The Syndicate

Kate wrote: ↑Sat Dec 31, 2022 4:11 am

falcon45ca wrote: ↑Sun Dec 18, 2022 5:05 pm I am hungover today and have to wrap presents n such.



If you need anything, just text me, don't call



Expect medium things from me tomorrow

Falcon, what was this??

I’m curious about this as well.

Neon wrote: ↑Fri Dec 30, 2022 11:36 am I hate my game this game.

I don't think I was that different to LGM but I was far less invested

Your text was similar, but you didn't really post any voting analysis here as you did in LGM. I think had you done more of that here, y'all would probably have had my number earlier, and possibly Kates as well. Your charts there once I understood what your data was saying, were impressive. But those charts also looked like they took a lot of effort on your part, so I personally would not want them to be something people "expected" of me

Golden wrote: ↑Fri Dec 30, 2022 4:33 pm Also before I joined spec chat I had exactly one hard town read and it was Roxy. Roxy terryclothed me good.

With Kate being sick, and me being frozen with fear (I haven't been bad since BSG I think), Roxy really carried us, and then Epi did as well. They put in huge team efforts until I found my feet and Kate started feeling more herself again.

Next time I say Roxy sounds mean when she's bad, slap me. I won't know WTF I'm saying.

@Dennis you played a good game in much harder circumstances than you had in LGM, which was about the best set up for a nub that I’ve ever seen. You took suspicion well, and didn’t let it faze you.

Also it was my idea to kill you :Feb:

DrWilgy wrote: ↑Fri Dec 30, 2022 12:50 am Ah... C'mon man. Open night to lose in the morning. Big rip.

Oh well. I played like garbage this game.

No. You absolutely did not. Don't judge your whole game by one mistake.

You tried harder than anyone, and you were 100% right about me, just for the wrong reasons. I even said that when I wrote that post the other day about why Dennis did not need to die for the SVS/Lucy/Dennis team to be debunked.

None of what I said made me civ, but it wasn't the reason I was bad either.

Until endgame, I played an awful game myself. I haven't been bad in years, and was super rusty. I was blendy, my reads were all wishy washy, trying to find 20 ways to say "but" without saying "but".

You were on the table for NK every night after Quin (and Quin really was for lulz; after that discussion about should he/shouldn't he lay out his thoughts during the night, we decided to NK him regardless of which he chose), but we tried to pick people we thought wouldn't be protected, and you were always a strong possibility for that since you were civving it hard.

I don't know ... I'm not quite ready to vote for this SVS yet, although giving people who asked for opinions some opinions is shady as all hell. Like she gave this last opinion literally becasue Dennis asked for it. Crazy shady.

Orange, Rosemary and Mountain Air. I LOVE that orange/spice pomander scent, and a light version of that would be lovely.

Ebwop

you and your boss *ARE* gonna find a way to make it bad

*bangs head into desk*

I went with the Bear

DrWilgy wrote: ↑Wed Dec 28, 2022 11:39 pm

(It was SVS)

I just wasn't here to swap back.

I'm so very very stupid.

Um, no. It wasn't SVS. I'm gonna be a bit of a bitch here, cause I know you feel bad (and you're not stupid either, Froggy. You just let that desire for the dramatic last minute moment get the better of you). And you were here.

You posted at 8:42 PM that you intended to switch to Kate. Post #1333.

Half an hour later, I voted at 9:10, almost an hour before the poll ended. Having seen your post that you intended to switch to Kate. Post #1336

You were in the thread when I voted. I saw you in the tray.

At 9:23, You asked me and Epi our opinions on Marmot, the post right after my vote post, some 10-15 minutes later, #1337.

So tell me what kind of weak save it was when I voted half an hour after you posted you would switch it to Kate (which would have tied it), so I was aware of that and expected it. I voted almost an hour before the poll ended, and three people, two of whom could have been expected to vote for kate, didn't even show up. And you were in the thread after I voted. You knew I had voted, the poll was 4-3 from 9:10 on. Can't blame it on old SVS if you chose to wait till the end to switch it back when you had clearly stated that intention when I voted. *AND* you were in the thread to ask the Marmot question. Neither of us could know there would be 3 no shows.

One thing I learned this game is that civvies *DO* have agendas; no matter what I do or say, you and your boss is gonna find a way to make it bad.

And tbh I would be very surprised if Marmot was bad.

DrWilgy wrote: ↑Wed Dec 28, 2022 10:23 pm @S~V~S & @Epignosis what are y'alls opinions on Marmot?

He’s been open and clear with his thoughts. Have no reason to think he isn’t town.

I don’t think Neon is trying to solve, either. Her game looks nothing like LGM.

I also loathe how she tried to get Quin to not reveal his thoughts during night one. Tried hard, too.

I don’t see Kate NKing Dennis, especially if he was suspecting her.

So imma [VOTE: Neon] aubergine

Mech spec = Mechanics speculation?

@Roxy i think it sounds like we have a 3P.

With this ratio, an extra baddie would be kinda overpowering. An extra civvie maybe not so much, unless the role had a power, then it might be overpowering too. And really, from a hosts perspective, what’s the point of a vanilla 3P?

No extra kills, so at least it doesn’t appear to be a Serial Killer

S~V~S wrote: ↑Tue Dec 27, 2022 7:39 am

Kate wrote: ↑Tue Dec 27, 2022 12:09 am Am I crazy or are there 15 roles and 16 players?

No, not crazy, I just looked and yeah, 15 roles, 16 players. I don't count roles anymore, I haven't seen a secret role in ages. Is that still done? Or iirc there was a last minute sign up; maybe she made a new role and didn't update the roles list?

@Mongoose is this something you'll explain?

No, it's not the last minute sign up, I just looked in the sign up thread, and Mongoose said:

Re: Felt 3 [SIGNUPS]
#66Post by Mongoose » Wed Dec 14, 2022 9:19:10 pm
One more person and we will get this game started!

As for role claiming and info dumping - let’s maybe not do that? But I’m not gonna have you modkilled if you do.

And only one person signed up after that.

Actually when i reread Dennis post, I see it was made pre Lucys death, since he was also town reading her based on the same reasons as me.

Heres the whole thing in context:
So again, this was disproved when Lucy flipped civ, no reason for Dennis to die to disprove it. I would like to know how it would still be valid after Lucy died, but before Dennis did. I am hoping Wilgy explains this to me. Dennis alive helps me if i'm bad, not the opposite way around.

Neon wrote: ↑Tue Dec 27, 2022 3:40 am

S~V~S wrote: ↑Mon Dec 26, 2022 9:33 pm

Spoiler: show

Quin wrote: ↑Mon Dec 19, 2022 7:26 am I did think about delaying this until just before the night ends, but I'll be working at the time so I don't have the luxury. Shrug.

methinks scum team is SVS, lucy and Dennis.

So far in this game, I'm disagreeing with pretty much everything SVS says, and our conversation about scum agendas felt semantic and circular. She thinks lucy focussing so much on the previous game instead of this one isn't suspicious, when my mind (and I'm not the only one) immediately goes to, to quote Kate: "Or maybe the agenda is keeping focus on the last game and keeping it off of her in this one?". This is the interpretation I would expect from town SVS, because it's such an easy angle to add pressure on from someone I usually associate with supertown.

What I disagree with the most, and therefore hate, is this post:

S~V~S wrote: ↑Sat Dec 17, 2022 4:20 pm

Dennis wrote: ↑Sat Dec 17, 2022 3:50 pm @S~V~S What made you think Lucy and I don't have BTSC?

The conversation you had with her about Istanbul/Mujahadeen felt real. It did not feel staged, it did not have that chatroom, "Let's go banter in the thread!" feel about it. Especially the way you ended it,

Dennis wrote: ↑Fri Dec 16, 2022 1:13 am Oh wow you sound like Mr. Talbot

Sorry, but I'm not very interested in history or politics. Most of it goes right through my head. I know hardly anything about the Cold War too. But if that's what makes you happy then you have fun, don't let me stop you

...followed by her attempting to reengage, but you just ignored it. It had an, "OK I'm done with this" feel to it.

lucy and Dennis's interaction did not feel 'real' at all. I don't understand how SVS is seeing it as an organic conversation when part of it involved lucy asking Dennis's mother for permission to start it.

Rather, it felt like lucy tried to force some OT-but-in-white-so-not-OT distancing, Dennis (or the third scum) realised how it looked, and told Dennis to shut it down. It could also look like a really weird attempt for the masons to hint themselves early on. GTH it's the former. Regardless, SVS is explaining away something that just seems so evocative to me. Find me a natural segue between Dennis avoiding problematic content on the internet and Constantinople and I'll eat my pileus.

I suspect lucy and Dennis for their exchange, and SVS for her response to it. Either way SVS/lucy can be w/w. I'll look at lucy and Dennis if I live.

@DrWilgy

Explain how NKIng Dennis, in light of Quins actual theory, quoted here, benefits me in light of Lucys flip. Indeed, Dennis’ NK actually hurts me.

Quin was associating me with Lucy, for thinking her real, organic conversation with Dennis actually sounded real and organic. He wasn’t associating me with Dennis. And even if he was ( he wasn’t) theventite thing was moot when Lucy flipped town, since his entire premise was based on my interpretation of Lucy.

Read this and explain how NKing Dennis benefits me were I bad, since I don’t see it.

You are literally playing exactly how I'd expect you to play if you were trying to discredit the solve using Lucy and Dennis flips. Like word for word here lol

Did you read the spoilered post? It's kinda wall o'text, so I pulled out the things I'm referencing, but it's still up there ^^ if you want to read it in context so you are assured I did not pull shenanigans with Quins original text:

Quin said: So far in this game, I'm disagreeing with pretty much everything SVS says, and our conversation about scum agendas felt semantic and circular. She thinks lucy focussing so much on the previous game instead of this one isn't suspicious, when my mind (and I'm not the only one) immediately goes to, to quote Kate: "Or maybe the agenda is keeping focus on the last game and keeping it off of her in this one?". This is the interpretation I would expect from town SVS, because it's such an easy angle to add pressure on from someone I usually associate with supertown.

This is completely about me and Lucy. None of it actually panned out. None of what Lucy said was suspicious or helping keep the focus off of her, it was civ Lucy trying to have a conversation with Dennis. He obviously doesn't recall my town game as well as he thinks, becasue he was WRONG here ^^ and when Lucy flipped town, his points were rendered moot, and did not require the death of Dennis to be so.

Quin then went on to say he REALLY hated this post of mine (I clipped out part of it, but the entire thing is in the spoilered text above):

I said: The conversation you had with her about Istanbul/Mujahadeen felt real. It did not feel staged, it did not have that chatroom, "Let's go banter in the thread!" feel about it. Especially the way you ended it,

Quins opinion on this:

Quin said: lucy and Dennis's interaction did not feel 'real' at all. I don't understand how SVS is seeing it as an organic conversation when part of it involved lucy asking Dennis's mother for permission to start it.

Rather, it felt like lucy tried to force some OT-but-in-white-so-not-OT distancing, Dennis (or the third scum) realised how it looked, and told Dennis to shut it down. It could also look like a really weird attempt for the masons to hint themselves early on. GTH it's the former. Regardless, SVS is explaining away something that just seems so evocative to me. Find me a natural segue between Dennis avoiding problematic content on the internet and Constantinople and I'll eat my pileus.

Wrong! It felt real becasue it WAS real. It wasn't evocative or anything shady, Lucy wasn't trying to "sound" any way becasue she was a civ, trying to have a conversation with Dennis. Again, Dennis does not need to be dead for this to be disproven. I am looking forward to Quins hat eating ceremony post game, or perhaps Wilgy can eat it for him.

Lucy said earlier in the game that she had been reported last game. Perhaps the permission she mentioned had something to do with that.

If I WAS bad, the person who would be dead is Wilgy. Not Dennis, who thought I was a civ in his big reads list, specifically because this theory had been disproven with Lucys flip.

(From the same Dennis post I used in my last post)

Dennis wrote: ↑Tue Dec 20, 2022 9:19 pm
SVS is town lean because of Quin's theory, nothing else of note

I realize Quin (and that's who I'm really arguing with here) really really really thinks I'm bad, but Wilgy needs to say he's going on Quins gut (and as a gut player myself, I respect that, that's what I go on, too, for the most part), not on this theory, which fell apart when Lucy flipped civ.

This theory being wrong certainly does not make me a civvie. But If I *AM* bad (and I'm not), it's not for this reason ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

Kate wrote: ↑Tue Dec 27, 2022 12:09 am Am I crazy or are there 15 roles and 16 players?

No, not crazy, I just looked and yeah, 15 roles, 16 players. I don't count roles anymore, I haven't seen a secret role in ages. Is that still done? Or iirc there was a last minute sign up; maybe she made a new role and didn't update the roles list?

@Mongoose is this something you'll explain?

Neon wrote: ↑Tue Dec 27, 2022 5:40 am I wonder if the team could just be Kate/Wilgy +1...TSP maybe...

Wilgy made a fairly robust role hint.

He repeated it at least once, and so did at least one player that I noticed.


Much as he wants to eliminate me, Wilgy is townlock, imo. I referenced it too, but it was probably buried in a text wall. It's why when I made my reads list, Wilgy was at the top of it.

@DrWilgy

Explain how NKIng Dennis, in light of Quins actual theory, quoted here, benefits me in light of Lucys flip. Indeed, Dennis’ NK actually hurts me.

Quin was associating me with Lucy, for thinking her real, organic conversation with Dennis actually sounded real and organic. He wasn’t associating me with Dennis. And even if he was ( he wasn’t) theventite thing was moot when Lucy flipped town, since his entire premise was based on my interpretation of Lucy.

Read this and explain how NKing Dennis benefits me were I bad, since I don’t see it.

DrWilgy wrote: ↑Mon Dec 26, 2022 8:09 pm One last chime in theory that I'd like for others to assess before EoN:

The Dennis kill following Lucy may have been a means to break down the suspicion presented by Quin that SVS, Dennis and Lucy were a team. If this is the case, SVS needs critical review.

Since your boss thought my association was with Lucy, that kinda killed that.

Dennis thought I was town, I would not have NKed him were I bad to discredit a theory that was already disproved by Lucys miselim.

I realize your boss really, really thought I was bad. But bosses can be wrong; mine is like every day.

lucy wrote: ↑Mon Dec 26, 2022 3:05 pm i did one semester of philosophy in 8h, i got an a, idk where to put this so i'll drop it in the thread cause a big weight is lifted from my shoulders

Congrats! That’s the best feeling, when you thought you maybe didn’t do great, but then you pull it out of the bag. Like Splints said, uni is something I wish I had handled better. So good on you!

fingersplints wrote: ↑Sun Dec 25, 2022 4:50 pm Merry Christmas to each and every player.

I have had the most wonderful holiday. It was stressful and I was hating every moment of it… then Val said “mommy”

For those who don’t know my daughter is non verbal autistic, and I just want to cry at this moment. It’s been an hour and a half and I’m STILL crying writing this. Merry Christmas all. I love you alll

This is the best Holiday gift ever, Splints! I have a niece who is also non verbal, and the first time she said "Mama" my sister was bawling like a baby, she was so happy.

Worst Gift Ever

My husband never got the knack of buying gifts for women, his sister always did his shopping for him when he was younger.

One year he got me a weed whacker for Christmas cause I said we needed one. Woo Hoo. And for bonus points, it was a gas powered one that required a pull cord like a lawn mower, and I was unable to start it. So only he could use it. Which kinda worked out for me in the end lol.

OMG Zaccutto is AMAZING! Now I want some.

Merry Christmas, to those who celebrate, and a Wonderful Day to those who don't! Time to go pick out some cake!

I’m still out for Christmas Eve, I thought today was the three day day, but I see it ends tonight. Should be back before the end but gonna vote now just in case.

Gonna [VOTE: Rondo] aubergine will answer @ ‘s later.

Neon wrote: ↑Sat Dec 24, 2022 11:15 am

S~V~S wrote: ↑Sat Dec 24, 2022 9:20 am So, stepmom is coming home today, apparently they can give you a blood test and theres a certain chemical they can detect only if you have had a recent heart attack, and she did not have one. They kept her overnight for observation, she is pretty elderly, so better safe than sorry. Possible Angina or anxiety. So I'll be doing the cooking today rather than just the guesting, lol.

Neon wrote: ↑Fri Dec 23, 2022 10:11 pm

Neon wrote: ↑Fri Dec 23, 2022 10:10 pm

Marmot wrote: ↑Fri Dec 23, 2022 9:51 pm

Neon wrote: ↑Fri Dec 23, 2022 1:35 am The Dennis kill to me shows the woofs aren't being pressured and that we are running way off base. Not surprising really methinks they are using night kills to bait us into easy misexes

Neon wrote: ↑Fri Dec 23, 2022 1:36 am I wouldn't be surprised if Wilgy or even Marmot or Epi are woofin

Do you believe this, or is this more of a "my top suspect was nightkilled and now I'm lost" reaction?

I believe we are way off base and mafia is laughing in our face by killing Dennis. Yes.

Alternatively SVS is scum and they were trying to discredit Quinns solve so we never went there.

What solve? I thought that was basically discredited when Lucy flipped town? I tend to go more with your framing theory re Dennis' death, so I plan to read back on Kate this AM. I know her pretty well, and I don't know that I see her NKing her kid right before Christmas Especially after he suspected her, although I thought his suspish was a bit of a No U. I think his first game was so sunshine, rainbows and puppies that he was a bit at sea over taking suspish.

Now see I suspect you have to say this no?

I am not sure what you are asking me here. I have to say what?

DrWilgy
Epignosis
fingersplints
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Roxy
Kate
sig (sub for sabie12)
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Lemonfairy
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
TonyStarkPrime
Marmot
Neon
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
RondoDimBuckle

No colors, just block's o'text. Fairly in order.

I would be pretty shocked if Wilgy, Epi or Splints were bad.
I would not be shocked, but somewhat surprised if Roxy was bad, her game here is totally different than LGM. Kate as well, while it's WIFOM, I don't know that I think she'd set up fake suspish on Dennis, or NK him, especially after he pushed back. I felt pretty good about Sabie. She didn't seem to be following anyone and had her own opinions, so a good look for sig to roll ino, imo.

I put Lemonfairy in her own group. She has mostly just breezed in voted and left, hasn't expressed many opinions. Gave one long post mostly town vibereads (it's a big post, I'll spoiler it). She hasn't really engaged. Pretty much NAI, I have no read on her. She has been voting for me, but I don't know why. The PoE group I have reasons to think could go either way. Lemonfairy I really have no read at all.
My PoE group is not really in any order, I tried ordering it but can't. Tony comes in, votes, and says nothing about why. He literally said (over two posts) "Everyone vote for Kate. I saw a kate post I thought was wolfy." OK, lol. The only time he ever made anything other than a one line post was when Roxy asked him to post suspects and he said, "i got news for ya, I'm not getting eliminated and if I do it's town's fault". She never said anything about suspecting him so not sure where that came from. This may be SOP for him, I know I played with him, but don't recall if this is the norm for him, so PoE.

Marmot and Neon, I have more complex thoughts on. Marmot's doing a lot of reads and is prompting a lot of discussion, trying to coax opinions out of people which is a good look. But it bothers me alot that he continued to imply my wordiness was AI when it absolutely is not, and I even pointed it out to him from another game where I was civ that it came up in discussion. I have very little conversational filter, so i over explain to soften things. It's something I do irl, it's a compensation mechanism. I posted the info from the other game, tagged him in it, and he did not respond, but still repeated the "too wordy" thing. When he put up his rainbow, he kinda wishy washy acknowledged it, but gave no other reason for reads. Perhaps I am just annoyed at him, because other than this I mostly townread him.

Marmot said in his rainbow list: S~V~S - I've talked about SVS at length already. She has been over-explainy, to which she has also explained this is normal for her (it's been so long since we've played together, I don't remember your exact playstyle), but at times to me it doesn't feel like it accomplishes very much. I would put her lower, but since this does appear to be the norm for her, I'm putting a little less emphasis on that particular style of posting in my read on her.

And Neon is nothing like her last game. Even if i agreed with some of her conclusions there, she was posting data, making reads. She came out like an avenging angel when we elimmed a bad Lucy in LGM, which townlocked her for me. But she made sad faces when we did it here to a Lucy who actually flipped town, but didn't really try and stop it. She could just be less interested, or she could be bad. I am leaning less interested, but I am not actively town reading her as i did in LGM, which is my only experience of her. Also her trying to talk Quin out of divulging his reads during the night, then he was NKed; things that make you go

Rondo I have talked about at somewhat in the Falcon discussion, and the aftermath. Rondo came in, make a fake list and seems to be sticking to it for no reason he has expressed to the point of making fake red checks in a game with no cops . And then anyone who doubts him either should "know his game" or becomes a wolf themselves. I got the impression it was becasue I voted for Falcon, but he seems a little over traumatized by this to the point that I am not sure if it is real or not. He's making "Civvies suck" type posts, but if he's town, he isn't helping with what mostly comes across as rage posting.

So, stepmom is coming home today, apparently they can give you a blood test and theres a certain chemical they can detect only if you have had a recent heart attack, and she did not have one. They kept her overnight for observation, she is pretty elderly, so better safe than sorry. Possible Angina or anxiety. So I'll be doing the cooking today rather than just the guesting, lol.

Neon wrote: ↑Fri Dec 23, 2022 10:11 pm

Neon wrote: ↑Fri Dec 23, 2022 10:10 pm

Marmot wrote: ↑Fri Dec 23, 2022 9:51 pm

Neon wrote: ↑Fri Dec 23, 2022 1:35 am The Dennis kill to me shows the woofs aren't being pressured and that we are running way off base. Not surprising really methinks they are using night kills to bait us into easy misexes

Neon wrote: ↑Fri Dec 23, 2022 1:36 am I wouldn't be surprised if Wilgy or even Marmot or Epi are woofin

Do you believe this, or is this more of a "my top suspect was nightkilled and now I'm lost" reaction?

I believe we are way off base and mafia is laughing in our face by killing Dennis. Yes.

Alternatively SVS is scum and they were trying to discredit Quinns solve so we never went there.

What solve? I thought that was basically discredited when Lucy flipped town? I tend to go more with your framing theory re Dennis' death, so I plan to read back on Kate this AM. I know her pretty well, and I don't know that I see her NKing her kid right before Christmas Especially after he suspected her, although I thought his suspish was a bit of a No U. I think his first game was so sunshine, rainbows and puppies that he was a bit at sea over taking suspish.

Neon wrote: ↑Fri Dec 23, 2022 10:12 pm

S~V~S wrote: ↑Fri Dec 23, 2022 10:10 pm Hey all sorry I have been afk, my stepmom had to go to the hospital with chest pains and they’re keeping her overnight.

I’m shot and going to bed, but should be around in the AM and at least part of the day.

Thanks for understanding

Well now I feel awful for that cross-post

I hope everything goes alright

No don’t feel bad, its a game.

And thanks docsvthink she’s ok keeping her for observation, mainly, justvstressful cause holidays.

Hey all sorry I have been afk, my stepmom had to go to the hospital with chest pains and they’re keeping her overnight.

I’m shot and going to bed, but should be around in the AM and at least part of the day.

Thanks for understanding

Epignosis wrote: ↑Thu Dec 22, 2022 11:05 pm Lemonfairy is like a teeeny bit town, i dont know how much of that read is just because of the pfp though

Someone translate please.

Pfp generally means profile picture. Lemon has a cute profile picture, so his opinion may be being influenced by that.

All righty then, Dead Poetry Jam.

I was at a big Holiday party last night and got home about 10 minutes past poll ending. But had i been here, I probably would not have voted differently.

DrWilgy wrote: ↑Wed Dec 21, 2022 5:23 pm

Spoiler: show

S~V~S wrote: ↑Tue Dec 20, 2022 8:19 pm

Spoiler: show

DrWilgy wrote: ↑Tue Dec 20, 2022 3:32 pm

S~V~S wrote: ↑Tue Dec 20, 2022 7:45 am

DrWilgy wrote: ↑Mon Dec 19, 2022 11:25 pm

S~V~S wrote: ↑Mon Dec 19, 2022 9:25 pm I am on my way to a holiday party. I may or may not be back in here tonight, and I have another Weds., but I’ll be normal days and tomorrow night.

I’m interested in knowing why Marmot and especially Wilgy pushed so hard on Falcon being bad, to the point that Wilgy pushed back at people who didn’t think Falcon was more suspish than he, Wilgy, was. But then didn’t vote for Falcon.

Marmot said he was gonna be out of thread at EOD so there’s that. But I don’t understand what Wilgy was about.

Don't blow my efforts out of the water. I even advised that it was still 2/3 confidence.

You say I pushed back? How do? I believe I inquired as to reasons as half of them weren't given.

How so? I read the thread. You have 41 posts, 18, almost half of them, reference Falcon. Then theres another 5 where you quote him and don't actually type out 'Falcon", so those posts only have his full user name. Most of them were a back and forth with him about why he was bad. I didn't see any 2/3 confidence. Your sureness was why I went back and reread him in the first place.

You pushed back at several people, at me and Sabie specifically for not being sure what to think of it. Then Roxy for saying of you and Falcon, you pinged her more.

You don't get to say, " I believe I inquired as to reasons as half of them weren't given." as if you were just asking for peoples opinions when half of your posts were about "Falcon is wolf", and implying people were bad for thinking YOU might be the wolf.

That said, I get what you're putting out in the post after this one. And it makes alot of sense, but I need to read back interactions to see if I actually believe it.

Aye, perhaps there's a misinterpretation in perception. As stated earlier, I threw Falcon off his normal game plan. That was my initial intention and gauging the reaction following to both Falcon and those around him was my intention.

I only after he responded formed a w read that was more than a 50/50.

By pushing back are you referring to "attempting to read me on meta is incorrect?" By all means feel free to sus me, but bring some arguments that make sense and at least acknowledge that if I advise meta isn't a good way to catch me that there is at least some slight truth to it. I'll continue being a 50/50 read as long as people do not realize that for the past 10 years, my entire playstyle has been in effort to both recognize and break my own patterns while observing the ones surrounding. Mafia is like walking the sands of Arrakis. Move in the same pattern and a sandworm will eat you.

Also further to reaction testing. What do you see re my views and method with Neon? How do you compare them to my handling of Falcon?

I didn't say anything about meta. This has nothing to do with meta; only with what has been said in this game. Although as a massive Dune fan, I 100% get your reference. But I am a tad confused becasue I was talking about this in reference to Lucy earlier, not to you.

I don't mean to be rude but I am not 100% sure I understand what you're saying. I think it is based on how you are wording things *this game* becasue I have not had this problem in the past. It almost seems like you are intentionally obscuring what you actually mean. I don't understand what "throwing Falcon off his normal game plan" means in relation to this. Is his normal game plan NAI? Did you disrupt his game just to test other peoples reactions to it? Was that fair to him? Did you ever actually suspect him, or was this an experiment?

How I would define Pushing back:

Person A: Well, I don't know what to think re Wilgy vs falcon.

Wilgy: What do you mean you can't tell?? Isn't it obvious that he is bad and I am not?

That has nothing to do with meta. I am, again, unsure what point you are trying to make with this. And I am not sure how "reaction testing" is a civvie thing, as you earlier described it. You disrupt someones game, post about it and see how people react to your posts, and you judge them based on whether or not they vote people based on your maybe not true opinions?

It just seems like an excuse to not take responsibility for your actions, and continue to suspect people who "fell" for your... experiment.

I don't understand your "method" as you have described it, so how it applies to Neon, I don't know. I think Neon seems disinterested and is not really invested. Not sure if this is NAI or not. I do know I picked up on your Falcon points (and Marmots, becasue my suspish of Falcon was based more on his interactions with Marmot than on yours) becasue I already was watching him becasue of how Rondos joke baddie team was players 3, 4 and 5, and totally skipped player 2, Falcon. So I paid more attention to your Falcon points than to your Neon points.

I am getting a bit frustrated, I dislike feeling dumb, and not understanding what someone is saying makes me feel like an idiot, lol.

Is his normal game plan NAI? Very much so.
Did you disrupt his game just to test other peoples reactions to it? Both his own and those around it.
Was that fair to him? Yes, not really sure about what is and isn't fair in this setting.
Did you ever actually suspect him, or was this an experiment? I did notice a lack of normal Falcon questions and it was about a 50% suspicion. Falcon's reaction moved it to the 70% where I was comfortable with his yeet.

Person A: Well, I don't know what to think re Wilgy vs falcon.

Wilgy: What do you mean you can't tell?? Isn't it obvious that he is bad and I am not?

I think that this may be a poor representation of me during the Scrabble. Yes, I did question many players that didn't know if my behavior was scummy or not, but I desired for them to draw their own conclusions and my questions were to evaluate as to if those conclusions were genuine.

I think in the presentation above, it is much more indicative of me encouraging a thunder dome. I did nothing of the sort. Any other wagons that had decent analysis behind them were more than welcome. As to if I were to vote there or not, that depends on the argument and if it made sense.

You disrupt someones game, post about it and see how people react to your posts, and you judge them based on whether or not they vote people based on your maybe not true opinions?

Yes, disruption during RVS is how data is generated. We were mostly in a chaos state and off topic until I did so. Yes, judging players reactions and votes is how Mafia is played and solved? Though, I feel that you are implying that my judgement was based on votes alone which feels discrediting for no reason.

No one fell for an experiment. I observed, provided a conclusion, that conclusion was wrong. If people agreed with me, fine. I'd like to know why they agreed with me so I can assess if they are being genuine. If they disagreed with me, also why? Did they have TMI and seek to benefit from a misyeet?

You are not an idiot. I would like you to answer though, if I am town do you have a discourse with how I'm playing the game? If I am wolf, was my push purposely to yeet Falcon and blame those around me blindly?

I didn't know if I could double spoiler, so I didn't even try, lol.

I would have answered some of this differently had I had time to do it yesterday pre yeet

I dislike disrupting someone elses game for no reason, or for less than "I am really pretty sure". This probably comes from the old days when dead meant "no win" even if your team goes on to win in the end. You had to be alive in the end to win, and disrupting someones game intentionally "just to see how they react" isn't something I see coming from a townie place. It's part of why I thought *you* were bad when I first came in, before I thought more about your boss. You may think it is a poor representation, but that is how I saw it at the time. I understand this is no longer the case, but I still tend to view town as benevolent; baddies yeet people and cackle about it in the chat room. Civvies are more careful.

I was not trying to sound "discrediting"; again, disrupting someone elses game for "data" is not something I am a fan of. It's why I really dislike the whole "No lynch is worse than lynching a civvie" mindset. You got data, but that persons game is over. It's an old fashioned mindset on my part, I suppose, and I am *not* being judgy. I know I am a minority here and I understand the reasons why. But I am still not a huge fan of it. You may recall that I took flak for trying to intentionally tie it to save the inestimable Dr Wilgy in LGM.

My *gut* reaction is to view it as bad, and I am a gut player more than a data player, although once past midgame, I'll take data more into account.

And i know I am not an idiot; but as I am sure you can tell, I love language. And reading what someone else is saying and not being able to get the gist of it is somewhat foreign to me, and frustrating as well. So thank you for being more accessible in your answer. It's like the word "slot" as it's been being used. Even though Neon explained it to me, I don't understand it's use here, what less expressive word it replaces. When I see it in a post I get all

That said, I am not sure what

if I am town do you have a discourse with how I'm playing the game?

means in context. Everyone should play how they see fit. I don't like lockstep when everyone thinks the same thing, and yeets people for thinking differently. I kinda loathe the word "antitown" applied as an "it is known". If we're not constantly evolving our mindset what is the point?

I am not talking about how you're playing the game. I am trying to suss out your intentions in your actions while playing the game, and to give you some sense of my own mindset, since your boss seemed to have some concerns in that area. I don't think you are wolf, but when I thought you might be, I thought you were trying to build suspicion on someone for vague reasons, and then you didn't even vote for them. I didn't think you did so "blindly", I doubt you do anything blindly in most games. But I didn't see a town reason for your actions at the time

@Roxy please dont!

lucy wrote: ↑Wed Dec 21, 2022 8:28 am

S~V~S wrote: ↑Wed Dec 21, 2022 7:48 am Dennis than about her.

u do know he's 0/2 right, if you feel better about dennis then suddenly i've townread town and there's no reasoning to vote me, not like there ever was

Did you read the rest of the post? I was townreading you on tone.

You gave a super evasive answer to Epi and your reason for your Falcon vote was non existent.

So yeah, I changed my mind.

Also @Dennis , you are town leaning me and Lucy solely becasue you disagree with Quins theory (since you're in it)? Do I understand that correctly?

If Quin had not posted that theory, how does that change your read?

lucy wrote: ↑Tue Dec 20, 2022 9:20 pm

Epignosis wrote: ↑Tue Dec 20, 2022 8:52 pm

lucy wrote: ↑Tue Dec 20, 2022 8:47 pm

Epignosis wrote: ↑Tue Dec 20, 2022 8:26 pm

Neon wrote: ↑Tue Dec 20, 2022 8:21 pm Someone help me understand the Lucy wagon?

It's me and DrWilgy.

I'm voting there for two reasons.

One, to give Dennis some breathing room.

Two, this:

Epignosis wrote: ↑Tue Dec 20, 2022 12:34 pm

lucy wrote: ↑Sun Dec 18, 2022 7:49 pm i'm fine with a falcon vote, i can't follow the guy, i'll iso wigly cause rondo reads are good

Can you point me to where you tried?

i've played 5ish games with rondo over a span of 5 months

Eh?

I was asking about Falcon.

i can't read, literally same amount of month long experience with falcon

I don't understand this answer at all.

He isn't asking if you have experience with Falcon, he's asking if you tried to even "Follow the guy". I read back last night and realized that your first mention of Falcon was your vote for him. So it isn't even like you tried to follow the guy. You just voted for the biggest wagon, a wagon on someone you said you can't follow. WTF.

So maybe you're right and me trying to tone read you is a fools errand.

Out of all the objectively bad, in retrospect, reasons to vote Falcon, this is the worst.

So when I reread you, leaving LGM, tone and my own biases, out of it, I am having a hard time seeing how you are town.

I will be rereading and following today when possible. I will have to vote early, I have my *big* fancy dress corporate Holiday party tonight, so I'm unlikely to be here after 5, and today is a lot of year end team meetings so I may not be in thread much before that, either. Having reread Lucy, imma reverse myself and piss Neon off again and [VOTE: Lucy] aubergine. Having reread them both, I feel better about Dennis than about her. And I am not 100% sure I will have time to make a different, informed, vote. I think Quins theory is based on some incorrect suppositions, but I can see Lucy as bad independant of it.

I came in yesterday gunning for Wilgy, but something he said gave me pause, so I reread him, too. And while I disagree with his conclusions, I don't think he's a good vote for today.

@Dennis I don't understand your vote for Splints.

@Marmot both from LGM, where I was town, since you used that as your comparison game. I didn't even have to pull up 500 word posts, it was an actual point of discussion.

Vivax wrote: ↑Thu Dec 08, 2022 5:19 pm SVS - Townlean - Clearly someone who finds joy in writing. While floofy, the posts I've read didn't suggest she was making it up dishonestly.

S~V~S wrote: ↑Thu Dec 08, 2022 5:32 pm @Vivax youre right, I do like to write and to talk. Why use 3 words when you could use 500? During family parties, my uncles used to pay me to go be quiet somewhere in 10 minute increments.

Marmot wrote: ↑Tue Dec 20, 2022 8:19 pm [VOTE: SVS] aubergine

SVS seems more verbose in this game then in LGM, and sometimes the size of her posts feel unnecessary in getting her point across. I'm not sure if this is AI, but I'm putting my vote there for now.


I know some people as wolf tend to be overexplainy or cover up their agenda with a vast amount of words, I'm curious what anyone else thinks.

Dude I'm wounded. I am always over explainy, always have been.

I didn't say anything about meta. This has nothing to do with meta; only with what has been said in this game. Although as a massive Dune fan, I 100% get your reference. But I am a tad confused becasue I was talking about this in reference to Lucy earlier, not to you.

I don't mean to be rude but I am not 100% sure I understand what you're saying. I think it is based on how you are wording things *this game* becasue I have not had this problem in the past. It almost seems like you are intentionally obscuring what you actually mean. I don't understand what "throwing Falcon off his normal game plan" means in relation to this. Is his normal game plan NAI? Did you disrupt his game just to test other peoples reactions to it? Was that fair to him? Did you ever actually suspect him, or was this an experiment?

How I would define Pushing back:

Person A: Well, I don't know what to think re Wilgy vs falcon.

Wilgy: What do you mean you can't tell?? Isn't it obvious that he is bad and I am not?

That has nothing to do with meta. I am, again, unsure what point you are trying to make with this. And I am not sure how "reaction testing" is a civvie thing, as you earlier described it. You disrupt someones game, post about it and see how people react to your posts, and you judge them based on whether or not they vote people based on your maybe not true opinions?

It just seems like an excuse to not take responsibility for your actions, and continue to suspect people who "fell" for your... experiment.

I don't understand your "method" as you have described it, so how it applies to Neon, I don't know. I think Neon seems disinterested and is not really invested. Not sure if this is NAI or not. I do know I picked up on your Falcon points (and Marmots, becasue my suspish of Falcon was based more on his interactions with Marmot than on yours) becasue I already was watching him becasue of how Rondos joke baddie team was players 3, 4 and 5, and totally skipped player 2, Falcon. So I paid more attention to your Falcon points than to your Neon points.

I am getting a bit frustrated, I dislike feeling dumb, and not understanding what someone is saying makes me feel like an idiot, lol.

@Marmot GTH gut reaction, I think she’s town

I get Quins point about my use of “agenda” re Lucy, but I stand by it. I don’t see a specific agenda here like I did in LGM, and I think having a specific agenda is a wolf thing. Town wants to catch the wolves; wolves want to divide and conquer and that requires specific focuses which town is less likely to have. I don’t see any of that in Lucy.

He said it was semantics on my part, but he was the one who took exception with my word choice and started that.

Maybe my word choice wasn’t just so, but I think my meaning is obvious.

@Dennis

This is *my* thought process, not anyone else’s as far as I know. It only explains my vote, not anyone elses. I didn’t see anyone else say that.

I’m not sure how you make that leap.

@Neon

I’ve only seen the one of his game besides this one.

I was in a game on another site, RM. Some other people here may have played it. This girl, SoFi, was trying to call her team to the chat. She thought she was sending a PM, but she really was posting to the thread.

It was *hilarious*. She posted something like,

“X, Y and Z, get in the chat room now! We need to talk about killing W! “

It was so funny

But maybe it was just a lulz thing on Falcons part. With his flip, I don’t see what else it could be. I can’t wait to ask Falcon post game.

I started reading back on Quins theory, and since it involves me, I'm taking it with a grain of salt, I'll finish it up later and post thoughts.

That said, I spent 90% of the entire last game watching Lucy, and i get she likes to be a mystery, and inscrutable, etc., but it isn't easy to maintain that. I used to try to do it, too, to help my bad game even when I was civ. But it's hard to maintain that without forming a discernible pattern of some kind over time. So I settled for just smutting up my town game a bit instead.

She looks totally different to me from LGM. She had a slick "trying to shock you" faux feel to her there that I totally am not seeing here.

But perhaps she is better at switching up each game than I was, plus it took me a few years to get to the point where I gave up, and I'm not sure how long she's been playing. I am far from a Lucy expert, as i am sure she is pleased to hear.

She also writes a charming romantic essay

OK, gotta go get ready for work.

Neon wrote: ↑Tue Dec 20, 2022 7:59 am I'm so confused lol

RondoDimBuckle wrote: ↑Tue Dec 20, 2022 5:29 am [VOTE: SVS ] aubergine

I see you have entered the tunnel you have built for yourself. Far be it from me to talk you out of it.

I said this several times in the Day one thread, gonna say it one more time, then you're on your own.

On Day Zero, you came into the thread first. Followed by Falcon about a minute later. You two were romping and cavorting when I got there. I was Player #3. Next, about 10 minutes after me, Kate. Player #4.

Then about 20 minutes or so after that came Quin, player #5. Then you made an (I assume) joke post that me, kate and Quin were the bad team. How Jolly! Players 3, 4 and 5.

But you left Falcon out of it. Why not start at player #2? So I thought maybe you and Falcon had BTSC. In this game, could be bad, could be good. So i decided to watch, and in my first "what sticks out to me" post, it was the first thing I mentioned.

So several people started a soft push on Falcon; Quin, Wilgy, Marmot. So i went back and reread him, I could see some points, but was still a bit waffly then he posted this:

falcon45ca wrote: ↑Sun Dec 18, 2022 5:05 pm I am hungover today and have to wrap presents n such.



If you need anything, just text me, don't call



Expect medium things from me tomorrow

"Just text me, don't call."

I have seen chatroom slips, and this reads *just* like one to me. Like he thought he was sending a PM, and he posted to the thread by mistake.

I thought it was hilarious.

So I went with it, because it was a bout a billion percent better than some of the Day One voting rationales you see out there.

Your reaction sold me on my BTSC theory. Like if me, Quin and Kate were actually on your joke baddie team, we'd all pile on falcon, of all people, who hadn't suspected or even mentioned afair any of us. You were OBVIOUSLY upset. But then you made the effort to point out you *weren't defending falcon*. SO at that point I was 99% positive we got a baddie day one.

So when he flipped as a non BTSC fabric, none of this made any sense to me. WHO WAS HE TALKING TO???

In any case, I can see you're gonna tunnel, and nothing I say or do will change your mind.

So have fun in the tunnel. I won't be joining you in there.

DrWilgy wrote: ↑Mon Dec 19, 2022 11:25 pm

S~V~S wrote: ↑Mon Dec 19, 2022 9:25 pm I am on my way to a holiday party. I may or may not be back in here tonight, and I have another Weds., but I’ll be normal days and tomorrow night.

I’m interested in knowing why Marmot and especially Wilgy pushed so hard on Falcon being bad, to the point that Wilgy pushed back at people who didn’t think Falcon was more suspish than he, Wilgy, was. But then didn’t vote for Falcon.

Marmot said he was gonna be out of thread at EOD so there’s that. But I don’t understand what Wilgy was about.

Don't blow my efforts out of the water. I even advised that it was still 2/3 confidence.

You say I pushed back? How do? I believe I inquired as to reasons as half of them weren't given.

How so? I read the thread. You have 41 posts, 18, almost half of them, reference Falcon. Then theres another 5 where you quote him and don't actually type out 'Falcon", so those posts only have his full user name. Most of them were a back and forth with him about why he was bad. I didn't see any 2/3 confidence. Your sureness was why I went back and reread him in the first place.

You pushed back at several people, at me and Sabie specifically for not being sure what to think of it. Then Roxy for saying of you and Falcon, you pinged her more.

You don't get to say, " I believe I inquired as to reasons as half of them weren't given." as if you were just asking for peoples opinions when half of your posts were about "Falcon is wolf", and implying people were bad for thinking YOU might be the wolf.

That said, I get what you're putting out in the post after this one. And it makes alot of sense, but I need to read back interactions to see if I actually believe it.

I am on my way to a holiday party. I may or may not be back in here tonight, and I have another Weds., but I’ll be normal days and tomorrow night.

I’m interested in knowing why Marmot and especially Wilgy pushed so hard on Falcon being bad, to the point that Wilgy pushed back at people who didn’t think Falcon was more suspish than he, Wilgy, was. But then didn’t vote for Falcon.

Marmot said he was gonna be out of thread at EOD so there’s that. But I don’t understand what Wilgy was about.

lucy wrote: ↑Mon Dec 19, 2022 7:15 pm

Quin wrote: ↑Mon Dec 19, 2022 9:22 am implying i have ever given a damn about "rEaD aCcUrAcY"

i give a damn that all your future insight is now completely inaccurate

Being right isn't all it's cracked up to be.

Epignosis wrote: ↑Mon Dec 19, 2022 7:17 pm

S~V~S wrote: ↑Mon Dec 19, 2022 7:08 pm I would like to be DB Coopers briefcase an hour after he jumped from the plane. I’d like to know if he lived or died.

Wow, I had forgotten about INHs' Wiseau fetish.

I would like to be DB Coopers briefcase an hour after he jumped from the plane. I’d like to know if he lived or died.

Neon wrote: ↑Sun Dec 18, 2022 9:29 pm It's easy to silence a correct solve with a kill. Nobody will push your solve as hard as you.

This is true.

Neon wrote: ↑Sun Dec 18, 2022 9:19 pm

S~V~S wrote: ↑Sun Dec 18, 2022 9:16 pm

Dennis wrote: ↑Sun Dec 18, 2022 9:11 pm

Quin wrote: ↑Sun Dec 18, 2022 9:09 pmno it doesnt

Yes it does. If you're right then you might get NK'd and that would suck.

No it doesn’t. If he never speaks his mind and is NKed, then no one ever knows what he’s thinking.

If anything not saying anything makes him more likely to be NKed.

And Mountain Vacation for the win.

This is actively false lol

How so?

If he never says anything, bad team sends in their kill right before the deadline and he gets killed.

If he says it during the night, there’s no point in killing him.