The Syndicate

Trustworthy Liberal wrote: ↑Fri Nov 06, 2020 10:17 pm YOu are all legit pushing me i have nothing more to do i have been pushed for three days now and everyone just seems okay with it we lose by you all killing me.

SO NUTELLA S TOWN ALWAYS SHOOTS

I AM THE ONLY ONE PUSHING YOU OVER HYENA
and well Hyena but that doesn’t count

This is noted in my “who is most likely scum” book

TL is now actively trying to achieve a town loss

Trustworthy Liberal wrote: ↑Fri Nov 06, 2020 10:15 pm I am town and all players think am mafia.
I think its just alison here so shoot them TSP claims a tiebreaker you can just kill me with that if alison is town and we lose anyway.

But if no shot hits and you kill me we just lose

I have a tiebreaker I don’t have a “stop wolves from achieving a parity win con”breaker

Nutella don’t shoot anyone for obvious game related reasons smh.

I think it’s more likely to be TL though some things have made me uncertain

Nutella’s around hi Nutella how are you

But Id say that your hostility feels forced

I also might be missing something here

You can solve with it as you like! But I don’t know what it does and I’d be leery of using any hypotheticals about what it does to solve the game. But yes, I’ve come to the conclusions that you’ve come to.

Well it kinda helps

I targeted nutella. This could be something blocky and it could be something doctory. That doesn't help.

It doesn't change who is most likely mafia and it explains everything and it fits with the current knowledge

would that do it?

what if the mafia kill is somehow restricted just how nutella's kill is

okay nutella has no more shots is also something to consider

Trustworthy Liberal wrote: ↑Fri Nov 06, 2020 8:31 pm
TonyStarkPrime wrote: ↑Fri Nov 06, 2020 8:29 pm
Trustworthy Liberal wrote: ↑Fri Nov 06, 2020 8:28 pm Everytime i see TSP try to clear himself from the roleblock thats been stated to have a failure chance i think they are more and more likely a wolf
I mean seriously I'm not going to accept "TSP is a wolf he got blocked" and also "TSP can't clear himself from a block cause the block maybe doesn't work who knows even though there's actually no mechanic that suggests that this is by chance" but I include further reasoning why I think I was definitely blocked N2 so
You are saying i am town cause i must have been Roleblocked D2 cause i for sure wasn't the last night.
I don't trust that and theres no way to confirm it.

I know you don't trust that. I'm not trying to use it to 100% confirm me. There are other reasons to confirm me. I don't like you pinning all of my towniness on "I was blocked n2"

Trustworthy Liberal wrote: ↑Fri Nov 06, 2020 8:28 pm Everytime i see TSP try to clear himself from the roleblock thats been stated to have a failure chance i think they are more and more likely a wolf

I mean seriously I'm not going to accept "TSP is a wolf he got blocked" and also "TSP can't clear himself from a block cause the block maybe doesn't work who knows even though there's actually no mechanic that suggests that this is by chance" but I include further reasoning why I think I was definitely blocked N2 so

Hyena wrote: ↑Fri Nov 06, 2020 8:25 pm
TonyStarkPrime wrote: ↑Fri Nov 06, 2020 8:24 pm
Alison wrote: ↑Fri Nov 06, 2020 8:22 pm
TonyStarkPrime wrote: ↑Fri Nov 06, 2020 8:22 pm I don't think it's possible that there was a holster on night 5 unless something went badly wrong
Why?

TonyStarkPrime wrote: ↑Fri Nov 06, 2020 8:22 pm cause any kill wins?
What scum team CHOOSES to holster. And not like immediately try to frame me and all that
It would HAVE to be one of me and TL then if this is the case, right?

I think there are about a dozen reasons why it's always one of you or TL

So, as TL raises, the question becomes why is the game ongoing. Inference, there's another force in play. It's why I suspect I wasn't blocked last night or the block failed and thus why I'm more confident that the block worked on night 2. Not being blocked means either one of the punk chat members has the ability to hold the block secretly or they are both lying.

or wolves holstered n3 shot alison n4 and shot me n5 because lol and got vested

Main wolf still doesn't know lost wolf and is in no danger of getting chopped is the only thing I can think of

Alison wrote: ↑Fri Nov 06, 2020 8:22 pm
TonyStarkPrime wrote: ↑Fri Nov 06, 2020 8:22 pm I don't think it's possible that there was a holster on night 5 unless something went badly wrong
Why?

TonyStarkPrime wrote: ↑Fri Nov 06, 2020 8:22 pm cause any kill wins?

What scum team CHOOSES to holster. And not like immediately try to frame me and all that

wait alison and me are also team-cleared via n2. I was blocked, Alison was still locked up. there was a kill

cause any kill wins?

I don't think it's possible that there was a holster on night 5 unless something went badly wrong

I had already locked up alison before but good try

Alison wrote: ↑Fri Nov 06, 2020 8:02 pm
TonyStarkPrime wrote: ↑Fri Nov 06, 2020 8:01 pm
Alison wrote: ↑Fri Nov 06, 2020 7:59 pm I don't think that theory about mafia losing their NK makes sense though, game balance wise. In that universe, town would have a suicide bomber, an investigative, some inventor that gives notes, a neighbourhood with a roleblock, and a dayvig, and scum get... their nightkills stripped away after D2 and a lost wolf?

The only world in which that is even remotely balanced PR wise is if nutella is scum and the dayvig is supposed to compensate for the lack of nightkill, but Occam's Razor is that this theory just isn't true.
We never found the inventor, I'm actually guessing they're a scum role (which would mean one of the VT claims is scum by nature).
I thought Enrique was the inventor?

Enrique apparently invented multiple things and then died and kept going then

But yeah I get your meaning. Could just be a mechanical snafu

Alison wrote: ↑Fri Nov 06, 2020 7:59 pm I don't think that theory about mafia losing their NK makes sense though, game balance wise. In that universe, town would have a suicide bomber, an investigative, some inventor that gives notes, a neighbourhood with a roleblock, and a dayvig, and scum get... their nightkills stripped away after D2 and a lost wolf?

The only world in which that is even remotely balanced PR wise is if nutella is scum and the dayvig is supposed to compensate for the lack of nightkill, but Occam's Razor is that this theory just isn't true.

We never found the inventor, I'm actually guessing they're a scum role (which would mean one of the VT claims is scum by nature).

Hyena wrote: ↑Fri Nov 06, 2020 7:59 pm
TonyStarkPrime wrote: ↑Fri Nov 06, 2020 7:57 pm that 'you' means hyena and tl but okay another possibility wolves have a protective role and keep saving the nightkill target
Do you think one of the wolves would be a lost wolf, or would both wolves be together? Because, like, I find it hard to believe they'd be able to pull this off without some heavy coordination.

I find it rather hard to believe that the wolves have been coordinating anything, given that the game is still going.

in which case

that 'you' means hyena and tl but okay another possibility wolves have a protective role and keep saving the nightkill target

If wolves are holstering they're probably either in a very bad situation or a very good one

So you both agreed to block Alison?

And like "wolves have no kill" which is a thing that's at least been floated since kills apparently don't happen anymore

Alison wrote: ↑Fri Nov 06, 2020 7:43 pm After full claims, nobody has claimed to be a doctor. That means that the only things capable of stopping a kill other than the punk chat roleblock, that we know of, are TSP's jailkeeper ability or a holster bluff. So there was at least one kill blocked by TSP or at least one holster.

And tsp bulletproof and outside chance of like "lost wolf can't be shot" things as well

Hyena wrote: ↑Fri Nov 06, 2020 6:21 pm
TonyStarkPrime wrote: ↑Fri Nov 06, 2020 4:16 pm
Hyena wrote: ↑Fri Nov 06, 2020 2:18 pm
Hyena wrote: ↑Fri Nov 06, 2020 2:15 pm Again, here are punk chat's RBs throughout the game:
N1: Poison - order of votes goes TH, TL, me, then Quin
N2: TSP - Trustworthy tried voting for themself initially, but then the order of votes goes TH, me, TL, then a late vote from Quin
N3: TSP - This is the night Marmot redirected our RB to TSP. Before that, the order of votes went Quin (for Alison), TL (for nutella), me (for nutella)
N4: Alison - TL and I voted nearly simultaneously
N5: TSP - TL and I voted nearly simultaneously

There hasn't been any night kills beginning N3. To note, this happened the night proceeding the day phase punk chat entered the thread. Also to note, TSP apparently has a bulletproof vest.

One possibility that could explain the lack of night kills is that punk chat has been roleblocking the correct mafia for the last three nights. If this is the case, then the game is pretty straightforward -- it's TSP and Alison. However... I'm not that lucky, I think. There was some logic that went into the decisions, but like.... three times in a row? I'll be impressed with myself if this actually is the case.
Another possibility is that mafia has been choosing not to kill at all. One reason I can see this is a possibility is that there could be a wolf in the punk chat and they've been afraid to attack them... but then why didn't they go after the people that have been in the thread? Maybe it isn't confirmed to them where the lost wolf is if the is one. If there -isn't- a lost wolf, I have no clue why they would choose not to nightkill someone, especially last night when they could have reached parity today.
I think “wolves shoot at tsp hit vest wolves shoot at Alison / are Alison and run into jail / wolves shoot at Nutella and Nutella got doctored by the only potential TP role in the game (my nonlethal action)” isn’t entirely out of the realm of possibility
Actually, how could a night kill -ever- have been prevented by your "nonlethal action"? You were RBed both times there wasn't a nightkill when you locked someone up. o:

I’m considering the possibility that I wasn’t blocked last night, a likelihood if you think Alison has the protective role and you’re both wolves. Or if there’s something else going on that I don’t underdtand

Hyena wrote: ↑Fri Nov 06, 2020 5:59 pm
TonyStarkPrime wrote: ↑Fri Nov 06, 2020 5:02 pm @TL @Hyena I need recollections of what went down the night Alison was blocked in scumchat. You say that you both agreed and Quin dissented?
No, we yeeted Quin the day before we blocked Alison. So, we both voted together on Alison. The night Quin didn't vote with us was the night Marmot redirected our RB to you.

Check your timeline?

@TL @Hyena I need recollections of what went down the night Alison was blocked in scumchat. You say that you both agreed and Quin dissented?

OH BUT

Like Alison and Vul cannot both be wolves who know of each other’s existence read what Vul said

TL Alison solves all the blanks too but it requires Alison lost wolf (interactions with Vul/LC) which doesn’t jive with my preconceived notions

I think TL clearing Hyena is pretty much always either w/w or a TMI ish thing. Sometimes it’s an actual pocket, but I think about he post “I don’t want to admit he’s pocketed me”. That’s what a wolf says when they realize they’ve been clearing a mischop opportunity.

I think in order of likelihood:
TL/Hyena (lost kill, probably)
TL/Alison (shot me double blocked kill, note TL argued against Alison block N5 apparently?)
Alison/Hyena
And then Nutella things

Okay I think it’s 2 of TL/Alison/Hyena with maybe an outside possibility of a lost wolf Nutella just being very confused

I’m still sort of feeling the “hyena/TL haven’t found each other” train. Or even TL is pretty sure but can’t say it just in case. And they don’t have a kill cause something

Okay I’ll lose to Nutella Alison I guess, there’s a block access wolf

If there’s a block access wolf

In any case we have to kill the block-access wolf first

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