The Syndicate

falcon45ca wrote: ↑Fri Mar 05, 2021 2:00 pm

Alison wrote: ↑Fri Mar 05, 2021 1:58 pm

falcon45ca wrote: ↑Fri Mar 05, 2021 1:57 pm

Alison wrote: ↑Fri Mar 05, 2021 1:53 pm

falcon45ca wrote: ↑Fri Mar 05, 2021 1:41 pm For all Alison's surety that I'm an outted Wolf, note she's not voting for me.

I called a vote out in thread. I neglected to update the poll because I was too busy dredging up the setup's list of cops to prove you a liar. This is a ludicrous and weak reason and you are flailing.

I'm not lying

Then give your full claim.

You have to flip me.

This is an acceptable proposal.

KZA wrote: ↑Fri Mar 05, 2021 1:59 pm Is there any enclave roles Grogu could be? Important thing to consider

I don't think anything that's happened so far gives us mech info on Grogu.

But I think the way he outed his mech info on Falcon was townie.

falcon45ca wrote: ↑Fri Mar 05, 2021 1:57 pm

Alison wrote: ↑Fri Mar 05, 2021 1:53 pm

falcon45ca wrote: ↑Fri Mar 05, 2021 1:41 pm For all Alison's surety that I'm an outted Wolf, note she's not voting for me.

I called a vote out in thread. I neglected to update the poll because I was too busy dredging up the setup's list of cops to prove you a liar. This is a ludicrous and weak reason and you are flailing.

I'm not lying

Then give your full claim.

TonyStarkPrime wrote: ↑Fri Mar 05, 2021 1:54 pm Yep, exhausted all possibilities. Falcon is VC.

Why are you certain he's VC and not Enclave?

Urist wrote: ↑Fri Mar 05, 2021 1:53 pm

TonyStarkPrime wrote: ↑Fri Mar 05, 2021 1:51 pm There’s another possibility, which someone should breach.

"falcon was eliminated. he was a vanilla townie"

If he flips VT I'm blacklisting him.

falcon45ca wrote: ↑Fri Mar 05, 2021 1:41 pm For all Alison's surety that I'm an outted Wolf, note she's not voting for me.

I called a vote out in thread. I neglected to update the poll because I was too busy dredging up the setup's list of cops to prove you a liar. This is a ludicrous and weak reason and you are flailing.

KZA wrote: ↑Fri Mar 05, 2021 1:50 pm

Urist wrote: ↑Fri Mar 05, 2021 1:49 pm

Urist wrote: ↑Fri Mar 05, 2021 1:47 pm

TonyStarkPrime wrote: ↑Fri Mar 05, 2021 1:46 pm Another possibility, Falcon is new Reno or whatever is the counterpart to Eldridge

NCR? That's why I asked if he was Westin (NCR).
But if that's the case he's already lying about Alison being a slaver so I don't see why we'd believe him.

To be clear, I'm saying it's possible falcon is Westin with a result of "New Reno" on Alison. If that's the case then I might believe it if he owns up to lying sooner rather than later, but ehhh

Well he could have Not New Reno and that would point to Alison being the slaver faking as vig but I doubt that

I've already covered that possibility.

Falcon claimed that he knew I was Slaver from the moment D2 started, and only confirmed I was Metzger after I claimed the dayvig.

If his night result was "not New Reno", he wouldn't have an inkling what I was until I claimed.

TonyStarkPrime wrote: ↑Fri Mar 05, 2021 1:24 pm alison is smart and would probably claim as the slaver here. falcon has no reason to be lying but has a claim that doesn't make sense.

He has a reason to be lying.

1) Falcon is mafia and roleblocks me N1.
2) He accuses me of being Slaver with TMI on Metzger's existence because that's what mafia do, they find reasons to shade and suspect town. It might've also given him an excuse to vote me and not Rej as Urist suspects.
3) Grogu claims that he has information about Falcon - now Falcon is under pressure and has to make a claim. If Grogu is tracker/watcher, Falcon has to assume he was tracked to my house.
4) Falcon remembers 2), and claims he has investigative results on me proving I am the Slaver in an attempt to get me exed before he gets exed himself. He knows he isn't long for this world, so this is his last ditch attempt to drag a strong town player with him into the grave.
5) Falcon gets caught because his claimed results are impossible. The end.

falcon45ca wrote: ↑Fri Mar 05, 2021 12:38 pm I didn't say I had info that proves you're Metzger, I have info that proves you're Slaver. I gleaned you're Metzger when you claimed the day vig

If Falcon is claiming that he checked if I was from New Reno, he wouldn't have any clue who I was before I claimed the dayvig. Yet he says that he knew I was Slaver before my claim, and only thought I was Metzger after the dayvig claim.

TonyStarkPrime wrote: ↑Fri Mar 05, 2021 1:14 pm

Alison wrote: ↑Fri Mar 05, 2021 12:58 pm That is mechanically impossible. I repeat, it is mechanically impossible for an investigative role to know that someone is a Slaver but not which. Falcon has been outed.

Check the list of cops for yourself if you don't believe me. Not a single one of 'em says the faction but not the exact role.

but they can check whether you /are/ eldridge

But Falcon said he came into the day phase knowing I was exactly Slaver, and only thought I was Metzger after I claimed dayvig.

That is mechanically impossible. I repeat, it is mechanically impossible for an investigative role to know that someone is a Slaver but not which. Falcon has been outed.

Check the list of cops for yourself if you don't believe me. Not a single one of 'em says the faction but not the exact role.

falcon45ca wrote: ↑Fri Mar 05, 2021 12:45 pm

Alison wrote: ↑Fri Mar 05, 2021 12:42 pm The intimidator ability functions if Metzger receives no votes 3 day phases in a row.

You planned to leave a checked Slaver alive for 3 days and just sit back and coast while town exes unrelated targets?

You're so full of shit.

Only need to interrupt the cycle once. I've been pushing you for a lynch, but nobody else sees it. Perhaps now they will.



You are a Slaver. 'Nuff said.

You know perfectly well that your push was never going to convince anyone. Anyone with two functional eyeballs could see that the exe today was going to be either Chop or Rej. You have no reason to allow a Slaver to live, especially when you could easily be killed in the night before you could out your results.

Here's the big clincher.

You've said your night action told you I was a slaver, but not that I was Metzger, right?

What role are you exactly? Because I went through a list of all the cops in the game, and not a single one of them would give you that exact information. Westin only confirms if someone is New Reno or not. Luke tells you if someone has targeted the Slaver, but not if they're the Slaver themselves. Dan McGrew is told if a player is Jagged Jimmy J. John Bishop is told if a player is with the NCR. Orville Wright is told a player's exact role - which means you would know in advance which Slaver I was. AHS-9 would confirm what type of ability I had, or if I had multiple, but not my faction. Every other investigative ability can only be brought into play Night 2 or later (eg. those dispensed by inventors).

So yeah, you tell me, Falcon - what role do you have that would tell you I was a Slaver but not which Slaver I was on Night 1?

You visited me NIGHT ONE. The day vig happened DAY ONE.

The intimidator ability functions if Metzger receives no votes 3 day phases in a row.

You planned to leave a checked Slaver alive for 3 days and just sit back and coast while town exes unrelated targets?

You're so full of shit.

falcon45ca wrote: ↑Fri Mar 05, 2021 12:38 pm I didn't say I had info that proves you're Metzger, I have info that proves you're Slaver. I gleaned you're Metzger when you claimed the day vig

No you didn't.

You first claimed to think I was Metzger because you thought I was TMI-ing that Metzger is in the game.

falcon45ca wrote: ↑Fri Mar 05, 2021 12:37 pm

Alison wrote: ↑Fri Mar 05, 2021 12:29 pm Falcon's actions do not make sense as a check.

He voted me on the pretext that he thought I was TMI-ing the existence of Metzger. He did not vote me at the start of the Day and he did not vote me after I made my claim.

If you tracked him to me (or watched him visiting me), it's more than likely he was performing a scum action on me.

No, I voted for you so you lose your intimidator ability, no pretext. I know you're a Slaver. Nice try tho, you are putting up a valiant effort.

This is not how cops with a red check act. If you are a cop you have a red check and town is falsely clearing your target/insisting on chopping something else, you claim and get them back on track. You do not sit around and park a vote on them so they will not get one less vote 3 day phases later.

All he's said is that he visited me, and that he got some kind of info on me that proves I am Metzger, which I am not. Falcon permitted the Rej and Chop wagons to build up momentum even though he "knew" the identity of a hostile 3P. A real cop would out instantly and redirect the votes. There is also no reason for him to continue staying shy about his actual role now that he's claimed investigative.

What makes far more sense is that he was caught visiting me - probably to roleblock me - and the only plausible explanation that he could have given his behavior this day phase is that he checked me as Metzger, so he's hard committed to pushing that line now.

Grogu wrote: ↑Fri Mar 05, 2021 12:32 pm

Alison wrote: ↑Fri Mar 05, 2021 12:30 pm

Grogu wrote: ↑Fri Mar 05, 2021 12:28 pm

Alison wrote: ↑Fri Mar 05, 2021 12:21 pm I am not the Slaver. Falcon is full of shit.

I do not think so. He must have info on you for a fact. Sorry I wished he was lying and hiding info but it makes sense now.

He does not. I repeat, if I am Slaver I have no incentive to flip Falcon because once he flips investigative I lose the game immediately. 3Ps want to survive at all cost, and confirming the person who checked them as being town is a death knell. Falcon is scum, and he's locked into claiming a red check on me so he's trying to suicide bomb me.

Did he claimed a check or some other info?

He has refused to claim anything. Probably because he doesn't want to accidentally contradict whatever info you have and reveal himself to be a liar.

Grogu wrote: ↑Fri Mar 05, 2021 12:28 pm

Alison wrote: ↑Fri Mar 05, 2021 12:21 pm I am not the Slaver. Falcon is full of shit.

I do not think so. He must have info on you for a fact. Sorry I wished he was lying and hiding info but it makes sense now.

He does not. I repeat, if I am Slaver I have no incentive to flip Falcon because once he flips investigative I lose the game immediately. 3Ps want to survive at all cost, and confirming the person who checked them as being town is a death knell. Falcon is scum, and he's locked into claiming a red check on me so he's trying to suicide bomb me.

Falcon's actions do not make sense as a check.

He voted me on the pretext that he thought I was TMI-ing the existence of Metzger. He did not vote me at the start of the Day and he did not vote me after I made my claim.

If you tracked him to me (or watched him visiting me), it's more than likely he was performing a scum action on me.

[VOTE: Falcon] aubergine

Grogu says he's lying. I say he's lying. Flip him and clear me. If I am Slaver then his flipping investigative outs me and I lose the game, so I have nothing to gain from flipping him if I am Slaver. If Falcon is cop then he should be more than happy to flip and out me and Grogu. No town would balk at trading their lives for two scum.

I am not the Slaver. Falcon is full of shit.

Urist wrote: ↑Fri Mar 05, 2021 9:07 am

Sloonei wrote: ↑Fri Mar 05, 2021 2:22 am Actually, on this note: if Rej is bad, he’s Vault City. Enclave is presumably the bigger team, possibly the bigger threat to the collective town factions. If in an ideal world we could choose between eliminating either an Enclave player or a Vault City player, I would prefer to target the Enclave. Chop is presumably Enclave if he is bad.

how did you get to the conclusion that rej is a vaulter?

interactions with esooa

Chop's push on TSP is so bad I wonder if they are teammates.

I've finished my catchup.

Rej is still mafia. Chop is still mafia. Epignosis improved. Dom was very active Day 1 and vanished Day 2. Grogu is lock town.

Grogu wrote: ↑Fri Mar 05, 2021 3:20 am Has falcon claimed anything? I have reasons to believe he is a baddie

Are you claiming a red check on falcon?

ChopChop wrote: ↑Fri Mar 05, 2021 2:20 am

Sloonei wrote: ↑Fri Mar 05, 2021 2:18 am Are we at least all in agreement that rej is mafia?

Here’s another null for me.

I have allot of Nulls

You have null on Rej? I want to exe you even more.

staypositivefriend wrote: ↑Fri Mar 05, 2021 2:17 am epi has been trending up quite a lot, imo

Yes. Marmot and Sloonei are unaligned and I believe it may well be TvS because it does not seem like a TvT fight.

DaughterOfOmega wrote: ↑Fri Mar 05, 2021 12:47 am

Marmot wrote: ↑Fri Mar 05, 2021 12:45 am

DaughterOfOmega wrote: ↑Fri Mar 05, 2021 12:38 am Tried playing league again today, second ranked game played against 3 smurfs, 2 were duo and the AD in the duo was grandmaster main account.

He then was shit talking me in all chat.

Why I want to break my laptop when playing video games

That's the worst.

I hope you didn't break your laptop because some conceited grandmaster thought it'd be fun to dunk on you.

oh dw the account just got permabanned after I spent 10 minutes breaking down why he has no life, and how low of a life form he is.

so now I can go back to doing sometihng fun, if that exists

you should not be getting this upset about league of legends

The problem I keep running into when I think about Chop is that aside from the role stuff, he's still scummy on play. His Day 1 was bad, and his theory that TSP is signalling me beggars belief. He has not provided any reasons for his mess of reads.

Urist wrote: ↑Thu Mar 04, 2021 11:58 pm here are some reads, delivered as promised:

I find this readslist to be thoughtful and insightful. I think you are town.

MacDougall wrote: ↑Thu Mar 04, 2021 10:40 pm

ChopChop wrote: ↑Thu Mar 04, 2021 10:32 pm

KZA wrote: ↑Thu Mar 04, 2021 10:21 pm

ChopChop wrote: ↑Thu Mar 04, 2021 10:20 pm

KZA wrote: ↑Thu Mar 04, 2021 10:19 pm Just give us some reads man

I’ve given multiple.
Any specific read/reads you want?

Just a quick summary of any stronger ones would work best for me

Jack - Scum
Falcon - Town
Urist - Lean Town
Jack - Lean Scum
Daisy - Leany Town
EPig - Leany Null Town

Reads so wild and wacky they can only be from a town. All ChopChop haters are now mafia.

These are not wacky reads. I've expressed all of these reads at some point in the game except for the read on Epi which is word salad.

The real angleshoot is whether or not listing Jack twice on this list means that Chop is the kind of player to leave out Esooa in the message.

Kylemii wrote: ↑Thu Mar 04, 2021 10:56 pm what exactly was in the message? does mafia use up a message ability night one?

Town messenger does, so mafia messenger does, too.

ChopChop wrote: ↑Thu Mar 04, 2021 10:32 pm

KZA wrote: ↑Thu Mar 04, 2021 10:21 pm

ChopChop wrote: ↑Thu Mar 04, 2021 10:20 pm

KZA wrote: ↑Thu Mar 04, 2021 10:19 pm Just give us some reads man

I’ve given multiple.
Any specific read/reads you want?

Just a quick summary of any stronger ones would work best for me

Jack - Scum
Falcon - Town
Urist - Lean Town
Jack - Lean Scum
Daisy - Leany Town
EPig - Leany Null Town

What the fuck is leany null town

Epignosis wrote: ↑Thu Mar 04, 2021 10:14 pm

If you think the letter wasn't proofread for shit then why do you balk at assuming double incompetence?

Epignosis wrote: ↑Thu Mar 04, 2021 9:57 pm

I would absolutely 100% prefer to have Mac's contributions than Chop's.

Sloonei wrote: ↑Thu Mar 04, 2021 10:09 pm

ChopChop wrote: ↑Thu Mar 04, 2021 10:08 pm

Sloonei wrote: ↑Thu Mar 04, 2021 10:07 pm

ChopChop wrote: ↑Thu Mar 04, 2021 10:06 pm Anyway, @staypositivefriend
@NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME

I want to remind you that Alison suggested that if they were in my position they would have fake claimed flavourless VT which is the absolute dumbest thing a town can do.
Scum probably have fake claims and as scum I could have just switched to that instead of hard claiming.

I also said I'd do that and I'm literally and indisputably the best mafia player in the world.

That’s the stupidest thing to do.
As soon as you claim, you die.

Actually what I said was that i wouldn't claim at all.

That was also what I said, just pretend to be a VT and keep your head low.

That emoji was unintentional lol

falcon45ca wrote: ↑Thu Mar 04, 2021 9:37 pm

Alison wrote: ↑Thu Mar 04, 2021 9:31 pm Falcon if you weren't voting me who would you vote?

Rej. Grogu is a close second.

Why not Chop?

Falcon if you weren't voting me who would you vote?

falcon45ca wrote: ↑Thu Mar 04, 2021 9:14 pm

Alison wrote: ↑Thu Mar 04, 2021 9:13 pm

falcon45ca wrote: ↑Thu Mar 04, 2021 9:10 pm

Alison wrote: ↑Thu Mar 04, 2021 9:09 pm I have good news and bad news.

The bad news is that Urist and nanook are the same person, and scumreading nanook for not explaining his reads in-depth is silly. Also, scumreading SPF for getting annoyed when people aren't listening to her or acknowledging her viewpoint is silly.

The good news is that I don't see either of those concerns as looking like a wolf cooking up a reason to kill a townie, and I don't think Urist/Sloonei are in the same team, nor do I think DOOM and SPF are in the same team. So DOOM and Sloonei get points from me.

Who are your Top 5 Scum?

ChopChop, Rej, Epignosis, Dom, and Poison.

I've raised issue with Epi's slanking. Tell me, is this is normal town game? What gets him on your scum radar?

There are a lot of good players this game and all of them were very wrong on D1. The gamestate is suggestive of a deepwolf biding their time through D1 and gently guiding town towards bad exes. Viewing the game holistically, Epignosis checks all the boxes for that role. He was cleared for reasons which, although seeming good at the time, on reflection appear to be rather flimsy. He generated some content early D1, but dropped off sharply, especially after he attained a consensus townread. He silently pushed narratives that weren't really questioned, and made a show of interrogating players, but we aren't privy to what conclusions he arrived at or why. Nobody has shown interest in pushing him or raising tinfoil or suspicion on him, despite tinfoil or suspicion being raised on damn near everyone else.

This evidence is suggestive that Epignosis is a deepwolf working with a team to cover up for him as he slips UTR and gets acknowledged as a consensus townread without people questioning why. Therefore I suspect him.

TonyStarkPrime wrote: ↑Thu Mar 04, 2021 9:14 pm if rej actually just came in and made one or two posts and dipped i agree with alison's assessment/comparison to SI

I'm not going to do Rej's scum game the discourtesy of just saying "we'll sort by post count and be done with it". I'm comparing him to SI on a bunch of metrics, including depth of engagement with the game, general discomfort, attempts to blend in, and the way he tries to deflect pressure off himself by using emojis and a sheepish tone. Those things fit.

falcon45ca wrote: ↑Thu Mar 04, 2021 9:10 pm

Alison wrote: ↑Thu Mar 04, 2021 9:09 pm I have good news and bad news.

The bad news is that Urist and nanook are the same person, and scumreading nanook for not explaining his reads in-depth is silly. Also, scumreading SPF for getting annoyed when people aren't listening to her or acknowledging her viewpoint is silly.

The good news is that I don't see either of those concerns as looking like a wolf cooking up a reason to kill a townie, and I don't think Urist/Sloonei are in the same team, nor do I think DOOM and SPF are in the same team. So DOOM and Sloonei get points from me.

Who are your Top 5 Scum?

ChopChop, Rej, Epignosis, Dom, and Poison.

I would like Urist to give stances on the rest of the game still even if they're unexplained. I just want to know where you're at on literally any subject other than ChopChop who's probably going to be resolved within a couple of days anyway.

I would like DOOM to continue doing her thing.

I have good news and bad news.

The bad news is that Urist and nanook are the same person, and scumreading nanook for not explaining his reads in-depth is silly. Also, scumreading SPF for getting annoyed when people aren't listening to her or acknowledging her viewpoint is silly.

The good news is that I don't see either of those concerns as looking like a wolf cooking up a reason to kill a townie, and I don't think Urist/Sloonei are in the same team, nor do I think DOOM and SPF are in the same team. So DOOM and Sloonei get points from me.

I'm interested to hear your read on SPF, DOOM.

Urist is promising content about the rest of the game. Reading him based on that content seems more likely to be useful than debating the same piece of WIFOM over and over.

KZA wrote: ↑Thu Mar 04, 2021 8:14 pm I also just felt straight up good vibes from Poison so that's probably fine for today

If Poison is scum, exe KZA.

If Poison is town KZA is probably town because this doesn't feel like TMI.

Sloonei wrote: ↑Thu Mar 04, 2021 8:11 pm

Alison wrote: ↑Thu Mar 04, 2021 8:04 pm sloonei, why is poison green?

Spoiler: show

Sloonei wrote: ↑Thu Mar 04, 2021 2:15 am

staypositivefriend wrote: ↑Thu Mar 04, 2021 2:11 am

Sloonei wrote: ↑Thu Mar 04, 2021 2:10 am

staypositivefriend wrote: ↑Thu Mar 04, 2021 2:05 am sloonei, do you have any thoughts about poison's posts on the last page or two?

I like the energy she is bringing, but I have not seen her do anything that would give me a strong indication of her alignment one way or the other. GTH town.

yeah, i liked them too, mostly because her tone feels unrestrained. was curious if you were thinking the same

Actually if there is something more than just “energy” that I would read in her favor: I like that she’s been unafraid to ask questions about things that have already been covered/comment on things she hasn’t read yet. Maybe that’s what you mean by “unrestrained”. It feels like she is here to follow her own leads at her own pace, and doesn’t care about optics or anything other than getting answers.

How confident are you in this read?

Urist has been talking about ChopChop and nothing but ChopChop for the last few dozen posts, with the main exception being to complain about an SPF push against him and support exeing Rej (who's the alternative to ChopChop). I am fine with him personally townreading ChopChop and can see where he would do it as town. My main concern is that in the meantime he isn't producing any content.

Urist, in order to assauge my concerns that you're using this as a smokescreen to avoid taking stances on other players, I would like you to give me a quick rundown on how you feel about the players in this game. A full readslist would be good, but if not, at least outline your stance on some areas of controversy (Mac, Nanook, Marmot, etc.)