The Syndicate

Huzzah.

Bonkers supreme.

Everyone leaving my wagon. Feelsbadman.

motel room wrote: ↑Fri Aug 20, 2021 12:57 am
Master Radishes wrote: ↑Tue Aug 17, 2021 10:15 am Scotty's mentions of TSP.

Spoiler: show
Scotty wrote: ↑Wed Aug 11, 2021 7:51 am
RondoDimBuckle wrote: ↑Wed Aug 11, 2021 3:11 am
MacDougall wrote: ↑Wed Aug 11, 2021 2:51 am
Scotty wrote: ↑Wed Aug 11, 2021 1:23 am Rondo hella reactionary though. Can’t shake this feeling, hackles standing up.

But I suck at D1 so maybe I should just pull a Mac and sheep the consensus town
Nah he's just mafia. You're doing well.
Interesting, I dont quite agree with a blatant declaration without any proof to back it up

[VOTE: TonyStarkPrime] aubergine
Note that if you turn out to be bad, this is your teammate just for this random vote.

Scotty wrote: ↑Wed Aug 11, 2021 4:38 pm <snipped irrelevant stuff>

I also like how someone (TSP?) said no more mech talk and it just did. Like, why are we not doing any more mech talk? I might be coming around to the whole mass claiming thing

Scotty wrote: ↑Thu Aug 12, 2021 9:55 am <snipped three other reads (tutuu, mizery, mac)>

TSP Lean town- has some mindmelding with some others lien they’re in some sort of secret organization. I don’t remember what his scum game looks like, but he appears to have a firm grasp of the mech stuff. Probably NAI but I lean town

The first post is...interesting. I could pretty easily see Scotty thinking of trying to tie Rondo to w!TSP 'just in case' TSP flipped sooner or later. Otherwise I feel there's not much point to Scotty trying to pre-flip associate two townies together like that.

The third post is his only read on TSP and it comes towards the end of the round when it's clear he's a liable chop. I don't know whether Scotty was going anti-spew already, or just trying to look last-ditch-solvy to prevent himself going over, but it's probably the latter seeing as it was a close vote? In which case he gave some hip-fire reads on a few players and TSP's is...pretty uninspiring. And the slightly jokey 'secret organisation' line feels too casual for my liking.

--

GTH I think TSP is more compatible than Mizery based purely on Scottyspew, but they both are so I'm fine with killing either.
Ok, but that second post you quoted looks to me more like they aren't in a team together. Did you include that one to show they were or weren't compatible?

I don't think the second post is particularly AI either way? I only quoted it since I was going for any specific mentions to/at/about TSP.

Track me all night long baby.

[VOTE: Master Radishes] aubergine

Collective wisdom can never be wrong right

Weekends aren't a great time for me to work up the energy after coasting for a few days. But I'll try.

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Fri Aug 20, 2021 8:20 am
Scotty wrote: ↑Wed Aug 11, 2021 9:45 am Want to hear from dyson and lomo.
Dyson, what’s the best vaccuum to buy?
Lomo, are you going to slank til you get vigged or are we going to have to lynch you early?
If this is the only post suggestive of town Dyson then I no longer care.

Half of Dyson’s reads in this game have looked fake to me, contrary to popular opinion.

Dyson was my first instinct yesterday, before Mizery.

He’s in the POE that felt good enough before. I’m not inclined to deviate yet.

[VOTE: Dyson sphere] aubergine

Yeah. I liked my reasoning for it not being Dyson, but it's reasonable enough that Scotty had two low presence partners and just called out both of them.

I also don't have a more convincing option right now.

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Thu Aug 19, 2021 8:45 pm Maybe the best argument that Radishes is mafia is that dyachei was the Night 1 kill. dya may be a great player, but I tend to question whether anyone kills them first, before they can even make a post, without knowing who they are. That would eliminate some people in theory.

Except I have a soft heart and wouldn't want to kill someone so quickly like that. (It's why I never would've been scum in S7 G9 as soon as Sloonei died N1, too.)

I had the same thought, that certain people may not have been aware of dya's capabilities and not have chosen them as a kill. (My mind went to Nanook, originally.) But I'm pretty sure Alison subbed in at the same time, so I'm not sure how much water that thought process holds.

falcon45ca wrote: ↑Thu Aug 19, 2021 6:30 pm
Master Radishes wrote: ↑Thu Aug 19, 2021 5:15 pm TSP

Have you actually like

read my iso and how I approached Scotty in D1

or anything like that?
Gotta be honest, that reads as tho you intentionally treated Scotty a certain way so as not to arouse suspicion should one of you flip

So do you think I intentionally treated Scotty a certain way?

Like I was a little surprised I didn't get sussed earlier tbh. But I was enjoying the free ride.

Ugh. Do I actually have to try?

Okay, fair.

Carry on.

Like actually maybe my approach on Scotty is more in my head than in my posts, I don't remember now. But I definitely shaded him early, then sat on that vote despite how close it was.

For that matter, how is tutuu in your PoE based off how Scotty treated her compared to everyone else

TSP

Have you actually like

read my iso and how I approached Scotty in D1

or anything like that?

I'm not bad.

I'm a bad ASS.

Yeah thegame is a bit slow atm since we have a more or less consensus PoE and it has worked so far so we're just sort of waiting to see what happens next.

I say we take two shots into the PoE before we panic about deepwolves. If that means Miz first, fine by me.

Oh okay yeah, I didn't really read Alison's posts very closely.

Now if I were a good player I'd go triangulate my analysis with other data points, like what Miz/TSP say about Scotty, Alison's iso, etc.

But that is a lot of effort and I am not willing to give it.

Scotty's mentions of TSP.

Spoiler: show

The first post is...interesting. I could pretty easily see Scotty thinking of trying to tie Rondo to w!TSP 'just in case' TSP flipped sooner or later. Otherwise I feel there's not much point to Scotty trying to pre-flip associate two townies together like that.

The third post is his only read on TSP and it comes towards the end of the round when it's clear he's a liable chop. I don't know whether Scotty was going anti-spew already, or just trying to look last-ditch-solvy to prevent himself going over, but it's probably the latter seeing as it was a close vote? In which case he gave some hip-fire reads on a few players and TSP's is...pretty uninspiring. And the slightly jokey 'secret organisation' line feels too casual for my liking.

--

GTH I think TSP is more compatible than Mizery based purely on Scottyspew, but they both are so I'm fine with killing either.

Scotty's mentions of Miz.

Spoiler: show

Scotty wrote: ↑Wed Aug 11, 2021 1:03 am lol tutuu out here throwing around townreads on everyone like a Mardi Gras bead queen on Fat Tuesday.

Between that mizery/tutuu interaction tho, I think mizery looks super town. I appreciate the humble attitude about not wanting to be read town for asking mech questions.

I don’t know how tutuu usually plays, but if they’re wolf, they’re trying to D1 power wolf, and power wolves make my head hurt

Scotty wrote: ↑Wed Aug 11, 2021 1:10 am
tutuu wrote: ↑Tue Aug 10, 2021 9:44 pm
Mizery wrote: ↑Tue Aug 10, 2021 9:42 pm Also though that mafia could just kill the town...roled...person...or whatnot, cant they? Otherwise why not just have the prs holster two cycles, have the PR...giver...outer.. out who they targeted, then they know who has the solid abilities or whatnot?

Do the PR...giver....outers...have to use their ability? Otherwise a wolf could just say they were targetef and then that conftown is really just a wolf, no?
"Do the PR...giver....outers...have to use their ability? " - yes, both town and mafia. they can pick to use the first shot on N0 or N1. the second they must use the night after. the pr receiver cant reject it, they have to take it and pick one of the two variants, but they can holster the actual shot indefinitely

and like yeah iss tricky. some info can get lost in the shuffle by lack of organization. lemme think if mass claiming day 1 could be good and could be something other people could be convinced of
Seems like you listed a bunch of prethought reasons to claim, and now that Miz is poking holes in your “plan”, you’re backtracking.

<snipped other stuff that isn't relevant here>

Scotty wrote: ↑Wed Aug 11, 2021 4:30 pm
Mizery wrote: ↑Wed Aug 11, 2021 2:36 pm Does scotty's entrance look like it could be a pocket attempt on me or am I making that up
I entered before you, goober

Also you’re probs the closest townread I have, and I don’t give town reads early often because I suck at tone reads and D1s are the bane of my existence

So yea, sure, jump in my cargo shorts

Scotty wrote: ↑Thu Aug 12, 2021 9:55 am On the flip, the only player that has even come close to pocketing me is tutuu, and I don’t even think that qualifies because I picked her First
Tutuu’s posts have had a pretty logical through line, and I’ve agreed with her today. So either we’re both wrong, right or I’m just a patsy. I choose life, senator.

I think mizery is still pretty town based on like I said, their interaction with tutuu early on.

Mac was on my radar as a possible mindgame mafia, and I guess he still could be the mafia provider, but ima let that play out. If he isn’t the town provider, that’ll sort itself out sooner than later

TSP Lean town- has some mindmelding with some others lien they’re in some sort of secret organization. I don’t remember what his scum game looks like, but he appears to have a firm grasp of the mech stuff. Probably NAI but I lean town

Yeah, they're compatible together. Not, like, 'slam dunk', but sure, it fits.

Although I do find Scotty using Miz's points about mech to undermine Tutuu interesting. I feel normally a scum would be hesitant to use a lower-presence partner's 'points' against a more active player like that.

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Tue Aug 17, 2021 9:28 am Dyson
falcon
Mizery
motel room
Tony

POE pool of 5 in alphabetical order.

Yeah. I do put enough stock in the Scotty post to remove Dyson, personally, but speaking collectively that's fine.

I'd go:

Shoot TSP/Mizery first,

then Falcon,

then Motel,

then worry about a deepwolf.

I guess it could just be Mizery too?

I was going to 'meh' it but his re-entry to the thread here...

Mizery wrote: ↑Tue Aug 17, 2021 3:52 am HELLO

I have a grilled cheese and tomato soup hype

Mizery wrote: ↑Tue Aug 17, 2021 3:54 am Hype a case on me for my acivity? I do remember explaining my lack of presence last cycle- I was working almost the entire weekend and when I wasn't working I was sleeping. Or drinking. one of the above.

...is not my favourite. He deliberately goes for a silly off-topic 'announcement' of his re-entry, and *then* shrugs off the case against him. The decision to make the 'grilled cheese' post first I just understand more coming from a wolfy mindset than a towny one, weirdly.

But that said, his following posts...

Mizery wrote: ↑Tue Aug 17, 2021 3:56 am I'm just kinda. Yall are doing so well, there's like. hardly. any reason for me to try

like

yall are

killing them

Mizery wrote: ↑Tue Aug 17, 2021 4:02 am I also just really like talking to people in thread and I haven't been online enough for that

...just make perfect sense from a towny perspective. Like that's exactly how I'm feeling.

So I dunno. Sure, could be Miz. I can't say I have strong feelings.

It could just be TSP I guess. I feel I'm okay at reading him when he's slanky town and maybe it's just a product of a somewhat lethargic gamestate but I don't really sense the usual slanky TSP I'm familiar with.

I don't feel like even trying to parse Alison's iso for potential spew tbh.

I do sort of think that she doesn't throw her partner w!Motel under the bus so quickly and easily though. I don't think she subs into the game to see the state of the scum team and thinks 'I can definitely solo this against Mac, Jay, Nanook, and tutuu.'

I'm not ruling it out, but it just strikes me as unlikely, even for someone confident in their wolfing abilities like Alison is.

Also just throwing it out there but falcon has shifted from an orangey-yellow 'lean scum I guess' to a greeny-yellow 'lean town I guess' in my head and now I feel like a bad friend for daring to call him scum.

falcon45ca wrote: ↑Mon Aug 16, 2021 8:06 pm
MacDougall wrote: ↑Mon Aug 16, 2021 6:54 pm I wouldn't be surprised if one of the people who got wagoned hard on day 1 or 2 are the last mafia tbh. Feels like that type of game moreso than a deepwolf.
If there's a deepeolf, who's your pick?

I've still got a mild tinfoil of tuutu

Nah, it's not tutuu.

Go pop open Scotty's iso and skim through it. He has way too much interaction with tutuu to be partnered with her. And sure, some scum do that with their partners, but I don't think Scotty does, based on everything else I can glean about him from his iso. At the risk of sounding insulting (which I'm not, because the following basically describes me too) I think Scotty is a fairly conventional wolf in terms of how he's focused on faking solving and nudging along potential mischops and trying to quietly distance from his partners a bit (see the post I quoted in a post above where he handles the LoMo slot). He doesn't treat any other slot the way he treats tutuu.

Man I've brought that post up multiple times this game. It's been an anchor in my solving of multiple slots.

#singlepostreads are the coolest reads.

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Mon Aug 16, 2021 6:58 pm My first guess for #3 is Dyson. I am barely here though.

Nah, don't think so - based on a single post Scotty made.

Scotty wrote: ↑Wed Aug 11, 2021 9:45 am Want to hear from dyson and lomo.
Dyson, what’s the best vaccuum to buy?
Lomo, are you going to slank til you get vigged or are we going to have to lynch you early?

Scotty throws two questions at two low posters and handles them completely differently - LoMo(/Alison)'s question is a serious nudge, Dyson's is a pure joke.

This was the post that directed me towards Scotty in the first place, and, without wasting words overexplaining it, I think Scotty's wolfy intentions with this post are crystal clear and I think it clears Dyson.

NotAnAxehole wrote: ↑Mon Aug 16, 2021 3:11 pm We should have lost this game.

Why

falcon45ca wrote: ↑Sun Aug 15, 2021 2:45 pm
Master Radishes wrote: ↑Sun Aug 15, 2021 1:34 pm I'm going to stay on Falcon because his general ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ attitude here fits with scum knowing they're doomed. I think (/want to believe) that a townie gets a bit grumpy or snarky or self-righteous or something like that instead.
I'm not doomed, even if the vote rands (which it shouldn't) that's 50/50. I'll take those odds to a casino everyday of the week, I'll bet I break even.

I've already had a tempertanrum this game, and I don't have the emotional energy to have another one

Stop saying things that make me want to townread you.

Not much excitement in a round like this, but WINNING is exciting and that's what we're aiming for.

Spoiler: show

falcon45ca wrote: ↑Sun Aug 15, 2021 1:43 pm
Master Radishes wrote: ↑Sun Aug 15, 2021 1:31 pm I agree with tutuu - let it rand.
That's not the town MR I know.

Um. Then you haven't paid attention to me in about a year and a half.

I love rand votes.

This is not an important post to solving the game. I just feel like responding to it.

--

Dyson sphere wrote: ↑Sun Aug 15, 2021 11:48 am Alright, quick question, I've been reading more than one player bemoan the post cap. Do you guys honestly believe that unlimited posting would actually help yourselves or each other or anyone really? I'm sure some of you could make a 1000 posts in a day phase. What would that even accomplish, I just can't understand that. What is there to say except make the thread require more effort to read?

Generally, yes, more posts = more info = more chances to assess people's alignments. There is definitely such a thing as 'info overload' that bogs down the thread, but 100 posts max is limiting for some players and means it's hard to fully evaluate their intentions. It limits the number of avenues of discussion that can take place, for example. It also allows the mafia to not worry about their thread presence as much; higher post counts forces more participation which can force mistakes being made. Some people do their best work when interacting live and just 'vibing' with the flow of the thread, as opposed to reading back and building analysis-based cases and such.

But it's all player dependent, of course. Everyone has different styles.

RondoDimBuckle wrote: ↑Sun Aug 15, 2021 1:40 pm TSP is here now for his last minute vote switch then to pretend he wasnt here at the end of the day again

Axe is also viewing

Maybe, but this is a bad method to read people. I always leave a game tab open on my computer even when not actively playing. (I usually keep my login private specifically to avoid people giving takes like this tbh.)

I'm going to stay on Falcon because his general ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ attitude here fits with scum knowing they're doomed. I think (/want to believe) that a townie gets a bit grumpy or snarky or self-righteous or something like that instead.

tutuu wrote: ↑Sun Aug 15, 2021 1:31 pm Since people will be confused by Master's last post, let me translate:

Basically Master is saying that he thinks falcon is either town-aligned or scum-aligned. One of the two

You just get me.

I am also okay with Alison going over. LoMo fits well with Scotty based on associative stuff, and Alison sounds towny but also she has a kickass wolf game so I can't say I've noticed any single thing that I think w!her couldn't say/do.

I agree with tutuu - let it rand.

falcon45ca wrote: ↑Sun Aug 15, 2021 11:43 am
Master Radishes wrote: ↑Sun Aug 15, 2021 7:38 am The problem with meta is that it evolves. Once upon a time it was easy to read Falcon; then once upon a different time it became harder (for me) as he improved his scum game and could match his tone/style more closely. Recently I felt comfortable reading him again, but less on meta and more so on how he treated me when we were in the same game.

So I hesitate to speak up because I don't want people taking me at my word as if I'm a meta expert. I find when you play *too* many games with someone you begin to see aspects of both their town and scum games in everything they do. I see that here with Falc. On top of that, nearly all our experience has been in the more insular CDC community, and only a handful of games in the last half a year off our home site (here on the Syndicate). Different environments mean changing meta as well, which also makes me hesitant to commit to a meta read.

My main concern here and now with him is that, in my most recent experience, I figured out wolf Falc based on him trying to pocket me, whereas town Falc is usually wary of me at first. In this game, he's...not been blatantly pocketing me, perhaps, but certainly I've seen no attempt to solve me. I feel like town Falcon should've been more reluctant to let me slank my way through the game like I sort of have. I've tried to avoid engaging him beyond non-game stuff to see how that develops and it...hasn't. He's done other little things I associate with town Falc, but big-picture-wise I'm not convinced.

So right now, GTH, I want to call Falcon scum. But if he flips town I'm just going to shrug and re-calibrate my expectations of him for future games together.
These are all fair takes, and I'm ok with how you're approaching my slot.

I prefer solving your slot later in the game, since reading you off tone isn't as easy for me as other players. I find it a simpler task to read you based off who and how you solve, and that's not something I can do in the early RDs. See the Champs game, where I tried to early game read you and failed miserably.

See you're doing it again.

Your first line is something a scum would say to try to appear reasonable etc etc.

But your last line makes perfect sense if you're town here as well.

Exactly.

[VOTE: Falcon45ca] aubergine

The problem with meta is that it evolves. Once upon a time it was easy to read Falcon; then once upon a different time it became harder (for me) as he improved his scum game and could match his tone/style more closely. Recently I felt comfortable reading him again, but less on meta and more so on how he treated me when we were in the same game.

So I hesitate to speak up because I don't want people taking me at my word as if I'm a meta expert. I find when you play *too* many games with someone you begin to see aspects of both their town and scum games in everything they do. I see that here with Falc. On top of that, nearly all our experience has been in the more insular CDC community, and only a handful of games in the last half a year off our home site (here on the Syndicate). Different environments mean changing meta as well, which also makes me hesitant to commit to a meta read.

My main concern here and now with him is that, in my most recent experience, I figured out wolf Falc based on him trying to pocket me, whereas town Falc is usually wary of me at first. In this game, he's...not been blatantly pocketing me, perhaps, but certainly I've seen no attempt to solve me. I feel like town Falcon should've been more reluctant to let me slank my way through the game like I sort of have. I've tried to avoid engaging him beyond non-game stuff to see how that develops and it...hasn't. He's done other little things I associate with town Falc, but big-picture-wise I'm not convinced.

So right now, GTH, I want to call Falcon scum. But if he flips town I'm just going to shrug and re-calibrate my expectations of him for future games together.

Nah we should aim for tied wagons and let it rand.

falcon45ca wrote: ↑Sun Aug 15, 2021 12:48 am Has MR done his ISO of me and I missed it?

I guess I deserve it, I missed his birthday this year. Again

Not even a card.

Nah not yet. Just woke up here. I'll get to it.

JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Sat Aug 14, 2021 4:44 pm @Master Radishes got any new reads? I am not sure what to post in this game right now. Maybe you have something.

Not really. Everyone said the things I was gonna say before I could say them. I like our collective PoE. I could...probably write my own words on them, but I'd end up with a lot of hedging and not really advancing things anywhere past where they already are.

For myself, what I should probably do next is iso Falcon. I've deliberately avoided it because he's the player I'm most familiar with and I was waiting to see if something happened to help me read him.

But overall I tend to trust my instinct about the gamestate and right now I'm okay with it? (Question mark added because I think the post cap is inhibiting my sense of things to an extent.) It's hard to truly gauge after one round, but I don't really feel like this is a game where the mafia are running rings around us or anything. I'm content to fire into the PoE once or twice and see what happens.

There can be only one 'MR' and motel room has been a member of the Syndicate longer, so he can have first dibs on the nickname.

I don't mind being called 'The Master of Radishes' or 'Lord Radish' or 'Radish GOAT' or any variation like that.

I know Mac has the ovaries to pull off a fake claim and all that, but it would be a bit...useless?...to claim giving Rondo a role knowing it would be denied. It achieves little for his hypothetical scum team.

Mac is just 'shrug, probs town' until we have anything more to go off of, imo.

Dyson sphere wrote: ↑Sat Aug 14, 2021 2:55 pm I'm making another post to increase my post count.

This is a good plan.

NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME wrote: ↑Sat Aug 14, 2021 2:46 pm Rondo says he got nothing at all

Actually I don't think he's firmly confirmed or denied anything, unless I missed it. He was being a bit cagey about it earlier.

tutuu wrote: ↑Sat Aug 14, 2021 4:51 am
Master Radishes wrote: ↑Sat Aug 14, 2021 4:49 am
Master Radishes wrote: ↑Sat Aug 14, 2021 4:47 am What's the lie falcon told?
Oh wait, was the lie that he suggested he lost his vote when he didn't?
I think he just used the wrong english tense and meant that he would have lost his vote if he went over, but made it sound as if he did

Yeah that's what my assumption was when I first read it.

Master Radishes wrote: ↑Sat Aug 14, 2021 4:47 am What's the lie falcon told?

Oh wait, was the lie that he suggested he lost his vote when he didn't?

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