Michelle wrote: ↑Wed Aug 02, 2023 5:16 am
JaggedJimmyJay wrote: ↑Wed Aug 02, 2023 5:10 am
@☆Princess Abigail☆ and @Michelle, I am generally leaving each of you to carry out your conversation. However, I think I might be able to help mediate some miscommunication or holes in the conversation, so say the word if you'd like for me to do that. I may do it on my own if I feel it's necessary, but for now I will just leave that offer on the table.
I would like your honest opinion.
If you think she ever made a clear stance about why is she suspecting me please show me where because I didn't find it.
Lack of wolf reads from her is a problem for me, for a wolf is easy to make town reads but they have a problem in pushing villagers directly because most of villagers are sensitive at such pushes and react back.
Sure, I can do that.
I think both of you have had some failings in this interaction, and that's okay. It's difficult sometimes to carry on a truly healthy conversation in a game that demands we accuse each other of things.
I believe Abigail has stated why she suspects you, if not necessarily in a single clean box. If she is town, she believes that you have returned her suspicion of you back onto her (omgus) without giving a fair effort to understand her or interpret her in good faith. Effectively, she's accusing you of a fake omgus tunnel. I think that she has said this more or less, and it's there for you to find if you really want to find it (which would be where you fall short in this exchange). However, Abigail also falls short, because her assessment doesn't give you any credit. She isn't considering why a town Michelle might genuinely suspect her and trying to connect with you or your suspicion. There's a degree of hypocrisy in that. These things are human nature.
I think there are some issues with your suspicion of her. I don't really find you suspicious
for them, but I will share what I mean. You have spoken a lot about what mafia
can do in your discussion of Abigail. For example:
- Mafia
can mimic their town game/meta.
- Mafia
can give town reads, because they have TMI.
Things like this are technically true, but are they actually
meaningful (or to what extent are they meaningful)? And do they leave Abigail in an impossible position?
What
can't mafia do? Is that a question with an answer? "Can" is a big word. Mafia "can" do just about anything. If your requirement for Abigail is that she do things that mafia can't do, then I would assert you are expecting the impossible. I don't think you'd be doing so in bad faith. This kind of argumentation happens all the time in Mafia games, including from honest points of view. And Abigail needs to understand that too if she is town.
Now, all of this said, I want to ensure my dialogue here is understood as I intend it. None of this means "Abigail is town". It's a manuscript to describe how the communication can break down
if she is town. She can still be mafia, and even a flawed case can still be right.
