The Syndicate

Party Crasher wrote: ↑Sun Mar 05, 2023 3:56 am but if u take a look at most mafia readslists, they have us as either "3p" or "question mark" or something like that

-t

This is majorly indicative imo.

Wolves would naturally assume that your role is someone they can push and get elimmed if they need to.

Party Crasher wrote: ↑Sun Mar 05, 2023 3:58 am yeah sloonei in case u missed it

our "vest" extends to not just normal death, but to getting chopped once lol (we claimed it pretty early, day 2 i think, maybe day 3) (it falls off in lylo)

-t

Mine doesn't extend to getting chopped.

And I want you to double check. Is it lylo, or just if it ends the game?

Also, notably, svs’s bulletproof vest does not appear to have that stipulation.

Sloonei wrote: ↑Sun Mar 05, 2023 3:45 am
Golden wrote: ↑Sun Mar 05, 2023 3:41 am Actually I just went back and read my own role.

It’s not lylo.

It’s if it ends the game. So if pc is the last wolf I think one shot would kill them.
huh?

PC claimed the same thing about his bulletproof vest as mine, which I have been conceiving as ‘doesn’t work at lylo’ in my head but I just realised that’s not quite correct.

Actually I just went back and read my own role.

It’s not lylo.

It’s if it ends the game. So if pc is the last wolf I think one shot would kill them.

Sloonei wrote: ↑Sun Mar 05, 2023 3:37 am
Golden wrote: ↑Sun Mar 05, 2023 3:35 am The other possibility here is it genuinely is PC and I’m clearing them for the wrong reasons. But that just seems so unlikely.
I also am about 85% in the camp of clearing Party Crasher for several strong but not rock-solid reasons, and 15% wondering if I'm making a mistake there.

But if they’ve been honest, we can only pop them without their best stepping in at lylo and I’m quite convinced there isn’t a pair here… everyone is paranoid of everyone.

The other possibility here is it genuinely is PC and I’m clearing them for the wrong reasons. But that just seems so unlikely.

Sloonei wrote: ↑Sun Mar 05, 2023 3:32 am @Party Crasher @Porscha What do you think of Golden claiming that he faked a town read on Alison to win her trust?

AND get her to vig me, which was really the important part.

Porscha wrote: ↑Sun Mar 05, 2023 3:28 am
Golden wrote: ↑Sun Mar 05, 2023 3:25 am From my perspective:

Sloonei is cleared by rondo
PC is cleared because that hydra just isn’t wolf in this set up imo
Dizzy is cleared by his claim and by the fact his game has replicated MY town game, the version that is outside my wolfrange, and I just find that incredibly hard to believe is wolf

That’s why, for me, it’s Porscha. It’s literal PoE. I have a poe of one. And I haven’t seen a good reason to flip my townread on PC or dizzy yet.
Do you suppose my constant shield of you past day 2 is TMI?

No. If I’m right that you’re wolf, I think you’ve played the game as close to your town self as you possibly could, and I think your shield of me was because your true town self would read me town.

Or, I’m wrong about you and it’s just a townread.

Honestly, wtf so I know I’m not secure in this read it’s all I’ve got (still going back ti finishing my iso on you though).

I don’t find Porscha wolfy at all. I like the progression with Alison being posted by Sloonei.

For me, this is a case of ‘I deeply respect this wolf game’ because I can’t help but reach my conclusion but I had a had previously reached a world view that Porscha was towny as f**k.

Porscha wrote: ↑Sun Mar 05, 2023 3:24 am
Golden wrote: ↑Sun Mar 05, 2023 3:21 am
Porscha wrote: ↑Sun Mar 05, 2023 3:19 am
Golden wrote: ↑Sun Mar 05, 2023 3:17 am
Porscha wrote: ↑Sun Mar 05, 2023 3:14 am
Sloonei wrote: ↑Sun Mar 05, 2023 2:30 am
Porscha wrote: ↑Tue Feb 21, 2023 5:32 am

Idk I kind of vibe with the idea of throwing 1 town and 1 wolf partner into the mix for wifom spew reasons like we are doing now

What you pondering gamer
Wow that post is something…
Cuz I fucking called it? :dab: Lmfao
Why would I as a wolf say that?
It would certainly be extraordinarily bold.
Sometimes you just smell bullshit

I prefer bullsuit.

From my perspective:

Sloonei is cleared by rondo
PC is cleared because that hydra just isn’t wolf in this set up imo
Dizzy is cleared by his claim and by the fact his game has replicated MY town game, the version that is outside my wolfrange, and I just find that incredibly hard to believe is wolf

That’s why, for me, it’s Porscha. It’s literal PoE. I have a poe of one. And I haven’t seen a good reason to flip my townread on PC or dizzy yet.

Porscha wrote: ↑Sun Mar 05, 2023 3:19 am
Golden wrote: ↑Sun Mar 05, 2023 3:17 am
Porscha wrote: ↑Sun Mar 05, 2023 3:14 am
Sloonei wrote: ↑Sun Mar 05, 2023 2:30 am
Porscha wrote: ↑Tue Feb 21, 2023 5:32 am
Alison wrote: ↑Mon Feb 20, 2023 11:49 pm
nutella wrote: ↑Mon Feb 20, 2023 11:36 pm

What is it

Sabiplz wrote: ↑Fri Feb 17, 2023 7:19 pm Side eyeing Seanzie and Creature joining that Dennis wagon like that
This feels a lot like Sabi knows Dennis is town and is preparing in advance to shade Seanzie and Creature for voting him.
Idk I kind of vibe with the idea of throwing 1 town and 1 wolf partner into the mix for wifom spew reasons like we are doing now

What you pondering gamer
Wow that post is something…
Cuz I fucking called it? :dab: Lmfao
Why would I as a wolf say that?

It would certainly be extraordinarily bold.

Porscha wrote: ↑Sun Mar 05, 2023 3:14 am
Sloonei wrote: ↑Sun Mar 05, 2023 2:30 am
Porscha wrote: ↑Tue Feb 21, 2023 5:32 am
Alison wrote: ↑Mon Feb 20, 2023 11:49 pm
nutella wrote: ↑Mon Feb 20, 2023 11:36 pm
Alison wrote: ↑Mon Feb 20, 2023 11:33 pm I do think the Sabi spew on Seanzie looks good for him and would prefer SVS/112 at this time
What is it

Sabiplz wrote: ↑Fri Feb 17, 2023 7:19 pm Side eyeing Seanzie and Creature joining that Dennis wagon like that
This feels a lot like Sabi knows Dennis is town and is preparing in advance to shade Seanzie and Creature for voting him.
Idk I kind of vibe with the idea of throwing 1 town and 1 wolf partner into the mix for wifom spew reasons like we are doing now

What you pondering gamer

Wow that post is something…

I’m not lying on my role! For goodness sake why is it so hard to believe! I can’t wait until after the game so you can see!

Sloonei wrote: ↑Sun Mar 05, 2023 3:04 am
Golden wrote: ↑Sun Mar 05, 2023 3:02 am
Sloonei wrote: ↑Sun Mar 05, 2023 2:54 am Golden's early-game progression on Alison feels noteworthy.

It starts off with some blunt dismissal of her early suspcision. Then it turns into open skepticism. After a brief back-and-forth, he seeks more elaboration from people who know Alison. But then he eventually settles on a town read, specifically citing some similarities he sees between Alison and himself.

I think this progression looks authentic. More importantly, I don't think a mafia member goes through this much effort to arrive at a town read of their partner on Day 1 of a game.

Does this mean it's just Porscha?
I will say my town read comes after I decided to neighbour her and was an outright lie lol.
Hey can you maybe not answer my questions before I've asked them? Thanks.

But just to be clear: you're saying you didn't actually town read alison?

I never had a town read on Alison, not for an instant. That exchange about the intellectual honesty of her take about my Kate read was literally a ‘wolf read never revoke’ moment for me.

Sloonei wrote: ↑Sun Mar 05, 2023 3:03 am
Golden wrote: ↑Sun Mar 05, 2023 3:01 am
Sloonei wrote: ↑Sun Mar 05, 2023 2:09 am
Golden wrote: ↑Sun Mar 05, 2023 2:01 am Sorry, her post responding to mine here was.
Can you explain what you saw that made you want to do that?
Her response was false… she DIDNT have an answer to why my conduct was wolfy. She was just throwing shade at someone she didn’t know for townreading someone else she didn’t know without intellectual honesty/a good answer to why it was wolfy and anticipating getting away with it.

And, in hindsight, the fact Alison went hard on that might stem from svs telling her teammates that Kate and I could be dangerous if we found each other as town.
Why did you eventually arrive at a town read on her?

See above lol.

From the moment I decided to neighbour her (and note, I didn’t know I had btsc until Alison showed up in a new channel after night one), I changed tactic. I wanted to bait Alison into shooting me. At first, I thought ‘buddy her and establish my town core history, become a threat for her team’. When she turned up in btsc with me, that morphed into ‘show zero doubt in your read in thread and in neighbourhood’ and ‘hint to her that my role gets much more powerful of I stay alive’.

Sloonei wrote: ↑Sun Mar 05, 2023 2:54 am Golden's early-game progression on Alison feels noteworthy.

It starts off with some blunt dismissal of her early suspcision. Then it turns into open skepticism. After a brief back-and-forth, he seeks more elaboration from people who know Alison. But then he eventually settles on a town read, specifically citing some similarities he sees between Alison and himself.

I think this progression looks authentic. More importantly, I don't think a mafia member goes through this much effort to arrive at a town read of their partner on Day 1 of a game.

Does this mean it's just Porscha?

I will say my town read comes after I decided to neighbour her and was an outright lie lol.

Sloonei wrote: ↑Sun Mar 05, 2023 2:09 am
Golden wrote: ↑Sun Mar 05, 2023 2:01 am Sorry, her post responding to mine here was.
Can you explain what you saw that made you want to do that?

Her response was false… she DIDNT have an answer to why my conduct was wolfy. She was just throwing shade at someone she didn’t know for townreading someone else she didn’t know without intellectual honesty/a good answer to why it was wolfy and anticipating getting away with it.

And, in hindsight, the fact Alison went hard on that might stem from svs telling her teammates that Kate and I could be dangerous if we found each other as town.

Sorry, her post responding to mine here was.

Sloonei wrote: ↑Sun Mar 05, 2023 12:47 am
Golden wrote: ↑Fri Feb 17, 2023 12:03 am
Alison wrote: ↑Thu Feb 16, 2023 11:57 pm
Seanzie wrote: ↑Thu Feb 16, 2023 11:54 pm
Alison wrote: ↑Thu Feb 16, 2023 11:52 pm
Seanzie wrote: ↑Thu Feb 16, 2023 11:49 pm
Alison wrote: ↑Thu Feb 16, 2023 11:48 pm
[VOTE: Kate] aubergine

Don't think GOC usually has VTs, and going out of your way to claim it when you could just say "I'm definitely town" is doubly weird.
Why you no respond to me?
What do you want me to respond to you about? I said my role, you said you'd elim it. Good for you. I'm not going into specifics for obvious reasons so...
Why Golden?
Because the disparity between Golden's desire to loudly announce how much they're townreading Kate and their desire to actually give reasons or do things that might convince people Kate is town is a large one.
I have so much difficulty with the perspective going on here (and just in Alison’s posts generally)

What is my mafia justification for saying I town read Kate then having no desire to convince people?

What is the mafia jusrifucation in Kate awkwardly claiming vanilla?

You’re calling out things you can objectively claim are weird. But why is it bad? Town does weird shot all the time. You gotta be able to figure out wilgys town weird shit from his wolf weird shit.

When someone comes in the thread pointing out weird shit and calling it all suspicious without analysis of why they think it’s wolf-leaning, that bothers me.

Alison, why do you think your above description of my behaviour towards Kate is wolf-leaning?
On the other hand, this is an elaborate three-way exchange if all three of Alison, Seanzie, and Golden are partners here.

This is also, for the record, the moment I decided to neighbour Alison.

Sloonei wrote: ↑Sun Mar 05, 2023 12:04 am Do we think the remaining mafia is/are lost?

If we hit every non-lost mafia in this game and just missed the one lost one, that’s bad luck.

At this point Occam’s razor is that the setup for this game is straightforward.

Porscha wrote: ↑Sat Mar 04, 2023 10:55 pm
Golden wrote: ↑Sat Mar 04, 2023 10:18 pm
Party Crasher wrote: ↑Sat Mar 04, 2023 9:44 pm
Dyslexicon wrote: ↑Sat Mar 04, 2023 8:48 pm It is later. I didn't get an item.
so either ender gave an item to rondo or a wolf has it and is just chilling

ok cool i guess
Double targeting Porscha seems unlikely.
I assume he would give it to rondo cuz rondo was shielding him

I think this is probably the straightforward answer.

I can understand why he wouldn’t want to risk sending me a gun for starters.

Party Crasher wrote: ↑Sat Mar 04, 2023 9:44 pm
Dyslexicon wrote: ↑Sat Mar 04, 2023 8:48 pm It is later. I didn't get an item.
so either ender gave an item to rondo or a wolf has it and is just chilling

ok cool i guess

Double targeting Porscha seems unlikely.

Dyslexicon wrote: ↑Sat Mar 04, 2023 8:44 pm If the last wolf is lost wolf, all spew is irrelevant. So that's fun.

I think non-team wolves and non-team 3ps are exceedingly unlikely given they didn’t exist in the first 35/40 flips.

We have zero basis in either revealed roles or results of literally any other power we’ve seen in the game to believe there’s a redirector.

It means believing eg wolves knew ender gave guns and never tried to get one.

Party Crasher wrote: ↑Sat Mar 04, 2023 7:07 pm What if ... hear me out

Mod squad kills on every even night. They killed Alison N2. They killed Neon N4.

What if Mafia didn't kill anyone N4. Because they failed their soup on D4, and that was their punishment. And the earliest possible kill they could make is on N5. And it was on Rondo - so he can't rescind his faulty green peek on mafia Sloonei

-t

If we elim Sloonei and he’s town we deserve to lose.

We can’t tinfoil this. That’s exactly what I did wrong with Scotty when he was clearly the one townie being pushed as an alternate for wolf elims by wolves. We just can’t ignore the obvious imo.

So rondo may ultimately win town the game by saving us from ourselves.

Party Crasher wrote: ↑Sat Mar 04, 2023 6:11 pm

wolf sloonei winning goc after getting falsely peeked as town

-t

Genuinely we’d all be elimming Sloonei without that peek I expect.

Gotten through day 1 on Porscha.

Other than a throwaway response to Sean, the only wolf interactions for Porscha on day 1 are with MR and Sabi.

With MR it’s asking michelle why she wrs MR, MR makes a jokey response, Porscha laughs.

The sabi interaction is deeper. My summary is:

Sabi calls Porscha a low poster (objectively wrong in terms of how many posts Porscha had by then), maybe a 3p. Porscha asks for evidence that is never forthcoming. Porscha also says sabi ‘might be wolf’ but doesn’t go any further than that or do anything with it.

I don’t think anything in Porscha’s day 1 is either wolf-indicative or wolf-clearing tbh.

Agree with sheep about the town ‘feel’ of Porscha so far.

(Have just touched on the start of day 2 and porschas interactions with marmot are much more revealing imo, but back later to continue down that path).

Porscha wrote: ↑Sat Mar 04, 2023 5:02 pm
Golden wrote: ↑Sat Mar 04, 2023 4:56 pm As far as I’ve got in Porscha iso her only mention or interaction with other wolves is to ask someone why they wr MR. I haven’t had time to go further.
Did you skip the parts with sabi and alison

Haven’t gotten to them yet

As far as I’ve got in Porscha iso her only mention or interaction with other wolves is to ask someone why they wr MR. I haven’t had time to go further.

Thinking it’s me is paranoia and a really bad take.

I’ve started an iso on Porscha and I’m pretty confident that’s your answer which I’ve said multiple times. I’m not pushing it because I haven’t done the work yet.

But tutuu, you haven’t done the work either. Stop confbiasing yourself over and over and go read, I beg of you.

Party Crasher wrote: ↑Sat Mar 04, 2023 4:10 pm Dizzys SR on us feels real and I feel like its towny

I really think it's just Golden. Golden is not pushing a scumread today, he is just defending himself

To answer some points @Dyslexicon

1) We were passive about SVS because I was scared. I lacked confidence and I didnt want to be controlling. I was hoping you guys see something that I dont. Sheep was the one who wrote that post you quoted, not me. After I saw the Scotty flip I felt vindicated in going Kim Jong Un on your asses the next day

2) It is disingenuous to keep saying my PoE was bad. Every single player's PoE was and is bad, considering our situation here, where we can't find the last wolf (or wolves). Yours included, as I know I'm town.

@Sloonei really need your input asap. Since you're the clear, I suggested to my hydra that we just sheep you. Let me know if theres anything we can do in terms of catching you up

-t

Instead of just vibing can I please suggest you iso me.

Dyslexicon wrote: ↑Sat Mar 04, 2023 1:51 pm
Golden wrote: ↑Sat Mar 04, 2023 5:53 am But it could be American soup?
Why would you assume that as a role? None of the flipped wolves has had a role like that, but town has. This is making up special cases just to force me into fitting being wolf

Not to force, just to be open minded.

Porscha wrote: ↑Sat Mar 04, 2023 6:26 am I'm sure dizzy will come back in here later and sweet talk me into second guessing myself but... they kinda make the most sense to me

The last wolf cant be caught on spew or general gameplay decisions very much... but did dizzy vote scotty over svs with you golden? Were you the only 2 remaining players who did that?

Yes

@Porscha are my reasons for townclearing PC flawed?

But it could be American soup?

It’s just that dizzy did get to prove their claim!

Porscha wrote: ↑Sat Mar 04, 2023 5:49 am *sigh* idk why my abilities never seemed to reach their targets but like idk who to go here if it isnt dizzy
Dizzy could have just killed ender to be able to claim vt as the shot especially if rondo was killed outside of mafias hands

I do think from the perspective of t!you it can only make sense it’s dizzy or possibly me.

Kate was really convinced it was dizzy, and I could see some of her points as we talked about it. She’d screenshot dizzy posts and we’d talk about them. She also nailed marmot after I lost faith and she never stopped seeing svs as bad, so I think her instincts were good this game.

Porscha wrote: ↑Sat Mar 04, 2023 4:35 am Alright btw does anyone still suspect pc

It’s broken af to have the hydra in wolfchat.

And I believe then when they talk about their back and forth neighbourhood chat.

I think those are good reasons for the tr personally.

Although I am worried that if we don’t end it today we don’t get another. We definitely can’t end up 3/2 on someone/dizzy eg, or if we elim wrong day 6 doesn’t happen.

Party Crasher wrote: ↑Sat Mar 04, 2023 3:46 am Porscha's claim is by far the worst which weirdly means it's ... the towniest? Is that a dangerous read to make?

-t

Yes. It’s either dizzy or Porscha and if you let Porscha push you off with mechanics that’s a problem.

We need a you/me/sloon consensus both days here.

You’re timfoiling, you’re spending all your time worrying about mechanics.

I’m not lying. If I was lying, it still wouldn’t be indicative of me being wolf though. I roleclaim lie as town all the time. So even though I’m not lying, whether I am or not should not be where your focus is,

My thread relationship with baddies should be,

And you should have a really good reason why I neighbouruse Alison night 1. Given Kate confirmed that as true in the thread. Especially because I’ve explained it depth and the evidence of its truthfulness is in the thread from day one.

Tutuu, please… I can’t keep doing this.

Do full interactive reads of

Me and Alison
Me and marmot
Me and svs

I do not think, if you do this, a wolf read of me can possibly be sustained.

Party Crasher wrote: ↑Sat Mar 04, 2023 3:42 am Now im back to thinking its Golden

The only evidence of his role is Kate being neighbored n3 and then dying the next day. As a day action. Her and Urist

All of the mafia roles have been pretty simple, 1 line of text

Golden could simply be a 1-shot mafia neighborizer

Every other one of his footprints are on dead people and a wolf that doesnt count

-t

I’d have to be 2-shot

Kate confirmed I’d been honest about the Alison stuff.

Party Crasher wrote: ↑Sat Mar 04, 2023 3:20 am With respect to Porscha and Golden, multiple people (maybe yourselves included) perceive your wolf range as a lot smaller than your town range

As in, you are not known for being godlike superstar unreal fabulous solo hero wolves

Dizzy is absolutely known for that. His wolf range is infinite, as in, it goes as far as his town range, imo

If Dizzy is mafia, I can't really dismantle his claim and his softs. But if anyone here is capable of fooling everyone so much, I think Dizzy is the only one capable

-t

Oh no. I do have a godlike superstar unreal fabulous solo hero wolf reputation.

I’d say I’m the only one who says my wolf range is as narrow as it is. I think it’s easy to make your wolf range feel large with a few basic high-percentage wolf strategies.

I compare dizzy to me precisely for this reason. I think their wolf game is amazing, I think they can fool me. But their game is absent some of those high-percentage strategies.

I could be on board with it being dizzy. I don’t think it is the clearly correct solution though. I do hope I have more time for proper analysis tomorrow.

Nothing has come up in any time to explain an extra kill that wasn’t in Alison’s role…

Porscha wrote: ↑Sat Mar 04, 2023 1:45 am
Golden wrote: ↑Fri Mar 03, 2023 11:17 pm Also I don’t think it’s accurate to call it a redirect, in the sense that the victim is chosen at random from those in my neighbourhood. Part of why I baited Alison to vig me day 2…

Btw we still don’t have an explanation for Alison’s claimed kill, do we?
I think sig shot you or her ya lol

I meant the kill of pyxxy

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