The Syndicate

The headline here is that Strawhenge is amazing.

Hally wrote: ↑Mon May 03, 2021 8:11 pm
Sloonei wrote: ↑Mon May 03, 2021 8:10 pm
novaselinenever wrote: ↑Thu Apr 08, 2021 6:19 pm A message to the people of Fargo,

My fellow Americans,

Today is a day to rejoice, but also to look ahead. We have eliminated the first threat to our great democracy, but there is still a long road ahead of us. In celebration of our early achievements, I am excited to announce an avocado stimulus. Every American household will receive 1 avocado in the coming weeks. Without the Kansas City Mafia's tight control over our avocado imports, we are free to share our surplus with the hard working American people.
But this is not the end of our agenda. Tonight, we will also be targeting domestic issues that threaten us from within. I wish that I could report more at this time, but it is not in the best interests of our beautiful country for me to do so.

Thank you, stay vigilant, and may God Bless America.

Spoiler: show
@Oddmerta @Alison @Sloonei @Long Con @tedxtr @KZA @AL_sama @Strawhenge @Justplayingitcool @fingersplints @staypositivefriend @Hally @Dom @BoKnows @Esooa @falcon45ca @NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME @Michelle @TonyStarkPrime

gotta make it more obvious, chief

I originally planned to use that ability to transmit all my info, but then I found out it was a day ability, so I couldn't use it as a failsafe in the event that I died in the night.

novaselinenever wrote: ↑Thu Apr 08, 2021 6:19 pm A message to the people of Fargo,

My fellow Americans,

Today is a day to rejoice, but also to look ahead. We have eliminated the first threat to our great democracy, but there is still a long road ahead of us. In celebration of our early achievements, I am excited to announce an avocado stimulus. Every American household will receive 1 avocado in the coming weeks. Without the Kansas City Mafia's tight control over our avocado imports, we are free to share our surplus with the hard working American people.
But this is not the end of our agenda. Tonight, we will also be targeting domestic issues that threaten us from within. I wish that I could report more at this time, but it is not in the best interests of our beautiful country for me to do so.

Thank you, stay vigilant, and may God Bless America.

Spoiler: show
@Oddmerta @Alison @Sloonei @Long Con @tedxtr @KZA @AL_sama @Strawhenge @Justplayingitcool @fingersplints @staypositivefriend @Hally @Dom @BoKnows @Esooa @falcon45ca @NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME @Michelle @TonyStarkPrime

nova has forsaken us.

staypositivefriend wrote: ↑Sun Apr 11, 2021 6:01 pm
Sloonei wrote: ↑Sun Apr 11, 2021 5:59 pm
staypositivefriend wrote: ↑Sun Apr 11, 2021 5:57 pm i don't have time to write a legacy post in the next 3 minutes. if there's any read that i havent been clear enough on, then feel free to ask
Are you gay?

YES

Justplayingitcool wrote: ↑Sun Apr 11, 2021 5:59 pm legacy: im drunk

fake

staypositivefriend wrote: ↑Sun Apr 11, 2021 5:57 pm i don't have time to write a legacy post in the next 3 minutes. if there's any read that i havent been clear enough on, then feel free to ask

Are you gay?

BoKnows wrote: ↑Sun Apr 11, 2021 5:57 pm Sloonei just trolling I think

This is a No Troll Zone. We're in a different fairy tale.

No legacy from me. I feel I've left everything I need to in the thread in the event that I die tonight.

Michelle wrote: ↑Sun Apr 11, 2021 5:39 pm
Hally wrote: ↑Sun Apr 11, 2021 5:33 pm
Michelle wrote: ↑Sun Apr 11, 2021 5:24 pm
Hally wrote: ↑Sun Apr 11, 2021 5:14 pm i get the sense from how michelle and ted have been talking that this is not really different to how al plays as a villager? then what’s he like as a wolf? i’m struggling to imagine how he could be wolfier
He's not wolfier, just have an agenda-y vibe
does he not have an agenda-y vibe here?
His scum range is wider than that, he would not go for just few players.

Even if he was playing his first game in a new environment with a bunch of new people who are being really loud and proactive?

Hally wrote: ↑Sun Apr 11, 2021 5:22 pm
Sloonei wrote: ↑Sun Apr 11, 2021 5:19 pm
Hally wrote: ↑Sun Apr 11, 2021 5:16 pm
Sloonei wrote: ↑Sun Apr 11, 2021 5:14 pm Legacy read time?
i don’t feel confident enough in anything to leave a legacy but i think i’ve generally made my positions known well enough
Mind condensing your positions together in one easy-to-find place?
i can try

Your efforts will be honored and appreciated.

Hally wrote: ↑Sun Apr 11, 2021 5:16 pm
Sloonei wrote: ↑Sun Apr 11, 2021 5:14 pm Legacy read time?
i don’t feel confident enough in anything to leave a legacy but i think i’ve generally made my positions known well enough

Mind condensing your positions together in one easy-to-find place?

AL_sama's blind review of the mechanical information available to us:

AL_sama wrote: ↑Sun Apr 11, 2021 3:43 pm
Sloonei wrote: ↑Sun Apr 11, 2021 3:31 pm So far we have a player who is presumed to be a mason with a dead civilian.
its fine to trust mason claim as long as they know each other's roles -- Hally is town

Sloonei wrote: ↑Sun Apr 11, 2021 3:31 pm A player who has claimed to be a treestump with some slight verification.
not sure about this one -- Esooa TBD
Sloonei wrote: ↑Sun Apr 11, 2021 3:31 pm A player who claims mechanical/flavor knowledge of other roles, in such a way that appears likely to be a civilian.
the info can be trusted but not the player -- Alison's info is legit, but she may not be
Sloonei wrote: ↑Sun Apr 11, 2021 3:31 pm A player who claims mech info on another player which clears that second player.
this is 50 50 can go either way -- Michelle and Ted are a shrug

Legacy read time?

Sloon-ee is the canonical pronunciation.

I’m sorry, i made this name up when i was 12

KZA wrote: ↑Sun Apr 11, 2021 4:26 pm how do you guys pronounce sloonei?

Pap-reek-ah

falcon45ca wrote: ↑Sun Apr 11, 2021 3:39 pm
Sloonei wrote: ↑Sun Apr 11, 2021 3:33 pm
BoKnows wrote: ↑Sun Apr 11, 2021 3:26 pm
Hally wrote: ↑Sun Apr 11, 2021 3:26 pm there was a point in the game where falcon was widely v read. what was the reason for that?
cause it's obvious when he's scum and he isn't obvious scum
Counterpoint: multiball
Counterpoint: players make adjustments
Your face is a counterpoint to awesomeness

Sir we only tolerate fake murder here.

BoKnows wrote: ↑Sun Apr 11, 2021 3:37 pm
Sloonei wrote: ↑Sun Apr 11, 2021 3:33 pm
BoKnows wrote: ↑Sun Apr 11, 2021 3:26 pm
Hally wrote: ↑Sun Apr 11, 2021 3:26 pm there was a point in the game where falcon was widely v read. what was the reason for that?
cause it's obvious when he's scum and he isn't obvious scum
Counterpoint: multiball
Counterpoint: players make adjustments
day 1 he wasn't obvious scum. that was before multiball. falcon has been playing this way without error over the past year.

What do you mean “before multiball”? The mafia teams would presumably know it’s multiball from the start. Marmot seemed to.

Michelle wrote: ↑Sun Apr 11, 2021 3:31 pm Who said TSP could be partner with Marnot? Reading Marmot's Iso I don't find this idea

@fingersplints maybe? I do remember one person saying that, but most of us were saying the opposite.

BoKnows wrote: ↑Sun Apr 11, 2021 3:26 pm
Hally wrote: ↑Sun Apr 11, 2021 3:26 pm there was a point in the game where falcon was widely v read. what was the reason for that?
cause it's obvious when he's scum and he isn't obvious scum

Counterpoint: multiball
Counterpoint: players make adjustments

AL_sama wrote: ↑Sun Apr 11, 2021 3:23 pm
fingersplints wrote: ↑Sun Apr 11, 2021 3:15 pm
AL_sama wrote: ↑Sun Apr 11, 2021 3:09 pm mech clear in a novas game I don't know what to feel abut that
Please come back and explain. Is that abnormal for a nova game?

Also any other thoughts you have.
novas always uses lots of stuff to mislead mechanics so its hard to fully trust a mech clear claim

I m too confused to make any reads

So far we have a player who is presumed to be a mason with a dead civilian.
A player who has claimed to be a treestump with some slight verification.
A player who claims mechanical/flavor knowledge of other roles, in such a way that appears likely to be a civilian.
A player who claims mech info on another player which clears that second player.

Which of those should be trusted or not trusted?

AL_sama wrote: ↑Sun Apr 11, 2021 3:17 pm
Sloonei wrote: ↑Sun Apr 11, 2021 3:05 pm
AL_sama wrote: ↑Sun Apr 11, 2021 3:04 pm this is awfully funny I m barely even active

anyways hey vig san just shoot me its better then wasting a lynch
Welcome! Do you have any thoughts relating to this game?
not really I m confused with all these back and forth

Why do you think we shouldn’t be mech clearing people? Who shouldn’t be mech cleared?

Hally wrote: ↑Sun Apr 11, 2021 3:15 pm to be clear, i don’t really think what i just said re: falcon is a smoking gun really

generally wolves are better about being consistent amd avoiding blatant contradictions and lies

but i really dislike that falcon initially refused to explain himself and then when he did he presented an explanation that makes no sense

i think falcon voted al_sama EoD1 so it’s curious to me that he would vote tony EoD2 over al_sama for dubious reasons. i don’t know what this means

It is still juicy

AL_sama wrote: ↑Sun Apr 11, 2021 3:09 pm mech clear in a novas game I don't know what to feel abut that

say more

Hally wrote: ↑Sun Apr 11, 2021 3:04 pm
Sloonei wrote: ↑Sun Apr 11, 2021 2:47 pm
novaselinenever wrote: ↑Sat Apr 10, 2021 6:03 pm D2 -
Spoiler: show

falcon is saying he voted tony because he liked tony’s wagon composition better

tony’s wagon nook, lc and splints on it, all people in falcon’s poe

al_sama’s wagon has nobody in falcon’s poe and three presumed mech clears

falcon is saying he voted tony based on wagon composition when wagon composition should have led him to vote al

this doesn’t compute

The juiciest read in all of Fargo.

AL_sama wrote: ↑Sun Apr 11, 2021 3:04 pm this is awfully funny I m barely even active

anyways hey vig san just shoot me its better then wasting a lynch

Welcome! Do you have any thoughts relating to this game?

I'm feeling Hally's "falcon is just lying" argument.

BoKnows wrote: ↑Sun Apr 11, 2021 2:56 pm where can I find the votes?

https://mafiathesyndicate.com/viewforum.php?f=2

Esooa wagon locktown.

I trust the AL_sama wagon much more than the TSP wagon at a glance.

novaselinenever wrote: ↑Sat Apr 10, 2021 6:03 pm D2 -
Spoiler: show

The letter l is now punctuation.

I'm targeting AL_sama if I'm going for one of the low-posting slots herel

I’m not worried about Dom just yet.

NANOOKTHEGREATANDFEARSOME wrote: ↑Sun Apr 11, 2021 1:52 pm Dom is alive cause syndicate hates killing afk people for some reason and would rather drag their slot to endgame

It’s weird that Dom wasn’t an option at eod yesterday either.

But I guess we’ve believed in the content we have over the lack of content dom has provided

BoKnkws did not fake being drunk and I highly doubt he came in here with the mindset of disrupting or embellishing anything. It is no factor at all in my read of him.

Justplayingitcool wrote: ↑Sun Apr 11, 2021 1:01 pm My POE IS

Nanook
Lc
Al
Dom
bk

Would put KZA just above the PoE of five

Why not falcon?

fingersplints wrote: ↑Sun Apr 11, 2021 12:53 pm I’ve apparently been spending too much time on mafia as my toddler lightly bit me in the arm and then immediately farted in my face for attention. Don’t have kids everyone
Be back later

I have found this is the best way to get the attention of loved ones, to be fair.

Hally wrote: ↑Sun Apr 11, 2021 12:51 pm does it really matter who’s on what team? can’t we just kill not villagery people until we have flips from both teams and go from there?

Mac said to be skeptical of people who aren't hunting for teams.

I don't think he was trying to warn us about you though.

Hally wrote: ↑Sun Apr 11, 2021 12:49 pm my five would be

al sama
long con
dom
jpic
nanook

with falcon and splints being kind of a backup i guess

i would be pretty shocked if there aren’t multiple wolves in those names

Who's Team Marmot and Who's Team Other Team?

fingersplints wrote: ↑Sun Apr 11, 2021 12:47 pm @Sloonei also you are missing strawhenge on that list

Oh, nice catch. I have him as my top town read among the players who have no mechanical information backing them up. I suppose he'd be on the list of potential POE candidates for the exercise, but he would not be in my POE.

fingersplints wrote: ↑Sun Apr 11, 2021 12:44 pm
Sloonei wrote: ↑Sun Apr 11, 2021 12:33 pm
fingersplints wrote: ↑Sun Apr 11, 2021 12:31 pm @Sloonei I love the
“Me:
Me”

section

I definitely agree with the talk that Falcon needs revisiting. I remember thinking they were town early on, but I’m not sure that it’s a good enough reason with the recent flip and their latest activity. (Changing votes while not wanting to answer why)
His lack of an explanation upon request is not a great look either.

If you had to crunch the game down into a 5-player pool of suspects, who would they be?

If I were to crunch the player list to the “least townie” 5 I’d probably end up with Al, Dom, LC, jpic, and maybe Falcon.
But I’m having a hard time picking just 5. Being wrong about tsp is making me question a lot. I still don’t have a great read on spf. I’m less confident on town lean for Bo. I don’t know if we can trust the claims for Odd and KZA. And what if I’m just stupid and wrong in my town read of nanook.

I feel like the way LC pushed for me yesterday was believable. I don't think that's an argument he tries to make if it's not 100% genuine. Caveat is that this is multiball, so there's nothing stopping LC from making a genuine argument as scum. It could be the case that he knew I was wrong about Ted because he (LC) is on Team Marmot himself, and his suspicion of Me + Tony in tandem was legitimate. But I had been vaguely leaning town on LC prior to that anyway. He's a long way from being resolved, though.

Do any of these players strike you as being particularly linked to Marmot?

Sloonei wrote: ↑Sun Apr 11, 2021 1:08 am Anyone down for tring to build a 5-person POE as an exercise?

al_sama, nanook, and dom are unavoidably going to be in it, I think. Though some people seem to be treating nanook as self-resolving with his "I have a role" claim. But meh. If I am looking at this game big picture, then nanook is one of the three people I am most suspicious of.

The remaining two slots are trickier. My gut wants to throw Falcon in there as a signal that we need to re-evaluate, but that's hasty. I suppose JPIC belongs. He feels like a comfortable #4.

The fact that I am now struggling to name a 5th in the pool of remaining players is worrying.

"Clears":
Hally
Alison
Esooa
Michelle
Ted

Pseudo-clears:
Oddmerta
KZA

Me:
Me

That leaves the following group of people:
Long Con
falcon
fingersplints
BoKnows
staypositivefriend

So... which person(s) from that list can be crammed into shrunken POE pool?

fingersplints wrote: ↑Sun Apr 11, 2021 12:31 pm @Sloonei I love the
“Me:
Me”

section

I definitely agree with the talk that Falcon needs revisiting. I remember thinking they were town early on, but I’m not sure that it’s a good enough reason with the recent flip and their latest activity. (Changing votes while not wanting to answer why)

His lack of an explanation upon request is not a great look either.

If you had to crunch the game down into a 5-player pool of suspects, who would they be?

KZA wrote: ↑Sun Apr 11, 2021 12:31 pm
Sloonei wrote: ↑Sun Apr 11, 2021 12:31 pm
KZA wrote: ↑Sun Apr 11, 2021 12:30 pm
BoKnows wrote: ↑Sun Apr 11, 2021 12:29 pm as long as people don't role claim we should be okay.
Huh? Explain this
think that's a reference to the soup fear
what if he's TMIing it

then bo is silly

KZA wrote: ↑Sun Apr 11, 2021 12:30 pm
BoKnows wrote: ↑Sun Apr 11, 2021 12:29 pm as long as people don't role claim we should be okay.
Huh? Explain this

think that's a reference to the soup fear

BoKnows wrote: ↑Sun Apr 11, 2021 12:27 pm when did ted become clear?

Just before the deadline, when Michelle told us she had mech info that clears him.

These were my posts shortly before Drunk Posting started happening. I want to bump them so they're not lost.

Spoiler: show

Sloonei wrote: ↑Sun Apr 11, 2021 12:52 am I talked about reaffirming town reads yesterday but did not actually do anything about it. I think that should be a goal over the next ~48 hours. Not just for me, but for all of us. I do not disagree with Alison's proposal to swing away at the players in the bottom of our POE. The odds of all of dom/al/nanook being town are low. What this phase has taught us, though, is that the game is not quite as easy as we were making it out to be, and that means at least one person has fooled us. Double checking our town reads seems like the most effective way to remedy that.

Now, as for methods to do a mass sweep of players who are widely read as town in a multiball game... I don't know.

Sloonei wrote: ↑Sun Apr 11, 2021 12:56 am
MacDougall wrote: ↑Wed Apr 07, 2021 10:29 pm Mac's Guide to Scum Hunting in a Multiball Environment

Obviously the main thing to consider in a multiball environment is that the mafia are encouraged to scum hunt. Very good wolves know that it's actually pro their win con to, as normally, kill townies and push against town but the temptation to be sincere in hunting is overwhelming so in most compositions multiball environments feature an environment where everyone is scum hunting and every push in sincere. This causes what I dub the "Syndicate 2018 GOC Effect". Because everyone is scum hunting, and the mafia factions don't have a specific goal of gaslighting and exploiting townies to push the wrong places, the general thread sentiment is much more sound than it ordinarily is. Consensus POE's are likely to be very accurate.

How to find wolves in this environment beyond just ordinary POE can seem tricky, but it's actually quite easy if you focus on solving compartmentalized teams as opposed to "just wolfy". In actuality those that tend towards solving for base level reasons as opposed to heavily focused on team building are >rand mafia in this environment.

So we have a flipped mafia, now what? Well the normal rules still apply. Marmot probably wasn't in anti spew until late so he probably wasn't pushing on his teammates much, so you can use normal rules to check for who he spews as not his teammates. What's different is you can't rely on those reads to also be town and in actuality they are more likely to be mafia than town. The flipped wolf started the game with a more sound POE when it comes to hunting the other team than we did. So his reads are a great place to start looking for wolves from the other team. When it comes to reading those that the flipped wolf defended or town read, you need to check the agenda behind it. Was he genuinely townreading that person? Because that is a thing they can actually do. Remember usually wolves can TMI a town, but they can't here. They can only have genuine townreads. What is the agenda behind the town read? Was the person under any pressure? Is there any benefit to that person's survival in the flipped wolf town reading them? If so, maybe that's a team mate.

So questions that require answering:
1. Who did Marmot push on?
2. Who that he pushed on buried him?
3. Can we build a consensus small POE (less than 5 players) and then get everyone to draw a line in the sand on how they feel about that person?
4. Who has spewed themselves town by repeatedly focusing on multiball solving since the flip
5. Did anyone spew themselves mafia by TMIing that they knew it was multiball?
Just gonna bump this.

Mac's point about the scum teams starting with a smaller POE pool feels very useful for me right now.

Sloonei wrote: ↑Sun Apr 11, 2021 1:08 am Anyone down for tring to build a 5-person POE as an exercise?

al_sama, nanook, and dom are unavoidably going to be in it, I think. Though some people seem to be treating nanook as self-resolving with his "I have a role" claim. But meh. If I am looking at this game big picture, then nanook is one of the three people I am most suspicious of.

The remaining two slots are trickier. My gut wants to throw Falcon in there as a signal that we need to re-evaluate, but that's hasty. I suppose JPIC belongs. He feels like a comfortable #4.

The fact that I am now struggling to name a 5th in the pool of remaining players is worrying.

"Clears":
Hally
Alison
Esooa
Michelle
Ted

Pseudo-clears:
Oddmerta
KZA

Me:
Me

That leaves the following group of people:
Long Con
falcon
fingersplints
BoKnows
staypositivefriend

So... which person(s) from that list can be crammed into shrunken POE pool?

BoKnows wrote: ↑Sun Apr 11, 2021 12:22 pmhi

are you mafia?

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