The Syndicate

falcon has been fine the past couple of pages, I probably just misread him. Thankfully the real mafia outed themselves in response to my push on him instead of sitting back and letting me int myself into him like I would have.

[VOTE: Marmot] aubergine

The more I think about it the more I realize that there is no fucking way you are scumreading me in good faith for making bold claims and arguing them to the bitter end. You have interacted with me in politics chat, mafia spectator chat, and within mafia games. I have never once backed down on a position or accepted anything other than cold absolutism. It is simply unbelievable for you to think it is >rand wolf for me to tell Wilgy he does not know what ego is.

DrWilgy wrote: ↑Wed Aug 24, 2022 3:15 pm
Alison wrote: ↑Wed Aug 24, 2022 3:01 pm
DrWilgy wrote: ↑Wed Aug 24, 2022 2:58 pm
Alison wrote: ↑Wed Aug 24, 2022 2:24 pm
DrWilgy wrote: ↑Wed Aug 24, 2022 2:21 pm Confidence comes from a built set of interactions within a game typically. I do not believe that opportunity has been made to exist yet, hence ego. I can, however, believe your stance on this matter as genuine to you.

I have never seen a policy executed that has ended favorably for town. Perhaps that's my own play experience, and no, I don't think you have buried Falcon.
It is a myth that you need "a built set of interactions" to catch mafia. Sometimes it can help and sometimes you just need one post to catch them. Mac, who is my identity this game, caught Sabi off their first post last game. Remember that?

Policy exes are the key to success for any village. I consider them a cornerstone of my play.
Yes, but did it come to fruition on Mac going "aha! I have found the scum! Kill them or me!"?
Kinda. Would you like me to link you a game where I did that as town? Just to ease your mind that it is possible for a townie to project such confidence?
No, I do not believe that would help me in this scenario. I'd think I'd fall into my tendencies and just start tunneling you.

I need to digest and see if you genuinely believe your take here.

I do. Next question.

DrWilgy wrote: ↑Wed Aug 24, 2022 3:04 pm
Alison wrote: ↑Wed Aug 24, 2022 2:31 pm
Sabiplz wrote: ↑Wed Aug 24, 2022 2:29 pm
Alison wrote: ↑Wed Aug 24, 2022 2:27 pm
Sabiplz wrote: ↑Wed Aug 24, 2022 2:26 pm Policing someone based off a bad read not even 6 hours into D1 is dumb and anti town behavior.

Anyway are we all role playing as Mac this game?
The policy would be if I deathtunnel someone the entire D1 and they flip town. Either I am mafia powerwolfing or I am a townie who has decided to work for the mafia and either way I should be eliminated in that scenario. It's a sound policy.
Let's say you're town. That's two miselims. It's 9x2. We only have 2 miselims till limlo.

It's a terrible policy that's anti town if you are an actual town player.
If I spent 48 hours running it down I would prefer to be executed instead of dragged to F5 for a free loss. Think about it.
Why are you preconditioning yourself for "running it down"

Only siths deal in absolutes.

I don't know how to explain this to you but absolutes are the best possible thing that you can be doing at this stage of the game.

lucy wrote: ↑Wed Aug 24, 2022 3:06 pm who is outed wolf

You will be if you don't give some thoughts soon.

(It's Visorslash but I am serious about the reads.)

MissSparkles wrote: ↑Wed Aug 24, 2022 3:04 pm
Alison wrote: ↑Wed Aug 24, 2022 3:00 pm
JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Wed Aug 24, 2022 2:57 pm
MissSparkles wrote: ↑Wed Aug 24, 2022 2:54 pm Have you ever changed your avi before? I feel like it’s always the same aesthetic with u and that makes me a sad panda.

I skipped and read the latest page and deduced both of my reads on you on posts I’ve seen from this page aka recent developments.

So like I felt like u saying “u bamboozled her” as mafia before and simultaneously calling her town was a good look and not something I’d see mafia doing, I like your tone and responses towards her and they felt towny in nature.

Alison’s being super aggressive and yea ok could be a wolf in power, but this early in the phase and this vocal more often than not comes from a towny imo
What experience do you have playing with falcon and Alison?
More than enough to know playing aggressively is completely NAI for me.
I mean the last time I saw you open this aggressively you caught mafia as the sk, and the play your doing itself is towny so LOL. So aggressively confident Alison this early has never been mafia for me, so eh not sure why you think this when I’ve never seem your openings as scum too compare

"Alison seems very similar to the time she was the SK... better town clear her"?

That read makes no sense. It reeks of TMI. If anything you should be more suspicious of me.

[VOTE: Sparkles] aubergine

DrWilgy wrote: ↑Wed Aug 24, 2022 3:03 pm
Alison wrote: ↑Wed Aug 24, 2022 2:29 pm
Sabiplz wrote: ↑Wed Aug 24, 2022 2:27 pm Nothing Alison has done since her pop in has given me towny pings.

She's still awkward and stiff.

Anyway I have a migraine so I'm going to be in and out today.
So exeing me now for having stiff tone is a good move, but exeing me if I murder a townie with my bare hands is a stupid and anti town move?
That's the thing I believe you are failing to see. If you are town, you can't murder a townie by oneself.

This is if you are town. The notion that you can be solely responsible for a town yeet still doesn't feel towny.

It's called strongarming. I like doing it.

Marmot wrote: ↑Wed Aug 24, 2022 3:03 pm
Alison wrote: ↑Wed Aug 24, 2022 3:01 pm
Marmot wrote: ↑Wed Aug 24, 2022 3:00 pm I could have an incorrect take on your meta Alison, but the first thing that comes to mind when seeing this argument with Wilgy play out is that mountainous game a few months ago where Sean argued with you on Day 1 with you before you flipped scum, and when I went back to compare metas, the whole argument from you was pretty bad, and probably not one you believed, but you didn't back off.

You might do this as town too. Don't have time to cross reference now though
I believe my arguments. What makes you think I don't believe them?
You told Wilgy that he doesn't know what ego is. I think it's a bold claim to say that someone doesn't know what ego is. I'd bet Wilgy does

He said something was ego.

That thing clearly wasn't ego.

I know he can read and he saw what happened.

Therefore he has an incorrect definition of what constitutes ego. Simple as.

Marmot wrote: ↑Wed Aug 24, 2022 3:02 pm This might sound sarcastic, but it isn't.

This is a good use of selective phrasing to make your statement sound kind while also getting your exact point across.

My point was that I didn't understand your post. No selective phrasing was involved. You might be reading too much into what I am saying.

Marmot wrote: ↑Wed Aug 24, 2022 3:00 pm I could have an incorrect take on your meta Alison, but the first thing that comes to mind when seeing this argument with Wilgy play out is that mountainous game a few months ago where Sean argued with you on Day 1 with you before you flipped scum, and when I went back to compare metas, the whole argument from you was pretty bad, and probably not one you believed, but you didn't back off.

You might do this as town too. Don't have time to cross reference now though

I believe my arguments. What makes you think I don't believe them?

DrWilgy wrote: ↑Wed Aug 24, 2022 2:58 pm
Alison wrote: ↑Wed Aug 24, 2022 2:24 pm
DrWilgy wrote: ↑Wed Aug 24, 2022 2:21 pm Confidence comes from a built set of interactions within a game typically. I do not believe that opportunity has been made to exist yet, hence ego. I can, however, believe your stance on this matter as genuine to you.

I have never seen a policy executed that has ended favorably for town. Perhaps that's my own play experience, and no, I don't think you have buried Falcon.
It is a myth that you need "a built set of interactions" to catch mafia. Sometimes it can help and sometimes you just need one post to catch them. Mac, who is my identity this game, caught Sabi off their first post last game. Remember that?

Policy exes are the key to success for any village. I consider them a cornerstone of my play.
Yes, but did it come to fruition on Mac going "aha! I have found the scum! Kill them or me!"?

Kinda. Would you like me to link you a game where I did that as town? Just to ease your mind that it is possible for a townie to project such confidence?

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Wed Aug 24, 2022 2:57 pm
MissSparkles wrote: ↑Wed Aug 24, 2022 2:54 pm Have you ever changed your avi before? I feel like it’s always the same aesthetic with u and that makes me a sad panda.

I skipped and read the latest page and deduced both of my reads on you on posts I’ve seen from this page aka recent developments.

So like I felt like u saying “u bamboozled her” as mafia before and simultaneously calling her town was a good look and not something I’d see mafia doing, I like your tone and responses towards her and they felt towny in nature.

Alison’s being super aggressive and yea ok could be a wolf in power, but this early in the phase and this vocal more often than not comes from a towny imo
What experience do you have playing with falcon and Alison?

More than enough to know playing aggressively is completely NAI for me.

Marmot wrote: ↑Wed Aug 24, 2022 2:51 pm
Alison wrote: ↑Wed Aug 24, 2022 2:17 pm
DrWilgy wrote: ↑Wed Aug 24, 2022 2:15 pm
Alison wrote: ↑Wed Aug 24, 2022 2:11 pm
DrWilgy wrote: ↑Wed Aug 24, 2022 2:06 pm I don't know what to make of this.

I don't think a town makes this play, there's never a need for it outside of ego. I do think a wolf attempts it trying to squeeze by following. Ye old thunderdome into "oh, me?"

A wolf all in this early though? Clever if the play is to widdle down the dome later and by presenting it early you can get out.
Yeah, a town Alison has never thunderdomed someone on page 3 before. That would be incredibly out of character. Normally she plays so passively in the early game. Hmm.

Have you considered that I am just a townie with a confident read? Why does there need to be ego involved?
Passive, no, but I'd expect you to bury Falcon, not establish a policy. Your question asking about my considerations is also faulty in that clearly in the post above I do so.

This however, I lean towards the replication of Ego. I did try to learn you last game going through your ISO twice just yesterday. There are immediate differences, I think.
I have never made an egoistical play in my entire mafia career. You don't know what ego is. It is not just having a confident read.

I have already buried Falcon. Now I am just getting others on board. You are weirdly reluctant to accept the policy of simply killing me if I am wrong on falcon. Why?
This is forum mafia, not LoL solo queue

Taking this argument to the point of saying that Wilgy doesn't know what ego is is rand scum for you imo, in that when you make a take, you argue it to the end, regardless of how you get there or the solidity of the take.

No offense but I have no idea what you are trying to say in any of these sentences. Please rephrase.

lucy wrote: ↑Wed Aug 24, 2022 2:48 pm
Alison wrote: ↑Wed Aug 24, 2022 1:47 pm Let's skip the part where I tunnel lucy for 5 pages to make her trust tell and just go directly to asking her if she's going to do it.
I don't trust tell lmao

You heard it everyone. No clearing lucy for doing the pessimistic woe is me stuff.

Poor Mac was shaken by last game's hammer.

Wilgy slanks every game regardless of align. This is a break from character. Do you think he does this as town or as mafia more often?

Do you feel Jay has TMI and if so why?

This seems like a situation that calls for nanook to interpret. He is the king of difference checks. What say you nanook?

So the two people I have locked town distrust and scumread me while the person I have lock scum is standing up for me and thinks I'm town. What a fascinating dynamic. I can already see Jay furiously scribbling association charts.

Sabiplz wrote: ↑Wed Aug 24, 2022 2:31 pm
Alison wrote: ↑Wed Aug 24, 2022 2:29 pm
Sabiplz wrote: ↑Wed Aug 24, 2022 2:27 pm Nothing Alison has done since her pop in has given me towny pings.

She's still awkward and stiff.

Anyway I have a migraine so I'm going to be in and out today.
So exeing me now for having stiff tone is a good move, but exeing me if I murder a townie with my bare hands is a stupid and anti town move?
I'm not pushing to lim you. It's 6 hours into D1. I still need to read everyone else in the game. You're the only person not in my null pile this game so far. That's all.

You read all these pages and I'm the only one you have any semblance of a read on? Well go ahead then, proceed at your own pace, I'm sure you'll come up with something.

Sabiplz wrote: ↑Wed Aug 24, 2022 2:29 pm
Alison wrote: ↑Wed Aug 24, 2022 2:27 pm
Sabiplz wrote: ↑Wed Aug 24, 2022 2:26 pm Policing someone based off a bad read not even 6 hours into D1 is dumb and anti town behavior.

Anyway are we all role playing as Mac this game?
The policy would be if I deathtunnel someone the entire D1 and they flip town. Either I am mafia powerwolfing or I am a townie who has decided to work for the mafia and either way I should be eliminated in that scenario. It's a sound policy.
Let's say you're town. That's two miselims. It's 9x2. We only have 2 miselims till limlo.

It's a terrible policy that's anti town if you are an actual town player.

If I spent 48 hours running it down I would prefer to be executed instead of dragged to F5 for a free loss. Think about it.

Sabiplz wrote: ↑Wed Aug 24, 2022 2:27 pm Nothing Alison has done since her pop in has given me towny pings.

She's still awkward and stiff.

Anyway I have a migraine so I'm going to be in and out today.

So exeing me now for having stiff tone is a good move, but exeing me if I murder a townie with my bare hands is a stupid and anti town move?

Sabiplz wrote: ↑Wed Aug 24, 2022 2:26 pm Policing someone based off a bad read not even 6 hours into D1 is dumb and anti town behavior.

Anyway are we all role playing as Mac this game?

The policy would be if I deathtunnel someone the entire D1 and they flip town. Either I am mafia powerwolfing or I am a townie who has decided to work for the mafia and either way I should be eliminated in that scenario. It's a sound policy.

falcon45ca wrote: ↑Wed Aug 24, 2022 2:25 pm
Alison wrote: ↑Wed Aug 24, 2022 2:13 pm So falcon what is your read on me?
Your take on my slot is strangely aggressive if you're Maf.

I'd say you're more likely town who thinks they've caught something

Interesting answer, carry on.

DrWilgy wrote: ↑Wed Aug 24, 2022 2:21 pm Confidence comes from a built set of interactions within a game typically. I do not believe that opportunity has been made to exist yet, hence ego. I can, however, believe your stance on this matter as genuine to you.

I have never seen a policy executed that has ended favorably for town. Perhaps that's my own play experience, and no, I don't think you have buried Falcon.

It is a myth that you need "a built set of interactions" to catch mafia. Sometimes it can help and sometimes you just need one post to catch them. Mac, who is my identity this game, caught Sabi off their first post last game. Remember that?

Policy exes are the key to success for any village. I consider them a cornerstone of my play.

DrWilgy wrote: ↑Wed Aug 24, 2022 2:15 pm
Alison wrote: ↑Wed Aug 24, 2022 2:11 pm
DrWilgy wrote: ↑Wed Aug 24, 2022 2:06 pm I don't know what to make of this.

I don't think a town makes this play, there's never a need for it outside of ego. I do think a wolf attempts it trying to squeeze by following. Ye old thunderdome into "oh, me?"

A wolf all in this early though? Clever if the play is to widdle down the dome later and by presenting it early you can get out.
Yeah, a town Alison has never thunderdomed someone on page 3 before. That would be incredibly out of character. Normally she plays so passively in the early game. Hmm.

Have you considered that I am just a townie with a confident read? Why does there need to be ego involved?
Passive, no, but I'd expect you to bury Falcon, not establish a policy. Your question asking about my considerations is also faulty in that clearly in the post above I do so.

This however, I lean towards the replication of Ego. I did try to learn you last game going through your ISO twice just yesterday. There are immediate differences, I think.

I have never made an egoistical play in my entire mafia career. You don't know what ego is. It is not just having a confident read.

I have already buried Falcon. Now I am just getting others on board. You are weirdly reluctant to accept the policy of simply killing me if I am wrong on falcon. Why?

falcon45ca wrote: ↑Wed Aug 24, 2022 2:13 pm
Alison wrote: ↑Wed Aug 24, 2022 2:12 pm Mac can't play in this game so I have to take his place. I bet you wouldn't give Mac shit if he said what I did. Well I am Mac now.
I gave Mac shit last game we played for his bad read on my slot, so this is demonstrably false.

I was talking about Wilgy's response not yours. Funnily enough yours was perfectly fine.

I found you as town in 1 post last game and defended you til my dying breath. Why can't I do it this game? Am I mafia? Are you mafia?

So falcon what is your read on me?

Mac can't play in this game so I have to take his place. I bet you wouldn't give Mac shit if he said what I did. Well I am Mac now.

DrWilgy wrote: ↑Wed Aug 24, 2022 2:06 pm I don't know what to make of this.

I don't think a town makes this play, there's never a need for it outside of ego. I do think a wolf attempts it trying to squeeze by following. Ye old thunderdome into "oh, me?"

A wolf all in this early though? Clever if the play is to widdle down the dome later and by presenting it early you can get out.

Yeah, a town Alison has never thunderdomed someone on page 3 before. That would be incredibly out of character. Normally she plays so passively in the early game. Hmm.

Have you considered that I am just a townie with a confident read? Why does there need to be ego involved?

DrWilgy wrote: ↑Wed Aug 24, 2022 2:00 pm
Alison wrote: ↑Wed Aug 24, 2022 1:57 pm Wilgy just relax. If I am town my push on Falcon is genuine. If I am mafia either I am deathbussing my partner D1 in 9v2 in which case you should definitely help me do it, or I am outed after he flips green.
That's absolutely not true.

Jay and Sabi have both given credence to Falcon being a net neutral. What would imply you'd be outed after he flips?

This conversation is. Policy me if falcon flips green. Simple as.

Wilgy just relax. If I am town my push on Falcon is genuine. If I am mafia either I am deathbussing my partner D1 in 9v2 in which case you should definitely help me do it, or I am outed after he flips green.

DrWilgy wrote: ↑Wed Aug 24, 2022 1:53 pm
Alison wrote: ↑Wed Aug 24, 2022 1:51 pm
DrWilgy wrote: ↑Wed Aug 24, 2022 1:49 pm
Alison wrote: ↑Wed Aug 24, 2022 1:38 pm Sabi is already light years out of their scum range. Falcon has posted nothing but fluff, lacks the sharp paranoia and inquisitiveness of his town game, and is being towncleared for bullshit reasons. Wilgy is top posting and are you telling me he decides to do that as wolf instead of town?
I disagree with your Falcon take.

I see an effort to break out of RVS early, an introspective that provides play context and movement on two slots.
I have never been wrong on falcon in my entire life. Just sheep me on him and vote me out if I'm wrong.
How often have you caught Falcon D1?

No clue.

DrWilgy wrote: ↑Wed Aug 24, 2022 1:49 pm
Alison wrote: ↑Wed Aug 24, 2022 1:38 pm Sabi is already light years out of their scum range. Falcon has posted nothing but fluff, lacks the sharp paranoia and inquisitiveness of his town game, and is being towncleared for bullshit reasons. Wilgy is top posting and are you telling me he decides to do that as wolf instead of town?
I disagree with your Falcon take.

I see an effort to break out of RVS early, an introspective that provides play context and movement on two slots.

I have never been wrong on falcon in my entire life. Just sheep me on him and vote me out if I'm wrong.

Anyway good night.

Let's skip the part where I tunnel lucy for 5 pages to make her trust tell and just go directly to asking her if she's going to do it.

That's half the game solved in 5 hours, I'll give you the other half by EOD.

Jay has already figured out Sabi and Wilgy's alignment therefore he is townsiding regardless of his alignment. If he is town he will produce the second red flip soon and we win. If he is mafia he will simply be policied after long enough.

Townsiding in 9v2 seems kinda risky and scum Jay would definitely try to powerwolf after what he did last wolf rand.

Ergo Jay is most likely just town and so is Marmot who Jay trusts.

So Falcon's buddy is in Nook/Esooa/lucy/Sparkles/Visor.

Sabi is already light years out of their scum range. Falcon has posted nothing but fluff, lacks the sharp paranoia and inquisitiveness of his town game, and is being towncleared for bullshit reasons. Wilgy is top posting and are you telling me he decides to do that as wolf instead of town?

Marmot wrote: ↑Wed Aug 24, 2022 12:49 pm I don't really have an opinion on Alison yet. I've seen her enter a game once before shitposting, and she was flipped scum Day 1 for it. I'd be a little surprised if she did it again. Not enough content to tr though.

Off to therapy, see you nerdz later

Nah I don't really think about that or care about it at all. It mostly depends on my mood.

Wilgy is town. Sabi is town. Falcon is mafia.

All of these things are undoubtable truths and everyone should treat them as confirmed.

[VOTE: Falcon] aubergine

Going to bed now.

The game has already been solved because I now have 3 cop checks.

[VOTE: NANOOK] aubergine

I say we let the jester win.

[VOTE: Marmot] aubergine

His Vernon vote is extremely sus. Self prez my arze.

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