The Syndicate

DrWilgy wrote: ↑Sat Sep 19, 2020 12:13 am Good game lol.

Why didn't we kill Cayvie? that's literally all I wanted this game.

Yeah me too!!

Haha, and you guys were just like, *shrug* " we're good either way"

I was killed by accident?

TOLD you guys cayvie was bad.

dov wrote: ↑Sat Sep 12, 2020 4:16 am if you chop me, you're just letting mafia win quicker- just killing another town.
why am I being prioritized over cayvie?

I believe that marcher would have Gladiatored his team-mate. It makes the most sense.

chardonnay wrote: ↑Sat Sep 12, 2020 1:02 am
Long Con wrote: ↑Fri Sep 11, 2020 8:14 pm Told you he was town.
Well, thanks.

Where would you go from here?

I would chop dov, and then cayvie.

Told you he was town.

Dragon D. Luffy wrote: ↑Thu Sep 10, 2020 6:49 pm Wait people think I'm scum with cayvie because of the tea claim?

That's... weird.

in my mind, you guys are not on the same team.

[VOTE: dov] aubergine

chardonnay wrote: ↑Wed Sep 09, 2020 2:14 amI know you're 41, I checked your profile a while back haha. If your mafia playing history predates these forums I think I'd like to ask you some things post game, if that's ok?

Ha ha yeah that's fine. This is my fourth main mafia forum, and I'm full of crazy old-timer stories.

PSINightmareEmpower wrote: ↑Wed Sep 09, 2020 2:32 am
PSINightmareEmpower wrote: ↑Wed Sep 09, 2020 1:47 am

I had a stoke trying to read this lol

Apparently I also had a stroke trying to spell the word stroke

chardonnay wrote: ↑Wed Sep 09, 2020 12:43 am LC implying I wont always be 24 is just </3 ;.; </3

I'll never trust you again LC

Dude I'm 41 but still feel nebulously in my twenties at heart. Some of my friends have bad knees n' shit. My body is still strong and beautiful; I don't think I will accept my age until I start to break down.

That said, never trust anyone over 30, right?

chardonnay wrote: ↑Wed Sep 09, 2020 12:08 am Im hard scum reading Fatmo, but im not really seeing any hard evidence that makes me thing he cant be scum.

I guess the most town like thing about him s that both flipped NKs town read Fatmo p hard. I don't think that Marcher would choose those kills for his self preservation exclusively as they kinda were the de-facto flip yesterday ,and today. SO if Fatmo is scum that probably mean that last scum would have been in Alisons, and Nuetlla's line of sight. Which is an extra jump in logic for Fatmo to be mafia.

-/-/-/
Pre-edit

Yeah, it stands for "Demon's Octagonal Vollyball" get with it LC.

Is dov's name an acronym?

cassowary
cayvie
dov
Fatmo

Here's my list off the top of my head. It would possibly change if I ISOed everyone and got fresh takes. This game got a little stagnant just in recent days, and my mind is much more fresh with Radiohead Mafia next door.

Of course dov is also mafia. That's what I believe. If you're definitely going down anyway, you want to try to use your power to benefit your fallen teammates.

Adding my [VOTE: MArcher] aubergine to the train now.

I'll be voting soon but I need an adult to tell me it's my turn.

So I should hold my vote until my turn in some loose order comes?

cayvie wrote: ↑Sun Sep 06, 2020 5:38 pm
Long Con wrote: ↑Sun Sep 06, 2020 5:23 pm Jack is burnt... again?
maybe he's zuko

Jack is burnt... again?

Ok Alison.

Unexpected. Should we hammer Jovian tomorrow or does this change things?

Now that I think about it, I probably would have stayed on Nutella if I were scum.

Carotenoid wrote: ↑Sat Sep 05, 2020 10:36 am [VOTE: Marcher Jovian] aubergine

I don't see any reason why a scum team would watch a v/v nutella-Marcher Jovian opposition go and nk in it.

That makes a lot of sense. [VOTE: JOVE] aubergine

chardonnay wrote: ↑Sat Sep 05, 2020 1:56 am It also means that technically Jack could still be mafia. Not that it matters as he is resolved when he dies from the burn.

A town aligned poisoner, what a funny thing to play with. Really weakens the doc this game imo. Doc saves a mafia aligned burn victim, and that victim is plausibly cleared haha. WIFOM city

I was a town aligned poisoner in the very recent U-Pick game, hosted by Joseph. I was the Coronavirus.

Alison wrote: ↑Fri Sep 04, 2020 3:55 pm Alright, kill LC after resolving the Jovian/nutella difference check. He doesn't act like this when he has suspicion wrongly cast on him as town. He tries to show he's town, and gives up if he doesn't succeed. He doesn't lash out at people and openwolf like this.

Alison wrote: ↑Fri Sep 04, 2020 2:33 pm
Long Con wrote: ↑Fri Sep 04, 2020 2:29 pm
Alison wrote: ↑Fri Sep 04, 2020 2:28 pm
Long Con wrote: ↑Fri Sep 04, 2020 2:06 pm Me not having done enough is NAI, and you vastly overstate the level of awfulness in my vote yesterday, because, though it was a throwaway vote, it was 100% acceptable in the situation.
It doesn't matter if it's NAI, it's a reason you're in the POE.

Justify your vote to me.
I did that when I cast it.
"I don't have a preference between Jiwon and Cass" is not a reason to naked vote someone who had 0% chance of being exed last day phase and then leave the vote on before vanishing.

Yeah it is.

Are you afraid to get caught with your vote on a townie?

Let me know if you have any real questions for me.

Alison wrote: ↑Fri Sep 04, 2020 2:28 pm
Long Con wrote: ↑Fri Sep 04, 2020 2:06 pm Me not having done enough is NAI, and you vastly overstate the level of awfulness in my vote yesterday, because, though it was a throwaway vote, it was 100% acceptable in the situation.
It doesn't matter if it's NAI, it's a reason you're in the POE.

Justify your vote to me.

I did that when I cast it.

cayvie wrote: ↑Fri Sep 04, 2020 2:18 pm
Long Con wrote: ↑Fri Sep 04, 2020 2:06 pm Wow that's ugly.

Skimmed the catchup. I like Jack and DDL as town, [color=#FFB0FF]Alison is sketch-city still[/color] but whatchagonnado. This latest nutella-Jovian thing has my interest.
do you think Alison is particularly likely to be mafia?

Still withholding judgment on that for another phase.

Wow that's ugly.

Skimmed the catchup. I like Jack and DDL as town, Alison is sketch-city still but whatchagonnado. This latest nutella-Jovian thing has my interest.

Alison wrote: ↑Fri Sep 04, 2020 8:42 am
Alison wrote: ↑Fri Sep 04, 2020 8:38 am Here's where I am in terms of reads at the moment. The list of people in each category is not ordered. Consider this my legacy reads if I should die during the night phase.

Hard Town - These are the people who've done something to make me actively trust them.
Alison
PSINightmareEmpower
Carotenoid
Dragon D. Luffy

Townlean
cayvie
DrWilgy
Fatmo
Long Con
nutella

Mixed Bag
chardonnay

Scumlean
Jackofhearts2005
Marcher Jovian

Scum
cassowary
DJ Neutron Star
dov
I think move LC one category down, from townlean to scumlean. He hasn't done enough and nutella is right that a vanity wagon so close to EOD looks awful.

Me not having done enough is NAI, and you vastly overstate the level of awfulness in my vote yesterday, because, though it was a throwaway vote, it was 100% acceptable in the situation.

LOL what's the point, less than an hour till chop.

But really, I don't have that much preference between Jiwon and Cass. Also, I'm going to a cottage and won't be online from 3pm EST until the following morning, around 10am. So good luck with the chop!

Linki: Oh, hammer? Do we want that?

[VOTE: MArcher Jovian] aubergine

DJ Neutron Star wrote: ↑Thu Sep 03, 2020 1:33 pm
cassowary wrote: ↑Thu Sep 03, 2020 3:17 am
DJ Neutron Star wrote: ↑Thu Sep 03, 2020 2:05 am it reads like cassowary just sort of choosing someone who was being voted and naming some generic scumtell that could apply to them at the time
Excuse double post here, I'm on my phone so quoting is annoying, but this is not why I voted LC. Perhaps I should have made my case using more quotes of LC at the time, but his ISO at the time was like mostly mechanical speculation (elements and hypothetical vote-restricted mafia role) and a couple off topic posts, then he sort of vaguely agreed with the psi case, then suddenly jumped back in with a vote on Cayvie. It kind of read to me as all over the place, like he wasn't really paying attention to the thread very much.

He's had more to say now though, but that was my reasoning at the time. Just want to clear that up.
could you elaborate on what it is you continue to not like about Long Con beyond just affirming you don't like him/think he's strange?

She also mentioned a perceived lack of paying attention to the thread, and being "all over the place". I think maybe she likes me even though I'm strange.

Carote... that was intentionally a WTF read?

Alison wrote: ↑Wed Sep 02, 2020 11:35 pm Non-voteres put your vote down now. 2/3rds of the day is over and you haven't been voting all day. I can and will forcibly murder every single person in the not voting section if you do not take a stance in a timely fashion. Vanity wagons count as not voting unless you have a really good reason why you're correct to make that vote. Do not let the mafia hide their true intentions until it is convenient for them. Make them make difficult decisions early.

You get to decide which "wagons" are vanity, I take it. Is my cayvie vote "vanity"?

DrWilgy wrote: ↑Wed Sep 02, 2020 10:11 pm
Long Con wrote: ↑Wed Sep 02, 2020 8:36 pm
DrWilgy wrote: ↑Wed Sep 02, 2020 8:33 pmThere must most definitely be a wolf amongst Cayvie, Cass, Ji or LC.
Why do you make me waste a post asking why you think that, man? How can you say something like that and not know you are expected to explain why?
But I explained in the same post:
"Often I think a gamestate like this is indicative of being on the right path and that wolves have attempted to open counter wagons."

It's a gamestate type thing. I doubt we get to a tie like this without scum having a hand in it.

So by "must most definitely", you really mean "this could be right sometimes".

Why would you pollute the thread with this needless false confidence?

chardonnay wrote: ↑Wed Sep 02, 2020 8:57 pm
PSINightmareEmpower wrote: ↑Wed Sep 02, 2020 8:01 pm
While I somewhat agree with you here, I'm almost more inclined to read U-G/Chardonnay as w/w. It felt to me like Chard spotted the odd behavior of his scumbuddy and wanted to be the first to call attention to it in the thread for towncred or something, but didn't want to actually commit to bussing. There are two things wrong with this read though. 1. Chard likes to bus a lot, so him doing a half-hearted response to avoid bussing isn't as likely for him as it is for other people, and 2. They do know each other pretty well so I wouldn't be surprised if it was just a "my friend is acting kinda weird" reaction as either alignment.
I don't really love bussing tho? I'd say less then 50% of my scum games feature me bussing.

-/-/-/-/--/-

@Long Con

If the Cayvie wagon doesn't pan out who would you switch to?

I see some UG talk, but I haven't looked at their posts yet...at this point I might sheep someone or hook up with a leading wagon that I felt strongest about. Maybe Wilgy, he's irked me a bit.

Linki: although that stuff nutella just said about UG is right up my alley.

To be fair, though, you guys lynched me baselessly as soon as I subbed in, so I don't feel like I got a good dose of her scumgame there.

DrWilgy wrote: ↑Wed Sep 02, 2020 8:33 pmThere must most definitely be a wolf amongst Cayvie, Cass, Ji or LC.

Why do you make me waste a post asking why you think that, man? How can you say something like that and not know you are expected to explain why?

Alison wrote: ↑Wed Sep 02, 2020 7:30 pm I mean the way I used it has meaning. You're supposed to look at a sequence of events and try to figure out what's the most likely explanation for those events. You can point at anything I said about the game and I'll tell you why that explanation is the most likely one compared to alternative interpretations. The point I'm trying to make is that there are other, better explanations for cayvie's behavior and you appear to be tunneled on it.

A matter of perspective? I would not say that I'm tunneled on anything, but maybe we have vastly different definitions of what tunneling is, I don't know. From my perspective, I looked at cayvie's ISO, and got the feeling that she wasn't on the level, and tried to ascertain why I felt that way. Those behaviours are what I believe made me feel that way.

If you have the awesome ability to look at any sequence of events and figure out the every possible explanation for them, AND which one is the right explanation, then please, don't let me stand in your way. I'm not convinced that your perspective is that broad just because you say it is.

cassowary wrote: ↑Wed Sep 02, 2020 6:08 pm
DJ Neutron Star wrote: ↑Wed Sep 02, 2020 5:34 pm@cassowary
i'm also unsure why you qualified the Long Con vote as a wagon— nutella was explicit about her vote being a gut vote
meh, I guess I thought more people had voiced explicit suspicion on LC than I'm finding looking back

I stand by the vote though. Not a fan of LC's most recent post here either, even though I do appreciate a good gif.

Well, the gif was a totally appropriate response to a ridiculous assertion, so I don't know what to make of your lack of fandom. I take it you support the idea that me saying "as the chop" and not "as a wolf" is a negative indicator for my alignment?

chardonnay wrote: ↑Wed Sep 02, 2020 6:15 pm
Long Con wrote: ↑Wed Sep 02, 2020 2:55 pm I'm leaning toward cayvie as the chop right now. I don't like how her change of opinion on DDL went, and her ISO largely reads to me like pocketing attempts of DDL and Alison. [VOTE: cayvie] aubergine
Its pretty on the nose for Cayvie to pocket a player in such a manner.

Whats your read on Carotte?

I'll look into it.

Alison wrote: ↑Wed Sep 02, 2020 6:16 pm I'm pretty happy giving PSI a day 1 pass since everyone who's played with them is saying in no uncertain terms that they're well within their town meta. The end of day 1 is approaching in 9 hours, and I'd like the wagons to be between Jiwon and Cassowary. If you're not one one of those two people, or don't want to be, talk to me about your concerns.

Re: the cayvie case, I'm not sold on it. It's a constructed narrative. Like yes, if you walk in and try to make up a story about why cayvie is scum and why her actions fit some scum agenda, you can say the glasses read was an attempt to pocket DDL, she was trying to pocket, yadda yadda.

But take a step back and look at the balance of probabilities, and ask yourself if there's anything that makes that interpretation more likely or convincing than any other. I don't think it is. There's a lot about cayvie's behavior that doesn't make sense if that theory is true. For instance, LC, you tell me you think cayvie is trying to pocket me and DDL. Does wolf cayvie trying to pocket Alison accuse her of being condescending and strongly disagree with her posts about mafia theory? Does wolf cayvie trying to pocket DDL really come up with "your joke about glasses had town energy" as the most likely thing to say to make DDL townread her?

Yes, why are you asking these questions which have obvious answers? It's what I said, ain't it?

You seem to be pushing the notion that a wolf starts the game with a set agenda and then carefully follows the original plan and always does things the best way. That's not the mafia that I have ever seen played. Scum react to the thread, and it's not always perfect in hindsight. You and DDL were big interactions for her, whether she intended it to be that way or not, and the way she dealt with it - especially DDL - looks like a wolf pocketing attempt to me. I guarantee I could take any assertion or accusation in this game and call it a "constructed narrative", so how's about we just use real terms that actually have meaning?

Carotenoid wrote: ↑Wed Sep 02, 2020 5:38 pm
Long Con wrote: ↑Wed Sep 02, 2020 2:55 pm I'm leaning toward cayvie as the chop right now. I don't like how her change of opinion on DDL went, and her ISO largely reads to me like pocketing attempts of DDL and Alison. [VOTE: cayvie] aubergine
I'm a *little bit* bothered that this is thinking in term of finding a chop rather than finding wolves.

What the fuck?

cayvie wrote: ↑Wed Sep 02, 2020 3:21 pm
Long Con wrote: ↑Wed Sep 02, 2020 2:55 pm I'm leaning toward cayvie as the chop right now. I don't like how her change of opinion on DDL went, and her ISO largely reads to me like pocketing attempts of DDL and Alison. [VOTE: cayvie] aubergine
rude >:|

what don't you like about my progression on DDL?

What progression. You suspected him, then he told an almost-joke, and then you were gushing with townpraise for him. It's fake, it's a pocketing attempt.

Carotenoid wrote: ↑Wed Sep 02, 2020 5:38 pm
Long Con wrote: ↑Wed Sep 02, 2020 2:55 pm I'm leaning toward cayvie as the chop right now. I don't like how her change of opinion on DDL went, and her ISO largely reads to me like pocketing attempts of DDL and Alison. [VOTE: cayvie] aubergine
I'm a *little bit* bothered that this is thinking in term of finding a chop rather than finding wolves.

I'm leaning toward cayvie as the chop right now. I don't like how her change of opinion on DDL went, and her ISO largely reads to me like pocketing attempts of DDL and Alison. [VOTE: cayvie] aubergine

Dragon D. Luffy wrote: ↑Tue Sep 01, 2020 9:17 pm
Long Con wrote: ↑Tue Sep 01, 2020 9:15 pm
Dragon D. Luffy wrote: ↑Tue Sep 01, 2020 9:08 pm
Long Con wrote: ↑Tue Sep 01, 2020 8:39 pm
Dragon D. Luffy wrote: ↑Tue Sep 01, 2020 7:21 pm U-Pick is a godawful representantion of wolf DDL, though.

Like, really bad.

I did not play that game at all. I pretty much gave up on like Day 3 and wasn't even reading in the previous days.

Examples of wolf games were I wasn't a royal mess include:

viewtopic.php?f=27&t=1692
viewtopic.php?f=28&t=1725
viewtopic.php?f=28&t=1584

I won the first and the third ones and made it to lylo in the second one.
Can't believe you linked A World Asunder, you made my stomach knot up, just a little.
Why not, that game was great.
I'm glad you have the good memories.
Oh I know I did some arguing about balance when it ended, but here's the thing, I always complain about balance after games.

One or two broken roles do not ruin a great concept with great execution.

In fact, I was talking with juliets the other day and we were wondering when you're hosting the next World Apart game.

I am much more prepared to host Spider-verse Mafia actually. I should see if I can get it in the queue. I haven't begun designing A World Ascended yet.

Dragon D. Luffy wrote: ↑Tue Sep 01, 2020 9:08 pm
Long Con wrote: ↑Tue Sep 01, 2020 8:39 pm
Dragon D. Luffy wrote: ↑Tue Sep 01, 2020 7:21 pm U-Pick is a godawful representantion of wolf DDL, though.

Like, really bad.

I did not play that game at all. I pretty much gave up on like Day 3 and wasn't even reading in the previous days.

Examples of wolf games were I wasn't a royal mess include:

viewtopic.php?f=27&t=1692
viewtopic.php?f=28&t=1725
viewtopic.php?f=28&t=1584

I won the first and the third ones and made it to lylo in the second one.
Can't believe you linked A World Asunder, you made my stomach knot up, just a little.
Why not, that game was great.

I'm glad you have the good memories.

Alison wrote: ↑Tue Sep 01, 2020 8:41 pm What does "I'm okay with this analysis, very nice" mean? You agree with it? You disagree with it? You disagree with it but think it makes DDL look town regardless?

I agree that it makes PSI look suspicious, and I double-down on that with a DDL townread.

Dragon D. Luffy wrote: ↑Tue Sep 01, 2020 7:21 pm U-Pick is a godawful representantion of wolf DDL, though.

Like, really bad.

I did not play that game at all. I pretty much gave up on like Day 3 and wasn't even reading in the previous days.

Examples of wolf games were I wasn't a royal mess include:

viewtopic.php?f=27&t=1692
viewtopic.php?f=28&t=1725
viewtopic.php?f=28&t=1584

I won the first and the third ones and made it to lylo in the second one.

Can't believe you linked A World Asunder, you made my stomach knot up, just a little.

Dragon D. Luffy wrote: ↑Tue Sep 01, 2020 8:11 pm Actually now that you mention it.

Spoiler: show
PSINightmareEmpower wrote: ↑Tue Sep 01, 2020 4:17 pm I'll be honest, I'm not entirely sure what you mean by 'I don't know why you think this so you must be wrong'? You lost me there. I mean, I understand you take issue with the read, and it's about my weird intuition thing, but I don't really understand what specifically you mean?

To be fair though, I don't really read the post the same way I did when I first wrote that. Sometimes I think I should wait a bit before giving thoughts on a post because I'll read it differently at different times. I'm also really reaching for a scumread here because I always feel weird when I don't have a single scumread at a given time; but it's also probably still too early to have a proper scumread so maybe I should just be patient.

Definitely waffling on the Cavyie read though, for no other reason than that almost everyone else is townreading her so it's making me doubt myself. Might have to move her back up to null until further notice.

3/33
I'll be honest

if you need to point that out maybe you aren't being honest

I'm not entirely sure - the entirely feels like

I mean, I understand... but...

Holy waffling, Batman

but I don't really understand what specifically you mean?

There is an adverb tell in this forum. I'm burrowing it. ADVERBS!

To be fair, though

"To be fair" is another sentence that tries to ease the reader into what they are going to say and "though" reinforces that.

it's also probably still too early to have a proper scumread so maybe I should just be patient.

Full of flowery language, declaration of not scumreading, but isn't sure of that either.

Might have to move her back up to null

null is noncommital

until further notice.

Until someone makes a better case so I can jump back, ofc.

Yeah I totes see it.

I was kind of feeling bad about cass before (and yes, I just made that nickname and I didn't know her before) and now she's a high town read imo.

I'm pretty okay with this analysis, very nice.

Yeah me too!

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