The Syndicate

If the wagons will be frozen like this, then I have no other option than switching over to Creature and trust the senses of those voting for him.

nutella wrote: ↑Sat Jul 27, 2019 1:16 pm
Rej wrote: ↑Sat Jul 27, 2019 1:09 pm
nutella wrote: ↑Sat Jul 27, 2019 1:05 pm
Rej wrote: ↑Sat Jul 27, 2019 12:49 pm Nutella played basically like this:
-fluffing from the sidelines (early posts)
-lunching me, also commenting from the sidelines
-doing a pseudo iso on Dom and some gth
-commenting from the sidelines

I heard nutella can perform far more impressive, I don't know her meta, but did she bring forward the DP somehow?
I don't mind voting between Drago and Nutella right now.
Not sure what you mean bring forward the dp, but I am considering the other side after your recent posts. I won't have time to look much into Drago before the deadline, but based on how the discussion goes I could be convinced to vote him over you.
Are you just convinced by my posts or do you have an own opinion on the drago case? I don't see myself as overly good scumhunter, but I just feel like pointing out some things and getting some things pointed out.

Bringing forward the DP = contributing and concluding. For your case the only noteable I have seen was an ISO case on Dom for example.
Mostly starting to be convinced by your posts, but I also liked rimmer's point about drago's relative lack of comment on your lynch train (which I still need to verify for myself)

why you mention dragomir's case in this context, were you showing readyness to lynch him?
but timmer convinced you to keep your vote on me? just timmer? cmon, timmer hasn't a wagon on him but you seem to act like timmer is still in danger in anyway.

so when I flip town after my lynch then people will dig into you timmer dom and drago because I am 100% convinced now that one or up to 2 of you guys could be scum.
If people ask why I am so laid back, I am multitabbing like 6 games currently so it happens that I miss stuff and don't particulary care about it. Atleast I still try to perform in my best way, even if I tend to use bad or mistaken wording. Ya guys will get used to me.

Dyslexicon wrote: ↑Sat Jul 27, 2019 1:08 pm I don't know Timmer very well, but I haven't really felt them suspicious in how they handled Rej.
I also think Rej is likely town.
Owner also comes across town to me from what I know.
There's other players that seem town to me to some extent, but I'm not very familiar with them. Like Tony. But I think I felt some psychic energy between Tony and Creature at a point.

Then there's people who are barely here. Luna and Sabie I've played with and would want to post much more content.

Juliets is a bit forgettable tbh. She had a case on Rej. Actually don't think I love that she kind of picked up from me - "You're right, Dizzy" and then went on to make the case. I feel like if Rej is actually town, it's pretty easy to make a "sound case" on him and not look bad for doing it.

I am known for having bad D1s from time to time, especially in a new enviroment I gotta get used to it + the fucking heatwave in germany which is luckily over by tomorrow lol. Sry for defending myself that way haha.

nutella wrote: ↑Sat Jul 27, 2019 1:05 pm
Rej wrote: ↑Sat Jul 27, 2019 12:49 pm Nutella played basically like this:
-fluffing from the sidelines (early posts)
-lunching me, also commenting from the sidelines
-doing a pseudo iso on Dom and some gth
-commenting from the sidelines

I heard nutella can perform far more impressive, I don't know her meta, but did she bring forward the DP somehow?
I don't mind voting between Drago and Nutella right now.
Not sure what you mean bring forward the dp, but I am considering the other side after your recent posts. I won't have time to look much into Drago before the deadline, but based on how the discussion goes I could be convinced to vote him over you.

Are you just convinced by my posts or do you have an own opinion on the drago case? I don't see myself as overly good scumhunter, but I just feel like pointing out some things and getting some things pointed out.

Bringing forward the DP = contributing and concluding. For your case the only noteable I have seen was an ISO case on Dom for example.

nutella wrote: ↑Sat Jul 27, 2019 12:10 pm hmm let's look at dom's iso and my iso and compare the volume of reads!

dom: 29 posts, many of which are just jokey banter and several more of which consist more of his particular brand of snarky prodding (usually exaggerating an insinuation about a player's behavior to an undeserved extent, such as the one I am debunking right now about my content).
Reads of players contained therein:
1. Suspects sig for appealing to meta
2. Doesn't like nova/creature exchange, doesn't like nova in general, votes nova.
3. Doesn't like the rej/timmer exchange, doesn't like rej in general, votes rej.
4. Not sure this counts as a read but repeated prodding of sloonei for dodging a question or something I don't follow, it's classic dom blowing up a molehill
5. Couple other things that don't really count as reads. Doesn't like timmer "downplaying his prowess," criticizes both LC and me for not producing enough content.

So that's somewhere between 4 and 7 reads on players. I don't know what Dom thinks about many other players. There are a lot that he straight up never mentioned. I'm sure the same is true for me, but I don't think he gets to be on his high horse about this.

Now me: 14 posts, a handful of which are either jokes or mentioning I'm busy.
1. "Drago, sig, sloonei all town. Dyslexicon and creature bad. Quin who knows." That's five and a half actual reads on player alignments right off the bat. In a single post I have reached read parity with Dom.
2. Called out nova for being spicy. Tbf still not sure how I feel about him so maybe that's another half read.
3. Hated rej's content and voted for him. Wasn't sure about timmer's position in the situation.
4. Think Owner is town.
5. Said dizzy could be 3p.

That's like... eight or nine reads.

Basically Dom is full of shit. I know that his way of calling people out for little things is consistent with his town meta, but when I actually break it down and compare it to the rest of his content, I'm not impressed. He's using his nudges to push people into the spotlight to draw attention away from his own hypocrisy.

Ok I will put a theory together:
Nutella and Dom are scumbuddies, both tried to interact with each other, but nutella's conclusion about Dom is giving me the feel of nutella defending herself and dom in some shady way:
"I'm sure the same is true for me, but I don't think he gets to be on his high horse about this."
Is she intentionally pushing forward dom to "play"?

Both ended up lynching me and stopped interacting with each other. Dom did not answer to nutella's case but rather digs into my case and lunches me off.
In the end I feel that both nutella and Dom's vote came out of nowhere, they just tried to take a standpoint.
I feel Dom has hard times finding a lynch target here.

Sry for firing so many shots, I feel people expect this from me.
I did a soft ISO on Dom, do you want me to dig more into him? In the end you can twist anything around to look scummy if you just have scenario to speculate on and see how big the accuracy is.

[VOTE: nutella] aubergine
anyway let's try out this

Dyslexicon wrote: ↑Sat Jul 27, 2019 12:49 pm
Rej wrote: ↑Sat Jul 27, 2019 12:43 pm I can confirm that Michelle can be a lazy/busy player sometimes. I could read her better with more input from her side.

A last question to you veterans: more people jumping on my cases/drago cases, does it mean that this are mostly civillians jumping over to look and make right decisions or could it be baddies who approach to save someone?

Ok from my perspective I am a civillian this makes everyone who looks into Dragomir and everyone who wants to safe me more of a civillian. On the other side I don't know if mafia profits from mislynching Dragomir, when Dragomir approaches me or other people agressively. So mafia rather profits from Dragomir'S agressive play and mafia would rather push forward the votes on me and safe Drago.

I still wonder what role timmer's plays in this.

I will ISO nutella because she wanted to take a look on my and dragos and timmers cases I think.
But like, why would Drag be a mislynch? Do you not consider it likely that he's not a mislynch? In which case, why are you voting there?

And to the other stuff ... it's usually not as simple as "baddies vote there" or "civs all follow this lead". It's way messier than that. A lot of the time I find scum are actually voting off wagons and trying to not attract attention (depending on play style)

I will tell you more about what I know about Drago.
When I started mafia there was almost a golden rule where you tried to get Dragomir lynched D most of the time because for a period of time dat guy had some lesser evolved scumplay and meta. Then I played less with Drago while he had a streak of hosting, laying low, gathering experiences outside our enviroment. Then he suddenly came back and we had a game where we were mafia together. Since then I saw Dragomir differently, he also wanted to become a better mafia player and all in all he became a more agressive player.
Right now I have hard times trusting Drago especially when arguments get thrown around of me being an easy lynch sometimes or whatever.

That's why I think he could be a mislynch but it depends on what mindset mafia follows.

Also what are your thoughts on nutella? Do you like her play this DP?

Nutella played basically like this:
-fluffing from the sidelines (early posts)
-lunching me, also commenting from the sidelines
-doing a pseudo iso on Dom and some gth
-commenting from the sidelines

I heard nutella can perform far more impressive, I don't know her meta, but did she bring forward the DP somehow?
I don't mind voting between Drago and Nutella right now.

I can confirm that Michelle can be a lazy/busy player sometimes. I could read her better with more input from her side.

A last question to you veterans: more people jumping on my cases/drago cases, does it mean that this are mostly civillians jumping over to look and make right decisions or could it be baddies who approach to save someone?

Ok from my perspective I am a civillian this makes everyone who looks into Dragomir and everyone who wants to safe me more of a civillian. On the other side I don't know if mafia profits from mislynching Dragomir, when Dragomir approaches me or other people agressively. So mafia rather profits from Dragomir'S agressive play and mafia would rather push forward the votes on me and safe Drago.

I still wonder what role timmer's plays in this.

I will ISO nutella because she wanted to take a look on my and dragos and timmers cases I think.

Dyslexicon wrote: ↑Sat Jul 27, 2019 6:35 am I have no fucking clue what Rej is doing. I was worried that he might be town that just plainly doesn't make sense and clam up. I've seen a lot of town getting lynched for "that doesn't make any sense" - but then they're still town. BUT, the fact that he is just giving up is a really bad look. On the other hand, the game seems quite stagnant and whatever with Rej being a leading wagon by far. I'm not sure it would be like this if Rej was mafia? Maybe other mafia want bussing credit, but also meh. So if Rej is not town I could also see them being an Indy. Would explain why it seems like nobody really cares that much.

Right now I'm suspicious of anyone tiptoeing around the Rej lynch by not talking about it or just "Why is Rej being lynched guyezz?" (Looking at you, Jack). I don't see any town motivation to not get into the discussion unless you're going to something else. This is also why I don't really like Quin.

@Rej - If you are actually town here, this is a golden opportunity to gather a lot of analysis and reads.

Oh I thought the DP would be far from over. I am out and I have to fiddle myself back into the game. I can do some ISO on the people that voted for me. I think I delivered my concern about Dragomir. Guy wanna lynch me off in two games without big reasoning. How big is the chance that guy is scum in one of both scenarios.

Dragomir and others should know me, I would never go hyperagressive on someone if I wouldn't be town/indie. Also as mafia I would rather sheep my partners, especially in a new enviroment I could never take the lead.

People know exactly my meta and still vote me up..."Dragomir"

Dragomir should townread me based on meta or atleast read me as indie (I AM NOT AN INDIE).

I refused from voting timmer because guy has too much backup and I can't break him. I am not a veteran guy like you, I play for 5 months. Also currently I suffer from a heatwave so I just play convenient and halfassed. I am sorry, if I survive this lynch I will find a way to fiddle back into the game.

Also people really think I am bad, feels like everything I pull off is bad lol. Sry I have a chance of 90% getting a bad role and this time I hit the 10%. *Rough feelings*

[VOTE: Dragomir] aubergine

I like you dyslexicon, you are town because you dig up into my case, either you want towncreds or you rly wanna save a fellow townie from a mislynch. I have never been good saving myself from a mislynch.

[mention]juliets[/mention]

juliets wrote: ↑Fri Jul 26, 2019 5:47 pm Rej, I went back over your case again and have re-printed it here below in the spoiler. I don't rule out changing my mind about you but I see a lot of things in your case about timmer that just don't make sense. Plus, I'm really stuck on the fact you voted timmer just because he told you to read the thread. It looked like an overreaction or as I said earlier, that ya'll are teammates. Please answer my questions after the spoiler about your case.

Spoiler: show
Rej wrote: ↑Fri Jul 26, 2019 1:12 pm @timmer
I am still convinced that you are bad, the way the wagon got turned on me is prove enough.

First of all: You were also one of those that didn't fully track D0, so in order for you to contribute you jumped on my bait question and threw shades on me for not reading up myself. But at that point you also weren't updated, so if you were a civ that didn't catch up in the thread, then you should follow the same interest as me.

What I see you being an extremly opportunistic player and that this doesn't follow a civillian mindset. First your jump on my bait, then you magically getting rid of my wagon is well played. But tbh only the baddies play like that.

I will tell you what will happen: I will get lynched this DP, while my vote stays on you. And after that it will be clear that our case is V/W case.
A V/W case where the wolf is totally opportunistic going against civillians.

I think I described it correctly, what do you think?
So here are some things I just don't get:

1. Why are you calling your question about someone summarizing Day 0 a "bait" question? Bait for what? It looked like a normal question from someone who was not caught up.

2. You said timmer threw shade at you but I didn't see his comment that it was just 4 pages you could read it as shade. You said "if you were a civ that didn't catch up in the thread, then you should follow the same interest as me." What does that mean, follow the same interest as you?

2. What do you mean when you say timmer "got rid of your wagon"? I don't remember there being a wagon on timmer. The paragraph did not make sense to me.

3. At the end you call timmer totally opportunistic. I don't get that - can you explain further? You voted for him first, not the other way around.

You are saying it for yourself, I was just asking a normal question. You are underlining this statement right? So this means a normal question deserves normal answers right? Normal answers that tend to help me get into and cooperate with people (civillians) right?
So again a civillian, especially one who hasn't cought up himself is telling me to read it myself. I still think it was timmer's convenient way in bringing his own DP forward to look like civillian. I tend to never townread people like him and it's often correct.

Especially when I am new in an enviroment it is good to have some quick summaries in order to get those people help the civs.

Timmer had a wagon of 3 votes on him, while I was offline the "wagon" got change on me. It was again opportunistic same as when he gave his convenient answer to my summary question. Would a civillian do that? I just had my eyes open and I am convinced I cought a bad guy. While timmer is playing opportunistic and turned everything against me.

Is self voting allowed here? I feel like scum myself right now. My stance on timmers is clear, I tried to pull out a neutral read there without digging into someone's meta. Guy basically OMGUS vote me, instead of taking a proper stance. I fos him for a reason beyond simply "not helping". I fos him for a whole mentality and I reasoned that.

[mention]timmer[/mention]
I am still convinced that you are bad, the way the wagon got turned on me is prove enough.

First of all: You were also one of those that didn't fully track D0, so in order for you to contribute you jumped on my bait question and threw shades on me for not reading up myself. But at that point you also weren't updated, so if you were a civ that didn't catch up in the thread, then you should follow the same interest as me.

What I see you being an extremly opportunistic player and that this doesn't follow a civillian mindset. First your jump on my bait, then you magically getting rid of my wagon is well played. But tbh only the baddies play like that.

I will tell you what will happen: I will get lynched this DP, while my vote stays on you. And after that it will be clear that our case is V/W case.
A V/W case where the wolf is totally opportunistic going against civillians.

I think I described it correctly, what do you think?

Creature wrote: ↑Thu Jul 25, 2019 8:40 pm
Rej wrote: ↑Thu Jul 25, 2019 8:32 pm sounds reasonable, I like this thinking even if it risks mislynches
Not if you keep an eye for the deadline and keeps the wagon on someone you scumread.

interesting, gotta keep my eye on you, gotta learn alot from you

I will go sleep now see ya later

Creature wrote: ↑Thu Jul 25, 2019 8:24 pm
Rej wrote: ↑Thu Jul 25, 2019 8:07 pm @Creature why are you voting TonyStarkPrime? yout vote gave me sheepy vibes
is there a reason why you wanna get a big wagon running? why so eager?
I voted TonyStarkPrime for reactions.

Big wagons cause more infospreading because it puts someone in spotlight, making that person squirm more while also making others need to justify their stances around said person.

sounds reasonable, I like this thinking even if it risks mislynches

[mention]Epignosis[/mention] just wanted to be sure there is no convenience or sheeping in that vote. Some people might do so for chainreactions.

I don't mind the wagon on Timmer tho.

Epignosis wrote: ↑Thu Jul 25, 2019 8:09 pm
Rej wrote:why you voting timmer now, you just pointed out he and me could be team mates

i mean, is that the only reason? I would like to hear more on why the vote...

Sloonei wrote: ↑Thu Jul 25, 2019 6:47 pm
Rej wrote: ↑Thu Jul 25, 2019 11:50 am
Poison Chan wrote: ↑Thu Jul 25, 2019 10:45 am Poison Arrives.
Poison is civillian.

Other civillians: Sig, Juliets, Dragomir
All others might be bad.
Tell me about these reads, Rej.

they were just GTH reads, nothing essential I threw out D0, maybe I just want those people to be civillian

[mention]novaselinenever[/mention] no man you are right it was fabricated, is this AI now?

Dragomir wrote: ↑Thu Jul 25, 2019 6:57 pm
Rej wrote: ↑Thu Jul 25, 2019 6:11 pm
timmer wrote: ↑Thu Jul 25, 2019 5:40 pm
Rej wrote: ↑Thu Jul 25, 2019 5:33 pm
timmer wrote: ↑Thu Jul 25, 2019 3:20 pm
Rej wrote: ↑Thu Jul 25, 2019 3:19 pm Can someone summarize noteable events from D0 in one hunch?
It's only 4 pages to read...
I expect more help from a "fellow civillian".
It's literally all the help I can offer, as I haven't read them.

I skimmed through and I had hard times getting reads, so my question, was my civillian way of getting either a short summary or get other reactions out.
A bad guy here would take the most convienient answer to my question just to show activity.
That's not how it works and you know it.

But I can make it work bruh

[mention]Epignosis[/mention] why you voting timmer now, you just pointed out he and me could be team mates

[mention]Creature[/mention] why are you voting TonyStarkPrime? yout vote gave me sheepy vibes
is there a reason why you wanna get a big wagon running? why so eager?

timmer wrote: ↑Thu Jul 25, 2019 5:40 pm
Rej wrote: ↑Thu Jul 25, 2019 5:33 pm
timmer wrote: ↑Thu Jul 25, 2019 3:20 pm
Rej wrote: ↑Thu Jul 25, 2019 3:19 pm Can someone summarize noteable events from D0 in one hunch?
It's only 4 pages to read...
I expect more help from a "fellow civillian".
It's literally all the help I can offer, as I haven't read them.

I skimmed through and I had hard times getting reads, so my question, was my civillian way of getting either a short summary or get other reactions out.
A bad guy here would take the most convienient answer to my question just to show activity.

[VOTE: timmer] aubergine

timmer wrote: ↑Thu Jul 25, 2019 3:20 pm
Rej wrote: ↑Thu Jul 25, 2019 3:19 pm Can someone summarize noteable events from D0 in one hunch?
It's only 4 pages to read...

I expect more help from a "fellow civillian".

Can someone summarize noteable events from D0 in one hunch?

Poison Chan wrote: ↑Thu Jul 25, 2019 10:45 am Poison Arrives.

Poison is civillian.

Other civillians: Sig, Juliets, Dragomir
All others might be bad.

TonyStarkPrime wrote: ↑Thu Jul 25, 2019 9:01 am
Rej wrote: ↑Thu Jul 25, 2019 8:58 am
Dragomir wrote: ↑Thu Jul 25, 2019 8:52 am [VOTE: Sig] aubergine
D0 votes?
LMAO
Sometimes people just get very eager and can’t wait to kill someone. I think that’s a good sign scum doesn’t want to seem too bloodthirsty where town just wants to get to the lunch.

got it, Drago is always this bloodthirsty tho, last game D0 and also where we come from

Dragomir wrote: ↑Thu Jul 25, 2019 8:52 am [VOTE: Sig] aubergine

D0 votes?
LMAO

Dragomir wrote: ↑Wed Jul 24, 2019 6:55 pm
Rej wrote: ↑Wed Jul 24, 2019 6:12 pm I slowly start to figure out how Drago plays D0 lol.

@novaselinenever oh I love Zeitreise/Trime Travel alot! but currently I am looking for stuff with Witches, as I am a Witch fanatic
Have you now? Enlighten us.

You are just agressiely bullshitting.

I slowly start to figure out how Drago plays D0 lol.

[mention]novaselinenever[/mention] oh I love Zeitreise/Trime Travel alot! but currently I am looking for stuff with Witches, as I am a Witch fanatic

novaselinenever wrote: ↑Wed Jul 24, 2019 4:01 pm Rej watch Dark, if you haven't already. You're welcome.

why? a co-worker is also telling me to watch it lol
I currently read TPN from the beginning on, gotta catch up! Love it so I am full heart with TPN!

FINALLY...just kidding lmao

I am town guys, lets have fun!

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