The Syndicate

Mongoose wrote: ↑Fri Dec 30, 2022 12:55 am I want to make sure @Lemonfairy gets her due here -- 3/4 baddies in her spread! I was very impressed.

Lemonfairy wrote: ↑Sat Dec 24, 2022 3:07 pm so if I order them, I'll get my readlist

town
fingersplints
Marmot
Neon
Roxy

townlean
sig
Rondo
Tony

POE/scum
SVS
Epignosis
Kate
DrWilgy

Neon wrote: ↑Tue Dec 27, 2022 4:50 am I think we basically have the solve if Kate is woof. Either way there's a wolf in Kate Epi Roxy SVS.

Mongoose wrote: ↑Wed Dec 28, 2022 11:33 pm

Mongoose wrote: ↑Wed Dec 28, 2022 11:32 pm Hells bells. That frog sounds just like my littermate Siamese kittens (Nadja and Laszlo, for all you What We Do in the Shadows fans).

Wow, so does that gecko. I'm basically an ambassador for Siamese cats now, amirite.

DrWilgy wrote: ↑Wed Dec 28, 2022 6:09 pm I'm starting to think that making a tie and going from there is correct.

[VOTE: Neon] aubergine

No I have not really assessed anything in the last cycle.

Kate wrote: ↑Tue Dec 27, 2022 9:06 pm

Neon wrote: ↑Tue Dec 27, 2022 8:28 pm

Kate wrote: ↑Tue Dec 27, 2022 7:04 pm

Neon wrote: ↑Tue Dec 27, 2022 6:44 pm

Kate wrote: ↑Tue Dec 27, 2022 6:42 pm

Neon wrote: ↑Tue Dec 27, 2022 6:37 pm

Kate wrote: ↑Tue Dec 27, 2022 6:24 pm

Neon's suses have been all over the place this game. Today she's trying to "dome" me (I think that's the new term) and now evidence against me is that I'm possible teammates with her?

I'm not and I'm not bad. Let's take a moment to review what's come out because the numbers are looking pretty bad for town.

I don't see how this is a dome.

An attempted dome? I'm not sure I'm using the term correctly. But you voted me straight out the gate after saying I want to give Kate time to talk bc she's been sick.

I did yes. I posted my thoughts pre analysis than analyzed and realized I'm just gonna vote you anyways and there's no reason to wait.

A dome is essentially a 1 v 1

And then just ignore what I say? That's not town behavior at all.

Especially considering I wasn't here bc I was ill, not just dodging the game.

Voting you is +EV

Doesn't mean I'm ignoring you I'm quite literally here talking to you right now. However you aren't even focused on trying to appear towny right now instead you are being defensive over my vote and shading me without any solving and while I have fully understood that you've had outside factors negatively impacting your play and that's a contributing factor to your naked iso there's hardly a reason for me to reeval at this stage with how this day has progressed.

Well I obviously have an idea who is bad, which is why I'm addressing you and your continued refusal to even consider thread evidence and just continue to dome or tunnel or whatever it is. Of course I'm defending, what should I do...lay down and die? I won't do that regardless of my health (I do feel a lot better today though). There are maybe 1, possibly no, days left for a miselim so yes, I'm going to try keep myself from being lynched.

DrWilgy wrote: ↑Tue Dec 27, 2022 9:39 pm

Kate wrote: ↑Tue Dec 27, 2022 9:02 pmWhat is +ev?

Effort Values.

Whenever a Pokemon knocks out another pokemon, the knocked out Pokemon provides points called effort values to to the Pokemon that knocked it out.

The amount and type of Effort Values provided is determined by the knocked out Pokemon. For example, knocking out an Azuril will provide 1 hp EV while knocking out a Magikarp will provide 1 speed EV.

A Pokemon can have a total of 510 EVs collected, but only up to 252 in each respective stat. This will often result in stat spreads like 6 HP, 252 Attack, and 252 Speed.

At level 100, every 4 EVs will yield 1 stat point on the Pokemon that collected it.

This is why competitive Pokemon training will often attempt to min max what EVs their Pokemon have collected to meet certain tasks.

A good example is the Speed EV investment on my Dudunsparce, as I've specifically invested 180 Speed EVs and a beneficiary nature so that under the effects of tailwind my Dudunsparce has a speed of exactly 214, out speeding Dragapult, the 2nd fastest Pokemon and the fastest that is commonly used in the VGC format.

How this relates to Mafia is beyond me.

Kate wrote: ↑Tue Dec 27, 2022 7:04 pm

Neon wrote: ↑Tue Dec 27, 2022 6:44 pm

Kate wrote: ↑Tue Dec 27, 2022 6:42 pm

Neon wrote: ↑Tue Dec 27, 2022 6:37 pm

Kate wrote: ↑Tue Dec 27, 2022 6:24 pm

Marmot wrote: ↑Tue Dec 27, 2022 5:57 pm

Roxy wrote: ↑Tue Dec 27, 2022 5:54 pm

why? I need reasons and proof. I have played many a game with her and have never read her correctly.

Off the top of my head

- I thought Kate was easy to read as obvtown in LGM, she hasn't been in this game.
- Dennis wanted to kill her, and he was nightkilled Night 2, which incriminates her more than anyone else.
- She was pushing Dennis, a confirmed civilian, the hardest, even after he began to settle into the game.

Then there is the possible pairing with Neon that's been observed by Epignosis and fingersplints, and I feel fairly good about fingersplints (although the jury is still out on Epi).

Neon's suses have been all over the place this game. Today she's trying to "dome" me (I think that's the new term) and now evidence against me is that I'm possible teammates with her?

I'm not and I'm not bad. Let's take a moment to review what's come out because the numbers are looking pretty bad for town.

I don't see how this is a dome.

An attempted dome? I'm not sure I'm using the term correctly. But you voted me straight out the gate after saying I want to give Kate time to talk bc she's been sick.

I did yes. I posted my thoughts pre analysis than analyzed and realized I'm just gonna vote you anyways and there's no reason to wait.

A dome is essentially a 1 v 1

And then just ignore what I say? That's not town behavior at all.

Especially considering I wasn't here bc I was ill, not just dodging the game.

Kate wrote: ↑Tue Dec 27, 2022 6:42 pm

Neon wrote: ↑Tue Dec 27, 2022 6:37 pm

Kate wrote: ↑Tue Dec 27, 2022 6:24 pm

Marmot wrote: ↑Tue Dec 27, 2022 5:57 pm

Roxy wrote: ↑Tue Dec 27, 2022 5:54 pm

TonyStarkPrime wrote: ↑Tue Dec 27, 2022 5:53 pm But like ok let's set it aside and kill kate

why? I need reasons and proof. I have played many a game with her and have never read her correctly.

Off the top of my head

- I thought Kate was easy to read as obvtown in LGM, she hasn't been in this game.
- Dennis wanted to kill her, and he was nightkilled Night 2, which incriminates her more than anyone else.
- She was pushing Dennis, a confirmed civilian, the hardest, even after he began to settle into the game.

Then there is the possible pairing with Neon that's been observed by Epignosis and fingersplints, and I feel fairly good about fingersplints (although the jury is still out on Epi).

Neon's suses have been all over the place this game. Today she's trying to "dome" me (I think that's the new term) and now evidence against me is that I'm possible teammates with her?

I'm not and I'm not bad. Let's take a moment to review what's come out because the numbers are looking pretty bad for town.

I don't see how this is a dome.

An attempted dome? I'm not sure I'm using the term correctly. But you voted me straight out the gate after saying I want to give Kate time to talk bc she's been sick.

Kate wrote: ↑Tue Dec 27, 2022 6:24 pm

Marmot wrote: ↑Tue Dec 27, 2022 5:57 pm

Roxy wrote: ↑Tue Dec 27, 2022 5:54 pm

TonyStarkPrime wrote: ↑Tue Dec 27, 2022 5:53 pm But like ok let's set it aside and kill kate

why? I need reasons and proof. I have played many a game with her and have never read her correctly.

Off the top of my head

- I thought Kate was easy to read as obvtown in LGM, she hasn't been in this game.
- Dennis wanted to kill her, and he was nightkilled Night 2, which incriminates her more than anyone else.
- She was pushing Dennis, a confirmed civilian, the hardest, even after he began to settle into the game.

Then there is the possible pairing with Neon that's been observed by Epignosis and fingersplints, and I feel fairly good about fingersplints (although the jury is still out on Epi).

Neon's suses have been all over the place this game. Today she's trying to "dome" me (I think that's the new term) and now evidence against me is that I'm possible teammates with her?

I'm not and I'm not bad. Let's take a moment to review what's come out because the numbers are looking pretty bad for town.

Marmot wrote: ↑Tue Dec 27, 2022 6:06 pm

Neon wrote: ↑Tue Dec 27, 2022 6:04 pm

Roxy wrote: ↑Tue Dec 27, 2022 5:06 pm

Neon wrote: ↑Tue Dec 27, 2022 4:56 pm

S~V~S wrote: ↑Tue Dec 27, 2022 4:26 pm Mech spec = Mechanics speculation?

@Roxy i think it sounds like we have a 3P.

With this ratio, an extra baddie would be kinda overpowering. An extra civvie maybe not so much, unless the role had a power, then it might be overpowering too. And really, from a hosts perspective, what’s the point of a vanilla 3P?

No extra kills, so at least it doesn’t appear to be a Serial Killer

Yes speculating on game mechanics and set up. Not my thing.

Maybe speculating but you honestly have no thoughts at all about it? Ok thanks for the answer?

Not really any thoughts I had would be speculation and that's not my specialty

Let's kill Kate.

Marmot wrote: ↑Tue Dec 27, 2022 6:05 pm Well it appears modkills won't happen if we roleclaim, but I'm not gonna roleclaim or hint because if we all roleclaim the game will break and town will win and that's not really a fun way to win.

I think in Wilgy's case it kinda made sense because he might not be VT (as SVS pointed out), but I hope other players don't plan on doing that.

I'm willing to accept Neon's explanation that she doesn't focus on mech stuff in games, although I'm going to treat that statement as NAI.

Roxy wrote: ↑Tue Dec 27, 2022 5:06 pm

Neon wrote: ↑Tue Dec 27, 2022 4:56 pm

S~V~S wrote: ↑Tue Dec 27, 2022 4:26 pm Mech spec = Mechanics speculation?

@Roxy i think it sounds like we have a 3P.

With this ratio, an extra baddie would be kinda overpowering. An extra civvie maybe not so much, unless the role had a power, then it might be overpowering too. And really, from a hosts perspective, what’s the point of a vanilla 3P?

No extra kills, so at least it doesn’t appear to be a Serial Killer

Yes speculating on game mechanics and set up. Not my thing.

Maybe speculating but you honestly have no thoughts at all about it? Ok thanks for the answer?

S~V~S wrote: ↑Tue Dec 27, 2022 4:26 pm Mech spec = Mechanics speculation?

@Roxy i think it sounds like we have a 3P.

With this ratio, an extra baddie would be kinda overpowering. An extra civvie maybe not so much, unless the role had a power, then it might be overpowering too. And really, from a hosts perspective, what’s the point of a vanilla 3P?

No extra kills, so at least it doesn’t appear to be a Serial Killer

Roxy wrote: ↑Tue Dec 27, 2022 3:55 pm

Neon wrote: ↑Tue Dec 27, 2022 3:30 pm

Roxy wrote: ↑Tue Dec 27, 2022 2:04 pm

Neon wrote: ↑Tue Dec 27, 2022 10:53 am SNIPS for ease

Dope I was right even though I was right for wrong reasons lol

Right about what exactly?

Wilgz lol

But you were like super waffley. Your posts read as if he was bad until last the phase or so then you switched it up by saying you could get info from his elim.

What do you make of the secret role? Any thoughts at all about it? You seemed to have posted right over it without commenting.

Roxy wrote: ↑Tue Dec 27, 2022 2:04 pm

Neon wrote: ↑Tue Dec 27, 2022 10:53 am SNIPS for ease

Dope I was right even though I was right for wrong reasons lol

Right about what exactly?

Kate wrote: ↑Tue Dec 27, 2022 2:00 pm Neon you seem to be "missing" a lot of thread evidence. Are you doing this purposefully because it's really starting to appear so.

Roxy wrote: ↑Tue Dec 27, 2022 1:44 pm

Kate wrote: ↑Tue Dec 27, 2022 12:09 am Am I crazy or are there 15 roles and 16 players?

I looked and indeed you are correct. I find this news chilling.

Neon wrote: ↑Tue Dec 27, 2022 3:42 am I want to see Kate do more today but I feel bad pushing someone ill with covid.

Also kinda think SVS is a hit and clears Wilgz which gives more info methinks than Kate but I'm gonna try to get back to basics and find my groove again...I feel alone on an island this game

Neon wrote: ↑Tue Dec 27, 2022 5:37 am I don't like doing vote analysis until 2 days after so we get more flips but D3 vote there only a few people off wagon and I'd bet there's 2 on and 1 off. I'll look deeper lately.

I think where I'm at right now I only want to kill in Kate SVS and Wilgz today. I town read Wilgz but he provides valuable info. I think SVS is a hit. Kate provides a lot of info and looks pretty bad overall

So out of those 3 I think I'd like to go Kate > SVS > Wilgy

[VOTE: Kate] aubergine

I quoted both of these as they are a contradiction of cover.

If you think Wigly is town why would he EVER be part of people you want to elim????
For info?
What info is so important that you would take yet another townie and elim them making it that much easier for the baddies to win???
I think no, just no way.

Mongoose wrote: ↑Tue Dec 27, 2022 9:53 am [insert vague answer here]

@Marmot @fingersplints @sig @Kate @Epignosis @S~V~S srsly wtaf do you all make of this??

This is something everyone should be talking about. It makes me worry. A secret role has never boded well for the town in any game I have ever played.

I am quite surprised someone skipped right over it.......

S~V~S wrote: ↑Tue Dec 27, 2022 7:28 am

Neon wrote: ↑Tue Dec 27, 2022 5:40 am I wonder if the team could just be Kate/Wilgy +1...TSP maybe...

Wilgy made a fairly robust role hint.

Spoiler: show

DrWilgy wrote: ↑Mon Dec 19, 2022 11:26 pm Also my boss is now deceased. RIP.

The correct play is to just go with Quin's legacy. [VOTE: Lucy] aubergine

He repeated it at least once, and so did at least one player that I noticed.

Spoiler: show

Dennis wrote: ↑Tue Dec 20, 2022 9:19 pm Wilgy town. Quin died and now his boss is deceased? Yeah all that does is set up himself up to get killed. If the other mason flips, then you get lynched (in my world).

Much as he wants to eliminate me, Wilgy is townlock, imo. I referenced it too, but it was probably buried in a text wall. It's why when I made my reads list, Wilgy was at the top of it.

Neon wrote: ↑Tue Dec 27, 2022 4:39 am D1 Analysis

Spoiler: show

falcon45ca (5) 29%
Voters: Kate, Quin, sabie12, lucy, S~V~S

DrWilgy (3) 18%
Voters: falcon45ca, RondoDimBuckle, Dennis

RondoDimBuckle (2) 12%
Voters: Roxy, fingersplints

Quin (1) 6%
Voters: Marmot

TonyStarkPrime (1) 6%
Voters: TonyStarkPrime

Lemonfairy (1) 6%
Voters: Neon

Neon (1) 6%
Voters: DrWilgy


I struggle to believe Falcon is clean D1 which means Kate SVS and Sig look bad here to me.

I also think it's Intresting that woofs have flipped Wilgz entire wagon and that wagon is entirely clean to me that screams frame job. I was feeling comfortable with Wilgz off minor things in thread but I don't think woofs flip his entire wagon...Wilgz is clear to me.

Simultaneously woofs probably don't stack everyone on Falcon here so 1 in Roxy Splints Marmot Me Wilgz TSP

But I'm confident in Wilgz town right now i know I'm town here so one in Roxy Splints Marmot TSP

TLDR; I think Wilgz is basically clear which works cause I'm TRing him and I think there's 2 distinct groups of people with a wolf in them

Kate SVS Sig

Roxy Splints Marmot TSP

S~V~S wrote: ↑Mon Dec 26, 2022 9:33 pm

Spoiler: show

Quin wrote: ↑Mon Dec 19, 2022 7:26 am I did think about delaying this until just before the night ends, but I'll be working at the time so I don't have the luxury. Shrug.

methinks scum team is SVS, lucy and Dennis.

So far in this game, I'm disagreeing with pretty much everything SVS says, and our conversation about scum agendas felt semantic and circular. She thinks lucy focussing so much on the previous game instead of this one isn't suspicious, when my mind (and I'm not the only one) immediately goes to, to quote Kate: "Or maybe the agenda is keeping focus on the last game and keeping it off of her in this one?". This is the interpretation I would expect from town SVS, because it's such an easy angle to add pressure on from someone I usually associate with supertown.

What I disagree with the most, and therefore hate, is this post:

S~V~S wrote: ↑Sat Dec 17, 2022 4:20 pm

Dennis wrote: ↑Sat Dec 17, 2022 3:50 pm @S~V~S What made you think Lucy and I don't have BTSC?

The conversation you had with her about Istanbul/Mujahadeen felt real. It did not feel staged, it did not have that chatroom, "Let's go banter in the thread!" feel about it. Especially the way you ended it,

Dennis wrote: ↑Fri Dec 16, 2022 1:13 am Oh wow you sound like Mr. Talbot

Sorry, but I'm not very interested in history or politics. Most of it goes right through my head. I know hardly anything about the Cold War too. But if that's what makes you happy then you have fun, don't let me stop you

...followed by her attempting to reengage, but you just ignored it. It had an, "OK I'm done with this" feel to it.

lucy and Dennis's interaction did not feel 'real' at all. I don't understand how SVS is seeing it as an organic conversation when part of it involved lucy asking Dennis's mother for permission to start it.

Rather, it felt like lucy tried to force some OT-but-in-white-so-not-OT distancing, Dennis (or the third scum) realised how it looked, and told Dennis to shut it down. It could also look like a really weird attempt for the masons to hint themselves early on. GTH it's the former. Regardless, SVS is explaining away something that just seems so evocative to me. Find me a natural segue between Dennis avoiding problematic content on the internet and Constantinople and I'll eat my pileus.

I suspect lucy and Dennis for their exchange, and SVS for her response to it. Either way SVS/lucy can be w/w. I'll look at lucy and Dennis if I live.

@DrWilgy

Explain how NKIng Dennis, in light of Quins actual theory, quoted here, benefits me in light of Lucys flip. Indeed, Dennis’ NK actually hurts me.

Quin was associating me with Lucy, for thinking her real, organic conversation with Dennis actually sounded real and organic. He wasn’t associating me with Dennis. And even if he was ( he wasn’t) theventite thing was moot when Lucy flipped town, since his entire premise was based on my interpretation of Lucy.

Read this and explain how NKing Dennis benefits me were I bad, since I don’t see it.

DrWilgy wrote: ↑Mon Dec 26, 2022 8:44 pm

Neon wrote: ↑Mon Dec 26, 2022 8:37 pm

DrWilgy wrote: ↑Mon Dec 26, 2022 8:09 pm One last chime in theory that I'd like for others to assess before EoN:

The Dennis kill following Lucy may have been a means to break down the suspicion presented by Quin that SVS, Dennis and Lucy were a team. If this is the case, SVS needs critical review.

Hey i said that!

Did I miss this?

Neon wrote: ↑Mon Dec 26, 2022 8:36 pm

Roxy wrote: ↑Mon Dec 26, 2022 7:04 pm Neon I am doing your separately. I was feeling town from you but with other people pointing out stuff I question if I am wrong about you. Would you try and give a reads list? I know this may not be your style but if enough of us make them and compare we then have a starting point. If you are town please help me. I do not want to be thinking every read I have this game is wrong.

Oh ignore that lol

DrWilgy wrote: ↑Mon Dec 26, 2022 8:09 pm One last chime in theory that I'd like for others to assess before EoN:

The Dennis kill following Lucy may have been a means to break down the suspicion presented by Quin that SVS, Dennis and Lucy were a team. If this is the case, SVS needs critical review.

Roxy wrote: ↑Mon Dec 26, 2022 7:04 pm Neon I am doing your separately. I was feeling town from you but with other people pointing out stuff I question if I am wrong about you. Would you try and give a reads list? I know this may not be your style but if enough of us make them and compare we then have a starting point. If you are town please help me. I do not want to be thinking every read I have this game is wrong.

Roxy wrote: ↑Mon Dec 26, 2022 7:00 pm Wilgy yep you have been part of my poe from almost the beginning of the game. I decided to re-read all your posts to see if what splints said could be true. I found many hints and no one has counter claimed. I do not like the fact you have basically outed yourself. I would vote to elim you on that principle alone you kids play way different and make the game an info/outing festival. My way is old fashioned. You had to work hard to find baddies with no info dumping or role claiming, which was considered poor sportmanship and game ruining. While I will keep an eye out i am no longer looking your direction.

Epignosis Its been awhile since we've played and I know I must not take my initial read as gospel but I do get strong civvie vibes from your posts, and i liked the way you have questioning others play/posts.

fingersplints I mknow I said I was reviewing everyone's posts and while I did skim yours I still feel you as town. You have played more than me recently so idk if you are actually pulling a Golden smooth move on me. I hope not. I adore tag teaming with you when we are both townie.

Kate still unable to get a decent read as the holidays then covid happened in your home. While I have no idea how covid feels I have seen people with it and all they do is sleep. I am hoping you will come up for food soon and poss throw out your top 3 suspects or give a rainbow.

Lemonfairy I have been givng you a town read and I have seen nothing to change it. Your vibe reads are much a few other older players I know. I was hoping you could be around a bit more this round.

Marmot I could copy what I said about splint to you as well. I hope you are not actually bad playing a role as good civ. I have been vibing with most of your reads, but I am nervous as we have yet to hit a baddie with an elim.

sig I have you tentatively as civ. I also worry you are playing a Golden style game. Though it really is opposite of how I remember your playstyle. I want to trust you but my brain hold me back.

S~V~S I have felt like you have played a town game but like Marmot you could pull the wool over my eyes but I really do not feel that is the case. While you have been a bit defensive about your posting style (which I disagree with Marmot here) I like how you have not let that consume your game. That reads as classic SVS townie play.

Little tsp Not digging your style. You give a name as bad with NOTHING to back it up. You read a post you say but won't quote it. I would like you to rainbow a list of players with how you feel about each one if you have time. Bc as it stands there is nothing in your posts that says I am town. The read more like a baddie trying to stay out of the limelight.

I will be around for discussion this next elim if I am not dead, I hope to help actually elim a baddie. Could we have a strong p[layer with two imv style players? Are there two strong and one imv? These are all questions I would like to talk about.

Mongoose wrote: ↑Sun Dec 25, 2022 9:25 pm Christmas Day Optional Check-in

What’s the worst gift you have ever received?

Mine was at a White Elephant last year and consisted of an apparatus you attach to your toilet so you can flush it with your foot. Very gag gift vibes, Luckily, someone stole it off me and I got to choose another gift (which ended up being a World Market ‘Teas Around the World’ tin.

TL; DR: Merry Christmas / Last Night of Hanukkah to those who practice.

DrWilgy wrote: ↑Sat Dec 24, 2022 11:11 pm

Marmot wrote: ↑Sat Dec 24, 2022 11:08 pm

DrWilgy wrote: ↑Sat Dec 24, 2022 11:05 pm Marmot, do you have an error with the Rondo yeet that I missed?

An error?

A rondo yeet feels like a shrug rn tbh

Kk. Same for me, but I like it more than Neon.

Was curious to see if Neon would build with you declaring your intent and me moving on there. Interesting that it didn't.

Marmot wrote: ↑Sat Dec 24, 2022 11:01 pm

Neon wrote: ↑Sat Dec 24, 2022 11:00 pm

Marmot wrote: ↑Sat Dec 24, 2022 10:58 pm

Neon wrote: ↑Sat Dec 24, 2022 10:54 pm

sig wrote: ↑Sat Dec 24, 2022 10:51 pm

Neon wrote: ↑Sat Dec 24, 2022 10:42 pm

sig wrote: ↑Sat Dec 24, 2022 10:41 pm Having said that his self vote is kinda dooming him unless he’s around @RondoDimBuckle

Self voting should be policied honestly

On one hand I get it but like the pragmatic side is like it’s more harmful to vote off a shitty civ than a potential mafia member

Self voters flip scum far more often than town and is anti town if they are town anyways so *shrugs*

Not in my experience, but I also speak as a chronic self-voter.

I have stats somewhere that I recorded and it's like pretty high in favor of scum in general

I'd be curious to see them!