts about her alignment. Which can come from town as a reaction test, but in the moment it felt to me more like a weird attempt at pocketing her or striking up a conversation/rapport with her when she asks why. It's why I mentioned I didn't like the energy coming from you, because it was a nebulous "this feels icky" sense.

Your discredit of my Wurzel read which I felt was pretty well founded made me suspect you could be buddies with Wurzel. The push on Gavial you are currently making makes no sense to me and is caught for the wrong reasons-y. You are also trying to get out of it by being as loud and angry as possible which is a scumtell.

I don't think it makes sense to accuse Gavial of trolling the game and filling the thread with anti town spam when he's made like two pushes. I've probably posted more about you being scum than he has.

hollowkatt wrote: ↑Fri Jun 11, 2021 9:05 pm
Alison wrote: ↑Fri Jun 11, 2021 9:00 pm hk what's your read on gavial and why?
my read is that he's a shouty gremlin and doing a disservice to town with the way he's posting and focusing on me.
When gavial is town he's generally pretty good at doing actual work, which is why I keep pressing him for what his reasoning is for his read on me, and why I said it's b/c I pwned him in bluey. I don't think he has a real reason for his read because if he did he'd want to be selling people on it, and pointing out how wolfy I've been, or what looks weird and trying to build a case.

Instead he's latched onto a throwaway post, shouted like a toddler, and generally filled the thread with potato based nonsense.

My real read is that he's not town. I'm voting for him because he's behaving differently from my expectations of him, and would like to see him start making actually game relevant posts.

I got the sense in some of your earlier interactions with him that you knew he was town and was trying to chase him off his scumread of you, getting increasingly frustrated and then resorting to pure aggression and a thinly veiled policy exe attempt on him.

I certainly don't buy that gavial tunnelling people for no reason is a scumtell for him

I have a townread on falcon

hollowkatt wrote: ↑Fri Jun 11, 2021 9:02 pm
Alison wrote: ↑Fri Jun 11, 2021 8:59 pm
hollowkatt wrote: ↑Fri Jun 11, 2021 8:35 pm lets be real, the only reason you're on me like this is because I wrecked you in bluey, right? because literally nothing I've done here is alignment indicative for me, and you've not actually said a god damn thing about how you get to a wolf read on me so either stfu and go bark up someone elses tree, or make with real reads and state clearly, for the record, why you wolf read me instead of being a shouty gremlin
your posting has been awkward (eg. "the fuck?" like you're making a token attempt to express incredulity without being incredulous) and this burst of anger seems manufactured
So you think gavial is right then that falcon and I are wolves together? How am I supposed to express incredulity then?
That's also not a burst of anger. I can link you some bursts of anger if you'd like?

no I think you're a wolf, probably with wurzel

hk what's your read on gavial and why?

hollowkatt wrote: ↑Fri Jun 11, 2021 8:35 pm lets be real, the only reason you're on me like this is because I wrecked you in bluey, right? because literally nothing I've done here is alignment indicative for me, and you've not actually said a god damn thing about how you get to a wolf read on me so either stfu and go bark up someone elses tree, or make with real reads and state clearly, for the record, why you wolf read me instead of being a shouty gremlin

your posting has been awkward (eg. "the fuck?" like you're making a token attempt to express incredulity without being incredulous) and this burst of anger seems manufactured

Gavial wrote: ↑Fri Jun 11, 2021 8:21 pm
Alison wrote: ↑Fri Jun 11, 2021 7:24 pm Falcon and Gavial are town.

Wurzel outed. Not liking the energy I'm seeing from Wiml or HK.
Explain.

he's not uptight at all and is relatively free flowing and poking around at various players. He doesn't have the aggressive edge to his posting that I see from him most of the time, but I don't think that's alignment indicative - he had it as wolf. I think that probing attitude is townie for falcon, and you are just tunnelled on him for bad reasons.

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