The Syndicate

Because I'm proud of it, here was my winning submission for the plot of Fight Club 2:

Fight Club 2....

Mere seconds after the closing scene of Fight Club 1...

"quick guys, check your credit cards, our debt should be gone!"

"Hey, what the... nothing changed!"

Somewhere, in a lush office... a man laughs maniacally.

"I guess they didn't know about... the cloud!!! mwa haha, cloud services for tha muthafuckin win, yo!"

The narrator's living room, drunk.

"You can't fight a cloud, man... this sucks."

He picks up the phone.

"Yeah, I'd like to order the new Fluhrmann line of sofa, please.... in... beige."

A tear falls down his face as he recites his credit card number.

Meanwhile, somewhere else...

Marla sits in a therapy group for internet hackers.

She watches, smoking silently, as nerd after nerd stand and cry as they profess "it's not fair! I can crack into any computer system, but... there just isn't anything left to fight against!"

She quirks an eyebrow.

"Gentlemen... I think it's time you met a certain someone."

Days later... the narrator is back in the dingy confines of the fight club, with the group of nerds.

He recites the rules of Fight Club.

"Now, who's first to fight?"

Two nerds take off their shirts and prepare for battle.

"GO!"

The nerds commence to thumb wrestle, their thumbs violence stabbing at each other.

Later...

Two nerds sit across from each other, shirtless, trying to complete a Sudoku before the other, sweat pouring off of their face.

Later...

the narrator rips an Apple laptop to pieces. When someone asks why he says "I wanted to destroy something beautiful."

Finally...

"Project Mayhem 2 is a go... nerds... take down that cloud!"

The nerds are seen storming into a random nondescript building in cities across America, full of supercooled servers. In each, the nerds plug into computers and commence to do battle with their fingers.

The narrator and Marla hold hands, looking at the windows at the city beyond.

Nothing happens. But somewhere, the credit card system goes down for realsies. There just aren't any explosions.

the end.

@svs, I had you down as one of about four people who were most likely tyler so I tried a little suicide move. I knew how the fights worked and that I had a small chance of killing you outright which would have been a boon but I also knew that there was a small chance I would die. if you died and you were tyler I would win. if I died at all tyler would die and the civs (minus me) would win.

since so many civs were inactive and since I couldn't figure anything out I thOught it was a worthy late stage hail Mary.

@juliets, SD wasn't recruited until Day 5! We were wrong about her, too!!!

@Long Con, no I didn't alignment-check you, you were, in fact, the one person Juliets and I successfully sniffed out in this game. And actually, I shouldn't include myself in that, JC sniffed you out early without my help, I was fixated on bullz at the time. When it came to your lynch, we had guessed llama's role, and we had long decided you were bad, so I went along with the bullshit case brought against you, lol. I've been on the receiving end of that kind of case, and I totally understand your frustration. Sometimes, info roles have to push cases that are otherwise weak, and hope others glom on, and that's what happened to you. It sucks, but it beats the other option which would have been llama saying "wink wink guys, just trust me, LC is bad, I KNOW it, wink wink". imo, llama did it all correctly

I utterly failed in this game. I had all of these missions I knew about, and every time i thought I found a baddie in the voting polls, I was wrong! Long Con, even you, I was technically wrong about. I thought you had been recruited Night 1 or 2, because you abruptly started staying in one fight club and voting yourself to fight over and over. But I guess you were still civ then?

@Alex this game was a HOOT. After the disaster that was my time in Recruitment Mafia, I jumped into this game determined to stay focused, and while I never accomplished a single thing (LOL) I DID stay focused! I've never had so many notes written down in my mafia life!

Great game and congrats to the baddies, honestly, none of you ever really stepped out of mine at all. You were, in strict "reading the thread" terms, pretty much impossible to find. Except for russtifinki. I guess in the end I was right about him.

S~V~S wrote:Llama was a civvie until right after the LC lynch.

And no you don't, Timmer.

LOL, in this case, I do. I'll explain. So Alex tells me, late yesterday in btsc, that I've got this one last chance to win, I just have to guess who Tyler is. Because I've been both the narrator AND the decoder, I've been "in the know" about countless mechanics in this game. I had decoded most of the missions, etc. ages ago. And I had accumulated notes on over 20 sheets of paper trying desperately to find Tyler through the early votes. So here it was, my big chance.

I knew Tyler had to be in a fight club to recruit someone, and that DH had to have been recruited by night 3, so that ruled a few people out. I knew Flyin High had been dormant for 4 days until Canuckle subbed in, so that ruled HER out. I told Alex that if the llama was Tyler, I give up on mafia forever, there's no way so that crossed llama off the list. I had my one last alignment check and used it on BWT, and I knew he was clean so he was off the list.

And so it went, using my decoding knowledge about the missions etc. and in the end, I had everyone ruled out but SVS and Mister Rearranger. I guessed SVS to be it seemed most likely that you had recruited BR and then LC and then DH.

So where did I go wrong???

The polls!!!! I was using all of the night polls to figure everything out, and I ruled out Black Rock because on Night 4, there was no one in the fight club with her who had been recruited, thus there was no way she was Tyler. Only, I never relayed that Long Con had just fought and been injured in that fight club, and thus was off of the poll!!!

I suck.

Dang guys, I guess y'all should have voted russtifinko with me! Too bad I had to be out of town at such a crucial moment! I think we've lost...

sorry for the vote and dash guys I am in the usa and am trying to avoid roaming charges. I'm at amcd right now. I think this lynch went well and I hope for the best!

Well, I had hoped to get through everyone, but I'm tired now and need to hit the sack.

Okay, russitifinko definitely falls into the more suspect side of this game for me.

Here are three posts:

August 5th:

Russtifinko wrote:
I am anti-lynching Vomps right now. I probably would've thought the same way before the Hobbit. I know you all don't know it yet, because I have been awful about posting it, but Vomps was one of the most engaged players in that game. He got more riddles right than anyone while he was alive, and was civ, but when he was lynched people accused him of not trying/participating.

My point here is that he can be very engaged and still be civ, maybe even more so than as a baddie. However, I don't blame you for thinking this way, since I had access to related info that you didn't.

I also don't love the idea of killing Vomps because he's on point, as you said. As long as I've been on the site, people have been bemoaning Vomps' perceived disinterest. I think punishing him for trying will only force him to post very little and act wacky all the time, which is ultimately counterproductive.

I urge others not to vote Vomps.

August 6th:

Russtifinko wrote:Voting....Canucklehead. Because (s)he really really really wants to fight. I also sympathize with Elo's plea for violence, and anytime Vomps garners more support I would vote him, since he's said he wants to as well and is being overlooked (and I don't think he's bad).

August 8th:

Russtifinko wrote:Will be busy graduating tomorrow! Voting Vomps. Only someone who's been recruited would say they wouldn't mind being recruited.

Sorry man, but those don't go together at all.

Also, heavy support for Long Con's fight theory: (truncated)

Russtifinko wrote:
Long Con wrote:Ok, here is Long Con's Grand Unified Theory Of How Fighting Works. From what I've read, a lot of people know some things about fighting, so I thought over what I know about it, and here's my theory. There are several elements that seem to affect fights. I hope I'm allowed to talk about them all, but from what I have seen, the 'possibly secret' parts have already been pretty well discussed.

And that's my theory.
I like this theory and motion that we accept it as standard canon. I will say that, based on my experience, it's weird to me that people are denying knowing at all why they won. It certainly wasn't all spelled out for me, but very bug hints were given. So I'e got my eye on Sorsha now.

Also sort of supportive of Long Con:

Russtifinko wrote:
This idea also fits with what LC was saying about MP rewarding active players. I think it's super plausible. Could be related to posting, voting, or whatever else MP can come up with.

One thing, though: DH was bad, right? So the police killing him wouldn't have anything to do with the baddies earning an NK, unless I'm misunderstanding you.

The voting flip on Vomps, plus support for Long Con = probably baddie, imo.

Mister Rearranger is next. This is a tough one. For a long time in the game he was very active, but the majority of his posts are about fights and game mechanics. But then, in the first few days that's kind of all we all had to talk about. In the latter phase of the game, he did start to lean towards suspecting Long Con, and voted LC third, which would be a bit ballsy for a teammate to do, though it's not unheard of.

Basically, with MR, I get a weird sense that he could be bad, but I can't really point my finger at any one thing, so he's at worst in the middle of the pack for me right now, and likely even not as bad as that.

Kyle is a mixed bag for me. There isn't much in his posts that is pingy. He suspected bullz for a time, but I can't knock him for that, I did, too. Really, the only thing that is semi-pingy is his vote for Long Con.

Kylemii wrote:i see... *nods*

in any case, i need to vote tonight. i don't see myself voting boogs any more because his explanation felt sincere to me. i'm likely to vote for LC because of that selective quoting thing. my instincts tell me that that is a baddie-like thing to do.

I'm going to be honest here, guys. While I wholeheartedly supported the case against Long Con, there is just something

about Kyle's vote. To only mention the selective quoting part in explaining why he would vote Long Con seems a bit weak to me, because that was really the weaker link in that case. Kyle voted 4th for Long Con which imo is roughly the point where baddie teammates tend to start piling on in a lynch.

I'll put kyle somewhere in the middle of the pack. His vote for Long Con doesn't feel right, but that's kind of only one thing.

I'll cover two people here, because they will be brief.

First, juliets. there is no content in the early part of the game, and her content in phase two has been on point and on topic. I see no reason to consider juliets as a recruit or as Tyler.

Second, keterman. His very big outbursts about Long Con were interesting but like I've said, I don't consider them a legit baddie move at this time, and plus, he can't defend today so he's moot anyway.

Next up in hedgeowl. Reading through the early phase of the game yields nothing of interest, the only ping I had had was the early "what hometown?" post but that was explained pretty solidly, I think.

Also, hedge owl never shared a fight club with DH and I stand by my hunch that Tyler has to be in the same fight club to recruit someone, so imo there is virtually no chance of hedge being Tyler.

And finally, reading through hedge's posts in phase two of the game, there is a lot of solid posting there, lots of on-topic discussion etc. I really don't get any pings from hedge.

Canucklehead. She replaced FH who was a complete no-show in the game for days. That makes the entire early phase of the game a bit of a wash. One thing I notice reading through Canuckle's posts is a strong tendency towards fluff posts. Lots of "IMMA FIGHT! ROAR!" type goofiness, a few questions on the game's mechanics early on, but there really isn't a ton of meat to anything she's posted. In fact, Canuckle has no major posts about finding Tyler of anything, until WABAM, this monster:

Canucklehead wrote:Well golly. That was a heavy reading load, and my semester hasn't even started yet.

Because I am supposed to be constructing a syllabus right now from which I will impart knowledge to the future leaders of America, and not playing mafia, I am going to be very brief here and just touch on my thoughts of some of the names that are being tossed around and the debates that are going on:

SVS/llama: this back and forth reads like it contains a lot of tension from a history of playing together. While I think (?) I agree more with SVS's POV on the issues discussed, that doesn't actually make me think llama is bad. I don't agree neccessarily with his thoughts on who Tyler is/was likely to recruit, I also don't really think holding those theories makes him likely to be bad. I don't know llama's style at all, but I would imagine that a baddie who was pushed so hard on a contentious issue would only put up a facade of a fight before acquiesing to the pressure and backing down in order to seem more "reasonable"/less lynch worthy. Llama's stubborness, and the increasing clarity with which he defins and defends his position actually make me think he's probably civ (though still possibly misguided in holding on to his recruitment theory)

Long Con/llama: I can't remember when LC voted for Dom, but I think it was fairly early?? (Please correct me if I'm wrong). I agree with many that it was a bit of a weak rationale for a vote, and seemed quite unlike LC...but I'm not sure I'm ready to vote for him yet. I don't usually find his posting or play style to be all that different from game to game regardless of his alignment, so his vociferous engagement with llama doesn't ping me as out of the ordinary. The Dom vote is weird, but I think there are other weirder things going on in the thread. As for llama, see above. I'm actually not suspicious of him, and think his exchange with LC is getting heated just because it seems to be two vocal, stubborn, and self-consciously incendiary players butting heads for the first time. If it comes down to a LC/llama tie-breaker, I'd throw my vote at LC, but I hope I don't have to.

Where I DO think I might want to throw a vote is at Vomps. I think Timmer's post was really interesting, and while I struggle to think why Tyler would recruit such a seemingly unpredictable and non-participatory player, the voting record is odd. Somewhat paradoxically, however, I ALSO find myself inclined to be a little suspicious of Timmer's sudden push for Vomps. Perhaps a case concocted to try and distract the thread from the other battles that are raging and get people's attention onto someone who, as a low poster and apparent wild card, might be an easy target and easy vote for those who are skimming through??

Long story short, I'm really really divided about Timmer/Vomps, and will probably come down on one side or another of that fence for today's vote.

That's one hell of a post for someone who hasn't said anything about anything but jokes and fights.

Plus, interesting note: since Day 8 Canuckle has had 9 posts in this game. She's had 23 in Misfits Mafia.

Considering that huge post above, I could see Canuckle being a recruit around night 7. She's a high fight level after winning a fight and suddenly there's that monster post but not much else.

I'd bet Canuckle is a recruit, but I give her no chance at being Tyler, I don't think Alex would have allowed such a role to be dormant for the first 3 days of the game.

Bullz I'm going to be a bit more brief on. I've suspected him off and on throughout the game of being bad. However, looking back at the reasons I had, it is all VERY circumstantial. As in, bullz was in the same fight club as DH at one point, and as Long Con at another point. Reading back through his posts, though, his defences sound genuine and I wouldn't put him near the top of my suspect list any time soon.

Black Rock wrote:
bea wrote:
Black Rock wrote:Well I have been trying to read and post all day. Either a child got in my way, or work, or my damn internet wasn't working. So much to read today. I went back and read the last day as I had missed a lot. As far as I could see there wasn't much to get out last day. Not much went on or said. The votes weren't really that suspicious.

To be completely honest I'm having troubles remembering specifics from the last couple of pages. So I guess I will have to look at them again. *sigh*
I'm guessing the kids got in the way again during your re-read and that's why you didn't come back with some thoughts besides "I'm feeling so lost right now. OMG this is how the players of my games feel?" it's weird being on the other side of a mind eff game isn't it? You are too good of a player to let you keep sliding on this. I would and have been lynched MANY times for less. see: Day 1 of your last game.

@ MR - maybe it is - maybe it isn't? I don't know. I know that the very name LC is enough of a mind eff that I'm worried that it can't be *this* easy - ya know? Part of me is going - we HAVE to be being played here. Who was it that said - "I feel like I'm sitting in front of two cups of wine?" - yea. That's me re: LC. Also - THANK YOU for actually being up and around. I always feel like I'm talking to myself.

No I went to bed. I was exhausted and I couldn't read anymore. I still haven't gone back.

I'm off today and will be gone till Sunday. I am working the biggest job of my life this weekend. Will be here when I can. I know I am usually more active, but RL has gotten in my way this game.

I find the LC voters very interesting. At this point I hope he turns up baddie. He gets lynched for stupid reasons every game, sometimes he is bad, sometimes he is good. Yes, I do think they are stupid reasons again this game.

I have to vote now, I'm voting for one of the bandwagoners who really had no original thought on it. Not DP, if he's about to die anyways... I went with MR since I feel like llama and Timmer had good reasons, kyle sort of explained himself better. If LC turns up bad then I am wrong, but by my read of the thread it doesn't seem very likely.

Black Rock. Let's start with this post. Bea brings up a good point. Black Rock has spent the last few game days kind of coasting, not really saying much. She says she is busy, and before anyone gets the wrong impression here, I'm sure she is! And she mentioned being away for a few days, etc. But let's take a close look at this quoted post. She pleads not having time to catch up, she says she feels lost. But look at the part I bolded. She sure seems to have an opinion on Long Con, and the people pushing against him. And most interesting, she calls the reasons against Long Con stupid, but then the very next line won't vote for me or llama because we had "good reasons"?

Also of note was the time Long Con logged in as Black Rock and voted in a poll so she wouldn't die. Obviously there are some variables here, such as we don't know exactly when Long Con was recruited, but I think there is a decent chance that a baddie Long Con would have let a civvie Black Rock die in that situation. The fact that he did what he did adds to the chance BR was a recruit or Tyler at the time.

ALSO also of note, though this more abstract, if Black Rock were Tyler, I find it VERY likely that she would have sought out Long Con to recruit him, and if you read her posts from the early phase of the game, she specifically tracked him down in Wilmington. She went there to "find her husband".

I think there are decent odds BR is a recruit or Tyler.

Okay, so I feel like this lynch is pretty crucial, and that I've spent too much of my time focusing on the early phase of the game trying to find clues about who Tyler is. We've had enough days in phase two now that there should be some more traditional mafia clues to find re: LC's and DH's baddie teammates, and most importantly Tyler.

I'm going to go player by player.

First up is BWT.

Over the last few days BWT has been fairly active, and spent a good deal of time mentioning Long Con. Part of it was in regards to LC's Big Fight Theory or whatever, and indirect from that, to Sorsha, but BWT never shied away from listing LC as a bit suspect.

Also, fwiw, this post doesn't sound like a baddie teammate to me:

birdwithteeth11 wrote:Also, I know we still have a bit over a day to vote, but with this many people still alive, it seems WAY too quiet still. I wouldn't mind hearing more from some people who have been quiet(er) since the merging.

Long Con, I see you lurking. Anything you have to add to the conversation?

BWT voted for Long Con in the lynch, though later into it which doesn't indicate anything.

Overall, I don't get a Tyler or recruit vibe from BWT from his posts, though of course recruitment could change at any time.

Oh I thought you were asking about SVS in particular, sorry.

I stand by my hunch on those numbers, until they are proven wrong, anyway. Notice even how Alex called this poll title "the final hours". I do absolutely think we are close to a big problem on the numbers. But my problem is, I have no idea who is bad or good right now, so anyone I try to come up with as a baddie is a complete crapshoot.

As for fighting, I have lots of ideas, about how it works and how it is determined who wins and if so, if their opponent is not injured, seriously injured, or outright killed. But the one thing I believe more than anything, because it is logical, is that the higher a person's fight skill level gets, the more likely it probably is that their opponent is seriously injured or killed.

I've been keeping a spreadsheet, trying to keep track of probable fight levels, and basically of the people who I think are likely still fight level 1 or 2, which includes me, I felt SVS was a good pick. If you are concerned about the ratio of good to bad left in the game, the last thing any of us should do is vote for someone like Canuckle or unfurl who I believe are at a high level. they are the ones most likely to kill an opponent. I think if we stick with the lower level people, the fight should end well. Or at least, it should have a BETTER CHANCE of ending well.

I hope that makes sense. I am clueless on who is bad or good at this point, so I'm sticking with my fight ideas, it's all I've got atm.

Mister Rearranger wrote:^Meaning you won't damage the civ/Mayhem ratio if you two fight, regardless of outcome? Or...?

Shit man, as much as I love to boast about having theories up the wazoo, I don't know much about much these days. And a lot of things I thought I was right about I was dead wrong.

If you want to have a discussion between now and the morning to try and determine a) whether two probable civs, b) two probable baddies, or c) one of each should fight and THEN try to figure out who fits the winning mild, go for it.

At this point, I don't think any such grand strategy is going to form by morning. So I'm going on gut. And I may not even win the poll to fight, I'm just one guy who wants to fight.

Mister Rearranger wrote:^Do you have an opinion on SVS's alignment though?

Not really, tbh. I read through her posts earlier tonight and didn't see anything pingy anywhere, so I felt like she'd be safe to fight against.

I'm going to vote for myself and SVS in the poll. No major reason, just wanna fight.

You know, I'm really unsure about Keterman. Not only am I def. giving him a pass while he can't defend himself, but the more I think about it, the more I just can't see Long Con in a baddie BTSC saying "look, even though I'm obviously toast, why don't you go in there and give yourself away as a fellow baddie, so that we protect Tyler? " Like, it makes no sense. At all. After the first outburst on Keterman's part, Long Con would have been all "sshh, no worries man, this is mafia, shit happens".

I don't think Keterman is bad right now.

Mongoose wrote:
timmer wrote:And incidentally I'd be willing to fight tonight if no one minds!
OMG your avatar is making me so sad. I think I've been as upset about her as most people are about RW. I actually sat down at the lake and cried yesterday. I like to think about her being reunited with Bogey, though.

I'd like to wait on Keterman since lynching someone who isnt able to defend is kind of shady. And I trust thellama so im going to drop my bullz thoughts for now. I tend to go off on tangents to the detriment of the cause.

And incidentally I'd be willing to fight tonight if no one minds!

Bullz posted this yesterday:

Bullzeye wrote:Well I'm definitely not going out today so I guess I have some more time to try to get my head back into this game! With the other one being in a night phase as well today looks pretty good for me to try to wrap my brain around fight club again.

Two hours later, this:

Bullzeye wrote:
I never planned to. However, LC is coming off more as a frustrated civ now and having been there pretty much every game I've played this year I definitely know the feeling. I probably won't vote for him either.

That alone shows that he is likely at least a recruit.

But let's look at DH and Long Con. They both were in New Castle Day 1. They both were in Wilmington Day 2. Only two other players still in the game were in NC and Wilm with them. Mister Rearranger and bullzeye. Mister Rearranger was the third Long Con voter in this lynch. Bullz didn't vote for Long Con, and called him a likely civ.

The other thing is, Keterman feels like he's throwing himself under the bus. His actions, coming out AFTER LONG CON WAS A GONER like he did, feel like he is protecting Tyler, to me. And Keterman was never in the sme fight club as DH and Long Con. I don't think he can be Tyler.

And I think we need to hit Tyler, not a recruit tomorrow.

Let's look at the numbers.

17 players left. Night 8. Tyler has had the chance to recruit 7 times. Two recruits are dead. So I'd say Project Mayhem should equal 6 people right now including Tyler. They will recruit again tonight, going back to 7 members. They will likely try to kill someone tonight. So they will have 7 out of 16 if successful. Let's say they throw Keterman to the wolves and he's lynched. Now they are 6 out of 15. Then they recruit and kill BOOM 7 out of 14 players left. End of the game.

That last part is a lot of supposing, but the key to me is that bullz a) just called Long Con a frustrated civ, b) he was in the same fight club as both DH and Long Con early on, c) the only other player who WAS in those fight clubs voted Long Con early in the lynch, d) I don't think Keterman can be Tyler, though he is very likely a recruit.

Thoughts?

Yup, but I may have something to gel with that. Stay tuned for a Case.

Looking at the people who died just now... I guess my theory about the self-votes meaning something was a little off, lol.

Thanks to the insane number of unrecruited civs who didn't bother playing, I'm pretty sure Tyler and the recruits are about this close (picture something really close) to winning.

In fact, I'd suggest that we have to not only hit a recruit in the next lynch but Tyler himself. This could be the last night before the last day. I've got to think...

Long Con wrote:Well... I'm really not supposed to talk about it...

Good point. The rules.

Long Con wrote: He was just kidding. Turns out his meds are all wrong.

I guess he told you that in BTSC?

Long Con wrote:I am the longest-lived dead man I have seen in some time. I can still dance! *dances*

So none of you figured out what Keterman was talking about?

How about you tell us, oh Wise One?

in fact, I went ahead and voted him. I didn't realize the poll ends at 8 in the morning, there's no way I'll have a chance to change my mind between now and then.

Kylemii wrote:
I was going to let this go, but LC did that to my vote-post-quote in that post too. I mean I did vote Sorsha for no real reason of course. It was a randomization, but the rest of the post was justification for why my vote was randomized. (AKA unable to make myself up to date on current events in time) My vote that day was only loosely comparable to his, and I think it kind of misses the point anyways.

Selective quoting can be an effective way of making posts less lengthy but only when the only information removed is irrelevant information. (i truncated most of the quotes in this post to include only relevant paragraphs in fact) If information which is even potentially relevant is omitted from a quote in a way which makes a point made by the quoter seem more valid seems like it may be a form of manipulation and it is concerning to me.

I've definitely truncated quotes as well, sometimes you have to. But not if you are using them to make a point like LC did. Explaining your vote and voting, is different than voting with little explanation. I'm very likely voting Long Con today. My gut is telling me this isn't like him.

Spacedaisy wrote:
Ok does anyone else think it's weird Canuck pushed so hard to fight someone and then her opponent ended up dead? she must have quite the skill level there. And I would assume she knew it going in. Did she replace someone?

She replaced FH, who I think lost a fight early on. If Canuckle has a high fight level, it sure didn't help the previous time! I'd still love to know how it all works!

Spacedaisy wrote:
I think I skipped one thing in my reading catch up. Why are we is cussing how the baddies might utilize BTSC? Why would it be anyway other than the norm for these games, I mean I have only ever seen chat rooms for the most part. Or is this a question about how/if BTSC works/exists for the recruits and Tyler? It would seem pretty disabling to the baddies to not allow them BTSC if you ask me. I can't see Alex crippling a team this way...

I've brought it up a bit, because Alex hasn't been willing to clarify. If you look at the roles, it says narrator and Marla have btsc. the cops have btsc. Tyler and narrator have temp btsc. But it doesn't say anything about btsc with Project Mayhem. Sure, they likely do, but then why hasn't he said? It's weird.

Bullzeye wrote:
timmer wrote:@Canuckle, the LAST thing I'm trying to do is say "vote Vomps because he's acting weird". I know very well how many times he has been lynched for "being Vomps" over the months, and that his persona works well as both civ and baddie. If anything, I find Boomslang's end of the self-voting more pingy than Vomps, because while Vomps never says anything about his votes, Boomslang had that one weird post that didn't sound legit at all. The main thing with Vomps is the way DH came in and gave him support when he hadn't asked for it.
I went back and looked at your Boomslang stuff and I'm not sure what I think actually. On the one hand, yeah self-voting for something you're obviously not gonna get is weird but at the same time why not? People vote in lynches for players who're obviously not going to be lynched by that point all the time.

In his case it's not so much that he self-voted the second time, but that he posted as if he was trying to make his vote sound legitimate. "As I did not win my fight and can fight again, I vote for me." That pings me. When you can clearly see that you aren't going to fight, posting that doesn't make sense. I'm not advocating for a Boomslang lynch over this one little thing, but I'm pointing it out as pingy. It's the kind of thing I obsess over; posts not written the way they should be, etc.

@Canuckle, the LAST thing I'm trying to do is say "vote Vomps because he's acting weird". I know very well how many times he has been lynched for "being Vomps" over the months, and that his persona works well as both civ and baddie. If anything, I find Boomslang's end of the self-voting more pingy than Vomps, because while Vomps never says anything about his votes, Boomslang had that one weird post that didn't sound legit at all. The main thing with Vomps is the way DH came in and gave him support when he hadn't asked for it.

Boogs wrote:Bea- Sorry I have not been able to get into this game at all and the style was throwing me way off with us not lynching or deaths etc. I asked to be replaced back on Day 3 tbh, and he told me to wait it out. I don't understand anything we have to go on in this game and don't understand how we are to win. So I've been coasting along and not participating because I have nothing to say and am lost. So I voted myself to get out but if you guys wanna vote me out as well I wouldn't mind. I think I may die anyway because I've been quiet.

Ugh, Boogs please don't do this. If you've got to replace out or whatever do so, I've certainly been in games where I got lost and didn't have a clue what to say or do. But don't pitch the idea of voting for you to die, I think we've got a bead on a few potential baddies here today and I'd rather we all focused on that.

And furthur to that, LC... "the more WE shine a light?" Wrapping your opinions in words like "we" is a standard mafia tactic to undermine an opponent's position, making them seem isolated. Groupthink comfort, and all that.

Long Con wrote:First, "trying to shut me up" is a euphemism for trying to kill me. Killing me is the only way you'll shut me up.

And your backpedaling doesn't hold up too well either. In the fight votes before lynches started, the votes were spread out and low because a) people wanted to fight, and b) sometimes a town didn't have more than a handful of people.

The more we shine a light on what you say, Llama, the less it stands up to the scrutiny. I've never played with you before, so I don't know if this mixture of lazy errors and endless discussion without a solid endgame is your usual, but it feels like you are just spinning in circles and then accusing your accusers.

You've done a lot of "theorizing" about Tyler and his recruits... So which players fit your theory? Have you named names, or just floated possibilities for others to form conclusions?

Does theorizing about Tyler make someone bad? Just curious. And LC, your Dom vote is very unlike you. I'm reading back through your posts and that was pretty lame.

Did you... read what I wrote?

thellama73 wrote:Also, SVS, I wish you would devote the same amount of energy to disputing the numerous, absolutely ridiculous theories of "who Tyler can recruit" based on nothing but wild guess from people like Timmer, Hedgeowl and Long Con.

It doesn't strike you as odd that they keep saying things like "well, let's assume that Tyler can only rercuit people whose name starts with J and who were born between April and June during a full moon on leap year"? And you thought I was making too many assumptions!

Theories are my life. FWIW, I think youve pushed some interesting buttons today. Sometimes button pushing illuminates things. I certainly won't be voting you anytime soon. Long Con seems pretty insistent about keeping this lynchs light on you, I think I need to reread him.

Okay, so I've tried to read back but this day feels like a lot of people are talking just to talk. Honestly, who has ANY clue who Tyler is recruiting, so why argue about the merits of different strategies, etc.? And arguing about whether the police are trustworthy or not? Fuck da police, let's get down to business here.

So here's something that's been bothering me. What does Project Mayhem do? The recruits don't seem to have roles. Alex has shown he would add new roles to the role list, like he did with the decoder, and there aren't new baddie roles. So what do they do? I don't think it would just be a group of 4 or 5 recruits or whatever all sitting around with a single group night kill to discuss. And look at Tyler's role description: "Wins when Project Mayhem is complete and when all unrecruited Policemen are dead." When Project Mayhem is complete? what does that mean?

So I started thinking that maybe recruits have certain tasks that they have to achieve, for "project mayhem" to be complete, and in the case of a mafia game, maybe those tasks could play out under our very noses.

Next I decided to try to find some weird stuff that might indicate some kind of "mission" going on. I' still working on a few larger theories, but one thing that I noticed, and I hate to pick on Boomslang when he said he'd be away for a few days, but the actions of both Vompatti and Boomslang since we merged have been odd.

Night 5, the first night here, most everyone voted for Boomslang to fight. No biggie. But look at who didn't:

MovingPictures07 wrote:
NIGHT 5

Who should fight?

Boomslang
15
timmer (11), Russtifinko (16), Sorsha (21), juliets (22), thellama73 (25), Bullzeye (28), Hedgeowl (31), DisgruntledPorcupine (32), Kylemii (34),
S~V~S (37), bea (39), birdwithteeth11 (41), Boomslang (44), Spacedaisy (45), Leamiteo (47) 31%

Hedgeowl
15
Keterman (6), timmer (12), Russtifinko (17), Sorsha (20), juliets (23), Bullzeye (29), Hedgeowl (30), DisgruntledPorcupine (33), Kylemii (35),
S~V~S (36), bea (40), birdwithteeth11 (42), Boomslang (43), Spacedaisy (46), Leamiteo (48) 31%

Vompatti
1
Vompatti (5) 2%

Next, night 6's fight poll:

MovingPictures07 wrote:
NIGHT 6

Boomslang
1
Boomslang (24) 4%

Canucklehead
10
Canucklehead (6), Kylemii (10), bea (15), Sorsha (16), S~V~S (17), Russtifinko (19), birdwithteeth11 (20), Dom (23), Keterman (25), Black Rock
(26) 36%

Elohcin
11
Elohcin (2), Bullzeye (3), Long Con (4), timmer (5), Hedgeowl (7), unfurl (8), thellama73 (11), juliets (12), insertnamehere (14), Leamiteo (21), DisgruntledPorcupine (28) 39%

Vompatti
1
Vompatti (9) 4%

Again, Vomps quietly voted for himself. But this time, Boomslang did as well. Boomslang's post about it:

Boomslang wrote:As I did not win my fight and can fight again, I vote for me.

But look where he voted? His was the 24th vote, look at how many votes Elohcin and Canuckle had already. His statement makes no sense.

And then night 7:

MovingPictures07 wrote:NIGHT 7

Who should fight?

Boomslang
2
Boomslang (5), Mister Rearranger (7) 6%

Keterman
12
Keterman (8), S~V~S (10), Long Con (12), juliets (15), Sorsha (16), Bullzeye (18), thellama73 (20), Black Rock (22), birdwithteeth11 (25), Canucklehead (26), unfurl (28), bea (31) 38%

Mister Rearranger
14
Mister Rearranger (6), Keterman (9), S~V~S (11), Long Con (13), juliets (14), Sorsha (17), Bullzeye (19), thellama73 (21), Black Rock (23), birdwithteeth11 (24), Canucklehead (27), unfurl (29), Kylemii (30), bea (32) 44%

Vompatti
1
Vompatti (2) 3%

This time, Boomslang didn't post at ALL about it. He just voted himself. And so did Vompatti.

These repeated self-votes are pinging the hell out of me, like they are on some mission where they have to vote themselves to fight as many times as they can or something. In fact, Vompatti has now voted himself to fight every single night except for night 2 where he voted for spaghetti. And DH, when he went to Penns Grove said "I voted Vomps, he wants to fight" despite Vompatti having not said anything. I'd wager that that could show that DH and Vomps were together as recruits and DH knew Vompatti was doing some kind of self-voting mission thing.

I've got more work to do, but no one else has consistently self-voted like Vomps and Boomslang, and with so little or such shoddy-sounding explanations.

Hey guys, sorry I haven't been posting, we went camping this weekend, but I'm around now and will catch up by late tonight. Thankfully this is a long day!

Hmm, interesting.

Canucklehead wrote:How odd. I know exactly why/how I won my fight.
Don't know why Elochin died, but I do know why I won....curious that that is not a universal experience. :hmmm:

Hmm. This is weird to ask, because I'm asking you to go back and reference your PMs from Alex etc. but are you SURE that you know why you won? Is it possible that you had something to do better than Elohcin, and that doing so would "help you win"? I know its weird to ask about PMs, but I think you should double-check this. Do you know that you accomplished something that would "help you win", or do you actually know exactly why you won? As someone who has fought twice, I think it should be the former, but if it is the latter, than you had a very different type of fight than either of mine, and I'm confused.

Sorry for missing the vote guys, we went camping at a nearby campsite that I could swear used to have cellphone service. Apparently, it doesn't. I'm just home getting supplies right now and heading back until tomorrow. I'll catch up then!

I feel like I may asked this already, but

@Alex, do Tyler and the Project Mayhem recruits share BTSC? If not, do the recruits know who Tyler is?

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