The Syndicate

What I meant to say is "I'm not going to be around as much tonight, starting now."

Mind-farted there. I have a party I'm going to in a few.

I'm not going to be around as much, starting tonight.

I think I've made the right choice. If not, then it's GG to nutella and her lackeys. Hope everyone follows up.

Lunalee wrote: ↑Fri Feb 08, 2019 5:22 pm

sabie12 wrote: ↑Fri Feb 08, 2019 6:35 am Also RIP kyle and reywas and congrats winners!

So speed started off going after inactives which is always a good way to mislynch someone so not a great idea early in the game. He speculates on how many mafia members there are. He says he will vote ddl but quickly changes to reywas who ended up being civ. Maybe ddl is a teammate he didnt really want to vote for but had to seem like he was going to. So I can see where the suspicion comes from.

Oh, I missed this post before.

So did I apparently.

So speed started off going after inactives which is always a good way to mislynch someone so not a great idea early in the game. "going after inactives" is not a great idea in the late game, either. I only went after Sprit, which consisted of me nudging him one day and lynching him a day or two later. At the time, most of the game was semi inactive but Sprit especially so. That said, he was here, he made posts in this game (showing that he wasn't completely AFK), and he seemed like a likely candidate to be laying low. I was wrong.
We wouldn't be having this discussion if I was right.

He speculates on how many mafia members there are. I see no issues with that, I do it every game.

He says he will vote ddl but quickly changes to reywas who ended up being civ. Maybe ddl is a teammate he didnt really want to vote for but had to seem like he was going to. So I can see where the suspicion comes from. Poor judgement on my part. It's gonna look bad, not much to do about it.

If you have anything else, I'll address it. Don't want to get bogged down in defending myself, though, that's how I get mislynched.

Sloonei wrote: ↑Fri Feb 08, 2019 4:57 pm I only bring it up so as to not overlook the possibility of a coordinated push against you. RE: the votes on speedchuck

That could be a thing.

I don't think I've had but one vote on me before today, and that was from nutella I think?

I don't have Luna or Sabie sorted.

Cynical look at DDL

Dragon D. Luffy wrote: ↑Wed Jan 30, 2019 6:14 pm

nutella wrote: ↑Wed Jan 30, 2019 5:47 pm

Dragon D. Luffy wrote: ↑Wed Jan 30, 2019 5:01 pm

nutella wrote: ↑Wed Jan 30, 2019 4:29 pm

speedchuck wrote: ↑Wed Jan 30, 2019 4:00 pm

Lunalee wrote: ↑Wed Jan 30, 2019 3:54 pm Ugh, the poll has way too many single votes on it right now.

Maybe you could fix that?

Lol last time someone called Luna out for not practicing what she was preaching she was bad

I don't necessarily suspect her for it here though. Only so much one can do

But we only have 4.5 hours so yeah who should we start grouping votes onto? I'd love to hear thoughts other than my own

The way you start the sentence with "lol" before throwing shade at someone then saying you won't "necessarily" vote for them triggered my senses.

Come on you have played with me in the last year.

Nutella I can't help it, it's an involuntary reaction. You say scummy things and it triggers my scumdar. I have to use all my willpower just to keep it down.

On the one hand, I noted this interaction as well. But DDL downplaying it, even on D1, is off. Why keep it down? Why not go after her and see what happens? It's D1.

Dragon D. Luffy wrote: ↑Wed Jan 30, 2019 6:21 pm This is normally the point where I'd be reading a reasonable LC defense and looking for a more serious wagon but LC hasn't posted again yet.

What do I do? I don't wanna pull the trigger on Nutella either.

Why not? Is DDL usually this hesitant to step out and DO things? And is he afraid of losing a valuable player, or of the repercussions?
I know it could be the former, but despite the joking tone, these posts feel like walking on glass.

Dragon D. Luffy wrote: ↑Sun Feb 03, 2019 10:31 am

MacDougall wrote: ↑Sat Feb 02, 2019 6:31 pm

nutella wrote: ↑Wed Jan 30, 2019 4:29 pm

speedchuck wrote: ↑Wed Jan 30, 2019 4:00 pm

Lunalee wrote: ↑Wed Jan 30, 2019 3:54 pm Ugh, the poll has way too many single votes on it right now.

Maybe you could fix that?

Lol last time someone called Luna out for not practicing what she was preaching she was bad

I don't necessarily suspect her for it here though. Only so much one can do

But we only have 4.5 hours so yeah who should we start grouping votes onto? I'd love to hear thoughts other than my own

In the above post this reads like a Mafia player latching on to a town made case. She is also exhibiting "the Russ" by casting doubt in both directions. This serves to pacify both Speechuck and Lunalee towards her at the same time. It's made even more genius by the fact that speedchuck wasn't even really explicitly suspecting lunalee, and nutella escalated it to that in a way to make it seem like speedchuck did. What you do here as mafia is go back and blame speedchuck when lunalee flips town. Not outright, but "speedchuck pointed out that she was being hypocritical and I agreed" is a good cover for raising a bad case.

You can see in the below post that DDL saw something samesuch in the post. He simplified it down to her use of the term "lol". I think he felt something else and struggled to quantify it. Speak to that for me DDL.

It's not just the "lol", it's the whole package of word usage. I'm going a little Epi here, but I believe he is right when he says people tend to put specific words to make their points feel weaker than they are, so they don't really take responsibility for it. Hence the adverbs thing.

Nutella wants to throw shade at people but she also wants to let us know she is not sure about it. Fine. But she colors it with "lol"s and emotes to mae it look more friendly than she should considering the fact she is, you know, throwing shade at people. There is a disconnect between the tone and the actions.

First sentence she opens with a friendly lol then attacks Luna on meta. Then second sentence she backs down, davalues her own post, and finishes it with a friendly emote. Then third sentence she passes the ball to other people and asks for a wagon. It could be the Luna wagon she just offered, it could be someone else.

I could see a civ doing everything I just described, especially a careful civ like nutella, but I could also see the baddie line of thought behind the whole thing. I think it applies to the rest of the case you build on nutella, too. That's why she is so hard to read, her civ and bad metas are similar.

When Mac goes after the same post, DDL doubles down and then still tiptoes. Somehow. So DDL is doing the same thing that he's accusing nutella of, in a way. Only she masks it in humor and he in hesitance and 'careful' play. Which, of course, it could be.

Dragon D. Luffy wrote: ↑Sun Feb 03, 2019 10:32 am Guys how likely it is that a baddie nutella would off Mac to silence him?

WIFOM much?

I don't think the nutella case was serious. It has been a consistent thing, and right here is where DDL tries to bring it to the masses. And like everything else in this game, it gets ignored.
We've been sitting on town lynches for days, so like with Sloon/nutella, I have to question whether this was worth doing. It is worth trying to suggest a lynch when the game is self-destructing perfectly fine on its own?
But then again, this is a pretty opportunistic take, right or wrong. Not a difficult thing to throw out there.

Dragon D. Luffy wrote: ↑Sun Feb 03, 2019 3:50 pm

nutella wrote: ↑Sun Feb 03, 2019 2:38 pm do you guys seriously want to lynch me for "weasel words" what is it 2016???

I wonder if DDL really believes what he is saying because he has seen me play a lot in the last couple years and he must know that the "lols" etc are a hallmark of my civ style. He's harping a bit too much on this one thing and then going "well whatever her civ and bad metas are too similar so who knows" like he's soft-pushing an easy target but backing off/not taking responsibility

And what is a hallmark of your baddie style, then? Because last I checked you also do all those things when you are bad. Mac is right, you are not that obvious to read.

I'm not soft pushing, I'm putting all possibilities on the table. The way you are acting is perfectly reasonable for a baddie to act.

You say you are always on the fence, which is true, but then you use that as a shield to act the same way as bad and win games because no one wants to lynch "on the fence" nutella anymore.

Meta can go die in a fire.
This post doesn't look all that bad, in isolation. It's true. It's also really self-aware, and so it could be made from either perspective.

Dragon D. Luffy wrote: ↑Sun Feb 03, 2019 3:51 pm [VOTE: nutella] aubergine

Dragon D. Luffy wrote: ↑Mon Feb 04, 2019 6:09 pm Reywas is melting down like a volcano.

Not sure how to interpret that.

As an easy lynch?

Dragon D. Luffy wrote: ↑Mon Feb 04, 2019 8:47 pm

G-Man wrote: ↑Mon Feb 04, 2019 8:40 pm Man O’Day! Are you kidding me? We’re taking the non-participant option on Day 3 after two consecutive mislynches AND down four confirmed civs? He better flip mafia or else it’s game over for the civs.

I agree. This sounds like the easy path to baddie victory.

[VOTE: Reywas] aubergine

I'll take the non-lazy option. At least there is some precedent to mafia faking meltdowns.

As an easy lynch disguised as a difficult one?

Dragon D. Luffy wrote: ↑Tue Feb 05, 2019 6:55 am

reywaS wrote: ↑Mon Feb 04, 2019 9:49 pm gman i think you hit the nail on the head with DDL being mafia as fug

Omgus much?

And easy lynch that can be blames on the lynchee?

Dragon D. Luffy wrote: ↑Tue Feb 05, 2019 6:58 am I proposed a nutella lynch. People didn't wanted. They wanted you or sprityo. I waited till the end to see which one to change to. You looked like the better wagon.

I'm not a super-hero, I can't guess who the scum is and force other people to vote for them.

Reywas didn't end up getting lynched, and DDL's follow-through the following day didn't look great. But then, there were a lor of people that ended up on Reywas. Hindsight bias here. My promised cynicism taints these posts, when really we'd have to look at Reywas' behavior. Obviously some of us thought Rey was bad or we wouldn't have voted there. If you look at these thinking Rey is bad, DDL's posts look a little low-effort but not horrible.

Dragon D. Luffy wrote: ↑Wed Feb 06, 2019 3:59 pm I'm getting a civ vibe from kyle. Something about him contributing early which he doesn't do often. I called him civ for this last game and I was right.

Not sure how to read SVS, I don't think I've ever played with bad SVS before. She is a big neutral for me.

Reywas is just going full OMGUS this phase and I wanna double OMGUS him.

[VOTE: Reywas] aubergine

Those are the most relevant posts.

DDL has done more case-making than Nutella, and only one of those cases has been tested. I remember him as being more active than nutella, even though he has less posts, because he has more relevant content in one of the above posts than nutella does in five of hers.

But some of that content is bad.

Some of it is easy. Some of it follows up, or is opportunistic. I've been looking at this game through the lens of "what does scum actually NEED to do to win, in this small low-posting game"? With that lens in place, DDL fits the mark better than Nutella/Sloonei (the others I've looked at). His posts are fewer, they say more when they need to, he doesn't stir the pot much unless the soup is already moving in that direction.

[VOTE: DDL] aubergine

[mention]Lunalee[/mention] [mention]sabie12[/mention] I'll be nice.
Either explain what about my behavior is scummy or get off my wagon and help lynch scum. We cannot afford large wagon splits today.

Sloonei wrote: ↑Fri Feb 08, 2019 4:31 pm

speedchuck wrote: ↑Fri Feb 08, 2019 4:27 pm

Sloonei wrote: ↑Fri Feb 08, 2019 3:14 pm [VOTE: Dragon D Luffy] aubergine

Things gotta happen.

Since it doesn't look like we're getting a response...

Is this vote representative of your input on my 'either/or' DDL/Nutella thing, or is it just a vote?

I suppose it can be taken as both. I await nutella’s response, but in the meantime I would prefer DDL as a suspect.

I’d also like to note that the only two votes prior to mine were from sabie and luna, both of them on you.

That's true.

I don't know what the reasoning is behind the votes on me, and I really, really don't want to be the MYLO lynch that sinks the game.

Trying to be chill about it, though, and approach things one at a time. Last time I was suspected in the endgame I tossed up a big stink, upset Dunya, got Luna lynched, and basically enabled Dizzy and quin to win as scum just because I was obnoxious and angry. I don't want to do that again.

[VOTE: nutella] aubergine

I'm going to look over DDL

Sloonei wrote: ↑Fri Feb 08, 2019 3:14 pm [VOTE: Dragon D Luffy] aubergine

Things gotta happen.

Since it doesn't look like we're getting a response...

Is this vote representative of your input on my 'either/or' DDL/Nutella thing, or is it just a vote?

And by weird I mean scummish

nutella wrote: ↑Wed Jan 30, 2019 1:25 am

Epignosis wrote: ↑Tue Jan 29, 2019 11:51 pm So...we just gone let the mafia not have to talk?
Okay.

Epignosis wrote: ↑Wed Jan 30, 2019 12:01 am

G-Man wrote: ↑Tue Jan 29, 2019 11:56 pm M Plus 7: dog-pee or die, mofo!

Please no. I don't want 470 posts to read tomorrow.

mmm yeah need that sweet sweet middle ground

We never did find it.

nutella wrote: ↑Wed Jan 30, 2019 1:26 am

Epignosis wrote: ↑Wed Jan 30, 2019 12:49 am Kylemii, MacDougall, and G-Man are bad.
Go.

oh yeah totes

nutella wrote: ↑Wed Jan 30, 2019 1:43 am

MacDougall wrote: ↑Wed Jan 30, 2019 1:36 am The only person I am absolutely sure is bad is nutella.

oh man this is gonna be good

I didn't realize Mac's scumread on nutella "started" this early. I don't think it was serious at this time. Nutella didn't either.

nutella wrote: ↑Wed Jan 30, 2019 1:43 am

Epignosis wrote: ↑Wed Jan 30, 2019 1:41 am

nutella wrote: ↑Wed Jan 30, 2019 1:25 am

Epignosis wrote: ↑Tue Jan 29, 2019 11:51 pm So...we just gone let the mafia not have to talk?

Okay.

Epignosis wrote: ↑Wed Jan 30, 2019 12:01 am

G-Man wrote: ↑Tue Jan 29, 2019 11:56 pm M Plus 7: dog-pee or die, mofo!

Please no. I don't want 470 posts to read tomorrow.

mmm yeah need that sweet sweet middle ground

You and I would be best friends in real life.

nutella wrote: ↑Wed Jan 30, 2019 1:44 am never thought epi would try to buddy me but k

"See how town I am and how my thoughts immediately jump to buddying because I'm town?"
That's what I always think when I see someone accusing another player of buddying them.
Buddying should always be called out by a third player, one uninvolved. That said, I'm still not sure we've seen a single serious post from nutella at this juncture.

nutella wrote: ↑Wed Jan 30, 2019 1:48 am

MacDougall wrote: ↑Wed Jan 30, 2019 1:47 am

nutella wrote: ↑Wed Jan 30, 2019 1:43 am

MacDougall wrote: ↑Wed Jan 30, 2019 1:36 am The only person I am absolutely sure is bad is nutella.

oh man this is gonna be good

You think I have a case eh?
Guilty mind.

no, I really, really don't. you're flinging poo and that always goes well

Confirmed that nutella either didn't think much of or shrugged off the Mac case.

nutella wrote: ↑Wed Jan 30, 2019 2:08 am bob wat r u doin

The first of four posts musing about Bob's gifs.

nutella wrote: ↑Wed Jan 30, 2019 12:48 pm [VOTE: epignosis] aubergine

nutella wrote: ↑Wed Jan 30, 2019 1:04 pm

speedchuck wrote: ↑Wed Jan 30, 2019 1:02 pm

nutella wrote: ↑Wed Jan 30, 2019 12:52 pm Oh and in case it wasn't clear I believe that Epi is exhibiting behavior that indicates he received a mafia role card.

Such as?

His interaction with me, his interaction with you about the rules, all give me sketchy vibes in light of how he played Vanilla.

Oh. Nutella apparently did suspect Epi for ... stuff. No, his interactions with me don't shed much light on that either.

nutella wrote: ↑Wed Jan 30, 2019 12:51 pm I do get what people are seeing in LC too, his call-out of cbob was opportunistic weaksauce. So rn it's between Epi and LC for me-- gimme a good Clásico boys

False binary.

nutella wrote: ↑Wed Jan 30, 2019 3:37 pm

Lunalee wrote: ↑Wed Jan 30, 2019 3:28 pm

nutella wrote: ↑Wed Jan 30, 2019 12:52 pm Oh and in case it wasn't clear I believe that Epi is exhibiting behavior that indicates he received a mafia role card.

Are you and Epi scum mates again?

Of course not. It's the perspective I gained from being scum with him recently that is drawing my attention to some of his behavior here. Maybe there is some element of recency bias, I should admit, but it is based in actual content. Like look at how he deflected the "reading the rules" accusation back onto speed.

I still don't see anything, but I wasn't in the game nutella is referencing.
On a more interesting note, I saw Luna's post here and hallucinated a typo that asked if Epi and nutella were scum maters.

Epignosis wrote: ↑Wed Jan 30, 2019 3:44 pm

nutella wrote: ↑Wed Jan 30, 2019 3:37 pm

Lunalee wrote: ↑Wed Jan 30, 2019 3:28 pm

nutella wrote: ↑Wed Jan 30, 2019 12:52 pm Oh and in case it wasn't clear I believe that Epi is exhibiting behavior that indicates he received a mafia role card.

Are you and Epi scum mates again?

Of course not. It's the perspective I gained from being scum with him recently that is drawing my attention to some of his behavior here. Maybe there is some element of recency bias, I should admit, but it is based in actual content. Like look at how he deflected the "reading the rules" accusation back onto speed.

Here's the post in which she implies she knows speedchuck isn't bad.

nutella wrote: ↑Wed Jan 30, 2019 3:49 pm How on earth do you pull that out of there? I have no idea what speed's alignment is, though I guess the implication is that if you are bad as I suspect, he is town. Nothing in that post suggests I *know* he is town.

nutella wrote: ↑Wed Jan 30, 2019 3:50 pm Maybe you read it that way because you know he is town.

Nutella's actually not wrong here in my opinion. At least, in her refutation. The original suspicion is still meh, and hindsight tells us how that played out.

nutella wrote: ↑Wed Jan 30, 2019 4:29 pm

speedchuck wrote: ↑Wed Jan 30, 2019 4:00 pm

Lunalee wrote: ↑Wed Jan 30, 2019 3:54 pm Ugh, the poll has way too many single votes on it right now.

Maybe you could fix that?

Lol last time someone called Luna out for not practicing what she was preaching she was bad
I don't necessarily suspect her for it here though. Only so much one can do
But we only have 4.5 hours so yeah who should we start grouping votes onto? I'd love to hear thoughts other than my own

The only point of this Luna observation seems to be shade-casting. Or maybe distancing.
Or perhaps it's just a random musing because nutella isn't sweating over every post she makes.

nutella wrote: ↑Wed Jan 30, 2019 5:47 pm

Dragon D. Luffy wrote: ↑Wed Jan 30, 2019 5:01 pm The way you start the sentence with "lol" before throwing shade at someone then saying you won't "necessarily" vote for them triggered my senses.

Come on you have played with me in the last year.

Between this and some later stuff, there is strooong anti-alignment here.

nutella wrote: ↑Wed Jan 30, 2019 6:43 pm Your tripping sense. SVS is obvtown.
....or is that just the recency bias speaking

Recency bias is the new meta? Thanks, I hate it. Nutella didn't need another waffle flavor.

nutella wrote: ↑Fri Feb 01, 2019 3:45 pm

Epignosis wrote: ↑Fri Feb 01, 2019 3:37 pm

Enrique wrote: ↑Fri Feb 01, 2019 3:31 pm Truth meta here. I'm a civ.

I actually voted for LC precisely because I've played with him for so many years, while Luna is a newer player that I haven't gotten to know that well. I didn't think about it too much and I mean obviously LC's lynch didn't turn out well. I can also see how that could be construed as lynching LC because he'd know how to read me better, but nah.

I'm not dead weight! I think it's a pattern at this point that it takes me a couple days to get into the groove of a game. Still getting there but I appreciate this engagement. I'll keep you posted...

Had your hand not been forced, where would you have voted?

What is happening

nutella wrote: ↑Fri Feb 01, 2019 4:16 pm Idk how I feel about his post

I don't have any idea what this part of nutella's ISO means. It's just there. AWKWARDLY.

nutella wrote: ↑Fri Feb 01, 2019 8:08 pm I may join the enri train, SVS had decent reasoning and his one last post felt weird/off to me

Oh, it means she thought he was bad. I'd love to know what felt 'off', but hindsight is going to ruin that.

nutella wrote: ↑Fri Feb 01, 2019 8:42 pm Luna is on the silly juice

This weird call out to luna, who voted Enri even though she didn't think he was scum? Nutella's luna interactions are hella weird.

nutella wrote: ↑Fri Feb 01, 2019 9:17 pm [VOTE: lunalee] aubergine

She got dat TMI hesitance yo

nutella wrote: ↑Fri Feb 01, 2019 9:22 pm Anyway I decided I believe enri's truth meta. Luna hasn't decided anything, and I know I shouldn't be one to criticize flipflopping but she seems to be fabricating thoughts on enri according to the whim of the thread.

What

Okay so there are more posts about this that may or may not end up posted in this ISO, which is already too long. But nutella got annoyed after Enrique's lynch, and I'm only now realizing that she was on board before randomly jumping off when the lynch was gaining momentum. This warrants a solid 'EW' in context.

nutella wrote: ↑Fri Feb 01, 2019 9:23 pm

Lunalee wrote: ↑Fri Feb 01, 2019 9:22 pm

nutella wrote: ↑Fri Feb 01, 2019 9:17 pm [VOTE: lunalee] aubergine
She got dat TMI hesitance yo

nutella's either town, or she learned to fake-suspect me when she's scum.

Lol this is hilarious

Weird.

nutella wrote: ↑Fri Feb 01, 2019 9:30 pm

Lunalee wrote: ↑Fri Feb 01, 2019 9:23 pm

nutella wrote: ↑Fri Feb 01, 2019 9:22 pm Anyway I decided I believe enri's truth meta. Luna hasn't decided anything, and I know I shouldn't be one to criticize flipflopping but she seems to be fabricating thoughts on enri according to the whim of the thread.

I mean if I were going with the whim of the thread I would just have joined the Enrique or Mac train.

Nah you expressed hesitance because you know he's town but then said you might as well vote him but then backed off again and tried to gather other opinions on the truth meta

Going a little harder here, but it's odd the way nutella is treating the Enri claim that just a bit ago she didn't buy.

nutella wrote: ↑Fri Feb 01, 2019 9:31 pm

Kylemii wrote: ↑Fri Feb 01, 2019 9:29 pm

nutella wrote: ↑Fri Feb 01, 2019 9:22 pmAnyway I decided I believe enri's truth meta.

expand?

Nothing to expand. That's it

nutella wrote: ↑Fri Feb 01, 2019 9:56 pm

Kylemii wrote: ↑Fri Feb 01, 2019 9:52 pm i think where i'm at is, lynching enrique makes the most logical sense right now but, that seems to only be mostly because he's the only person sticking out right now, no one else has been talked about extensively, and that just sorta leaves us with... this. that's not to say there isn't a chance eko pops up mafia, it just doesn't seem very exciting. his defense post triipped some alarm bells in my mind, his casual attitude towards breaking the tie he was part of did seem off. i wouldn't be surprised if he flipped mafia, but i also wouldn't be surprised if he flipped civ either. the main thing is that i don't have any better ideas, and it doesn't seem like anyone else does either

No that's a load of crap. Enri is one of the more active and imo more townie looking players imo and "sticking out" is not a good reason to vote somebody, and you're wrong that nobody else has been discussed. I believe I made a reasonable point against Luna.

nutella wrote: ↑Fri Feb 01, 2019 10:01 pm This is the second fucking stupid lynch in a row of a cool player who I would have liked to play with just because people are being fucking lazy

I've decided that I do not like this at all. Nor the sarcasm that follows.

nutella wrote: ↑Sat Feb 02, 2019 2:04 pm

Lunalee wrote: ↑Sat Feb 02, 2019 12:19 pm A bit relieved that Enrique flipped town. That makes me look good. But RIP another townie.

No it doesn't wtf

Luna just casually misses the whole point of nutella's livid accusations.

nutella wrote: ↑Sat Feb 02, 2019 2:07 pm My whole thing was I thought you had TMI on him so how you think his flip looks good for you is beyond me.

nutella wrote: ↑Sat Feb 02, 2019 2:12 pm The same could apply to me then. But you were weirder about it.

I'm not in that ISO, but I can't imagine that.

nutella wrote: ↑Sat Feb 02, 2019 4:27 pm

MacDougall wrote: ↑Sat Feb 02, 2019 4:24 pm SVS I solved some of the equation again but I won't show my work so in order to pass the test you have to reverse engineer it.
So I was in fact right about nutella who is definitely Mafia.
Go my friends and save the world.

Hey I know this might be hard for you to accept, but you're wrong.

Beginning to trust the Mac.

Nutella's play seems to drop off significantly once the suspicion from mac happens. Around the time Sloonei comes into the game. Some suspicion on Reywas, looks about normal. A push at DDL once he tries to further the Mac suspicion. A push at me. A giant shrug at the townreads in the thread. Nothing that horrible, unless you conflate the motives for the DDL push with more no u at mac's case. Nothing that stands out and reverse pings me into town territory. Nutella and Mac and DDL have already exhausted discussion on this, but I want to know where everyone stands on nutella's alignment, specifically regarding the Enri lynch and the actions surrounding it. I don't want to false binary today, but my vote will likely end up sitting between Nutella and DDL, unless something changes my mind. I don't think they are aligned. Not as scum. Not as town.

And right now (having just finished nutella's ISO) nutella looks weirder. I still need to read DDL's posts more thouroughly

Sloonei wrote: ↑Fri Feb 08, 2019 1:57 pm It’s not up to me to tell you guys how to read me in a game that i joined late and am operating at like 10% of a maximum effort. My posts are my posts. If you think they come from a civilian, that’s nice. If not, that’s too bad. There’s no magic rabbit for me to pull out of my hat.

I expected some sort of strong response on at least one of the questions I’ve asked, but all I’ve got back is a bunch of shrugs. I don’t have the time to do any thorough digging myself, but I’m trying to move things forward in a more facilitatory role.

The reads I shared in my reywas vote are the closest I can come to substantive opinions on things. DDL seems the closest thing to a consensus scum read and I don’t see a glowing civilian when I look at him, so I might just default to him. I’ve had an uneasy feeling about SVS for a couple days too. The exchange I had with luna was enough to make me doubt her a little, but not enough to lock her down as scum.

Okay I take it back. You aren't a limp cookie.

Trying to go through nutella's ISO is not even fun

Let's look at sloonei through cynical goggles:

Sloonei wrote: ↑Sun Feb 03, 2019 3:15 am

Kylemii wrote: ↑Sun Feb 03, 2019 3:09 am @Sloonei are you in mafia?

sure

He begins by admitting to being scum.

Sloonei wrote: ↑Sun Feb 03, 2019 12:52 pm

reywaS wrote: ↑Sun Feb 03, 2019 10:03 am

Sloonei wrote: ↑Sun Feb 03, 2019 12:17 am [VOTE: reywas] aubergine

Break the cycle

ooohhhhh what cycle are we talking about?

My player slot missed the first two votes.

This is all that came of the Reywas vote on D3.

Sloonei wrote: ↑Sun Feb 03, 2019 2:03 pm sabie’s “welcome to the gamd unless you’re bad” greeting felt a little forced. Anyone got things to sY about her?

Sloonei votes for Sabie, then posts this here. Nobody engaged him on this, so it's hard to see where it was going. Town trying to spur discussion or mafia trying to bait a train? Even with my aforementioned cynicism, I'd go town on this. No reason for scum to spur discussion, train or no, when nothing is happening.

Sloonei wrote: ↑Sun Feb 03, 2019 4:29 pm Nutella is lock town again you guys, trust me

This would be a read, but it's in response to nutella saying Sloonei always defends her when she's scum. Banter. Null. Would appreciate an actual read.

Sloonei wrote: ↑Mon Feb 04, 2019 6:47 pm [VOTE: reywas] aubergine

I barely know why and i’m probably not gonna be here for the deadline. MVP performance right here.

After trying to spur Sabie to talk, and failing, Sloon drops back on Reywas.

No posts during night 3.

Sloonei wrote: ↑Tue Feb 05, 2019 9:43 pm Who's supposed to get lynched this time?

Sloonei wrote: ↑Wed Feb 06, 2019 12:01 am [VOTE: speedchuck] aubergine

Probability said so.

Sloon goes after me in the posts directly after this. Again, this could either be him genuinely trying to sort me or trying to spur a mislynch on me. I lean toward the former for the same reasons.

I probably shouldn't be townreading Sloonei just for DOING things, but I can't help it.

Sloonei wrote: ↑Wed Feb 06, 2019 2:42 pm Who has a strong conviction about a particular player right now?

Sloonei is getting desperate for reads. I'm null on this, though. Asking questions or pushing things is good, but I want some statements as well. I don't know where Sloonei's head is at, and that's not great.

Sloonei wrote: ↑Wed Feb 06, 2019 3:22 pm [VOTE: kylemii] aubergine

He’s too cool and his coolness is freezing both the outside world and the progress of this thread.

Another nothing push. This one on a townie, apparently.

Sloonei wrote: ↑Wed Feb 06, 2019 6:09 pm

speedchuck wrote: ↑Wed Feb 06, 2019 6:01 pm This DDL lynch seems as 'easy' as every other lynch that's happened up till now. Sloonei's like, the only one trying to start up discussion and it's falling flat. Makes me nervous, like the flow of the thread is just gonna bury DDL and people are sitting back and letting it.

I’m like barely trying, and it’s only because I don’t know what’s going on.

This is true, but it's also bunk. There isn't anything going on. There aren't a whole lot of pages to keep up with either. Not a great excuse. That said, nobody else was trying at that time either. I'd buy this post better without the "because I dunno" excuse. It would sound more honest.

Sloonei wrote: ↑Wed Feb 06, 2019 6:25 pm [VOTE: reywas] aubergine again, I guess.

I took a glance at all the ISOs earlier and I came away feeling okay about DDL. He’s seemed to be actively making things happen this game. I’d expect scum to be playing more reactionary right now given the generally poor state of things for the Good Guys. Let us continue to lynch ourselves, and just give gentle nudges to keep us on the right (wrong) track. SVS is a player I could accuse of that, but I’m not so sure i want to vote for her. DDL is not. reywas feels like he’d fall into that criteria, but I mainly jus thave a vague gut feeling about him based on a snippets of things I’ve read.

Votes Reywas. There are some actual reads here, and they have substance and motive. That's good. How strong do you stand by these, Sloonei?

Sloonei wrote: ↑Wed Feb 06, 2019 9:42 pm I told you guys not to vote for reywas

Sloonei wrote: ↑Wed Feb 06, 2019 10:58 pm

Lunalee wrote: ↑Wed Feb 06, 2019 10:57 pm

Sloonei wrote: ↑Wed Feb 06, 2019 10:54 pm

Lunalee wrote: ↑Wed Feb 06, 2019 10:53 pm

S~V~S wrote: ↑Wed Feb 06, 2019 10:48 pm Why is it his job?

It became his job as soon as he said, "I told you so." :P

Well how was I supposed to know I was gonna say that before the lynch?

I don't know, the same way you seemed to know he was town before the lynch.

Do you suspect me for this?

This is like, the weirdest exchange in this game. At some point the banter becomes a thing and Sloonei snaps into "wait a minute, this might actually be serious" mode. I don't know who comes out of this looking more odd. I also can't tell if that final, more serious line is a "Do you really want to do this" or a "is this a thing I should look into in order to read you"?
Sloonei's trying with that serious line to get Luna to state a solid suspicion. Then...

Sloonei wrote: ↑Thu Feb 07, 2019 10:37 am

Lunalee wrote: ↑Wed Feb 06, 2019 11:15 pm Yes, a bit. But mostly just bantering because it's fun

Alright cool because it never happened. I voted for reywas and my original response was a joke.

I'm surprised Sloonei doesn't pull something out of this. Luna throws a waffle suspicion at him and he notes how baseless it is, then shrugs it off. Seems like he'd latch onto that and do SOMETHING with it.

Sloonei wrote: ↑Thu Feb 07, 2019 9:21 pm I was mildly pinged by luna admitting to suspecting me for a thing that literally never happened last night. But it could have been completely inconsequential.

Okay so he does mention it again. That's a thing.

Sloonei asks questions about reads on DDL, SVS, and Speed.

Then we have this odd post:

Sloonei wrote: ↑Fri Feb 08, 2019 12:07 am

nutella wrote: ↑Thu Feb 07, 2019 11:57 pm Why should I townread you sloo whoop de doo?

That’s not for me to say here.

It is absolutely for you to say here you limp cookie.

Overall, aside from some weird Luna interactions and a couple times where Sloonei excuses or brushes off his behaviour when it didn't need to be done, the questions he's asked and the content he's tried to spur seems genuine.
Those things exist, though. And the response in the thread has made it easy for Sloonei to go half-hearted in his attempts to look toownei.

I'm actually less comfortable with a townread on Sloonei than I was before, but equally uncomfortable with a scumread. He's not null, but he's not someone I'd want to lynch today. I'm much rather knock down another scum and do teammate analysis, as I think that would shed better light on Sloonei's alignment.

The message at the top of the poll seems to indicate that we have three scum. Plenty for POE.

I have some amount of townread on G-Man and SVS. I have had town pings from Sloonei and Nutella, but I want to look further at them and make sure.

100% wasn't expecting that.

[mention]Golden[/mention]

[mention]G-Man[/mention] Is all that analysis what you've been basing your reads on? I could see a Kylemii/DDL/SVS in the vote stuff you're looking at. Also can't rule out Sabie... maybe Luna.

I'd have to go back and see who was more chill on double-townie lynch days, but wasn't everyone? At least, to some extent.

RIP Reywas. Sorry we didn't lynch someone else.

[VOTE: reywas] aubergine

I may not be coming back this evening. Stuff to do. Good luck, whoever's here

Lunalee wrote: ↑Wed Feb 06, 2019 8:21 pm

speedchuck wrote: ↑Wed Feb 06, 2019 8:21 pm

Lunalee wrote: ↑Wed Feb 06, 2019 8:20 pm

speedchuck wrote: ↑Wed Feb 06, 2019 8:20 pm and apparently Lunalee moved right as I voted. Neat.

lol, vote reywaS with meeee

Should I though?

go look at how he responded to Mac's case on nutella after Mac died. It looks very opportunistic.

Hrm... right before he melted down under suspicion, too

Lunalee wrote: ↑Wed Feb 06, 2019 8:20 pm

speedchuck wrote: ↑Wed Feb 06, 2019 8:20 pm and apparently Lunalee moved right as I voted. Neat.

lol, vote reywaS with meeee

Should I though?

and apparently Lunalee moved right as I voted. Neat.

40 minutes left. Do I drop on DDL and solidify that or help a counter wagon?

Hm.

[VOTE: DDL] aubergine

Between DDL and Reywas, DDL comes off more structured and careful. Reywas is the more likely mislynch.

sabie12 wrote: ↑Wed Feb 06, 2019 6:51 pm Sorry I've been so not great this game. My depression has been very bad and I apologize for not being very involved.

Sloonei wrote: ↑Wed Feb 06, 2019 6:09 pm

speedchuck wrote: ↑Wed Feb 06, 2019 6:01 pm This DDL lynch seems as 'easy' as every other lynch that's happened up till now. Sloonei's like, the only one trying to start up discussion and it's falling flat. Makes me nervous, like the flow of the thread is just gonna bury DDL and people are sitting back and letting it.

I’m like barely trying, and it’s only because I don’t know what’s going on.

Idunno man. I nudge the thread a little and it's like poking an obese one-eyed cat.

reywaS wrote: ↑Mon Feb 04, 2019 9:47 pm

Dragon D. Luffy wrote: ↑Mon Feb 04, 2019 8:47 pm

G-Man wrote: ↑Mon Feb 04, 2019 8:40 pm Man O’Day! Are you kidding me? We’re taking the non-participant option on Day 3 after two consecutive mislynches AND down four confirmed civs? He better flip mafia or else it’s game over for the civs.

I agree. This sounds like the easy path to baddie victory.

[VOTE: Reywas] aubergine

I'll take the non-lazy option. At least there is some precedent to mafia faking meltdowns.

lmao

please do tell where was i faking a meltdown?

G-Man wrote: ↑Tue Feb 05, 2019 8:17 pm Meandering about town tonight for a few errands. If I die, you’ve got my spreadsheet to evaluate. You’re welcome.

If I live, I’ll expound upon the following points:

Dragon D. Luffy hasn’t triggered my usual auto-sus for him. For that reason, I suspect him. Many of his posts are short and to the point. There are just a few in his ISO of any considerable length. That suggests a cautious approach, which seems abnormal to me.

S~V~S is the opposite. She’s gotten a little explainy, a trait seen more often when she’s bad. She likes to shut people down by poking right back. She’s a slick, measured baddie, who can all but talk you into self-voting if you’re not careful. She’s not displaying busted SVS tone yet though. She dropped her suspicion of me too quickly and she’s come close to using her perceived expectations of others’ meta to plant seeds in the minds of others.

Kylemii is my weakest read of the three. I have two others in mind as alternates for the third baddie but I want to see if either of them die tonight, thereby helping me along the way.

Original DDL case stuff, from what I can tell. Everything else spawned from these points.

It's not great, but... at least there's a case?

This DDL lynch seems as 'easy' as every other lynch that's happened up till now. Sloonei's like, the only one trying to start up discussion and it's falling flat. Makes me nervous, like the flow of the thread is just gonna bury DDL and people are sitting back and letting it.

Kylemii wrote: ↑Wed Feb 06, 2019 5:01 pm

Sloonei wrote: ↑Wed Feb 06, 2019 3:22 pm [VOTE: kylemii] aubergine

He’s too cool and his coolness is freezing both the outside world and the progress of this thread.

yeah that's just kind of how my life is right now i guess

Dragon D. Luffy wrote: ↑Wed Feb 06, 2019 4:03 pm Like Reywas found a place where he can be angry at me for voting him once and now he can just sit there confortably, not doing anything but vote me for the rest of the game.

Are you suspicious or jealous?

Sloonei wrote: ↑Wed Feb 06, 2019 2:42 pm Who has a strong conviction about a particular player right now?

G-man does.

I townread Nutella, SVS, and G-Man though I disagree with him on some of his reads.

reywaS wrote: ↑Wed Feb 06, 2019 2:39 pm what does MYLO mean

Means you lose if you lynch the wrong person.

In other words, if you have 6 good and 4 bad... then lynch one good... you have 5 good 4 bad. After the nightkill, that's 4v4. Game over.

Usually hosts warn the players when we hit MYLO, so it looks like we're sitting at 3 scum.

Sloonei wrote: ↑Wed Feb 06, 2019 2:28 pm

speedchuck wrote: ↑Tue Feb 05, 2019 11:29 pm

Sloonei wrote: ↑Tue Feb 05, 2019 9:43 pm Who's supposed to get lynched this time?

I think it was... DDL? I'm down, I think. Will have to go over it.

Also ayyyy I'm a nominee! Though it's "Best Mafioso," not "got tons of mafia wins that year by virtue of having good teammates." Can't wait to see the reveal, cbob!

Deferring to common consnsus rather than positing his own reads. Whack.

Sloonei wrote: ↑Wed Feb 06, 2019 2:27 pm

speedchuck wrote: ↑Wed Feb 06, 2019 11:20 am @Sloonei ???

ur always bad. And also something about your initial response to me today was icky.

If I ever actually get lynched because "always bad" I'm gonna flip.

G-Man wrote: ↑Wed Feb 06, 2019 12:40 pm

speedchuck wrote: ↑Wed Feb 06, 2019 11:21 am Hrm. It's weird that it's not MYLO right now.

My thoughts revolve around the presence of some kind of indy role. There are still ten of us. If there are three mafia (my assumption for a game this size) and an indy, then that still gives us one more day. Today is critical, however, in determining if the civvies will have a chance to win. In my mind, we’re screwed if this lynch goes wrong. I’m something of an optimist in real life but I’m a tin-foiling pessimist when it comes to mafia.

I would have assumed 4 mafia, is the thing. But I guess a third party could explain things. Maybe even the extra kill.

Hrm. It's weird that it's not MYLO right now.

[mention]Sloonei[/mention] ???

Sloonei wrote: ↑Tue Feb 05, 2019 9:43 pm Who's supposed to get lynched this time?

I think it was... DDL? I'm down, I think. Will have to go over it.

Also ayyyy I'm a nominee! Though it's "Best Mafioso," not "got tons of mafia wins that year by virtue of having good teammates." Can't wait to see the reveal, cbob!

Who here would like to play a case-making game? I have an idea for one.

G-Man is lamenting the game being over or something, but I haven't seen a MYLO marker yet. And I've seen comebacks from worse that this. No need to get all negative.
It's the only thing I've suspected G-Man for all game. Someone pointed out in a recent game that dissing on town is usually a scum thing. I've found that to be true.

That said, I'm still sitting with a light townread on G-man.

[mention]reywaS[/mention] You've been talking all about your town meta. That means you would know how to emulate it. That's why I don't usually take meta defenses at face value.
But as long as we're here anyway, what is your scum meta? How is it different from your town one?

[mention]Dragon D. Luffy[/mention] Do you still think nutella should be lynched? Why? If you could control the lynch entirely (like a super hero), where would you put it tomorrow?

[mention]colonialbob[/mention] Same question as DDL. But can you give me a top three suspects, so I can see where your head is at? I think you can do that even with Futurama gifs.

reywaS wrote: ↑Mon Feb 04, 2019 5:50 pm DO IT

You didn't say the magic word.

I just now voted Sprityo. I think he's the quietest of the quiet in this game, and I wanna know why.

Apparently I'm in good company. Hi cbob.

linki: In the game of champions, I was like "I think I've figured her out now, this is it, I finally understand!" Cue scum flip. . . . cue table flip.

nutella wrote: ↑Mon Feb 04, 2019 12:41 pm

speedchuck wrote: ↑Mon Feb 04, 2019 11:52 am And Nutella believing the truth meta thing is ew, regardless of alignment.

Hey, no. That is uncharitable toward both enri and me. I said I know his character and can tell when he is legit. It's a gut thing from being friends with him for 10 years. Maybe that is unfair to everyone else, I don't mean to exclude people, it's just a specific sense that I have of him and I felt with certainty that he was town. It's not any more "ew" than if you defended Luna more than anyone else for example. It just so happened that it was in the context of a "truth meta" claim, which held water for me due to my understanding of enri's personality.

No, that's not what I mean.

I mean f*** "truth meta."

To be blunt, every interaction I have had with those two words put together has been negative. So when someone reacts positively to it, I blanch because positive reinforcement is a thing. Nothing to do with you and Enri.
Though, hey, I didn't know you knew him that well. Reinforces my interpretation of your posts.

And I don't defend Luna more than anyone else. Whenever I do, she ends up being scum.

S~V~S wrote: ↑Mon Feb 04, 2019 11:46 am I gotta say guys, this is not more exciting than the Super Bowl tbh.

I didn't watch it, but I heard the halftime show was bad.

Then again, what did they expect from Maroon 5?

I just read over the Macdougall case on Nutella. It's a pretty good run-down. Not perfect, but pretty good. I have half a mind to take Mac's suspicions and coast on them all game, like I did in GoC. Nightkill analysis, baby.

Problem is, this analysis came in on D3, and I had nutella as a semi-strong townread. Let's talk about some of the suspicions.

nutella wrote: ↑Fri Feb 01, 2019 10:01 pm This is the second fucking stupid lynch in a row of a cool player who I would have liked to play with just because people are being fucking lazy

I don't really have a beef with this post. It's not so much "Enrique was obviously town, boo to the voters, they all scum, I'm so town dontcha kno" and more genuine to me BECAUSE it isn't lamenting his role or alignment as much as the fact that he was around and interesting.
And she's not even wrong about the laziness. We on page 11, and this is D3. That's insane.

Nutella also doesn't have a reason to put herself out there and agitate the thread/voters with this if she's scum. In a more active game, this kind of talk could shame people and put nutella on a town pedestal. In this game, it just makes her stand out. I posit that, with the flow of the game as is, spurring on this discussion and kicking that hornets' nest is much less scummish than just taking the lynches as they come.

nutella wrote: ↑Sat Feb 02, 2019 2:04 pm

Lunalee wrote: ↑Sat Feb 02, 2019 12:19 pmA bit relieved that Enrique flipped town. That makes me look good.
But RIP another townie.

No it doesn't wtf

nutella wrote: ↑Sat Feb 02, 2019 2:07 pm My whole thing was I thought you had TMI on him so how you think his flip looks good for you is beyond me.

nutella wrote: ↑Sat Feb 02, 2019 2:12 pm The same could apply to me then. But you were weirder about it.

Hypocrisy is a staple of the town playbook.

At first glance, these are the only counterarguments I have toward the town nutella that I'm seeing. It comes down to motive, like Mac's post does. He alleged that Nutella is trying to put herself in a good position using TMI. I think it was a mix of nutella being aggressive and waffley. While waffles are not really a town play, regardless of the person, aggression is just not called for at all in this game.

I didn't address all of Mac's points, though. And Nutella believing the truth meta thing is ew, regardless of alignment.

Oh, good. I've had an occupied weekend, thanks for the 48 hour phase.

I'll jump in and see what's up if I have time today between all my prep activities

sabie12 wrote: ↑Sat Feb 02, 2019 8:30 am I know I'm not one of the cool players that anyone wants around or cares about playing with sorry. I was at least right that voting Enrique wasnt the right move.

Wrong. You're totes cool.

RIP Eko.

Enrique wrote: ↑Fri Feb 01, 2019 9:19 pm Memories of speed games from The Piano days are coming back to me. Those were the days when these rapid-paced games weren’t taken so seriously. We had an understanding that those were the kinds of games where everyone could chill out, goof around, and play like crap. Sheer luck won in those games.

What page are we on again?

I'm pretty sure we're playing this type of game.

Game this size probably has... what, 4 scum? 3P?

If we aren't going to try and build wagons larger than 2 or 3 votes, we'll be throwing strategy out the window.